Is “the principal benefit of cycling achieved only by risking life and limb”? Cyclist gets lambasted for jumping traffic queue; 30km/hr speed limit for bicycles in Flanders; Van Aert trains for cyclocross in snow + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
A Tale of Two Disciplines: Van der Poel and Evenepoel enjoy sunny ride in Spain, while Wout Van Aert trains for cyclocross in snow
Oh the duality of cycling. Two riders enjoying a ride in the most beautiful weather on a sunny hill in Spain, while another drudges his way through the snow with a bike.
With the cyclocross season now underway, it’s time for the roadies to let loose, but if you’ve chosen the double life of a cross and a road cyclist, there ain’t no rest for the wicked.
The men’s road racing world champion Mathieu van der Poel and the men’s time trial champion Remco Evenepoel were filmed cycling together in Calp, a quaint little town on Spain’s Mediterranean coast, with clear blue skies and a shining sun overhead.
Mathieu van der Poel and Remco Evenepoel riding together around Calpe, Spain. 🌈🤝🏼🇧🇪
🎥: Siebe Roesems pic.twitter.com/WMBiTmEybn
— Lukáš Ronald Lukács (@lucasaganronald) November 29, 2023
Evenepoel also posted the ride on his Strava, on which he was also accompanied by another Alpecin rider Siebe Roesems, with the activity titled ‘FC Alpecin’.
And then on the other hand, there’s Wout van Aert, fresh off the back of winning Tour of Britain and a road season which seemed to dazzle and burn too brightly at the start, only for it to flicker in the middle and end with not as many victories and goals as the Belgian rider might have wanted to achieve.
It’s been almost 10 months that Van Aert has raced in cyclocross, and now the 29-year-old rider from Herentals, Flanders, was back in his home region to amp up his CX training. With temperatures below the freezing point, he completed a 146km ride yesterday, and another 68km on Tuesday, with the latter titled ‘Annual wake-up call’.
Belgian rider Eli Iserbyt chipping in with a cheeky comment on Strava: “Please don’t wake up too much.”
And to add more to the misery, Van Aert also did a 10km run in wet snow yesterday, also part of training regiment for cylocross. Cycling, what a brutal sport.
MP duped by Daily Mail article claiming famous palm tree will be “chopped down” to make way for cycle lanes gets corrected by London’s cycling commissioner
A Conservative MP who urged Transport for London to have a “rethink”, as she posted a Daily Mail article claiming that a famous palm tree in the city is set to be “chopped down” to make way for cycle lanes, has been criticised by walking and cycling commissioner Will Norman, who pointed out that the tree is simply being relocated in order to “make London’s most dangerous junction safer for road users.”
The online backlash against Nickie Aiken came after the Conservative MP for Cities of London and Westminster reposted on X, formerly Twitter, a Daily Mail story on the removal of the phoenix palm tree, located on the northern roundabout at Lambeth Bridge, with the caption “save our palm tree”.
However, Aiken’s tweet prompted a vociferous response from cycling campaigners in the capital, including London’s walking and cycling commissioner Will Norman.
“As you know Nickie, the tree isn’t being chopped down, it is being relocated to make London’s most dangerous junction safer for road users,” Norman wrote. “We do not want any more fatal collisions at this location.”
A simple game of "Guess who"
Guess who – but cyclists hey… pic.twitter.com/Cr7QbQf3yz
— Rory McCarron (@CyclingLawLDN) November 29, 2023
Everyone, get your pitchforks out! It's road vs gravel bike time
I’m sure this will be a civil and amicable discussion: What should be your winter bike? The same ol’, trusty road bike, or is there a case for switching to a gravel bike?
road.cc writer Emily Tillet makes the case for the latter, and shares her experience of how having a gravel bike to tackle those harsh, wet, muddy conditions in the winter could be a better option for many…
Speed cameras given the go ahead for bicycle streets in Flanders — with impending 30km/hr limit on cycling soon
Flanders, one of the most historically rich and significant places for cycling in the world, has just approved a plan which will see the installation of unmanned, automated speed cameras in the bicycle streets of the Dutch speaking region of Belgium.
More importantly, a speed limit of 30km/hr will be applicable to everyone, including cyclists, and violation will lead to penalisation.
Bicycle streets, a common road infrastructure in Flanders and other parts of Belgium, are intended for cyclists to cycle easily and safely. Although people in cars and other motorised traffic are still allowed to drive there, they are subordinate to bikes and are not allowed to overtake cyclists.
> Do cyclists have to stick to the speed limit?
The Brussels Times reports that the speed cameras are scheduled for spring next year, once the draft decision has been approved by the Flemish Government. The law will then take effect ten days after its publication in the Belgian Official Gazette.
Until now, violations of the 30 km/h speed limit within a cycling zone could only be detected by manned automatic devices, requiring police officers to detect violations and impose sanctions. But soon speeding violations will be detected with speed cameras or average speed checks, without the need for a police officer.
Lydia Peeters, the Flemish Minister of Mobility and Public Works, said: “In recent years, many local authorities have set up cycling zones to give cyclists more space. Cycling is becoming more popular and it is my ambition to get even more people cycling in the coming years.
“With this adjustment, we give local authorities and police zones more options to enforce the speed limit. This is good for road safety and to encourage bicycle use.”
