Philip Pullman’s “damn fools” rant about cyclists without lights or hi-vis; Dan Martin’s Brexit ballache; Nine points and hefty fine for close pass shocker; Cyclist calls 30-second timeout on driver; Pelé-ton & Virgil van Bike + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
Bike thief removes glass pane to raid apartment storage
We cover a lot of bike thefts here at road.cc, it’s an unfortunate reality of owning a bicycle — someone somewhere will nick it if they can. However, rarely are they this organised, committed and professional…
Vancouver Police are investigating after a bike thief was caught on CCTV raiding the bike storage facility of an apartment building by removing a glass pane from the door. Building manager Ovidiu Mihuti told Global News the thief used suction cups to remove the panels, before using bolt cutters to remove six expensive bikes, believed to have been singled out.
The building manager believes it was a multi-day operation, involving a group of offenders who scouted the scene twice in the week before the raid. One man then returned early on Monday morning to complete the break in.
“It was on the night between Sunday and Monday,” Mihuti said. “They came without masks, they came without gloves or anything. Just tools and that’s all. I have no idea what’s the mentality of it.”
> “It makes you feel powerless” – victims in UK’s bike theft capital share their frustrations
Closer to home, Met Police yesterday recovered a £50,000 haul of stolen bikes. The force says six owners have been reunited with their bikes, some worth up to £6,500.
Cycle-ball: Football on a bike...time for your best/worst footballer cycling puns
Starting today, the 2021 UCI Indoor Cycling World Championships!
🌈 Cycle-ball & Artistic cycling
🗓 Oct 29-31#Stuttgart2021— UCI (@UCI_cycling) October 29, 2021
Who’d be good at this? Jimmy Floyd Saddlebaink, Harry Chain, Chainy Vardy, Ashley Roll, Wheelo Ferdinand…cut me some slack, it’s early.
Chris Boardman preps for COP26
More power to you, Chris
— Ned Boulting (@nedboulting) October 28, 2021
"I decided that he should face consequences": Fantastically petty New York cyclist shouts 30-second time out for dangerous driver...before wishing them a nice day
Cyclist really just put this driver in a 30s timeout then everyone went about their day 😂 #whatisnewyork pic.twitter.com/TbigirRUzF
— WhatIsNewYork (@whatisny) October 22, 2021
This one’s from last week, but too good not to share. The pettiness of it all, loud and proud counting, delaying his own journey, topped off by the cheerful “have a nice day”…tremendous. There’s almost certainly a serious point behind it about cyclists having to protect themselves from serious injury on the road, but we’re just going to enjoy it for the theatrical value…
Dan Miller owned up to this display of road karma, explaining: “Hey, this was actually me. So just before the video begins, I was riding in the bike lane, with the car to my left. The car, either not knowing I was there or not caring, made a right turn directly into my path and I had to jam on the breaks. It was dangerous and shitty driving.
“I yelled and hollered and both of us had to come to a stop. At that point, I decided that he should face consequences, so he got a thirty-second time out.”
His efforts didn’t go unrewarded either. Bike Lane Uprising, the app allowing cyclists to easily report drivers parked in cycle lanes, has a new hero…
Dearest, @meelar – please slide into the dm’s with your shirt size and shipping address 😘
— Bike Lane Uprising® (@bikelaneuprise) October 22, 2021
— 👼🚵♂️ Boulder Fiets Opa 🚵♂️👼 (@BikeBoulderBike) October 22, 2021
Not all heroes wear capes
— Entitled Cyclist🚲 (@EntitledCycling) October 22, 2021
The footballer cycling puns are rolling in...
Bobonabike, Chrisonatrike and roboito, take a bow! Virgil van Bike, Saddle-o Mane, Carbon Robben and Donny van der Bike. Very strong work…let me chuck Kurt Zoom-a and Rim (brake) Cahill into the mix…
Here’s some more cycle-ball for your entertainment…
Cycle ball is the weirdest sport you’ve probably never heard of pic.twitter.com/lDCuFVUvic
— Mashable (@mashable) January 12, 2020
EDIT: Stop the count. We have a winner…Peléton! mdavidford, take the acclaim of the entire live blog…
Bontrager's new "do-it-all" helmet
Bontrager has released its new Circuit WaveCel “do-it-all” helmet with an aerodynamic profile as well as Blendr magnetic mounts for attaching a GoPro and daytime running lights. “With premium features and a comfort-focused fit, plus a 5-star rating from Virginia Tech’s third-party testing facility, the Circuit WaveCel is at home from the tarmac to trail, bike path to bike park,” says Trek. What’s more, it is made with 50% post-consumer recycled EPS foam.
The new Circuit includes WaveCel technology which is a collapsible cellular structure that lines the inside of the helmet. “It’s designed to be more effective than traditional foam helmets in protecting heads from injuries caused by certain cycling accidents,” says Trek.
