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Furious van driver blasts horn and rages at cyclist… for stopping at a red light; “You are f***ing it up for all of us”: Cyclist berates Just Stop Oil activists for “harming the green cause”; “Fantastic turnout for DriveLondon” + more on the live blog

After the long Bank Holiday weekend and THAT Giro finale, Ryan Mallon’s back and raring to go for another sunny week on the live blog
30 May 2023, 08:29
Furious van driver blasts horn and rages at cyclist… for stopping at a red light (credit - RighttoBikeit)
Furious van driver blasts horn and rages at cyclist… for stopping at a red light

Ah, those pesky cyclists, always stopping at red lights… Doesn’t quite have the same ring to it, does it?

But that was the rather bewildering accusation thrown yesterday at Cork-based cyclist John – whose clips of poor driving from his Rightobikeit Twitter account have been featured previously on the blog and Near Miss of the Day – by a van driver unhappy that the cyclist had come to a stop… in a bike box… at a red light.

In the clip, as John stops at the traffic lights (coming to a halt in a designated painted section of the road designed to give people on bikes space), the impatient van driver immediately blares his horn, before opening and leaning out of his door to accuse the “very, very dangerous” cyclist of “jamming on his brakes”.

“At a red light? Really?” the baffled cyclist responds. “The lights are red, and you’re supposed to stop if you can.

“You’re responsible to stop a perfect distance away from me. I stopped at a red light!”

The video, posted on Twitter last night, was met with an equally confused response from John’s fellow cyclists.

“Great, now any time a driver complains about cyclists jumping red lights, we can show them this driver complaining that a cyclist didn’t do that,” wrote Steve.

Meanwhile, another Cork cyclist, Ashling, noted that the junction in question “has a delay between the red light you stopped at and the pedestrian crossing turning green. The pedestrian was already crossing as you stopped, so if you had done as he said was he going to run over the pedestrian.”

I’m not sure the van driver took that into consideration if I’m honest, Ashling…

“The absolute f'ing irony,” says Bob. “‘Cyclists need number plates because they don’t stop at red lights’. Also: ‘Why did you stop at that red light!’”

As John noted on Twitter last night, yesterday’s incident wasn’t the first time that he has been subject to those startling levels of cognitive dissonance:

But remember – cyclists, red lights, hi-viz, and so on…

30 May 2023, 09:36
“You are f***ing it up for all of us”: Cyclist makes the headlines after berating Just Stop Oil activists for “hurting the green cause”

A cyclist has made the headlines this morning after accusing Just Stop Oil activists, protesting in London yesterday, of “harming the cause” and “f***ing it up for all of us”.

The cyclist approached the activists as they slowly walked down Holloway Road in north London, blocking traffic, as part of a series of Bank Holiday demonstrations designed to draw attention to the group’s demand for the government to stop licensing all new oil, coal, and gas projects.

The rider – who pointed out to the protesters that he was “a liberal and a cyclist” – told them: “Everyone is just trying to go about their business, go about their day, and you are f***ing it all up for all of them.

“You might feel better about yourselves, but all you are doing is harming the cause because everyone hates you.”

He added: “I’m a liberal, and a cyclist, and I live in north London – and I hate you.”

> ‘Stop built-in car dependency... fund active travel’: Labour Party under fire for calls to clamp down on Just Stop Oil protesters

The Metropolitan Police told the Telegraph that officers had “imposed Section 12 conditions on those involved” in the Holloway Road march, which cleared the road.

“Where protests move to serious disruption or criminality we will take action to clear the road,” the force said.

Unsurprisingly, the cyclist’s roadside rant has divided opinion on social media:

Meanwhile, others focused on the important things… 

30 May 2023, 15:20
Vittoria Corsa Pro Pink Limited Giro d’Italia Edition
Vittoria marks end of Giro by releasing limited edition Corsa Pro tyres with pink sidewalls (as seen on Mark Cavendish’s stage winning bike)

Shut up and take my money now…

To mark the end of the Giro, Vittoria has released these rather tasty pink sidewall Corsa Pros, which were worn around Rome during the Italian grand tour’s final stage on Sunday by EF Education-EasyPost, Alpecin-Deceuninck, and Astana Qazaqstan, with a certain British champion sprinting to the stage win on the limited-edition tyres.