Cyclist catches taxi driver using mobile phone... and gets called "coward" (thrice)
London’s finest, ladies and gentlemen!
London Taxi driver on his phone while driving. pic.twitter.com/JJ7SUnmk85
— Cycling via… (@cyclingvia) November 30, 2023
Cyclist filtering through traffic: Not okay! Drivers doing the same: All good mate!
Oh this one brings back memories of another live blog post, possibly from this morning? So let me try and get this right, if cyclists jump a stopped vehicle (as was the case in the other video), it’s dangerous behaviour which can cause (and even draw wishes of strangers online) of bodily harm, but if you do so when sat in a metal cage, it’s all good and the cyclist is making something out of nothing!
Cyclists don’t pay tax so it’s only right that drivers can go onto the wrong side of the road and force them to stop….. 🙃🙃🙃 #cycleway4 pic.twitter.com/0ZFkhuNNep
— Greg N (@n00dles71) November 30, 2023
Happy St Andrew's Day!
Nothing to do with cycling, but considering it’s St Andrew’s Day today, it’s only fair I place this comical clip of Twitter boss Elon Musk trying to act vaguely amiable but failing hilariously on this live blog
“I am Andrew.”
“Sorry!”
“It’s okay…”
Musk: “The only reason I am here, Jonathan, is because you are a friend.”
Andrew: “I am Andrew.” pic.twitter.com/ZTz7t7h8hv
— Thomas B. Philly 🇺🇸 🇺🇦 🇮🇱 (@TheeThomasB) November 30, 2023
Looking back at this, there would probably be much better ways to wish our Scottish readers and all those celebrating, but oh well, some might say there could be better live blog hosts but you all are stuck with me instead!
Leave the bar tape at home! No Paris-Roubaix cobbles for 2025 Tour de France Grand Départ from Lille
The 2025 Tour de France Grand Départ route has just been unveiled by the organisers ASO, and it doesn’t bring me any joy to inform you that despite the peloton setting off from France’s Lille-Nord, tucked away in the Flemish region bordering Belgium and ever-so-close to the fabled cobbles which feature in the Paris-Roubaix classic, we won’t see the riders battle the brutal pavé.
If we can have 14 gravel sectors through the champagne vineyards in next years’ Tour de France, we could have surely had the cobbles, especially when it’s right there!
Anyway, the overall route does seem promising, with punchy climbs and the potential for crosswinds making things interesting in what is certainly going to be a sprinter’s victory.
Stage two ends at the lush seaside Boulogne-sur-Mer, albeit with a tough summit finish where Peter Sagan won in 2012, and finally the stage 3 from Valenciennes will feature the Cote de Cassel climb before the riders finish at Dunkerque.
More bad news: Cycling market downturn worse than expected, says Halfords
Halfords, the UK’s biggest bike retailer, has said that the downturn in the UK retail cycling market is worse than it expected, but adds that while its sales in the segment have fallen during the first half of its current financial year, it is performing better than its competitors.
Meanwhile, Crawley, West Sussex-based independent bike shop chain Balfe’s Bikes has published its latest full-year financial results, posting a loss for the year to end-March 2023.
Read more: > Cycling market downturn worse than expected, says Halfords
The unholy, ungodly, satanic thread for which no one is prepared for.
You could say that your live blog host isn’t too keen on a lot of the AI art you see popping around, but what I’ve just seen takes the cake as the best use of it. I almost want to say I’m okay with this sort of use as long as it’s only relegated to memes and laughs.
Bram Wulteputte asked ChatGPT to design a pro cycling kit, and normally it came out without any of those things know as, sponsors. However, he wrote on Twitter that for every 10 likes, he’d ask the AI to add more sponsors.
Now while some of them are quite nice to look initially (I really hope teams don’t start designing their kits using this technique), but by the team this trainwreck reaches its conclusion, it’s an acid-fuelled, nightmarish, bizarre trip. Anyway, here goes the most unhinged cycling thread ever…
I asked ChatGPT to design a pro cycling kit. For every 10 likes, I'll ask it to add more sponsors 🧵 pic.twitter.com/LZXgQZwiif
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
These actually look good.
Even more sponsors, but this actually feels quite realistic pic.twitter.com/ePca9zGHMX
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
Skip a few, and here we are.
I feel like we're maxing out, but we'll have to run full length pants all season to display the extra sponsors. pic.twitter.com/pYWrxvx5Ig
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
Now we are in crazy town.
Why should we limit ourselves to just the kit when we can put sponsors on the car too?
Standing on the hood does feel like an unconventional way of presenting a kit. pic.twitter.com/f0S4X3Gt00
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
We are NOT playing anymore. This is really serious now.
In hindsight, that felt more like a Hercules-level demigod. This is his daddy. pic.twitter.com/Fw10nQSGTN
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
Galaxies, universes, wormholes… Cycling has gone cosmic.
We've gone through the wormhole. Things have gotten weird. Cycling is now only a mental construct. pic.twitter.com/P7fk5Ph5Ia
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
THIS. This is what cycling will morph into. Ring the bells, for the AI has seen the future! Don’t tell us we didn’t warn you…
In this new universe, the kit is no longer where sponsors want to be. Sponsors want to be tattooed on every inch of the riders' skin. pic.twitter.com/6jRyCu6Ko3
— Bram Wulteputte (@CyclingBram) November 30, 2023
Victory for cyclists and walkers in legal challenge to council decision to reopen narrow bridge to motor traffic
Finally, some good news to cut through the usual doom and glow on this live blog!
