Decathlon CEO apologises for bike shortages; More talk that Froome is to leave Ineos; UK’s first competitive BAME cycling team; Lachlan Morton’s everesting non-record; Chris Boardman takes MP to task for cycle helmet tweet; Schrodinger’s car driver + more
SUMMARY
Chris Boardman takes MP to task for cycle helmet tweet
Margaret Greenwood, the MP for Wirral West, yesterday tweeted that there has been an increase in the number of children with head injuries because more are cycling.
Greater Manchester’s cycling commissioner, Chris Boardman, who famously once said that the helmet issue is “a red herring” and “not even in the top 10 of things you need to do to keep cycling safe,” swiftly responded.
1) Have a look at safest places in the world to ride a bike and see what they advocate.
2) look at least safe places to ride a bike and see what they do.
3) Look at places they made ⛑ mandatory and see what happened to cycling levels and injury rates.
4) Form your opinion
👍 https://t.co/ozq4FCZYeF— Chris Boardman (@Chris_Boardman) June 17, 2020
We *think* Greenwood’s tweet may have arisen from comments made by the Major Trauma Co-ordinator at the Royal Hospital for Children (RHC) in Glasgow.
The Extra reports that the RHC has seen 18 children admitted with moderate trauma related to bikes in the three months of lockdown compared to 13 in the whole of 2019.
Reflecting on this, Mark Lilley said: “Fortunately, the vast majority of children are able to go home following assessment and treatment but for some children head injuries can be serious enough to require admission and can often go on to develop symptoms of concussion.
“This can lead to headaches, fatigue, poor concentration, poor balance or co-ordination, sensitivity to light or noise, changes in mood and nausea.
“I am asking that parents and carers to please continue to encourage their children to keep using their bikes.
“If they have a helmet, please check it is the right size for them. If they do not have a helmet, then many shops have online guidance on how to measure your child’s head correctly to make sure they can get an appropriate sized helmet. Or check out ROSPA for more information on safe cycling.
“We really want to encourage people to keep cycling but to do it safely.”
Key worker? You can borrow a bike for free
Many key workers are discovering the benefits of riding a bike – for happiness, health and short trips.
The #BigBikeRevival project is offering free bike loans and repairs to help even more frontline staff start cycling.
Find a centre near you: https://t.co/LnbhUcqFBb pic.twitter.com/0DiE1BhX53
— Cycling UK (@WeAreCyclingUK) June 18, 2020
Schrodinger's car driver
Not sure the Schrodinger reference quite passes, but you get the idea all the same.
So since lock down started, how many friendly chats have you had with Schrodinger’s Car (Driver)? pic.twitter.com/ym5XG09F9d
— Lego Road Safety & Planning (@PlasticPlanners) June 17, 2020
How garden villages are locking-in car dependency
Government plans to develop 50 ‘Garden Villages’ and ‘Garden Towns’ across England will result in 200,000 households becoming car-dependent, says a new report we reported on yesterday.
Garden villages locking-in car dependency, says report. BBC article by @RHarrabin. https://t.co/uTfF0jwW7t
Diagram: pic.twitter.com/TJzpOWhsq8— Dave Walker (@davewalker) June 16, 2020
BCN announces formation of UK’s first competitive BAME cycling team
London based cycling club BCN (The Black Cyclists Network) was established in 2018 to address the lack of diversity and representation in UK cycling across all levels, grassroots to professional. It currently boasts over 100 members.
BCN yesterday announced its intention to create the first amateur British domestic racing team for Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic (BAME) riders with a view to competing in the 2021 season.
The team currently comprises nine riders – an Elite rider, four cat 2 and four cat 3 athletes – and is looking to build a team of 10 riders.
BCN founder Mani Arthur said “BCN is more than a club. We are a community built to address the lack of representation in the cycling world.
“There are a lot of cyclists from Black, Asian and Minority Ethnic (BAME) backgrounds in the UK and around the world yet very few resources cater for our communities.
“With the launch of the BCN team we aim to give much needed visibility to people of colour in the sport to inspire and engage a new audience to the physical, mental and social benefits of cycling.”
BCN is actively seeking partners for the project and has set up a Go Fund Me page.
Lachlan Morton’s everesting attempt no longer the record after checks on Strava segment data
On Sunday we reported that Lachlan Morton of EF Pro Cycling had become the latest man to claim the everesting world record after appearing to take 7 hours, 32 minutes, 54 seconds to make an altitude gain of 8,848 metres.