Mark Cavendish wins stage 21 of the 2023 Giro d’Italia (Zac Williams/SWpix.com)

It was the pink sidewalls that did it!

Only 1,000 of these beauties have been produced, so if you fancy mimicking Cav’s last ever Giro stage winning look, you better get on it quick…

Vittoria Corsa Pro Pink Limited Giro d’Italia Edition

> Vittoria claims new Corsa Pro is “the most advanced cotton road tyre ever made” 

30 May 2023, 14:49
More Giro reaction: Primož Roglič’s ex-ski jumping teammate was Giro d'Italia spectator who helped with crucial post-mechanical push
30 May 2023, 14:19
Geraint Thomas in the pink jersey on stage 14 of the 2023 Giro d’Italia (Zac Williams/SWpix.com)
“Shut it down, then get going again”: Geraint Thomas set to target time trial at Glasgow world championships – and “possibly” the Vuelta

I don’t know about you, but if I lost the Giro d’Italia by just 14 seconds on the penultimate day, and then managed to muster enough enthusiasm and energy to help my old mate score a fairy tale stage win the very next day, I’d probably spend the entirety of June in a dark room, never mind turning my attention to new goals and targets.

But that’s exactly what Geraint Thomas, the victim of that ruthless display of shock and awe by Primož Roglič on Monte Lussari on Saturday, has been doing since the weekend.

Geraint Thomas, stage 20 of the 2023 Giro d’Italia (Zac Williams/SWpix.com)

Zac Williams/SWpix.com

Speaking on his Watts Occurring podcast with teammate Luke Rowe, the Ineos Grenadiers rider says he will follow up the fourth grand tour podium of his career with a tilt at the British national championships at the end of June, before aiming to secure a first rainbow jersey on the road at August’s inaugural combined world championships in Scotland, where the rolling 47.8km course around Stirling should suit Thomas if he’s on form.

When it comes to three-week races, however, the 37-year-old is less sure about his plans – though he definitely won’t be lining up in Bilbao for the Tour de France on 1 July. However, he did say that the Vuelta a España, a race he’s only taken part in once, back in 2015, and a well-trodden path to redemption for those scorned at the Giro, was a “possibility”.

Geraint Thomas 2023 Giro d'Italia (SWpix.com/Zac Williams)

Zac Williams/SWpix.com

“I’m with the family for a week now. I’ll do a coffee ride, one or two, just to turn the legs over, but this week pretty much shut it down, then get going again,” Thomas said on the podcast.

“Nationals will be my next race and I’m looking forward to that. Worlds will be the next target. Being in the UK, it’s a big one, isn’t it, so maybe target the TT there.

“Then possibly the Vuelta as well, but we’ll see about that. I’m not going to commit to anything just yet, but I’ve already done the Vuelta once and it wasn’t a good experience, so it would be nice to go and have a better one.”.

30 May 2023, 13:42
2023 Lizzie deignan paris roubaix Trek Domane
‘Oh look, a Madone in the middle aisle’: Trek-Segafredo confirms Lidl as new title sponsor

Get ready for Lidl-Trek at this year’s Tour de France – and no, I don’t mean Gaia Realini’s bike (sorry) – as the supermarket giant has finally been confirmed as the US-registered team’s new sponsor, replacing Italian coffee company Segafredo just in time for July.

Announcing the new sponsorship deal – which was rumoured earlier this month to represent a hefty budget increase for the men’s and women’s teams, home to Mads Pedersen, Elisa Longo Borghini, Lizzie Deignan, and Giulio Ciccone – Trek said that Lidl will take over title sponsorship on 30 June, the day the Giro d’Italia Donne kicks off and the day before the men’s Tour begins in Bilbao.

 2023 Paris Roubaix Mads Pedersen, Trek Segafredo

Zac Williams/SWpix.com

The partnership with Trek won’t be the first time that Lidl has dipped its toe into the cycling world. The supermarket was one of the sleeve sponsors for the QuickStep team for five years from 2016 and currently backs the Flanders Classics races, its yellow, blue, and red logo a prominent part of the spring campaign in Belgium.