Cycling UK has won a legal challenge against Bournemouth, Christchurch and Poole (BCP) Council over the latter’s decision to keep a narrow road underneath a railway bridge in Poole open to motor vehicles – and says that the decision underlines the need for local authorities to properly evaluate the benefits of temporary restrictions on motor traffic before removing them.
Earlier this year, the charity applied for a judicial review of the council keeping Keyhole Bridge in Poole Park open to motor vehicles, with drivers regularly using it as a rat-run, thereby posing a danger to vulnerable road users due to the narrowness of the road.
Meet "David Plowie" and "Spready Salted", who keep London's bike routes open and safe, whatever the weather
‘David Plowie’ & ‘Spready Salted’ are also part of @tfl‘s fleet that help keep London’s bike routes open and safe whatever the weather. pic.twitter.com/kVKcEMDOCd
— Will Norman (@willnorman) November 30, 2023
Is the "principal benefit of cycling achieved only by risking life and limb"? Cyclist gets lambasted for jumping traffic queue
To start the day with, I have a video for you all, shared by a cyclist showing him navigating his way through a traffic queue, with the caption: “I’m posting this just so some motorists can get mad”.
And lo and behold, it seems to have hit a nerve with motorists, or rather most people, so much so that in usual social media (Twitter) fashion, some were even found wishing bodily harm upon the cyclist.
I’m posting this just so some motorists can get mad 🤣 pic.twitter.com/eEDJp4YaOH
— Cycling In Kilkenny 🚲 (@CyclingInKK) November 29, 2023
The video posted by the account called Cycling in Kilkenny has been viewed almost 20,000 times, and the top reply right now, posted by Neal O’Kelly reads: “The bit that amuses me is that the principal benefit of cycling (not having to queue in traffic) is achieved only by risking life and limb, but then cyclists complain that motorists put them in danger.”
Oh my! So if I’m getting this right, the chief advantage of cycling is to not have to queue in traffic? And you can only actually reap the rewards of this by having to risk your “life and limb”
I’m happy to cycle on the inside beside the footpath but most of the drivers road position made that impossible.
They should stop slowing down faster traffic.
— Cycling In Kilkenny 🚲 (@CyclingInKK) November 29, 2023
A few insidious comments too…
Of course they miss me, I’m that great. They love me 👍
— Cycling In Kilkenny 🚲 (@CyclingInKK) November 29, 2023
Typical, want 1.5 metres for a car to overtake. But happy to go against the flow of traffic on the wrong side of the road at much less than 1.5 metres.
— Vanquish Rider (@SteveVanquish) November 29, 2023
But of course, there was some banter too.
Imagine how much quicker the trip would be if there was a dedicated bike lane…..
— Ger Murphy (@Gerard_Murphy) November 29, 2023
Car drivers tell cyclist yo ride in the gutter so they can get by but won’t do it to let cyclist by,
— james (@mhh02) November 30, 2023
But after all is said done, is it actually a good idea to go past drivers on a not-very-wide road with oncoming traffic from the opposite side, with one person also pointing out that overtaking on the the Belisha beacon crossing was not a very “clever” idea, or is it just natural, and maybe even more efficient and quicker for everyone if cyclists were to filter past slower-moving traffic in this sort of situation?
What do you think? Let me know in the comments!
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Latest Comments
Amazing value for 30 bucks. Add a few stars there rockafella
How much of Halfrauds profits are due to them charging 15% commission on the cycle to work scheme they somehow have tied up so many companies to? Profiting off local bike shops and making more off sales than the IBD does, all because some clueless person in HR doesn't care what cycle scheme they choose, and employees get charged more too.
I'm currently sat next to a bike - but I'm not riding it, not is it on the road. Nor in Surrey. Remove me!
@MaxiMinimalist I see you retain your strange obsession with the claim that the only way Decathlon, a global entity with €16.8 billion revenues for whom the cycle team is an essential primary promotional tool for their kit and bikes, will be able to keep Seixas with a sugar daddy cheque from the owner of their co-title sponsor. Why is this? Incidentally Seixas is not winning the next Tour in any case unless Jonas and Tadej both crash out, so the question is unlikely to arise.
@ChrisA Just for info it's Bishops Cleeve. I think the bus lane bit is about the section along Lansdown Road going out of Cheltenham towards Gloucester. This "cycle lane" has been in place for many years. The surface is bumpy due to tree roots and eroded surfaces, cyclists are expected to give way at junctions and it goes past many driveways so you have to be alert at all times. There are bus lanes alongside some of this section and, yes, I still use the bus lanes and the road where the bus lanes run out. This section is not green like the rest of the path and when the green runs out getting through Cheltenham and onto the Gloucester section is hit and miss to say the least. The new green section from Bishops Cleeve to just north of Cheltenham town center is indeed well used and is much appreciated despite the lack of any cyclist priority at beg buttons. Cyclists do have priority at side roads, as in the picture, and motorists seem to be getting the idea. I don't know if it has anything to do with the OpSnap reports I sent in on the occasions I had to brake to avoid a collision when it was newly opened, but things are definiteley improving.