The Australian, who is based in Boulder, Colorado, climbed Rist Canyon, near Fort Collins, Colorado, 42 times.
Unfortunately for him, Morton’s effort was checked by Hells 500 — the organisation behind the concept of everesting – and they concluded he didn’t achieve the necessary elevation gain.
Writing on Facebook, they said: “As painful as it is, we stand by our community’s decision to recategorise this as a (very large) Everesting Basecamp listing, which means Keegan Swenson is restored at the top of the Everesting leaderboard.”
So how did this happen?
Hells 500 reckon they see under- or over-reporting of data from devices in about 10 per cent of all submissions, “and this is why we will check the elevation gain from repeats of a verified Strava segment over what the head unit will show.”
However, they also check the Strava segment itself, looking for ‘saw-toothing’ in the profile which tends to suggest a poorly formed segment, and one that could give an artificially inflated figure.”
This seems to be what happened with Morton’s effort.
Hells 500 went on to say that while the concept of everesting wasn’t initially about racing, they accept that this has become a part of it.
“One thing we never anticipated when creating this challenge for our crew was that it would one day be raced by riders at the top level of the sport. In fact, ironically, this challenge was set up as the antithesis of racing!
“That said, we appreciate and respect that whilst completion is the driving factor for the vast majority of participants, the appeal of setting new records for Everesting has clearly taken hold – and so we’ll need to adapt to that.”
As for how they’ll do this, they say that they’re going to have to approve segments for record attempts in advance.
“As mapping data varies in accuracy from country to country (and indeed the exact height of Everest itself is still a matter of some debate!) we will – to the best of our ability with the resources to hand – agree on a set elevation gain prior to an attempt.”
Rapha to highlight inspirational new cyclists as part of British Cycling’s #ChooseCycling campaign
British Cycling has said that if towns and cities follow Department for Transport (DfT) guidance and quickly implement new temporary infrastructure, up to 14 million UK adults are ready to start cycling.
To help people understand how the simple act of riding can positively influence the future of city life, Rapha is to showcase the most inspirational and remarkable people who turned to cycling in the last two months.
Founder and Chief Executive Officer Simon Mottram said: “Rapha was founded with the vision to make cycling the most popular sport in the world and there has never been such an opportunity – or urgency – to promote riding in our cities.
“We have always believed cycling has the power to transform lives – it is just about the most uplifting thing someone can do with their time – and we’re excited to bring all our efforts to bear on showing people just how inspiring cycling in the city can be.”
There’s another home exercise bike/fitness class thing
Ooh look, it’s another one of those indoor bikes associated with a series of at-home fitness classes.
You know, kind of like Peloton. (Only hopefully not too much like it, what with that firm’s famously litigious recent track record.)
Apex from Apex Rides on Vimeo.
The Apex website says the bike’s going to be on sale in John Lewis before too long.
Last month Peloton said that a cheaper version of its exercise bike – which retails for $2,245 in the US – was on its way with the firm looking to target the mass market.
Peloton can be pretty robust in its dealings with rivals.
In October 2019, the firm sued rival brand Echelon, accusing them of selling “cheap, copycat products” and patent infringement.
USA Herald reports that it’s also suing NordicTrack for its iFit leaderboard that it believes infringes on one of its patents.
They also threatened a YouTuber in 2018 because he was using the word “peloton”.
Froome departure rumours rumble on
These sorts of rumours have been bouncing around for a few weeks now.
Chris Froome’s contract with Team Ineos expires at the end of the year and he has not signed an extension yet.
The Times reports that he is considering an offer from Israel Start-Up Nation that could see him bought out of the remainder of his contract and competing against Ineos at this year’s Tour de France.
Bahrain-McLaren were previously believed to be the favourites to sign him.
Cyclists urged to give Dunwich Dynamo a miss this year
Traditionally held on the Saturday night/Sunday morning nearest to the full moon in July, Dunwich Dynamo involves riding 115 miles from London Fields in Hackney to Dunwich beach on the Suffolk coast.
It tends to attract around 1,500 participants.
Patrick Field, one of the founders, told the BBC that it is not officially happening this year – although there are no official organisers.
“It happens because people do it,” he said. “It’s a tradition.”
Southwark Cyclists have however cancelled return coaches from Dunwich, while Dunwich Parish Meeting said it was discouraging people from undertaking the trip.