“We are excited to work with a team that is committed not only to excellence in cycling, but also to the sustainable development of athletes in a family team culture,” Lidl board member Jeroen Bal said in a statement.

“We are convinced that healthy nutrition and an active lifestyle – shaped by sports and exercise – strengthen people’s well-being. Just as our Lidl products are accessible to everyone, cycling is a sport for everyone and suitable for anyone who wants to be more active in everyday life. We want to share this message with as many people as possible.”

Now, let the new kit speculation commence…

30 May 2023, 12:59
Potenza brake:shift levers.jpg
Campagnolo’s thumb shifters – Gone But Not Forgotten

A moment of silence, please, as we mourn the sad loss of Campagnolo’s iconic thumb shifters, a mainstay of the Italian brand since the end of the down-tube shifting era.

Those beautiful, elegant (and distinctly Campagnolo) thumb shifters have vanished without a trace from the Super Record Wireless, Campag’s debut with wireless electronic shifting, replaced by two paddles behind the brake lever.

2023 Campag super record wireless shifters

Out with the classic, and in with the 21st century...

They may not have been everyone’s cup of tea, certainly, but still, it’s a sad day for all lovers of tradition, history, and the satisfying thwack made as you shifted with your thumb.

Is nothing sacred anymore?!

Read more:

> Campagnolo ditches iconic thumb shifter and goes wireless with new Super Record Wireless electronic groupset... and it'll cost you £4.5k

30 May 2023, 12:13
Psst! Don’t tell Tony Blackburn or Mike Graham, but more cyclists are set to take over London’s streets this weekend…

I hear Blackburn’s organising a ‘Sit in your car and listen to the radio really loudly’ day as I type… 

30 May 2023, 11:37
“Green Civil War”: Mike Graham and TalkTV on cyclist’s “surprising” Just Stop Oil rant

Breaking News: TalkTV’s Mike Graham has taken the side of a cyclist (well kind of).

The concrete expert – who just two months ago advised his long-suffering viewers to not brake for people on bikes – was of course referring to the North London liberal cyclist who decided to vent his frustrations at yesterday’s Just Stop Oil protests in London, in a segment helpfully titled ‘Green Civil War’.

Joined by independent, and anti-active travel (as well as anti- a few other things), Greater Manchester mayoral candidate Nick Buckley, Graham claimed that the climate activists were intent on provoking “violence” through their traffic-blocking demonstrations.

Well, at least he didn’t mention the Highway Code this time…

30 May 2023, 11:06
Tony Blackburn insists “joke” idea to replace RideLondon with “event for car owners” wasn’t a serious suggestion

I suppose it was only a matter of time before the hastily backpedalling DJ opted for the classic Year 10 ‘I was only joking, Miss, I promise’ excuse…

> Tony Blackburn insists “joke” idea to replace RideLondon with “event for car owners” wasn’t a serious suggestion

Meanwhile, Dave Walker was once again on hand to eloquently sum up the whole RideLondon versus angry residents debate:

30 May 2023, 10:34
Israel-Premier Tech’s Rick Zabel shares his, ahem, interesting take on the eternal ‘wave or no wave’ debate

29-year-old German pro Rick Zabel (who’s been around long enough by now, I don’t feel the need to mention his more famous dad… Ah, shoot) appears to be combining his lead-out duties lately with a side hustle as the star, director, and producer of a series of bike-related Instagram videos.

His latest attempt, focusing on the eternal (and eternally boring, am I right?) wave debate, can best be described as an entertaining if deeply unsettling hybrid thriller/horror/cycling etiquette public information film:

 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

A post shared by Rick Zabel (@rickzabel)

‘Pro cyclists have their say on everyday cycling debates’ – Now there’s an idea for a Netflix series…

30 May 2023, 10:05
DriveLondon: A roaring success

Tony Blackburn must be buzzing…

> Tony Blackburn calls for RideLondon to be replaced by “event for car owners” – because “there are more of us and we pay to go on the roads”

30 May 2023, 09:07
Bank Holiday round-up

Have you recovered yet from that weekend of pure sporting drama at the Giro d’Italia? (Alright, enough with the snarky comments about the previous three weeks…)

Well, if like me, you spent your weekend shouting at your television and your Bank Holiday Monday going for a long bike ride just to process it all, here’s what you may have missed on road.cc…

(Warning: may contain references to veteran DJs who just love a bit of a ‘joke’.)