@MaxiMinimalist Ah yes, the good old "You are but what am I?" argument beloved of schoolboys everywhere. Anyone who calls someone a fascist must actually be some form of fascist themselves or other form of oppressor. Hitler and his vermin used this to great effect, claiming that all they were doing was saving the nation from the oppression of communists, social democrats and trade unions, frequently portraying themselves as the victims of said oppression. There's even a name for it in the psychology textbooks, DARVO: Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender.
It was when perce and that Clem Fandango bounced off one another that they both did their best work...
I don't believe that the Italian state under Mussolini was run particularly well. Their army were awful, their invasion of Greece failed, though their losses did draw Germany in because it threatened the flanks for Barbarossa. North Africa was also shameful, once again only saved by Rommel and the afrika corps. If your talking national socialist, I'm never going to dispute that German efficiency and bureaucracy, however stereotypical, will always rate highly, but the state was run on the whims of a madman, surrounded by sycophants enacting policies derived by attempting to ingratiate themselves from vague concepts and hints from the aforementioned madman. Often in competition with pointless duplication of effort.
Never mind that - they've gone and named the site road.cc instead of Surreyrider.cc - what were they thinking‽‽
What happened with the 2024 data that would have been published some time earlier in 2025. Did they even bother requesting that?
80 thoughts on “Is “the principal benefit of cycling achieved only by risking life and limb”? Cyclist gets lambasted for jumping traffic queue; 30km/hr speed limit for bicycles in Flanders; Van Aert trains for cyclocross in snow + more on the live blog”
The Irish cyclist’s overtake
The Irish cyclist’s overtake on the zebra crossing was fine, going nice and slow and wide enough to check if there were any pedestrians and to stop if there were. Most of their overtaking is fine also, however I definitely would not ride anywhere in the oncoming traffic lane if it means oncoming traffic passing you while you’re there; you simply can’t rely on drivers being ready for you to appear there and if they hit you you won’t have a leg to stand on legally. Those parts of the video definitely fall into the “we’re furious if drivers do that to us so we shouldn’t do it to them” category, in my opinion.
It is amusing at the end though to see all the traffic pulling into the oncoming lane to overtake the stopped oil tanker, surely by the lights of most of the anti-cyclist commenters on Twitter all of the traffic should have stopped and waited for it to move?
Agree – I would prefer to
Agree – I would prefer to pass on the left of the car, rather than towards oncoming traffic. The cyclist also appears to cross a solid white line. Not sure if it is different in Ireland, but in the UK that is illegal (unless you are in Lancashire Police purview)
Only watched it the once – but it looked like all the cars were behaving really well. The white van at the end looked to wait for the oncoming cyclist to pass, before overtaking the tanker.
This is what the irish Rules
This is what the irish Rules of the Road (their Highway Code) says.
*disclaimer. Not from the Govt site and I havent checked for a “cyclists filtering” exception.
Single continuous line: this denotes no overtaking on the carriageway on either side of the road. This must be strictly adhered to unless there is an obstruction in the road such as a vehicle, bicycle or horse moving less than 10kph, or if you are turning off the road into a driveway or side road and it is safe to do so.
Secret_squirrel wrote:
interesting the text is taken almost directly from UK code, except 10mph becomes 10kph. very few cyclists doing less than 10kph I would think, except on a steep uphill
Much of Irish Law / rules
Much of Irish Law / rules underlying principles and practice are – just don’t mention it to an Irish person.
Fascinating. I should have
Fascinating. I should have checked that! Good to know. I assumed there was no exceptions. Thank you (to everyone)
HoldingOn wrote:
It’s a bit tricky that one because in the UK (assume Irish law fairly similar) you’re not allowed to cross the white line except to overtake a stationary vehicle or bicycles, horses and road maintenance vehicles travelling less than 10mph. So the literal interpretation of that would be it’s okay to cross the white line to overtake a traffic jam that’s stationary, but obviously that would not be permissible for a motor-vehicle, I don’t know if the same applies to a bicycle or motorcycle, given that they have the capability to pull back into the traffic if there is an oncoming vehicle that a car doesn’t. Someone on here will know, I’m sure!
HoldingOn wrote:
It is allowed to overtake slow moving traffic doing less than 10mph, such as horses, cyclists (sometimes) and stationary cars.
Highway code rule 129
wycombewheeler wrote:
To be pedantic:
The way you phrase it and the way the Highway Code phrase it are subtly different. There is no general provision to overtake “slow moving traffic” – you may cross/straddle the continuous line to overtake a stationary vehicle (of any type), OR to overtake a pedal cycle, horse or road maintenance vehicle travelling at 10 mph or less.
Rendel Harris wrote:
Seconded (thirded?). If I’m doing something similar I always act like I’m playing leapfrog – overtake the stationary traffic but always make sure there’s a gap you can get into if there’s oncoming traffic.
On the matter of oncoming traffic, I went into the hatched bit down the middle of the A369 the other morning (I didn’t want to go on the shared-use path and then have to wait for the traffic to pass by so I could cross to the shared-use path on the other side, so I’d gone onto the carriageway, which was empty at that specific moment).
Nothing wakes you up like going along in the hatched bit and realising that the oncoming HGV is drifting to it’s driver’s right… INTO the hatched area you’re in
Ahh Neal O’Kelly one of those
Ahh Neal O’Kelly one of those weird anti-cycling trolls who appears to spend his entire day looking for cycling posts to make hateful comments underneath. One of the reasons I left Elons toxic platform.