“There’s no infrastructure for them waiting for when they get here,” said chairman Rod Smith.
GreenEdge have gone back to being Mitchelton-Scott after that weird sponsorship deal fell through
Last week we reported how Mitchelton-Scott were to become Team Manuela Fundación for the remainder of 2020 season.
At the time it seemed one of the more curious pro sponsorship deals of recent times. The Manuela Fundacion is a pretty small Spanish non-profit funded by husband and wife team Francisco Huertas and Maria Angustias González.
The statement announcing that the deal has fallen through doesn’t really clear things up at all.
“We felt a strong initial connection with Mr Francisco Huertas, the Manuela Fundación and their noble aims,” said team founder and principal Gerry Ryan.
“However, as the negotiations have evolved after the initial announcement on Friday, we have concluded that the relationship will not proceed. We wish Mr Francisco Huertas and the Manuela Fundación all of the best for the future.”
The GreenEDGE Cycling men’s and women’s teams will return to racing next month under the Mitchelton-Scott name, with a fully supported financial and technical structure provided by Ryan.
Ryan added: “The COVID-19 global crisis has thrown up many new challenges, but our primary focus remains on our world-class athletes and support staff.
“This will include a return to full wages for all riders and staff once WorldTour racing commences in August, and a commitment to the year 2021 as we search for a suitable sponsorship.
“We believe in this team, and the people and culture that have made it so successful these past eight years.
“Our riders have been inspiring in their commitment and motivation in what has been an uncertain season, and our staff loyal and determined to provide the best service possible in what will be a busy and challenging end to the year.
“We can’t wait to get back on the road and start winning more races.”
Decathlon CEO apologises for bike shortages
Eric Mazilier, the Decathlon UK CEO, has apologised for bike shortages and says the firm is working hard to find a solution.
“The enthusiasm for the unique price/quality ratio of our bikes has been incredible. I want to thank you for your trust,” he said.
“In relation to this, I have to admit we are experiencing difficulties to face this very high demand for our bikes and some of you were disappointed that you couldn’t find a bike quickly. I personally apologise for this and assure you that our teams are working hard to find solutions and meet your needs to the best of their ability.
“Thank you for your patience, continued support and loyalty during this time. I am extremely grateful to see that you are so passionate about sport and it inspires me to dream of a better lifestyle, more active for all of us and healthier for our planet.”
Decathlon aren’t the only cycling retailer struggling to meet demand.
Evans Cycles have been enduring a bit of a kicking on social media from customers complaining of delays, while Winstanleys Bikes received a flurry of negative reviews on TrustPilot for similar issues.
Cycling levels up by around 70% compared to early March
Brilliant to see cycling levels increase by around 70% compared to early March 🚴🚴♂️🚴♀️. And really keen to ensure healthy active transport sustained, so am providing councils with funds to install urgent infrastructure to keep cyclists safe – with more of this to come soon! 🚲
— Rt Hon Grant Shapps MP (@grantshapps) June 18, 2020
Trailer: The Racer (an Irish pro cycling film)
Set in summer 1998, The Racer follows ageing domestique, Dom Chabol, who wants to wear the yellow jersey before he retires.
Looks like he faces challenges and temptation and whatnot.
The film was due to premiere at SXSW in March before the event was cancelled due to the coronavirus pandemic.
It’s due to be shown at next week’s Cannes online Marché du Film.
18 June 2020, 08:34
British Cycling has announced the next phase of how it plans to reintroduce all sanctioned cycling activities in England.
British Cycling says coaching and club activity in England can return from today
Governing body continues to review planned dates to reintroduce sportives and races
18 June 2020, 08:34
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Latest Comments
@mitsky Its another one of those things that makes no sense isn't it. Someone was saying in another thread that we need a harder driving test. I don't think we do. Everyone who has passed in the last 20 years has done a test that is more than happy to fail you for behaviour that 90% of drivers exhibit every time they get behind the wheel. The test is fine. The fact that getting your license seems to be considered some weird proof that you will continue to drive safely is the issue. The fact that when you prove that you cannot drive safely its not immediately revoked is the issue.