Mark Cavendish wins stage 21 of the 2023 Giro d’Italia (Zac Williams/SWpix.com)

> Mark Cavendish sprints to sensational farewell Giro d’Italia stage win in Rome... with the help of some friends  

Geraint Thomas, stage 20 of the 2023 Giro d’Italia (Zac Williams/SWpix.com)

> Heartbreak for Geraint Thomas as Primož Roglič seals sensational Giro d’Italia win despite dropping chain during dramatic time trial 

Families reclaim the pedestrian and cycle zone in Norwich (credit: Claire Bullion/Facebook)

> “Educating people wasn’t working… Hopefully this will deter others”: Police target motorists using city centre pedestrian and cycle zone as a “shortcut”

2023 Ford RideLondon sportive (RideLondon)

> Tony Blackburn calls for RideLondon to be replaced by “event for car owners” – because “there are more of us and we pay to go on the roads”

Plus:

> Near Miss of the Day 866: £1,000 fine for close pass driver

> Almost all drivers agree that close passes of cyclists put lives at risk

> Grandmother, 85, completes 1,000-mile bike ride to remember her late children

> British Cycling’s new ‘Open’ category “patently designed to make sure that transgender women will compete at a major disadvantage”, says “perplexed” transgender cyclist

> Top TV comedy producer who “flipped the bird” and told CyclingMikey to “go f*** yourself” fined over £2,000 and handed six points for phone use while driving

> Primož Roglič gears up for decisive – and monstrous – Giro d’Italia mountain time trial by using gravel groupset… and specialist bike change mechanic

Ryan joined road.cc in December 2021 and since then has kept the site’s readers and listeners informed and enthralled (well at least occasionally) on news, the live blog, and the road.cc Podcast. After boarding a wrong bus at the world championships and ruining a good pair of jeans at the cyclocross, he now serves as road.cc’s senior news writer. Before his foray into cycling journalism, he wallowed in the equally pitiless world of academia, where he wrote a book about Victorian politics and droned on about cycling and bikes to classes of bored students (while taking every chance he could get to talk about cycling in print or on the radio). He can be found riding his bike very slowly around the narrow, scenic country lanes of Co. Down.

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80 comments

Avatar
Car Delenda Est | 9 months ago
1 like

Ignoring the fact they probably only mounted the pavement to get alongside the JSO protesters, and that I'm supportive of low speed pavement cycling:
cycling on the pavement in lycra makes you look like a massive p***k.

Avatar
Cocovelo | 9 months ago
4 likes

Imagine if the protest wasn't against oil companies etc, but was instead against the Big Bad EU or something like that. Would the protesters get the same treatment by the media? Not a chance.

Avatar
Rendel Harris replied to Cocovelo | 9 months ago
4 likes

Cocovelo wrote:

Imagine if the protest wasn't against oil companies etc, but was instead against the Big Bad EU or something like that. Would the protesters get the same treatment by the media? Not a chance.

A lot of the same people punching the protestors and then whingeing about being arrested for it are doubtless those who supported or indeed were involved in the lorry drivers' convoys in protest at fuel prices or the various London cabby go-slows. As it happens I lean towards the school of thought that says JSO are somewhat counterproductive and selfindulgent in their tactics but there's no denying the media bias against them.

Avatar
Roulereo replied to Cocovelo | 9 months ago
1 like

Irony at its finest, "I'm a liberal and I hate you...You're hurting the cause". 

The Woke hard left will always fall off their ivory towers, because at the depths of their black little pea hearts they are massive hypocrits who hate other people.

Demand more and more immigration, call anyone who questions it a racist. Meanwhile they happily demand other people curtail anything and everything in their daily lives for 'the climate emergency'.  