I can’t decide if he is a
I can’t decide if he is a parody or part parody.
He isn’t quite up to being an effective barrack room lawyer, and he does remind me of Gussie Finknottle.
I had a somewhat interesting chat with him the other day, explaining how “reasonable adjustments” on making barriers accessible meant that they were all going to be bollards, provided that reasonable will increasingly follow national guidelines.
I was also introducing him to the case law from 2021 from the Appeal Court I met recently which codifies (either convincingly or authoritatively depending on technicalities – it was a proposition in a Judge-adgument not a finding) that motobike ASB prevention interventions may not impede lawful use.
a1white wrote:
Yes, he is a weird one all right. The only reason I haven’t blocked him is the entertainment value from seeing him constantly make a fool of himself
“They say they want 1.5
“They say they want 1.5 meters but don’t give themselves 1.5 meters??”
“They don’t want to get punched but will walk past my arm??”
“They don’t want to get threatened with a knife but they will go and cut vegetables??”
I’m amazed how often I hear
I’m amazed how often I hear this too. If someone can’t comprehend the difference between a person on a 10kg bike slowly filtering past a stationary metal box, and 2-tonnes being propelled within inches of a very vulnerable road user at 30-60mph, when they could be forced to change direction at any moment by a stone or a gust of wind, then not only should they surrender their licence, but they should probably go back to infant school.
Absolutely. Almost all
Absolutely. Almost all cyclists are drivers but very few drivers are cyclists. Apparently respect and decency have no place when humans share a road.
Dunnoeither wrote:
A big part of the problem is that too many drivers think they can do what they like and that not all road users are equal. A bit of ‘levelling up’ would surely help.
If they knew that every cyclist carried a firearm then the number of incidents would dramatically decrease.
If the cyclist was their next door neighbour and the driver knows that if they harmed the cyclist then the cyclist’s family would wreak violent revenge then they’d surely drive far more carefully around that cyclist.
Simon E wrote:
You’d think so, but did I ever tell you about the time that one of the designers at the company I work at (a family friend – my cousin’s best mate) “close” passed me so badly that he left an imprint of his wing mirror on my right thigh? I pulled him aside in the office to speak to him about it, but on the way home that day he left-hooked me so badly I locked up the brakes and nearly ended up under his wheels.
Most drivers just don’t give a fuck.
Quote:
Cue bicycle nunberplates in Flanders!
Yeah, there’s no way to
Yeah, there’s no way to enforce it for cyclists, but those on mopeds etc. will need to watch out which is great.
Reading the article I think
Reading the article I think the title is misleading. I think the limit is aimed at motor traffic using the bicycle streets not the cyclists.
Yep, that’s what I think. You
Yep, that’s what I think. You can’t send a fine through the post for speeding if you can’t identify the rider.
I refer you to the first
I refer you to the first paragraph I quoted.
I remember when visiting my
I remember when visiting my grandparents in 1950s Geraardsbergen bikes had registration numbers on little triangular metal plates attached to the forks.
CyclingMikey’s explanation of
CyclingMikey’s brilliant explanation of the difference between cyclists filtering and drivers passing too closely:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikWFQquoZto
I prefer this one: https:/
I prefer this one: https://twitter.com/theJeremyVine/status/1492768026965463040
‘Hmm… this page doesn’t exist. Try searching for something else.’
Sorry, when you paste a link
Sorry, when you paste a link road.cc sometimes includes a trailing space in the hyperlink. Try this.
Yep, thats a good one too.
Yep, thats a good one too.
To me the Flanders bicycle
To me the Flanders bicycle road speed limit sounds, on balance, to be a benefit for people using cycles. It will help control dozy drivers in motor vehicles, which is the problem.
Provided it is enforced.
The only issue is imo if it turns out to be an entering wedge.
Yup, 30 km/h is a bit over 18
Yup, 30 km/h is a bit over 18 MPH, I have no trouble staying under that in town without needing a speedometer, unless there’s a long descent.
Despite the fact that it
Despite the fact that it could have been highly entertaining, probably the right call not to include pave sections in the opening stage of the Tour. Opening stages are always incredibly chaotic and nervous anyway, throw in a rainstorm and muddy cobbles and it could have been absolute carnage; imagine the criticism the organisers would get if two or three GC contenders went out on the opening day with broken collarbones or worse. In eschewing the chance to race on the cobbles they are thinking about the health and spectacle of the race as a whole as opposed to a one-off sensation at the start. For those of us who love Paris-Roubaix, well, we’ve got Paris-Roubaix! Without wanting to sound too much of the old curmudgeon that I am, I hope this starts a trend to stop including quite so many “novelty” stages in GTs, they are exciting enough as it is without the need to chuck in gravel or cobbles, in my opinion.
Quite apart from the cobbles
Quite apart from the cobbles thing, three stages in the Pas de Calais looks ideal for popping over w bike to spectate and ride and bring back wine.