Versatility is also covered with the helmet’s mount. “The magnetic connection makes light installation simple, stays secure through rough and fast riding, and is tested for breakaway forces to make sure accessories detach in the event of a crash,” says Trek.
"One of the worst reports we've received": Nine points and heavy fine for close pass shocker
One of the worst #closepass reports we’ve received.
Footage viewed several times in court on Tuesday to accentuate the gravity of the overtaking manoeuvre. Driver received:
Points: 9
Fine: £660
Surcharge: £66
Costs: £110Report an incident on the road: https://t.co/s6rV2KEBEy pic.twitter.com/wzOn84kC8Z
— ASPolice Roads Policing (RPU) (@ASPRoadSafety) October 29, 2021
Avon and Somerset Roads Policing Unit called this close pass “one of the worst reports we’ve received”. The driver appeared at court this week and received nine points, a £660 fine, as well as a £66 surcharge and £110 costs.
Despite the severity of the punishment, some asked if it went far enough…
Pretty sure that would be an instant Driving Test fail.
Why is this driver allowed to keep their Driving Licence?
— Fonant (@fonant) October 29, 2021
Others pointed out the driver of the red car in front also overtook on solid white lines ahead of the oncoming vehicle…
Avon and Somerset Police urged cyclists to report incidents via their website. Here’s some more of the reaction…
Richard Chambers said: “I assume the red car before the really really close pass also received points on their license? They also overtook too close and over a solid white line.”
Yep, I thought the red car was bad, with the truck coming the other way… That cyclist was luck to stay upright and not get killed by any following cars. Shocking.
— Peter Lewis (@PeterH_Lewis) October 29, 2021
That’s shocking.
Not just the pass, but that someone who did that, and was shown to do that in court, is still driving.
— Yeti (@yetiayrshore) October 29, 2021
The real crime...
Romanian police have recovered the Italian team’s stolen bikes, including Filippo Ganna’s gold Pinarello. One reader wasn’t so sure who the real bad guys are…hasn’t that poor Pinarello been through enough?
Wtf. That’s a crime.
They put the frame against those shelves!!!
— Sjoerd Driven F1 🏳️🌈 (@F1Sjoerd) October 29, 2021
> Romanian police recover Italian team bikes stolen from UCI Track Cycling World Championships
Dan Martin's Brexit ballache...but finally gets old team kit sent off to deserving charities
Packaged up some jerseys to send off to charities including a special item for @actionmedres but so far shipping is proving tricky. Now on my 3rd trip to the post office hoping I finally have the necessary Brexit customs paperwork. #thirdtimelucky
— Dan Martin (@DanMartin86) October 29, 2021
Three trips to the post office later and Mrs Martin can hopefully finally breathe a sigh of relief…all that old team kit is gone. Post-retirement, the two-time Monument winner put the call out on Twitter for suggestions about where he could send the pile of team kit at his gaff and was inundated with helpful replies. Let’s hope that paperwork was alright…
"I feel good, although not great, but I don't have to yet": Alex Dowsett arrives in Mexico ahead of Hour Record attempt
Alex Dowsett is having another crack at the Hour Record. In 2015, he held the record briefly before Sir Bradley Wiggins, and then Victor Campenaerts, bested his distance. Dowsett’s attempt is scheduled for November 3 and is happening at high altitude in Mexico at Aguascalientes’s velodrome — the same venue used by Campenaerts in 2019.
“I feel good, although there is no super feeling yet, but I should only be super within a week. That will come when I have processed the journey and am fully acclimatized. I’m good for it,” Dowsett said.
“We’ve already done some four-minute tests and we’re also testing tire pressures.”
Dowsett’s attempt will be broadcast by the BBC and on his YouTube channel at 4pm next Wednesday.
Philip Pullman's "damn fools" rant about cyclists without lights or hi-vis
The number of cyclists speeding through Oxford at night, with no lights, wearing dark clothes, is astonishing. Damn fools.
— Philip Pullman (@PhilipPullman) October 28, 2021
Philip Pullman writes something that gets people talking. Cool. Philip Pullman writes something about cycling that gets people talking. Now we’re listening…
His target? Cyclists in Oxford “speeding” about at night without lights or hi-vis. Cycling commentator and writer Ned Boulting challenged the author’s statement, saying: “I get how this might have annoyed you. But, please think twice about this kind of tweet. Unless you are a regular cyclists, you may not be aware of the levels of aggression we encounter day in and day out, not just on platforms such as this, but actually on the roads.
Before then apologising for sounding “sanctimonious” and accepting the author had “every right” to raise the point.
Plenty, of course, raised the point that lights and hi-vis are often used as a stick to beat cyclists when there are other more significant factors affecting safety…
Both of my friends who were killed cycling in Oxford were during the daytime. Lights and high vis wouldn’t have helped them.