The majority of posters here know it becaue they are like that, crabs in a bucket, each trying to show off their virtue signal to the tribe, putting a UKR, rainbow, trans flag on their bio, claiming their 'cause' above all these other 'stupid people, but dragging each other back down back into their messy bucket of Wokedom. 

Avatar
Rendel Harris replied to Roulereo | 9 months ago
9 likes

Roulereo wrote:

...at the depths of their black little pea hearts they are massive hypocrits who hate other people.

On the basis of this madder than a box of frogs rant, and your many other unpleasant comments about virtually everything on here, one would say it's actually you who hates other people. Go and have a nice lie down and perhaps a cup of tea.

Avatar
Cocovelo replied to Roulereo | 9 months ago
2 likes

Demand more and more immigration, call anyone who questions it a racist. Meanwhile they happily demand other people curtail anything and everything in their daily lives for 'the climate emergency'.  

Even if this were true, with which I disagree, then how is this hypocritical?

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to Cocovelo | 9 months ago
6 likes

Cocovelo wrote:

Demand more and more immigration, call anyone who questions it a racist. Meanwhile they happily demand other people curtail anything and everything in their daily lives for 'the climate emergency'.  

Even if this were true, with which I disagree, then how is this hypocritical?

I find a useful heuristic for identifying content-less rambling is that anyone using the word "woke" as a perjorative is best ignored.

Avatar
Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
13 likes

The incident with the van clearly shows the danger that red light jumping causes the rest of us that don't RLJ.

Every time a motorist sees a cyclist RLJ, it confirms the stereotype, so it soon becomes the mindset that a cyclist *will always jump a red light*, and so the following motorist thinks that they will have time to follow.
By not jumping, the cyclist has forced the drivist to mentally re-evaluate and potentially fuck up their day.

So ... For the sake of the rest of us, please stop jumping red lights.
Fight the stereotype, and let's get our traffic light safety back.

Avatar
Mungecrundle replied to Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
7 likes

Yet (as I understand it but cannot be arsed to go check for the evidence) Cyclists are no more likely to RLJ than other road users, but do it in a different way.

1. They have more opportunity to filter and run a light at low speed. Such as at a pedestrian crossing.

2. Turning left on red.

3. Jumping ahead of the stop line to be clear of traffic waiting behind.

4. At road works where a cyclist can dodge inside the cones.

Personally, I cannot remember the last time, if at all, that I witnessed a cyclist deliberately accelerate to crash through a junction at orange / just changed to red as drivers tend to do.

Whilst I'd agree with you in reminding others to respect red lights, I do think it is probably more important to focus on tackling the incorrect and generally unfair stereotype.

Avatar
Oldfatgit replied to Mungecrundle | 9 months ago
7 likes

My commute home through the centre of Glasgow is full of traffic lights.
Food delivery guys - on bikes and throttle pedalecs - have no respect for red lights. I am often sat there, on my bike, watching these guys go past on either the road or non-shared footway.

It happens ... it doesn't matter if you see it or not ... it happens.

Points 1 through 4 are not acceptable behaviour either.
Red light means Stop.
It doesn't mean go if you can see a way around it.

Points 1 through 4 only serve to reinforce the driverist mindset that cyclists will go through red lights - and that you have listed them shows that they are right.
If you are prepared to do any of those behaviours then you are part of the problem.
Don't be the problem... change your behaviour and be the solution.

You can be generic, or "you". How ever the cap fits.

Avatar
Brauchsel replied to Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
11 likes

Indeed. In my bit of London, it's absolutely unremarkable for cyclists (particularly but not at all only delivery riders) to ride through red lights. Pedestrian crossings seem to be the most usual venues, but also turning left at crossroads. I do see motorists do it occasionally, but that's infrequent enough (during the daytime anyway) that it sticks in my mind. Friends I ride with will sail through red lights if it *looks* clear, and I know they don't do that when driving. 

It fucks me right off. Partly the optics, as I want the moral high ground if I'm to be lumped in with all cyclists. Partly a sense that the world would be better if people didn't feel that the rules are only for others. Mostly because I've been knocked off by a woman blithely sailing through a crossroads that looked clear to her, and because I've many times had to grab my small child out of the way of someone who presumably thought that red lights aren't for cyclists. 