I love that, for Cycling in
I love that, for Cycling in Kilkenny, that was enough traffic to warrant posting a video of! When I think of the hundreds of stationary cars I have passed in my commuting…
Fatal Crashes
Fatal Crashes
The attached report refines data previously published by
and is a very significant step forward in understanding the causes of fatal crashes. By using the last, rather than an early assessment point, we draw benefit from an extensive investigation using a whole range of expertise, and in doing so provide a much more precise assessment of the contributory factors. We recognise that more informed fatal crash data will help all stakeholders – including policing – respond to and target the causes, and by doing so help to save life. It will also provide a more informed picture for crash victims and the wider public. The data has found a notable rise in speed and impairment through drink or drugs as contributory factors, and therefore we now know that these offence types are much more likely to result in fatalities. This reinforces our strategy of targeting drivers who commit these offences. On average 5 people die every day in the UK in road crashes, and somebody is killed or seriously injured every 23 minutes. So many people lives needlessly cut short or changed, and so many bereaved families left with lifelong devastation. This has to change and more informed data can help influence the urgent action needed.
From Andy Cox
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/contributory-factors-in-fatal-collisions-comparing-stats19-with-post-investigation-recording-2021-data/contributory-factors-in-fatal-collisions-comparing-stats19-with-post-investigation-recording-2021-data
Thanks – an excellent link.
Thanks – an excellent link.
Some limits to the data of course (it’s the police, so police have to have attended AND made a note of something) but it’s high proportion of the total available.
Probably not surprising to everyone but the main ones associated with deaths:
Speed – exceeding the speed limit or travelling too fast for conditions
Drink or drugs – driver or rider impaired by alcohol / driver or rider impaired by drugs
Distraction – driver using mobile phone
(Plus not wearing seatbelts)
Remind me why phone use and speeding aren’t “real” crimes again?
Please don’t share AI “Art”.
Please don’t share AI “Art”. It is trained by stealing from human artists. Every AI art piece is by definition stolen intellectual property from a all human artists who have a hard enough life as it is.
Today its: “Har har it put fingers on a shoe har har” but we are a very small number of years away from “Why would I employ a creative human to do that job when an AI can do it instead for free?”
I don’t want to live in a world where human creativity is eradicated, do you?
Agree. I don’t take
Agree. I don’t take photographs, because it’s putting landscape and portrait painters out of a job and eradicating human creativity.
People have wanted art, and to employ good artists, despite the technological changes through pretty much the whole of human history. I don’t see that changing.
If someone’s art can be replaced, without any loss of meaning, by AI then it probably wasn’t a good use of the artist’s time or skills. I’m pretty sure you could build a robot that could pedal a self-steering bike at 100kph, but people will still want to watch the Tour de France.
That doesn’t really change
That doesn’t really change the fact that they are using artwork without permission or payment, potentially for commercial purposes.
Unless an artist is blind
Unless an artist is blind then so have they!
Iirc one of the newer
Iirc one of the newer releases of either Disco Diffusion or Stable Diffusion is trained on unstolen art.
Can’t say I really know anything about it personally but a friend of mine likes to waffle about that stuff.
Most commercial art is in
Most commercial art is in large part created out of the works and ideas of other artists and quite a bit of fine art too. Certain types of work may be automated, but moan about it to a highly skilled type compositor of forty years ago, paying opportunities for human creativity will remain and probably expand.
To the angry cyclist for
To the angry cyclist for overtaking cars the red bus, there is a great cycle path next to him.
cyclisto wrote:
If you had ever ridden that route, or indeed just looked carefully at the end, you would know that the cycle path is not finished, if you look near the end of the video you can see that it’s blocked by signs. The intention ultimately is that one will be able to carry on straight heading west towards Southwark Park and on to Tower Bridge, but at the moment the only way to keep going is to get off the cycle path and go where the camera cyclist is going, round the one-way system.
I saw it had some obstacles
I saw it had some obstacles that force you to stop, but I would definitely pick this route than share the road with motor traffic. The cycle path on the video is like a motorway compared to the one I use for my commute, and still prefer it than the main road.
@hawkinspeter yes tangling with pedestrians often happens, but in such cases I have to shame to overtake them by their pedestrian side.
Overall cycle paths can be a little slower, but I don’t like trading speed for safety.
There was also another
There was also another cyclist using it fine, go figure.
Adam Sutton wrote:
Please see what I wrote above, the cycle lane stops just after where the bus has stopped and the only way of progressing from there is to cross both the traffic lanes and ride in the carriageway where the rider is. Surely you of all people wouldn’t be advocating that the cyclist should carry on on the pavement after the cycle lane has stopped? If you actually watch to the end of the video you will see the other “cyclist using it fine” having to come to a complete stop and wait to cross both the traffic lanes to join the camera cyclist in order to carry on their journey. This camera cyclist, by the way, is a huge advocate of that cycle lane and regularly posts videos of himself using it, if it was usable there he would be on it.
Please see what I wrote to
Please see what I wrote to the point that along that busy section of road it is clearly open and being used, enabling someone cycling with a child to avoid the situation they put themselves in, at least up to that point. It’s not rocket surgery.
Edit (hope that is OK) just to add, no where am I advocating cycling on the pavement, so quit strawmanning. Anyone with an ounce of common sense and a set of eyes can see at the point the lane closes there is a zebra crossing that would allow them to cross safely and join the carriageway.