@Rendel Harris The issue with GPS chips, as everyone who has one of those black boxes will attest to, is that they are crap. They interpret heavy braking as poor driving rather than someone else forcing it. They see rapid acceleration where there is none. All we need is a much higher chance of people being caught and punished for their everyday shit driving. I'm sure as a cyclist that every single time you go out on your bike you will have a dozen or more times when you think "that would have been a nasty accident if someone was coming the other direction". Eventually, when bad behaviour suffers no consequences it becomes completely normalised. Then we struggle to treat it as anything but a normal, unavoidable accident when that bad behaviour does incur consequences.
Drivers regularly pull out in front of me and cause me to slam on the brakes or avoid them. Very often they have seen me and just assume I'm not going very fast or they assume I will slow down/stop (which I do). Too many drivers don't look for cyclists, hate giving way to them or expect the cyclist to be moving slowly and just pull out.
@Rendel Harris By the time someone is looking at prison time its too late. As has been proven time and time again, the severity of punishment is a poor deterrent to bad behaviour if people don't think its going to happen to them or they don't think they will be caught. Now I do think that there should be far more severe and immediate punishments for bad driving when drivers are caught but this would need to be coupled with a massive push to actually act on information/proof of bad driving. As anyone that submits footage to the police knows, its a crapshoot and certain police forces are anti-cyclist. This would try to essentially put people off misbehaving whilst driving before they cause an accident rather than getting the tired old excuse of "it was a single dangerous incident, they definitely don't do this all the time and their luck finally ran out". Perhaps it should go even further and if you have a history of speeding and you hurt someone speeding, that is looked upon in a very dim light.
Can we talk about “Washing up liquid contains a lot of salt – not a great idea to use a corrosive substance on a bicycle”? This is an urban myth. I have washed all of our many bikes using Fairy liquid or Ecover for decades. I’ve never found any evidence of corrosion, paint, laquer or decal wear, or any sign of anything. I regularly service forks and bearings, swapping a lot of gear, and everything has always been fine. Here’s far too much info below - long story short, Fairy liquid in 5L of hot water has a borderline-homeopathic amount of salt, it’s fine to use on a bike. ============ The honest answer is that neither Fairy nor Ecover publicly disclose the actual sodium chloride concentration in the consumer products I could find. The safety data sheets list hazardous ingredients above reporting thresholds, but sodium chloride is not reported for either product. However, we can put some realistic bounds on it. Fairy Original The SDS lists: Sodium laureth sulfate: 20-30% Lauramine oxide: 5-10% Alcohol: 1-5% No sodium chloride is declared. 15 In detergent formulations, sodium chloride is commonly used as a viscosity modifier (thickener) and is typically present at around 0.5-3%, sometimes lower. The absence of declaration suggests it is either not present or present at a low concentration that does not require reporting. This range is an informed formulation estimate, not a value stated by Fairy. Ecover The Ecover ingredient information lists: Sodium lauryl sulfate Lauryl glucoside Cocamidopropyl betaine Alcohol Lactic acid Sodium octyl sulphate Again, no sodium chloride is listed. Ecover's formulations tend to rely more heavily on plant-derived surfactants and may use little or no salt for thickening, but I could not find a published concentration. 63 What does this mean for bike washing? Let's assume a worst-case 3% salt content in Fairy. If you add: 10 mL Fairy to a 5-litre bucket Then salt introduced would be approximately: 10 mL × 3% ≈ 0.3 g salt Distributed through 5 L water ≈ 60 mg/L salt For comparison: Typical seawater: ~35,000 mg/L Lightly salted winter road spray: often hundreds to thousands of mg/L The wash bucket above: ~60 mg/L So even under a pessimistic assumption, the salt concentration is hundreds to thousands of times lower than the salt exposure your bike gets from winter roads. From a corrosion perspective, the quantity of salt introduced by washing-up liquid is essentially negligible compared with: Riding on salted roads Coastal spray Leaving winter grime on the bike Therefore my practical conclusion remains: ✅ Fairy or Ecover in a wash bucket is extremely unlikely to contribute any measurable corrosion risk. ✅ The important thing is rinsing and drying afterwards. ✅ Winter road salt is the real enemy, not washing-up liquid.
Another example of a driver's actions that would have been a straight fail in a driving test but is barely likely to lead to a disqualification... I'm wondering if having a driving licence is like a "Get out of jail free" card...
Yes indeed. I have a version of the R8100 and you definitively need ceramic for the socket.
@perce I'm not sure I agree with that. I think thats just confirming that he is take fully responsibility and recognises that the cyclist could have done nothing to mitigate it.