— Claire Lucas (@profclairelucas) October 29, 2021
Meanwhile, motor vehicles cause this each year on Oxfordshire’s road which appears not to grate Phil’s gears at all. https://t.co/qSLFGzlqUh pic.twitter.com/4cM7E7dJ96
— Peter Smith (@Pinarello_Pete) October 29, 2021
Some agreed with the author however…
‘I’m a keen cyclist’ is not a licence to excuse people driving without looking where they are going. Lights are a legal requirement, but insisting on hi-viz is just victim blaming and excusing poor driving.
— Mike Stead (@tweetymike) October 29, 2021
Whilst the colour of clothing is irrelevant. The lack of lights is not. It is stupidity and dangerous for all road users and pedestrians in not using lights.
Yes there are idiots on radio, SM who have a pop, normally it’s easy to ignore/engage. But no lights is 🤦🏻♂️— Dave 💙 (@Davebot90324770) October 29, 2021
Others, like road.cc news editor Simon, just wanted to deliver the goods…
Their Dark Materials. https://t.co/0MnEdrSWK1
— Simone Di Michele 🇮🇹 (@simonmacmichael) October 29, 2021
road.cc on the ground at IWGB protest about cuts to London cycle training budget
Simon was on the ground at IWGB Cycling Instructors Branch’s protest ride today against the cuts to London’s cycle training budget. We’ll have a full story about it up on site over the weekend…
Who will be crowned national hill climb champ?
Sunday’s a big day in the world of hill climbing. Arguably, the biggest day. It’s hill climb national championships day. This short film will get you in the mood for some suffering. road.cc Liam informs me he’ll be there, battling up Winnats Pass considerably slower than the best. In fact, he went as far as to say that if he wins we can freely accuse him of nefarious practice…I’ll be on the sofa with my feet up.
Andrew Feather is the reigning champ. Somebody Liam knows well from our ‘bike or rider’ vid…answering the all-important question: just how bad a bike would Andrew need to be riding for Liam to beat him up a climb?
29 October 2021, 07:29
29 October 2021, 07:29
29 October 2021, 07:29
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Latest Comments
@Paul J Van Schip certainly seems a bit of a dick, but he's a European and multiple World Champion on the track, pretty sure you don't get there without having some talent in your legs.
Poor Vincent cannot get over the simple fact that given the choice people prefer dedicated cycling spaces, rather than pretending to be cars like vehicular cyclists.
What is the point of the fancy air sensor if it can't account for changing weather conditions?? If all you care about is a delayed approximation of aerodynamic watts in steady conditions, you don't need any special sensors for that. Just your speed on a decently flat course is enough to approximate rolling resistance and drivetrain losses. And the rest must be aero. If you assume a less aero body position at the same watts, your speed will drop while rolling resistance also drops, which means approximated aero watts goes up. And that's enough to demonstrate what you've shown in your testing protocol ("I sat upright and the number went up a little while later").
Your correction is accurate - it's almost always been "the (lack of) thought that (doesn't) count". "Massive" - less than a billion a year spent on active travel (trying to catch up / building a network across the entire country) Not massive - 6 billion every year (2026-2030) spent on road *maintenance* of existing "already built, goes everywhere, very convenient" road network for inactive travel Ultimately the reason "cycle infra" is *needed* is those unbelievably colossal amounts spent every year (and for more than a century now) on making mass motoring not just viable but apparently the "best choice" for most journeys. As the Dutch and others have shown, the majority of people *are* prepared to cycle and even mix with very light, slow local motor traffic *if* cycling is also made safe and convenient for the whole of their journey (including secure parking at both ends). (The history of the financial drivers of the current situation are a complex topic but note that while people complain about "crumbling roads" and underfunded motor infra - with some reason - by us continuing the fuel duty escalator freeze (for example) we're actually helping motorists pay *even less* for that activity / subsidising more of the cost of driving than ever.)
yes, but people will still object - which was my point.
So ' Priority of Road Users' and 1.5 metre clearance at 30mph has been been reduced to 'sharing'? NCN route 2 here in South Hams is an absolute scream with white vans, tractors and total idiots who refuse,or are totally incapable,to reverse on high Devon banked lanes ...means you have to get off and pedal back to a passing place....could be at that all day...so I don't bother...
@MaxiMinimalist Agreed. The big problem I see now is today's parents grew up being driven to their schools, and therefore, see private motor vehicles as the only viable form of transport. The vast majority of UK infant and primary schools have a catchment area that is within easy walking distance from home to school. Yet, the traffic caused by pupils being driven to/from school is astonishing. Banishing the "School Run" should be a priority for all schools.
When I was a kid (that was during the previous millenium when phones were connected to a plug in the wall), I rode my bicycle to school, music academy, sport grounds, parties even during the winter. The government didn't have to spend, correct that, didn't have to think of spending massive amounts of money to build cycling specific infrastructures. Over the past 3 or 4 decades, cars have grown bigger, taller, safer (for their drivers) and faster. Meanwhile, motorists have become abusive, aggressive, hypersensitive to people moving on two wheels, aka cyclists. Spending billions upon billions on new infrastructure won't address the crux of the matter. Sadly.