It's so fucking easy to just stop when and where you're meant to. (And naturally, that means that if a car or bus is in the ASL box, I'll be in front of them and taking my sweet time about setting off when the lights change).

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giff77 replied to Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
0 likes

Totally agree with you on all your points. I do my utmost to not run lights and will be seen shaking my head when someone else does. There have been a couple of instances where a mirror and shoulder check have established some clown is 6' off my wheel and I commit to the jump as I've no desire to be a billiard ball and be catapulted into the middle of a junction.

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Rendel Harris replied to Mungecrundle | 9 months ago
6 likes

Mungecrundle wrote:

4. At road works where a cyclist can dodge inside the cones.

I've always worked on the assumption that if the roadworks are set up in such a way that it's safe to ride through (e.g. lane coned off but no works started, no workers present) and I can ride to the left of the red light and through the coned space without ever encroaching on the oncoming traffic's lane it's OK; I might also do this when I have a green if safe so as not to hold up traffic behind, e.g. on an uphill contraflow. This is the only time I'll pass a red, I assume that passing it to the left of the light and never riding in the lane it's controlling I'm not actually jumping it, but I'd be interested to know the legality of that.

Avatar
Oldfatgit replied to Rendel Harris | 9 months ago
3 likes

Why would you consider that as *not* jumping a red light?
Would you ride through a red to turn left (currently illegal unless signed different)?

The only way that you can pass through red in those kind of circumstances is to get off and push.
You become a pedestrian.

That the traffic lights are temporary and specifically for roadworks is immaterial. They carry exactly the same weight in Law as permanent ones.

Avatar
Rendel Harris replied to Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
4 likes

Oldfatgit wrote:

Why would you consider that as *not* jumping a red light?
Would you ride through a red to turn left (currently illegal unless signed different)?

....

That the traffic lights are temporary and specifically for roadworks is immaterial. They carry exactly the same weight in Law as permanent ones

Because I'm passing to the left of the red light, not riding through it, and not riding on the carriageway it's controlling, as I said. The red light is there to stop people travelling on the available carriageway and I'm not doing that. Rather than asking for a moral lecture I'm genuinely curious about the legal position, which is if I don't pass through the red light – which I would have to pass on its right to do so – don't ride on the active carriageway at any point and ride through a coned-off area where no workers are present and no works are yet taking place, am I breaking the law? 

In answer to your question as to whether I would ride through a red to turn left, I think "this is the only time I'll pass a red" in my previous post covers that.

Avatar
Oldfatgit replied to Rendel Harris | 9 months ago
1 like

Even though the lane is closed, you still pass through a red light on the carriageway and it would still be considered RLJ.

The active status of a lane does not affect its classification and use .. the lane does not stop existing as a carriageway and as such, the law still applies.

It is similar situation to red crossess over lanes on motorways. The cross means that the lane is closed, and you must not pass that point in that lane. The lane hasn't stopped existing as part of the carriageway, and it is an offence to proceed in that lane.

The only way that you can pass a red light is on foot.

So yes, you are breaking the law.

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HoldingOn replied to Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
4 likes

Been reading this with interest. I can't find anything specific to "portable traffic lights" - which tend to be used for most roadworks. They seem to be different to "temporary traffic lights"

Highway Code Rule 109 seems pertinant:

Quote:

You MUST obey all traffic light signals (see ‘Light signals controlling traffic’) and traffic signs giving orders, including temporary signals & signs

It doesn't specify portable traffic lights

I understand what has been said - the red light is closing off the lane you aren't using - but you will likely have passed a sign saying something like "When red light shows, wait here"

I think Oldfatgit (it feels rude to call you that!) is spot on - drivists tend to think in the moment, so will be unlikely think "oh thats nice of them - moving ahead so we don't get held up" I believe they will more likely knee-jerk "f**kin cyclist going through a red light"

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chrisonabike replied to Oldfatgit | 9 months ago
0 likes

Oldfatgit wrote:

...The only way that you can pass a red light is on foot. So yes, you are breaking the law.