If we don't fight it now, we'll all end up forced to wear baggy shorts!
@Rendel Harris Agree, I am baffled that the 84 year old who is now banned from driving for year can then start driving again without a retest. We should be re-tested regularly.
48 thoughts on “Decathlon CEO apologises for bike shortages; More talk that Froome is to leave Ineos; UK’s first competitive BAME cycling team; Lachlan Morton’s everesting non-record; Chris Boardman takes MP to task for cycle helmet tweet; Schrodinger’s car driver + more”
Brilliant response from CB to
Brilliant response from CB to the misinformed MP, and the twitter responses seem to be universally condemning her for being completely ignorant on the subject, but I only read the first fifty or so. Included this graph which I hadn’t seen before:
About time we had some more
About time we had some more helmet related graphs.
That graph is problematic
That graph is problematic though, and I’m not sure it supports either pro- or anti- helmet religions (there, I’ve offended everyone for balance). Participation was falling before the law came in, the subsequent participants may have been keener, longer distance, nuttier (before or after taking up helmets), you could stretch the X axis and make things look quite flat, etc etc. On the other hand, the injury rate clearly climbs after the law came in and participation falls, and that damage continues for years.
So that doesn’t seem to be the stake through the heart of the argument either way, and I don’t think we’ll get there any time soon with stats or experimental science on crash test dummies.
I am personally very conflicted on wearing a helmet but 100% against a law. I agree with the idea that they’re not much use at speed (even my slowness and timid descending) but also that the barrier to participation is most severe on those cyclists who are casual, new to it or slow (who may be riding at the sub X mph where helmets may help), and they’re actually the important ones to the planet, not the enthusiasts that we presumably all are.
I treat helmet as part of the
I treat helmet as part of the same routine as gloves, SPD shoes, and glasses.
TheBillder wrote:
It looks like (roughly) participation is halved, and the injury rate is doubled, which suggests that the actual number of injuries hasn’t much been impacted one way or the other.
Yeah, and without any
Yeah, and without any demographic information it’s pretty much impossible to draw much in the way of concrete conclusions beyond mandation seemed to lead to a further decline in participation.
TheBillder wrote:
But not so problematic for the people attacking the helmet law as those who instituted it, who claimed that it would save hundreds of lives and thousands of injuries; it clearly hasn’t.
There may be questions of interpretation and how much cycling and cyclists may have changed after the law, but one thing is absolutely clear; nobody can claim that the law has made cycling safer. But the politicians can’t admit that they got it wrong, so NZ and Oz are stuck with these insane laws until they get some sane politicians.
They’re in pretty short supply everywhere, but the NZ PM seems to be pretty rational, at least regarding the pandemic, so maybe she’ll take a look at this law.
just got to hope all the
just got to hope all the Audis and nondescript Vauxhalls get traded in for e-soooters.
the chart needs another vertical line, labelled “point at which it became clear that it was going that way”. I wonder if it would co- incident with the start of the decline seen in the 1990s?
even for Jacintha, who seems to be about as sensible a politician as you could hope for, reversing the requirement is difficult – the next cyclist trauma case brought in to hospital “on your head be it”, as the saying goes.
I completely agree that it
I completely agree that it doesn’t show any such decline in injury, but (obv) doesn’t show any prior promises either. That would be difficult to chart. It also doesn’t show any other trends that might affect participation, and my point is that these graphs can’t really be useful.
For example, if I were on the compulsion side of the debate, I’d take the most recent bit from 2009 onwards as evidence that the low lifes and kiddies who can’t be bothered to learn to drive are finally getting the safety message, as participation is rising and raw injury numbers are falling. As this is 15 years after the law came in, this is clearly because those youths who have never known anything else are now doing more, safer rides.
That’s such obvious cherry picking and conflation that surely we can all see it’s wrong. The counter argument, made already and simply “participation down, injuries up” is also over simplified because of the probable change in the population in the data from “lots of people including most kids” to “only the keen” – though I’m adding at least a spin to the point fukawitribe made above.
So we don’t know anything really from that graph about whether the law was good, bad or indifferent.
As a side anecdote, I used to have a Specialized helmet with a warning sticker inside which cautioned against use for anything other than cycling. Such use could cause “serious injury, death by strangulation, death”. So perhaps too many people in NZ were using one of those, avoiding both the specific and the generalised death risks.