Obree had some actual talent in his legs though, in addition to his bike/aero engineering talent.
Малко като опит за доказване е излязло... Никой няма нужда от толкова голям въртящ момент и мощност на шосеен велосипед с тънки гуми, които дори трудно ще предават тази мощност върху пътя. А ако има и ограничение от 25 км/час е още по-безмислено.
88 thoughts on “Philip Pullman’s “damn fools” rant about cyclists without lights or hi-vis; Dan Martin’s Brexit ballache; Nine points and hefty fine for close pass shocker; Cyclist calls 30-second timeout on driver; Pelé-ton & Virgil van Bike + more on the live blog”
Manual Neuer, Virgil van Bike
Manual Neuer, Virgil van Bike, Saddle-o Mané… I’ll be back later with the rest of my five a side team.
Carbon Robben if you want a
Carbon Robben if you want a lighter player.
£100,000 reward for the
£100,000 reward for the return of 2 bikes !!
https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/19679619.clacton-annual-naked-bike-ride-organiser-targeted-bike-thief/
Mr Brown said the reward will be offered on several conditions. He said: “Firstly, the bikes must be returned to Clacton Police Station or the nearest station.
“Secondly the information has to lead to the arrest, prosecution, conviction and sentence of the person responsible.
“Finally the person claiming the reward must not have had any involvement with the theft of the bikes.”
Donny Van der Bike
Donny Van der Bike
Bobonabike wrote:
Only to be found on the bike rack (bench), not on the road (pitch) ☹
I’d be wheely good at Cycle
I’d be wheely good at Cycle-ball.
you’re welcome.
My five-a-side team – I’ve
My five-a-side team – I’ve gone for a blend of the requisite skills.
Eros Keeperchi
Lars Fullbak
Demi Spokes
Matteo Rabonatini
Aero Lennon
Subs:
Quillian
Christine Playmakerus
Coach: Hernan Crossbar
Goodwill Ambassador: Peléton
30 second time penalty
30 second time penalty delivered immediately for dangerous driving? I couldn’t agree more!
It probably seemed like an eternity for the driver, and is likely to have had a significant impact on their standard of driving, probably better than getting a small fine or sent on a course six months later.
A nice reminder that the few
A nice reminder that the few seconds you may save by driving dangerously really are not worth it.
eburtthebike wrote:
I’d be tempted to try this myself, but my own impatience would be my undoing. Also, I wonder what percentage of bad drivers would just turn violent and threatening when presented with a delay?
hawkinspeter wrote:
Could try just for a few seconds whilst saying “Bad driver!….Baaad driver!” in a firm commanding voice whilst hold in up a finger
hawkinspeter wrote:
Ask Our Nige – I bet they know, and have graphs and media interviews to prove it, plus a statement from ‘top lawyers’… 😉
brooksby wrote:
there is only one top lawyer as well you know
Whatever % have a car leased
Whatever % have a car leased through a company. Then you can assault people with impunity.
It wouldn’t work over here.
It wouldn’t work over here.
They would just drive over you.
I suspect that many times
I suspect that many times drivers who are willing to risk someone’s life to save a few seconds are suddenly happy to take all the time in the world to explain why nothing they did was wrong, if a cyclist so much as raises a Roger Moore eyebrow at them…
brooksby wrote:
I remember one particular occasion when I was riding my bent and towing a trailer, on my way to a cycle festival in Bristol, was close passed, and I shouted out in fear and shock. The driver stopped and explained to me that he’d given me lots of room.
That cycle soccer looks very
That cycle soccer looks very similar to unicycle hockey in terms of bike handling, though it looks more complex as you can use either wheel for balancing and shooting. Their bike handling does look similar to unicycle tricks – hopping on one wheel etc.
Well done ASP RPU. Excellent
Well done ASP RPU. Excellent job
None of the “better” helmets
None of the “better” helmets comes with a bug mesh, not sure why that is. But I wonder, does the wavecell stuff keep the flying critters out, at least the bigger, bitey-stingy sort?
Sriracha wrote:
Better? You mean more expensive, right? The only thing those helmets have going for them is better advertising and more gullible consumers.
Not cycling related per se,
Not cycling related per se, but here’s a classic example of “financial hardship” being expoited: https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/eliza-manners-fined-fifty-pounds-speeding-pleading-financial-hardship-b963014.html
According to “Mr Loophole” /
According to “Mr Loophole” / lawyer to celebrities Nick Freeman, she would have had to declare her income and outgoings. Presumably she has no means of income and is supported by her parents.
So the article says she has
So the article says she has her own business, was driving an Audi and lives in a £700,000 apartment in Notting Hill and was fined less than half her declared weekly income.
Sounds like she does have means of income apart from her parents.
And she couldn’t afford a £100 fine but in the end it cost her £50 plus £84 court costs and she pleaded guilty too.
DoomeFrog wrote:
Yeah, but the £50 fine might have caused her “cashflow problems”, apparently (?).