Adam Sutton wrote:
So a cyclist knowing that the cycle lane is coming to an end in about 50 yards must ride right up to the point at which the cycle lane ends and then across two lanes of busy traffic in order to progress, rather than perfectly legally switch to the road in advance in a safer place to do so. And if they do decide to use the road then it serves them right if they encounter motorists who are breaking the law, that will be their fault and not the motorists’?
Rendel Harris wrote:
Maybe the motorists want to punish cyclists that look ahead and anticipate problems? They’re probably envious as they can only see up to the car in front and no further.
Please point out where I have
Please point out where I have said they “must” use the cycle lane?
As the highway code states, and am sure you are aware?
“Rule 61
Cycle Routes and Other Facilities. Cycle lanes are marked by a white line (which may be broken) along the carriageway (see Rule 140). Use facilities such as cycle lanes and tracks, advanced stop lines and toucan crossings (see Rules 62 and 73) where they make your journey safer and easier. This will depend on your experience and skills and the situation at the time. While such facilities are provided for reasons of safety, cyclists may exercise their judgement and are not obliged to use them.“
As noted there is a perfectly usable section of cycle lane that would avoid that section of road and the conflict. This situation ultimately isn’t even about them being on a bike, in a car you often face the same impatience. So why as a more vulnerable road user put yourself in that situation in the first place, and then even try and force your way through?
I also take back what I said about it being someone with a child, on second look it was another adult and the camera cyclists passed them with oncoming traffic like an absolute dick.
Adam Sutton wrote:
So, to use that zebra crossing cyclists would have to dismount, push twenty yards up the pavement to the zebra crossing, cross over the first zebra to the island, wait for someone to stop for them on the second zebra, cross over again and then push further down the road to find a safe place to rejoin, rather than join the carriageway perfectly legally and safely a little further down. Why exactly should they have to do this, so that motorists can carry on using the oncoming traffic lane to overtake the bus instead of waiting a few seconds themselves? Extraordinary how ingrained it is in the minds of some people that the car is king and that cyclists should be doing everything possible to stay out of their way, to the extent of eschewing perfectly safe (if motorists are prepared to follow the law) legal and sensible riding practices in order to expose themselves to considerable inconvenience just in case they get in the way of any motorists who decide that they would like to break the laws regarding overtaking.
Rendel Harris wrote:
And your point is? Sometimes, it makes sense to do this. Unless you want a bit of fame on X formerly twatter I guess.
Rendel Harris wrote:
Thanks for showing the cyclist using it.
Adam Sutton wrote:
You’re welcome, it also shows the cyclist having to come to a complete stop and wait to continue their journey whilst the camera cyclist, even though impeded by the motorists making an illegal overtake on the bus, carries on their journey.
Rendel Harris wrote:
Oh good grief having to stop! Same as you would at junctions, lights and crossings. Sometimes you have to stop. Again, none of this is rocket surgery. It’s a little long forgotten thing called common sense.
Adam Sutton wrote:
You have to stop a lot commuting along that path, so why would you add to the amount of time you have to stop when there is a perfectly legal and (if the drivers were driving legally) safe alternative to use on the road? It’s so telling of your attitude towards cyclists and cycling that you have made six posts on this issue castigating the cyclist for their perfectly legal behaviour and you have not mentioned a single time the motorists driving illegally.
Rendel Harris wrote:
Actually all I did at the start was point out that the cycle lane was usable. I have expressed an opinion that it would be preferable in that given situation. The only comment I have made that could be claimed to be “castigation” is their poor pass of the other cyclist.
You have once again come back with straw man arguments, and once again are insistent that I have an attitude against cyclists.
Yes the drivers are pulling an illegal pass, that much is bleedin’ obvious and doesn’t actually need to be stated, hence my comment;
“This situation ultimately isn’t even about them being on a bike, in a car you often face the same impatience. So why as a more vulnerable road user put yourself in that situation in the first place, and then even try and force your way through? “
It is little more than opinion and is as valid as yours, please take that bug out your arse you seem to have towards me.
Adam, at some point you
Adam, at some point you realise that all Rendel is here for is to argue, and promote traffic to the site as part of the road.cc staff.
Left_is_for_Losers wrote:
road.cc editors, as I’ve been a part of your staff for so long can somebody tell me where my paycheque is please?
Get well soon Loser. xxx
Adam Sutton wrote:
Charming expression. Perhaps when you take the elephant-sized one you have about cyclists going about their lawful occasions on the road out of yours?
Truth hurts I guess.
Truth hurts I guess. And apologies for merely mentioning a usable cycle lane, had I known it would trigger you so much I wouldn’t have.
Adam Sutton wrote:
Common sense like not overtaking a bus when there’s a cyclist approaching and an overtake would be dangerous or at least force the cyclist to stop to avoid a collision?
hawkinspeter wrote:
What’s your point? I am not denying that, common sense by and large has gone out the window and is why either cycling or driving I use a camera.
Adam Sutton wrote:
My point is that you’re only calling for “common sense” from the cyclist when the far more appropriate (and useful) response is that the illegal overtaking is the problem. “Common sense” would be the cyclist assuming that the public road was for use by all traffic and not be put in danger by self-entitled motorists who can’t even wait for a couple of seconds. On one side you have safe, reasonable behaviour and on the other side you have dangerous selfish behaviour and you seem to think that it’s the cyclist that needs to change.
hawkinspeter wrote:
I haven’t really, but whatever straw man helps you and Rendy out, sure.