But only in "in a very specific and limited way" though?

I'm a hypocrite in that I stick to the rules BUT.  I don't approve of RLJ by motor vehicles pretty much any time and by cyclists at most times.  However I am less troubled by cyclists breaking them.  Also after having stopped for lights at road works I have indeed then sometimes ignored them rather than waiting further.  This is where I am as certain as I can be that I can see the end of the one-way section and far enough beyond it that I can be absolutely sure of getting through before any vehicle could reach it from the other direction.  I don't want to risk falling in a trench / having to jump into a hedge.

FWIW I also roll through them at some points on some critical mass events - which certainly leave some members of the public annoyed and / or confused.

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ShutTheFrontDawes replied to Rendel Harris | 9 months ago
0 likes
Rendel Harris wrote:

Because I'm passing to the left of the red light, not riding through it, and not riding on the carriageway it's controlling

Ah, another one to put in the list of quotes under "Rendel Harris: he really is that stupid". That you quote Marcus Aurelius on here to look intelligent is increasingly comical.

You red-light-jumping hypocrite.

Avatar
BalladOfStruth replied to ShutTheFrontDawes | 9 months ago
2 likes

Whilst I agree that this is running a red – I myself am very dubious of those temporary traffic light/contraflows. They’re not set up with cyclists in mind, the timings do not allow for cyclist speeds and it’s almost impossible to clear them before the upstream light releases a bunch of drivers towards you (all of whom assume you’ve run a red instead of being caught out by the timings, and all of whom will happily have a head-on with you to teach you a lesson). These set-ups have been the source of a number of NMOTD entries - including a particularly terrifying one involving a lorry.

If I encounter one, I must admit, I’ll usually seek to go around it rather that through it. Though I'll usually dismount.

Avatar
chrisonabike replied to BalladOfStruth | 9 months ago
3 likes
BalladOfStruth wrote:

Whilst I agree that this is running a red – I myself am very dubious of those temporary traffic light/contraflows. They’re not set up with cyclists in mind, the timings do not allow for cyclist speeds and it’s almost impossible to clear them before the upstream light releases a bunch of drivers towards you (all of whom assume you’ve run a red instead of being caught out by the timings, and all of whom will happily have a head-on with you to teach you a lesson).

I've had this, and I do now find myself checking the timings while waiting (am I going to get through) and also eyeing the closed lane for escape potential. Obviously you may not be able to fully assess either eg. if the roadworks round a corner or otherwise go out of sight.

Avatar
ShutTheFrontDawes replied to BalladOfStruth | 9 months ago
0 likes
BalladOfStruth wrote:

Whilst I agree that this is running a red – I myself am very dubious of those temporary traffic light/contraflows. They’re not set up with cyclists in mind, the timings do not allow for cyclist speeds and it’s almost impossible to clear them before the upstream light releases a bunch of drivers towards you (all of whom assume you’ve run a red instead of being caught out by the timings, and all of whom will happily have a head-on with you to teach you a lesson). These set-ups have been the source of a number of NMOTD entries - including a particularly terrifying one involving a lorry.

If I encounter one, I must admit, I’ll usually seek to go around it rather that through it. Though I'll usually dismount.

You have a perfectly acceptable and legal option: get off and walk through the lights. Cycling through them on red is illegal. Full stop.

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Rendel Harris replied to ShutTheFrontDawes | 9 months ago
4 likes

ShutTheFrontDawes wrote:

Ah, another one to put in the list of quotes under "Rendel Harris: he really is that stupid". That you quote Marcus Aurelius on here to look intelligent is increasingly comical. You red-light-jumping hypocrite.

Ah, another one to put in the list of quotes under "ShutTheFrontDawes: he really does have some very worrying anger issues; one can only hope that by being so gratuitously and furiously offensive to so many people so regularly online he lets off steam that stops him behaving like this in real life." Get well soon.

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ShutTheFrontDawes replied to Rendel Harris | 9 months ago
0 likes
Rendel Harris wrote:

ShutTheFrontDawes wrote:

Ah, another one to put in the list of quotes under "Rendel Harris: he really is that stupid". That you quote Marcus Aurelius on here to look intelligent is increasingly comical. You red-light-jumping hypocrite.