DoomeFrog wrote:
I wouldn’t want to have any dealings with a business that might go bust over a £50 cashflow shortfall.
Re: footballer cycling puns,
Re: footballer cycling puns:
Any information on how
Any information on how powerful the magnets on the Bontrager helmet are?
Will they make the wearer smarter?
Will they promote healing?
Will they block the 5G?
andystow wrote:
You’ll need the foil upgrade for those features….
Captain Badger wrote:
But it will allow mind control by Bill Gates out of the box.
mdavidford wrote:
Nah, that functionality is only enabled on download of the app jab2.0
Captain Badger wrote:
— Captain Badgerjab 2.0 is not compatible with older devices so you’ll probably end up needing a new phone and GPS to get it to work properly.
And a monthly subscription to unlock the genuinely useful features.
andystow wrote:
I think they aid blood flow by drawing dissolved iron to the top of the head
You should use lights at
You should use lights at night to be seen and to see.
Hi viz – not essential as we all know from bitter experience.
I do have hi viz as I am on nsl no streetlights and I am now older and have a low risk appetite *. My view reflects the poor standard of driving I see, so really it is forcing vulnerable users to accommodate those who have a higher requirement to drive safely but are not held to account properly.
* I have even started using a rear light in the day in low light conditions.
Another case of Schrodinger’s
Another case of Schrodinger’s cyclists – simultaneously invisible and yet somehow frequently seen.
See my comment below about
See my comment below about walking in Oxford recently – yes we saw them, but much later and so being forced to react more hastily (thereby increasing the chances of one of us, as pedestrians, making an error) than we would if they’d had lights on.
If you, as pedestrians, are
If you, as pedestrians, are having to take evasive action to avoid cyclists, I would say that the bigger problem is with their general manner of cycling rather than their lack of lights.
Well you might say that but
Well you might say that but if that is the case then I guess motor vehicles don’t need light either, in fact when I was a youngster cars only used sidelights making cyclists more visible under street lighting. Since a succesful campaign to make vehicles use full headlights it makes cyclists and pedestrians harder to see when against a background of headlights making lights for cyclists fairly important if you wish to live.
Re Philip Pullman’s comments,
Re Philip Pullman’s comments, I happened to be in Oxford last Wednesday for a gig and met up with my father, who lives nearby, for a couple of pints; walking around the closed streets near the Bodleian and round the back of the High on a damp misty evening it really was surprising how many cyclists were whipping through shared spaces at high speed and without lights (a noticeably higher proportion than on my home turf in London, and compliance isn’t exactly brilliant here), as well as using the pavement as an extension of the roadway even where the road was closed to cars. Being in company with an eighty-year-old with poor hearing who relies heavily on visuals made it a pretty stressful experience. We can argue endlessly about hi-vis, helmets, daylight lights etc, but surely nobody thinks it’s OK to ride without lights at night, do they? Seriously?
BTBS does cos the ctc said so
BTBS does cos the ctc said so in 1930.
Rendel Harris wrote:
Clearly some do….
I think that folk are concerned that the lights issue is used distract from negligent driving
While I have argued that an
While I have argued that an attentive driver will see cyclists with or without lights, and thats it’s amazing how people who think cyclists without lights are invisible see enough of them to complain about it.
It is not OK to ride without lights at night, I guess sometimes people get caught out, and hadn’t expected to be out until dark when they left home, and sometimes peoples batteries run out but then there are probably are those thinking they can get away wiht their short journey without buying lights.
wycombewheeler wrote:
It’s a somewhat specious argument though, isn’t it? You may see someone without lights but far later than you could have done, e.g. in the mornings I ride across the Clapham Road, a popular route into town; it’s not uncommon to have to brake for a cyclist without lights who was to all intents and purposes invisible and then became visible as they came within the beam of a streetlamp or my own lights.
You have jsut reminded me of
You have just reminded me of an encounter at traffic light controlled crossroads. I was waiting to turn left (I know, crazy, I didn’t jump the red), as the light changed and I moved off, the next thing I know is a cyclist coming straight at me!
He was turning right into my road but overtook the cars and cut the corner by a huge margin.
No lights, dark clothes. I could not see him with the headlights of the cars in play.
So it is not just motorists who have to see cyclists.
I agree. I often see cars at
I agree. I often see cars at night with no rear lights on (when I’ve managed to alert the drivers – including, once, the driver of a police van – they’re oblivious that they only have daytime running lights on at the front). The fact that I have so far managed to see them doesn’t make it sensible. On the other hand though, I have seen cyclists with cheap lights which, while they satisfy the legal requirement, don’t do much at all for visibility.
quiff wrote:
Totally agree with that, the inadequacy of some lights is quite startling as is the fact that people are prepared to ride with them as their only protection – especially as £10-£15 on Amazon will get you a set of very adequate lights.
quiff wrote:
It’s always baffled me (and those drivers too, I guess, there’s plenty of them) as to why the regulations provide for cars to have DRLs front only. No surprise at all that many drivers assume that their lights are on front and rear, for since when was it ever possible to switch car lights on at one end only?