Hats off to Chris Boatdman
Hats off to Chris Boardman for standing up for cycling and for us all. Thanks Chris.
Helmets off surely?
Helmets off surely?
Casque!
Casque!
Is Everesting officially over
Is Everesting officially over yet?
mdavidford wrote:
Yep – trenching * is where it’s at now…
* No. Not that one.
fukawitribe wrote:
Um, it is the one I assumed – not sure what you expected people would think it referred to?
Anyway, I’m taking up Trunching.
mdavidford wrote:
Is Everesting officially over yet?— mdavidford
Yep – trenching * is where it’s at now…
* No. Not that one.
— fukawitribeUm, it is the one I assumed – not sure what you expected people would think it referred to?— mdavidford
That’s probably a good thing as far as you are concerned – there are a number of other meanings, mostly variations on a theme, but some are more… mmm… esoteric than others.
Shame about the GreenEdge
Shame about the GreenEdge sponsorship. Sharp Navy and Pink wings on the kit. Just send me the samples. You can’t more of a defunk kit than a team that never existed.
BEHOLD! a Labour MP has made
BEHOLD! a Labour MP has made a stupid anticycling comment!
…but where is the party bashing? where is the serpant-like vitriol that is so often spewed out here when a TORY MP does the same? You don’t even MENTION she’s a LABOUR MP?, this would be the TITLE of the story if she were a Tory!
Double standards. Hypocrites. Predictable Left Bias; these are words that spring to mind of this website and its audience.
Another rung on the ladder of professionalism, which this website has sunk far, far below. There was a real opportunity here, to prove there was a shred of integrity left.
Failed.
Alright, I’ll help restore
Alright, I’ll help restore your trust in the site – or it’s readership at least – being something of a lefty myself:
Bloody silly comment from a Labour MP that. I expect better.
Did you mean to put that
Did you mean to put that comment on the daily mail website?
Why do you choose to browse
Why do you choose to browse the site? I know what I do when I’m unhappy with something, I get rid of it. Your choice.
On yer bike
On yer bike
“….Predictable Left Bias;
“….Predictable Left Bias; these are words that spring to mind of this website and its audience.”
I think you mean a rational, sensible position adopted by any thinking person having seen the ultra-shambles of this government.
eburtthebike wrote:
There are plenty of people who lean right and think the current government is a shitshow.
It’s not the direction of one’s political compass that has anything to do with one’s capability for rational thought, it’s the weight of it.
srchar wrote:
What? How much does a thought weigh? Or did you mean how much the political compass weighed?
Help me out here; what does that sentence mean?
Alexuk may stray towards
Alexuk may stray towards hyperbole but the point is valid.
If a Conservative MP or Brexit supporter says something stupid these details are prominently displayed.
The converse is definitely not the case as today’s blog shows.
The comments section is getting increasingly vitriolic and unpleasant and I’m sure it’s related to the increasing politicisation of what is supposedly a cycling website.
“The comments section is
“The comments section is getting increasingly vitriolic and unpleasant….”
From Rich_cb, Mr Benign and friendly himself.
I only take issue with people
I only take issue with people who lie and mislead people deliberately.
So, basically just you.
I don’t routinely swear at people, call them scum or, satirically I’m sure, suggest they should be shot.
I’m interested in politics,
I’m interested in politics, occasionally a shiney new gadget or thing, and very little interested in how fast the cycling professionals are going this year, or if someone is leaving one team to go to another. Overall I’m glad they do their thing because it gets cycling a bit of (mostly) positive profile as the triumphs of 2012 fade into memory, and more of a voice.
what I’m concerned about comes back to public policy, attitudes and therefore to politics. politics – along with death, sex, religion – difficult and upsetting, not discussed in polite society. Yet here we are.
Labour has an uneasy relationship down the years with the environment with anti-war, with controlling the car – traditionally the party of heavy industry, of workers’ jobs – by no means perfect, but way better than most Conservatives on the issues that concern us. Over the last 60 years we’ve seen the rise and rise of the car and all that goes with that – we have to call it together.
Rich_cb wrote:
Leaving aside the wider question of whether those of different political persuasions are treated differently in general (and my feeling is that while that may well be true below the line, it’s less true of road.cc itself), in this particular case the MP has only made the relatively minor and common (indeed, common among many who cycle) error of being misguided about helmet use. It should be challenged and corrected, but that’s about it. They haven’t come out with any of the more egregious nonsense about cyclists being ‘a menace’, causing congestion, or constantly ignoring the rules of the road that would warrant a more robust condemnation.