In terms of “common sense” This is nothing more than having the sense to use a route that has the least risk. Same as on my commute I take a route that probably add about 1-2 miles, but both misses a big hill (so timewise not much different) and also a main road that is heavily used by HGV traffic. Sure it is perfectly legal and right that someone could use that route, but common sense would avoid it.
This article is from the cycilsts perspective, is it not? So expect a viewpoint from that perspective.
Adam Sutton wrote:
Have I misunderstood you? I’m not intending to build a straw man and don’t see that I am.
You made a comment about the cyclist using the bike lane and having to stop frequently being “common sense” and I responded that the best use of common sense would be by the motorists – after all it’s the motorists that are causing the issue and the danger.
Anyhow, there’s often a trade-off between safety and convenience and people will have different appetites for perceived danger. If you prefer to stick to bike lanes, then that’s fine and dandy, but it smacks of victim blaming to decry a cyclist using the road as the being dangerous when the danger is entirely manufactured by poor driving. Yes it happens and the cyclist avoided a collision, but not everyone wants to take a different route just because traffic laws are poorly enforced.
hawkinspeter wrote:
I am hardly “decrying” or “victim blaming” jesus wept.
As you just stated “people will have different appetites for perceived danger.” All I have done is point out the cycle lane was clearly usable along that stretch and could avoid the situation.
Adam Sutton wrote:
But you did write this:
I’m simply pointing out the asymmetry in your treatment of cyclists and motorists. If a motorist had to emergency brake because some idiot was overtaking a bus stupidly, then would you be pointing out that there’s other routes that they could have been driving?
You’re questioning the judgement of the cyclist for daring to use the road and the only problem with taking that route is the actions of one particular motorist. Do you see why I would interpret your comment as victim blaming?
hawkinspeter wrote:
Yes I do, because like Rendy you cannot simply accept a simple statement or viewpoint that differs from your own hard set viewpoints, and therefore have to create counterpoints to things you want me to have said and blow things out of proportion.
I am going to end this by simply stating in reference to one of the tangents that has been locked on repeatedly. With regards expecting a cyclists to stop, dismount and rejoin the carriageway utilizing the crossing. The very fact that there is a crossing there means there is a degree of probabilty that cycling on the road you would have to stop, so this is hardly the huge incovenience it is being touted as.
We have an area that gives
We have an area that gives options. The one is safer and slower and the other is faster and as demostrated in the video possibly dangerous. Anyone may chose his route. I would definitely choose safe and slow, some here would prefer speed. As many times posted here before, I cycle in order to feel safe given the expected real conditions, not the ones I would expect other drivers to make if they fully obliged to the law as if they were robots.
I will not necessary agree with some laws in other countries that oblige you to cycle in cycle lane if it exists. But in any case when there is dedicated cycle infra I try to use it. Not only because in the vast majority is safer than having to share the road with a 40 ton truck, but because when you use them, it is the best advertisement for people still hesitant to cycle. More cyclists on the road, greater chances to have better cycling infra in the future.
Have a nice weekend guys
I live outside of London
I live outside of London where what passes for cycle infrastructure is in most cases a shared use sign on the pavement. I would love to have infrastructure like this on my doorstep, and enjoy using it when I have the energy to take the brompton with me to avoid the tube going from central to West London.
Have a great one.
Adam Sutton wrote:
I responded to your questioning the cyclist using the road – you did specifically do that, so why are you fabricating some personal attack on me and “Rendy”?
I have no problem with you having a different viewpoint, but if it’s a victim blaming one, then I’ll try to clarify why you want the cyclist to modify their behaviour, but not the motorist that’s causing the issue.
Why do you think this is being blown out of proportion? I at no point accused you of victim blaming, but pointed out that your comment was (there is a difference between accusing someone of “being” something vs pointing out that a comment has that property). I’m wondering if you’re projecting somewhat.
hawkinspeter wrote:
I am not projecting at all, just as I never “decried” the cyclists for using the road. All I did was point out that the cycle lane that cyclisto referenced at the start, was at that point in use/usable.
Adam Sutton wrote:
Well, it certainly came across that way to me.
Decry: To express disapproval of (a person); denounce: synonym: criticize.
So, interpreting your question as a simple, non-judgemental question, I would answer that the cyclist wants to use the straight-forward quicker route.
You’ve completely ignored
You’ve completely ignored what I’ve said, the cycle path stops there and you would have to cross the road and cycle in the traffic lane that the cyclist is using anyway. They have simply switched to the road sensibly in advance so they don’t have to try and cross two lanes of traffic in order to carry on going forward.
cyclisto wrote:
Do you mean the one on the other side of the road? Just a case of crossing two lanes of traffic to get there, probably tangle with pedestrians or get stopped at every side street and then cross back over two lanes of traffic when it suddenly stops and you want to use the road again.
Alternatively, drivers could just wait until they could make a safe overtake of the bus – maybe 5 seconds or so?
Sarcasm on
Sarcasm on
But surely the vehicles were “established”
sarcasm off
Musk: “The only reason I am
Musk: “The only reason I am here, Jonathan, is because you are a friend.”
Hilarious! As if he has friends.
AI cycling kit: the shoes are
AI cycling kit: the shoes are making me twitch. Why did nobody prompt it to replace football boots with cycling shoes?!