Agreed. My car predates DRLs,
Agreed. My car predates DRLs, so I’ve only experienced them when I’ve had hire cars etc, but I was also struck that the dashboard in these seemed to be lit at all times (not sure if that’s universal). If the instrument lights only came on with the side/headlights then maybe that would be another cue to drivers that they were not suitably lit.
quiff wrote:
I swear I picked up a hire car in the states wherre the opposte was ture, the dashboard was illuminated more brightly when the lights were off.
So until I got out of the brightly lit car park and onto the unlit road, i thought the lights were on.
quiff wrote:
My wife and I have both changed cars over the last 12 months. Both our current vehicles are over 10 years old (2007 and 2009 to be precise) and both have dashboard lights that are always on. They do still pre-date DRLs though.
The issue for me is in low light, where you can’t really see your headlights on the road in front of you. I am still getting used to the fact that the dashboard being lit up doesn’t mean that the external lights are on.
Jetmans Dad wrote:
My 2005 jalopy (sometimes referred to as the Wanty Gobert team car before they got good) has instruments lit like Piccadilly Circus all the time, so I dimmed it. Hence when the headlights are on, the dash is dim, but when off
it’s like looking into a low sun just before running someone over.
I just had to get used to it being the other way around from anything sensible.
DRLs are another stupidity. I think aimed at motorists who are unable to find the light switch in murky conditions, but leads to everything being lit and so nothing stands out. Like painting the entire world hi vis yellow, it appeals to people who have never heard of camouflage.
When it’s foggy I get
When it’s foggy I get annoyed by cars without fog lights on or indeed with no lights on at all. If it’s a bit misty how hard is it to switch on the purpose specific lights that you actually paid for. Yes it does ensure that you are seen earlier.
However, I don’t have thousands of followers and even if I did I don’t think stating it will make a difference.
And the flipside – those who
And the flipside – those who use their fogs when it’s not foggy. Usually only the front ones because it looks cool (nah, they’re not fog lights mate, they’re ‘driving’ lights – I confess, I was guilty of this in younger times) but there are some who manage to do the rear too.
Rear ones are because ‘it was
Rear ones are because ‘it was a bit misty last week’.
‘Oh, should I have turned it off at night now it is a cloudless evening?’
IanMK wrote:
Rule 236. You MUST NOT use front or rear fog lights unless visibility is seriously reduced. as they dazzle other road users and can obscure your brake lights.
so not when ‘it’s a bit misty’, although the reason for this has become a ,little obsolete with the advent of high level centre brake lights.
Rendel Harris wrote:
And how would that be different for a pedestrian or even a dog? Both of which I’m sure you would equally want to avoid hitting in the dark.
As I say, use lights it’s sensible and helpful to others, it can certainly reduce the chances of someone pulling out of a side road in front of you, and hopefully not get lost among the lights of other cars.
But lack of lights should not be a get out of jail free card for drivers, because they should be driving to be able to stop in the space they can see to be clear, and that does not mean “no lights, means there is nothing there”
wycombewheeler wrote:
Because pedestrians and dogs aren’t generally mixing with motorised traffic in the middle of the road at 20mph plus?
Complains about all the
Complains about all the cyclists he sees without lights and hi vis.
why?
because he can’t see them.
Flippant comments aside,
Flippant comments aside, riding in the dark without lights is actually pretty stupid.
OnTheRopes wrote:
It’s also illegal
Working in Cardiff a while
Working in Cardiff a while ago and driving into the City centre at 6am in the dark I was actually gobsmacked at how many cyclists had no lights at all.
So many delivery cyclists
So many delivery cyclists with poor or non existent lights and reflectives. If they change the status of these workers then l would like to think that the company has to take more responsibility for health and safety.
I agree with what you say,
I agree with what you say, though most that I saw were commuters not delivery cyclists.
Haha, I misread the time. I
Haha, I misread the time. I’ll pay more attention in future.
IanMK wrote:
Yes they would. If they are employed the employer must ensure that they are provided with sufficient H&S equipment to carry out their job safely.
In addition, the employer must also conduct H&S risk assessments for the role (the previous implies that teh above has been done, otherwise how would you identify what equipment the employee requires?)
Facking elf and safety. No wonder tech billionaires can’t turn a profit….
IanMK wrote:
You’re very much right – I did notice this evening though, strolling back from a cheeky pre-prandial snifter with Mrs H in the local, that all the JustEat riders, in this neighbourhood at least, had excellent wired-in lights on their ebikes. Probably the difference between company-supplied bikes and other companies like Deliveroo where, I believe, the rider supplies their own bike?