Is the BCN (Black cyclists
Is the BCN (Black cyclists network) club open to white cyclists? After all, if there was a WCN (White cyclists network), it would be racist.
biker phil wrote:
How long would it have taken you to Google the answer to this question? (the answer is yes, there are white members).
Have a read about why this club has been set up. It’s really positive.
My point, benm, is that if
My point, benm, is that if there was such a club called the white cyclists network, it would be shut down amid howls of racism. By simply having a club called the black cyclists network, the members are putting themselves on a plinth and declaring they are different, yet are crying out to be treated as equals. Why can cyclists not simply be a member of their local club, regardless of their race, creed or colour. I haven’t read about them other than on here, I’m glad that the reason why it has been set up is positive, but calling it the title it is, sends out the wrong message.
Francis Cade, a cyclist and
Francis Cade, a cyclist and YouTuber, has a couple of great videos talking with Mani, one of the club’s founders, about why a group like the BCN is helpful for cycling as a whole. Check them out – I’d be surprised is you thought they were ‘putting themselves on a pedestal’ after giving them a watch.
What would you call a club
What would you call a club set up to encourage more black cyclists? It’s just sensible advertising.
The name might send out the wrong message to you, but doing some basic research on the club quite quickly shows that the agenda is to increase diversity in cycling and create a club where people who, for many reasons haven’t felt comfortable joining a local club, want to cycle together. What would the agenda for your white cyclist network possibly be? The only rationale I can think of is a prejudiced one, therefore it would be highly likely to get called out as such.
biker phil wrote:
In the light of the recent news coverage of systemic abuse, widespread racial prejudice and police violence against black people, I’m struggling with this. I don’t want to demean your opinion but I’m seriously scratching my head here. It’s as if the stories of the civil rights movement in America, the Suffragettes, the anti-Apartheid protests and boycott of South African sporting events, Rock Against Racism, the Stephen Lawrence case, the experiences of black footballers here and in other countries (and many, many other things) have somehow not made an impression; that you’ve not seen the recent articles by about the senior black professionals and highly educated people – civil servants, politicians, police officers, academics, doctors and many others in this country – whose careers and personal lives have been blighted by racial prejudice.
By forming a cycling club named “Black cyclists network” they are somehow “putting themselves on a plinth”? What does that mean? And how do you know? Does forming a club for people like you indicate arrogance? If I lived in Spain or Turkey and set up a “British Cyclists Network” to help visitors from the UK and British people living there, would it be arrogant? Again, I’m not attacking you, I just don’t understand.
How many black people do you know? Try asking them about prejudice, abuse and police harassment and the fact that that black people are 38 times more likely to be stopped and searched than white people. Francis Cade’s recent chat with Mani of the BCN is definitely worth viewing:
We’re past the “treat
We’re past the “treat everyone the same” phase. If there’s an issue, affecting a group of people with protected characteristic, you assess and can make an intervention, which might indeed be to the exclusion of others.
Example: My hospital are offering vitamin D tablets to BAME colleagues. You, Biker Phil, assuming you are white (like me) and don’t have one of the other medical needs indicated, will have to buy your own, and /or eat some oily fish.
David9694 wrote:
You’d be better off exposing skin to sunshine for about 10 minutes or so to get your vitamin D topped up, but it’s not so likely that you’ll be deficient in it (especially if you’re cycling outside regularly).
I’ve read that there’s investigations into vitamin D levels and Covid severity, but I didn’t know that hospitals were handing it out already.
hawkinspeter wrote:
People with darker skin require longer exposure to sunlight to build the necessary levels of vitamin D. 10 minutes may not be enough, even for pale-skinned people, unless it’s every day when the sun is high enough in the sky and even then arms and legs should be exposed. If you work indoors during the day it may be very difficult to get enough sunlight exposure (though I agree that this is by far the best way to improve and maintain vitamin D levels).
For supplementation vitamin D3 is more effective than D2. Some studies have suggested that vitamin D supplementation is better taken with vitamin K. Sunlight and fresh fruit and veg will always be better for you than tablets or a sunbed.
I recall reading somewhere
I recall reading somewhere that IIRC Singapore was trialling vitamin D, magnesium and vitamin K to help with Covid. And yes, vitamin D2 may well be useless as it’s processed differently to D3.