Ah, another one to put in the list of quotes under "ShutTheFrontDawes: he really does have some very worrying anger issues; one can only hope that by being so gratuitously and furiously offensive to so many people so regularly online he lets off steam that stops him behaving like this in real life." Get well soon.

Perhaps you should try to improve yourself so that you're not such a danger on the roads. If you don't know that cycling through a red light is illegal I expect that there are plenty of other dangerous and/or illegal things you do (whether you self-justify with some rediculous excuse or not).

Waste no more time arguing about what a good man should be. Be one.

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Rendel Harris replied to ShutTheFrontDawes | 9 months ago
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ShutTheFrontDawes wrote:

Waste no more time arguing about what a good man should be. Be one.

Excellent! There you are, if I hadn't quoted old Marcus you wouldn't have gone looking him up to find a telling quote, so you've learned something. You're welcome.

Maybe soon you could learn the difference between riding through a red light and riding past it on the left in a cordoned off deactivated lane.

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ShutTheFrontDawes replied to Rendel Harris | 9 months ago
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Rendel Harris wrote:

Maybe soon you could learn the difference between riding through a red light and riding past it on the left in a cordoned off deactivated lane.

There is literally no difference.

The highway code is clear: "You MUST obey all traffic light signals"

The law (RTA 1988) is clear:
"(1)Where a traffic sign, being a sign [...] has been lawfully placed on or near a road, a person driving or propelling a vehicle who fails to comply with the indication given by the sign is guilty of an offence.

It really is that simple.

Red light means stop Rendel. A child knows it.

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Car Delenda Est replied to ShutTheFrontDawes | 9 months ago
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Let's be realistic: lawful or not RLJ cyclists are no more dangerous than a jogger crossing the road.

However it can potentially make the cyclist safer by removing the possibility of them being left hooked/rear ended by the car behind

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ShutTheFrontDawes replied to Car Delenda Est | 9 months ago
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Car Delenda Est wrote:

Let's be realistic: lawful or not RLJ cyclists are no more dangerous than a jogger crossing the road

Tell that to Peter McCombie. Oh wait, you can't because he's dead. Killed by a red-light-jumping cyclist.

We have these laws for a reason. Don't pretend otherwise.

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Car Delenda Est replied to ShutTheFrontDawes | 9 months ago
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I never said it was without risk and as I said in my amended post: it can potentially make the cyclist safer by removing the possibility of them being left hooked/rear ended by the car behind.

I believe that road death statistics would decrease if cyclists could treat a red as a 'give way'

And before you argue that I'm trying to legalise dangerous cycling: the current law did no more to deter Emir Loka than what I'm proposing, and they would be no less at fault if they caused a collision

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wycombewheeler replied to ShutTheFrontDawes | 9 months ago
3 likes

ShutTheFrontDawes wrote:
Rendel Harris wrote:

Maybe soon you could learn the difference between riding through a red light and riding past it on the left in a cordoned off deactivated lane.

There is literally no difference. The highway code is clear: "You MUST obey all traffic light signals" The law (RTA 1988) is clear: "(1)Where a traffic sign, being a sign [...] has been lawfully placed on or near a road, a person driving or propelling a vehicle who fails to comply with the indication given by the sign is guilty of an offence. It really is that simple. Red light means stop Rendel. A child knows it.

so where there are multiple lanes, does a red on any of the lanes mean all lanes should stop? Or do you accept that red lights can apply only specifically to some lanes. They certainly never apply to a pavement.

So in the example of cordoned of roadworks, is the correct result to go through only on green, staying out of the coned off area in the certain knowledge the oncoming traffis will be bearing down on you before you get out the other end, because we know that roadworks never consider giving enough time for cyclists.

I have to say i was ttempted to stop and walk all the way back through the roadworks infront of him (after all bikes have no reverse) and then sit and enjoy the case when drivers coming the other way proved as bloody minded as the one approhing me, when the driver coming the other way could clearly see me in the roadworks when they decided their light was green so they would go regardless.

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