Just before Pandemic in Jan
Just before Pandemic in Jan 2020 I was in London walking back to my Tower Bridge hotel. The CS there had a significant proportion of cyclists either without lights, with lights but poor rear ones that you could barely see after 10 yards, and one memorable woman whose long coat dropped down past her stem mounted rear light. In the old days with the D battery eaters, it was probably more understandable, but in this age when a decent pair of lights cost about £30-40 and can be charged anywhere, it is perplexing.
haha or the even earlier D
haha or the even earlier D size ‘Never Readies’ – had to stop every now and then to hit them
Of course lights not being
Of course lights not being used is going to be used as another stick to beat us with.
They are, after all, a legal requirement.
The respondents below who are transferring responsibility on to the car driver (not supposed to drive faster than they can see etc) why would you not want to use lights?
I’ll also ask if you’ve been seriously, life changingly injured while out on your bike. As someone who has, I find this constant shift of responsibility to the car driver unfathomable. Yes, they should be looking out for other road users … But so should we.
In the good old days, lights had batteries that could be changed; so you carried spare batteries or money so you could buy new ones.
Now, USB charging has all but made that redundant, and not all lights have adequate end of life warnings.
Small, high intensity lights that clip on your seat post or handlebars are a very cheap alternative to the spare battery and as a backup to your main lights.
There really is no excuse for riding at night with no lights.
Oldfatgit wrote:
I hope your injuries still allow you to enjoy cycling in some form. Or at least some of the benefits (mobility, exercise, the outdoors) if not on a bike.
Never been seriously injured, had some close calls, had some injuries through my own stupidity. Thankfully never hit anyone else in any vehicle.
You say “I find this constant shift of responsibility to the car driver unfathomable.” Why? And why do you think it’s a shift of responsibility?
I’m sure you’re a better individual than I am in terms of “mustn’t grumble” / getting on with the positives of living. I’m interested – are any / several / none of the following your point?
Your opinion may something completely unrelated to the points above. It may be the same as before your accident, it may not. I’m just interested what it is.
Thank you ChrisOnATrike
Thank you ChrisOnATrike
(I’ve not quoted the whole post for brevity)
Part of the many injuries I sustained, was my left kneecap was shattered in to 4 pieces and my PCL was snapped in two. The kneecap was brought back together using pins and tension wire, but the PCL was left (I don’t blame them, it was emergency surgery, and I had enough trauma to recover from. From what I’ve read, PCL recovery is an absolute nightmare; as it was I couldn’t walk unsupported or bend my knee for 4 months)
Despite hours of intense physio, this has left me with a limp and I can’t walk very far without a stick.
One of the hardest things was laying in my bed in HDU, on a breathing tube, wires everywhere, and having to look at my kids (youngest was 8 and refuses to remember anything about it). I don’t have the vocabulary to describe my feelings that my kids nearly lost their dad, and that is only through sheer chance (a paramedic unit saw the accident, stopped and got my heart restarted a few times until help arrived).
Btw, the collision happened at 1745 in broad daylight, with no mitigating circumstances.
Cycling wise .. I tried getting back on a bike. I was ok for about 15 miles or so if it’s flat; after that it hurt. I mean, *hurt*. Not just for the immediate day, but for almost a week after. I must admit, there were times of get home from a (much shortened) club ride, I’d be in tears and hit the industrial strength painkiller.
I’m a hobby cyclist; I cycle purely for fun and for the health benefits. I have s stressful job (don’t we all nowadays), and cycling helps – especially group cycling.
I hired an e-bike … Wow – what a difference.
I went out and brought one, and there has been no stopping me since. I’ve recently completed my first 100 mile ride (ok, I was in bits afterwards, not going to lie about that).
As for the ‘mustn’t grumble’ … I whine like a scalded cat 🙂 . I’ve had depression since the accident. My mental outlook isn’t anymore positive than anyone else’s. If there’s a dark side to something, I’ll look at that first.
The accident had changed the way I ride. Unless I’m in a group, you won’t find me hugging the kerb. Closest I’ll get is the nearside wheel rut. Normally, I’ll sit in the middle of the lane. I’ve become more aggressive, less passive in my riding; I tend to ride like I drive my car: its *my* lane, and if you don’t like it, you’re free to overtake …
I still get close passes – had one or two NMotD on here – but I tend to be quite calm about them now. I’ve stopped myself shouting expletives by shouting the reg number instead (you’ll not be surprised to know I ride with front and back cameras).
I pretty much agree with your bullet points, and that’s why I find the shift unfathomable.
My interpretation of some of the posts below is “so what if you’ve not got lights. Car drivers *should* see you; it’s their responsibility, so it’s fine to ride at night without lights”
I’m sure that I’m not alone in reading that message.
We are vulnerable, we are not surrounded by amour plate.
We have a duty to our families, ourselves, friends and other road users to protect ourselves.
I don’t agree with hi-vis; it’s a waste of time. Brights with reflective strips work better (although I love my ProVis jacket, but where I am is rual and it gets *dark).
Why wouldn’t someone want to give others as much notice as they can of their presence? Why would you want to put your life at risk like that … for the sake of £20?