You can’t get vitamin D from
You can’t get vitamin D from the sun in the uk for 5 months of the year no matter how hard you try the sun isn’t high enough in the sky. So yeah take your vitamins
Biker Phil, I’m not going to
Biker Phil, I’m not going to have a pop at you but I’m going to try to give a different perspective on this, as far as I understand it, being a white person myself. I appreciate that my perspective and explanation may be fumbling and unclear at times, as I certainly don’t claim to have a complete understanding of the issues myself. I have road cycled and mountain biked in Sheffield and the Peak District for over 10 years now. In all those years I could probably count the numbers of BAME roadies that I have seen on the fingers of both hands. I don’t recall seeing any BAME roadies as part of chain gangs or club rides. Similarly, when I was a keen fell runner (a few years ago, admittedly), I’m not sure I saw any BAME runners at any races, apart from one member of my club. In my years mountain biking, I recall seeing very few black mountain bikers. I’m sure that my brother, who climbs and canoes, would probably say the same about those two pursuits. Seeing as how a good proportion of the UK’s population is BAME, and (for example) there is good representation of the black population in football, it would seem that certain sports, or outdoor pursuits, have some kind of issues with attracting certain sections of the population. Cycling would seem to be one of these. As it stands, white people don’t need to set up whites only cycling clubs. It just seems to be the case that this is the norm anyway. I am in no way suggesting that cycling clubs actively excude non-white people. It may just be, that in some, or a number of ways (that I suppose some white people may find difficult to understand), some, or many BAME people feel that such clubs are unwelcoming. Hence they may feel the need to set up a club, or network, with the specific aim of overcoming any barriers to participation that these sections of the population may experience, or perceive. I always remember at an AGM of my running club, when the under-representation of BAME people was discussed, the feeling was very much “Well they know we are here, and they are very welcome to join us”. This was no doubt true. But there was very little appetite for trying to find ways to pro-actively recruit amongst those communities, or to understand what barriers (real or perceived) there were to them joining the club. In a similar way (although I’m sure that the analogy is not perfect), I’d imagine that the reason that it was felt necessary to institute a ‘Woman’s Hour’ on the radio was because, at that time, the vast majority of radio shows were felt to serve men. In a similar vein, the reason that there has been a need for a “Black Lives Matter” movement is because it’s pretty clear that to certain, powerful sections of the police and the those in Government, black lives matter less than white lives. It doesn’t really work to simply reverse the situation and say that a “White Cycling Network” would be racist, and so imply that a black cycling network must be racist too. It ignores the obvious power imbalance between majority and minority ethnic communities, and why minorities may need to take certain measures and actions to empower themselves, that there is simply no need for majorities to take.
The thing is, it’s not as if
The thing is, it’s not as if there’s all these BAME cyclists and there is some barrier to them joining clubs. Last time this issue came up I took more notice on my daily commute. Plenty of BAME kids walking to school, but almost no adults cycling to work – almost everyone on a bike was white. It did make me wonder, at the level of individual personal choice, what makes one person choose to cycle and another not, and how does colour come into it.
I’d guess that it’s something
I’d guess that it’s something to do with owning a car being seen as a status symbol or rather that not owning a car is seen as a sign of being poor. BAME communities might be more sensitive to being judged by others as they get so much more hassle because of their looks and also BAME communities tend to live in disadvantaged areas.
Isn’t there an actual offence
Isn’t there an actual offence in that there ‘Merica of “driving while black”?
(or, it seems like there is).
I read an article recently which said – even here in Old Blighty – that many police officers have an attitude that someone who is BAME and is either well-dressed or driving a ‘good’ car is seen as “fair game”
The ‘cyclist network’ is
The ‘cyclist network’ is already white. So there is no need to label it ‘white’. It’s a given and it’s a fact. I used to work in professional motor sports and travelled the world doing so – and i never saw a black mechanic, team crew member, media representative, driver, physio . . . . I am sure it’s the same in professional cycling. Black people were not excluded but they certainly weren’t included either. Just look around – all positions of influence and power are held by white mostly males. So there is absolutely nothing wrong with promoting minorities (disabled, BAME etc) and there is no need to feel threatened by it either. Your privilege is not under threat.
having a BAME team is racist
having a BAME team is racist in itself
should we make a white or
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