Why do some people see it as a defeat; that we’re pandering to the car driving fraternity? We’re not, it’s a legal requirement.
My claim will be going to the High Court (I’m in Scotland), even though we have admission of 100% responsibility from the other party … and the accident happened 3 years ago.
If you don’t have lights on at night and get seriously injured, then you can forget any real compensation.
I lost 18 months wages … I’ll get that back, but if a rider had no lights, then it’s mitigating circumstances, and good luck getting a payout.
Sorry if it’s a bit rambling as I’m on my phone, and if you got this far … thank you.
TLDR: protect yourself, aint none else going to do it.
I think we tie ourselves in
I think we tie ourselves in knots over this because we constantly confuse the aims of public policy with those of private initiative.
Public policy should make changes to our world to create a better safer place, and not instead constantly seek accommodations to allow us to safely endure the status quo.
Private initiative takes the world as it is and makes us safer within it.
So in the case of every councillor’s daughter, public policy should be to make the streets safe to walk without fear of harassment or worse, at any time of day or night. And yet which councillor would not advise their daughter to cover up a little more, maybe avoid certain places at night?
I don’t see a conflict between these two positions.
In the case of cycling of course public policy should aim to build proper infrastructure and make motorists drive safely. Crucially, public policy should not be for cyclists to accommodate dangerous driving, it should be to eliminate dangerous driving. But that does not mean that cyclists should not respond to the world as it is.
So as a cyclist I run DRLs and wear a helmet, whilst railing that I should not feel it necessary to do so. In other words I do take these measures whilst arguing vehemently against making them mandatory.
Sriracha wrote:
In the case of lights on a bike at night, there is no room for conflagration.
The Law clearly states that lights at night must be used by all road traffic, with the exception being pedestrians, who are advised to wear a reflective strip. Organised walks (qty of persons undefined) are supposed to have a white light to the front, and a red to the back (try selling that one to the Edinburgh ghost walks … ).
This Public policy does make our world a safer place (true, there are exceptions, but by their nature, they are exceptions) as it enables other road users to see us from a far greater distance, and in the vast majority of cases, alter their behaviour accordingly.
I do wonder, how many of the respondent’s below engaged in onus-shifting, ride at night with no lights?
Indeed, those who argue
Indeed, those who argue against lights at night should not be afforded the time of day!
Oldfatgit wrote:
True – a naked flame wouldn’t conform to BS6102/3.
mdavidford wrote:
It worked for trains 🙂
Early bicycle lights burned
Early bicycle lights burned acetylene generated from calcium carbide.
Once went caving getting the light from a similar system.
I have two front and two rear
I have two front and two rear lights. Each front/rear pair is on a different charge cycle so as to prevent having no lights due to running out of charge.
If you are aware that there
If you are aware that there are cyclists without lights and hiviz then surely you must be able to see them?
If they were totally invisible you would not be aware of any cyclists being there at all.
I always use lights day and night myself but I can always see the unlit cyclists because my lights light them up, just like a car headlights would.
You could argue that if you
You could argue that if you are aware that there are cars about without lights on then you must be able to see them, so maybe we don’t need lights at all?
Try seeing an unlit cyclist on a busy road at night when they are backlit by headlights, so if turning ot of a side road in front of oncoming traffic for example, if it’s raining it’s even worse.
It is true that if you drive for the conditions you should always be able to see an unlit cyclist, but quite frankly I find this being constantly used as some sort of defense as ridiculous.
Half the time the cyclists is
Half the time the cyclists is seen, it will be when they are nearby and coming the other way. As earlier, it’s no good seeing a cyclist going in the same direction late due to no lights.
You see unlit cyclists when they are within the range of your lights but you won’t see them when they are off to the side, above you, obscured by the lights of oncoming traffic.
yupiteru wrote:
You can only conclude that you can see some of them. How would you know you’d seen them all?
yupiteru wrote:
At what distance can you see the unlit cyclist?
5m?
10m?
30m?
100m?
20mph has a braking distance of 12m*
30mph has a braking distance of 23m*
*usual stuff about tyres, road, weather etc applies.
Well done A&S police for
Well done A&S police for prosecuting that murderous close pass and getting a result, and congratulations and admiration to the cyclist for staying upright. Like others, I was disapointed at the leniency of the sentence, even if it is much higher than other cases. The driver has demonstrated beyond all doubt that they are not competent to be in charge of a machine that kills and maims tens of thousands every year.
I’m starting to think that A
I’m starting to think that A&S are probably one of the best forces for cycling close passes submissions.
hawkinspeter wrote:
They were pretty good when I submitted a video of a spectacularly close pass a few years ago, even if they did mention my swearing.
Cyclist was lucky not to be
Cyclist was lucky not to be killed – could have easily come off and been runover by following traffic or landed in the opposite carriageway and run over.
Driver should have been banned immediately for a long time.
hirsute wrote:
Eternity.