“How is this even a question?” Cyclists slam “who’s in the right” poll after rider struck by corner-cutting driver; Red light hypocrisy as lorry driver speeds through junction; LTN congestion claims blasted; Pog on the Poggio + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
“Maybe the problem isn’t with cyclists, or an ambition for quiet safe residential streets, or Low Traffic Neighbourhoods. Maybe the problem is with too many cars or too many careless drivers”
More from Streatham’s now LTN-less car utopia:
Just maybe the problem isn’t with cyclists or an ambition for quiet safe residential streets, or Low Traffic Neighbourhoods. Maybe the problem is with too many cars or too many careless drivers.
Streatham High Road today! pic.twitter.com/iFhmRW0ts6
— Pete Elliott (@pete556) March 11, 2024
Pog on the Poggio (and some questionable wall art)
A well-wrapped up Tadej Pogačar here, helpfully pointing out exactly where he’s going to attack (and warm the hearts of headline writers everywhere) on Saturday, during today’s recon of Milan-Sanremo’s crucial final climb.
Oh, and he also had time during his recce to visit one wall artist’s flattering depiction of the Slovenian superstar (alongside, I assume, Filippo Ganna), located somewhere on the Poggio:
Yikes.
Rather diplomatically, Pogačar described the portrait as “me in fill ‘sprinter’ version”.
To be fair, Pog in full sprinter mode would be a frightening prospect at La Primavera…
Giro’s bonkers, “innovative” new time trial helmet makes an appearance… back in 2001
In more ‘there is nothing new under the sun’ news, road.cc founding father Dave – while presumably digging through his old Cycling Plus archives – stumbled upon this dead ringer for Giro’s new “innovative”, crazy, probably soon-to-be-banned Aerohead time trial helmet… being worn by Cyclescheme founder Richard Grigsby way back in 2001.
“John Lafford made it and it fitted over an approved aero helmet,” Grigsby said at the time. “I used it after the excellent ’Get fit for the millennium’ series in Cycling Plus to score my dream of a 20- minute 10.”
Well, at least he got better results out of it than Visma-Lease a Bike have so far (what, too harsh?) And now we finally know where Giro and POC got all their ideas…
2023 season “unique and may never happen again”, says Mathieu van der Poel
As he prepares for his season debut, and title defence, at Milan-Sanremo on Saturday, Mathieu van der Poel has admitted that it will be difficult to replicate his career-defining 2023, a year that saw him a maiden rainbow jersey on the road in Glasgow, along with a ‘cross world title and wins at Paris-Roubaix and Sanremo.
(Alex Whitehead/SWpix.com)
“Yeah, it was a really special season and it will be really difficult to do it the same or better… is impossible, I think. But for sure, I’m aware of the fact that it was unique and it will maybe never happen again,” Van der Poel, who’s already began his 2024 in style by winning his sixth cyclocross world championships, told the Eurosport Cycling Show, which will air tonight at 5.30pm.
When asked for his favourite moment of 2023, the 29-year-old said: “If I have to pick one, I think the World Championships is something I was always dreaming of, so it was maybe the nicest victory of last year.”
(Alex Broadway/SWpix.com)
Looking ahead to 2024, Van der Poel reckons his main targets are “mainly the same as I did last year” – with the added bonus of a possible tilt at Olympic gold in the road race or on his mountain bike (or both), with the MTB race coming just eight days after the end of this year’s Tour de France in Nice.
“It’s a bit of a strange year with the Olympics, which is also a goal for me,” the multidiscipline star says. “But yeah, mainly, the big races I target are the same as last year, and then I’ll be at the Olympics.”
In December, Van der Poel told Het Nieuwsblad that he won’t replicate his 2021 season, which saw him leave the Tour early to prepare for the Olympic mountain bike race in Tokyo (one he spectacularly crashed out of in the first lap as Tom Pidcock took gold).
(Zac Williams/SWpix.com)
“Either I’ll ride the Tour and then I’ll only do the road race at the Games,” he said. “Or I don’t ride the Tour and then I do the road race and mountain biking. What I am certainly not going to do is ride the Tour and then leave it earlier, like I did for Tokyo.”
“We had a really good season, especially with Jasper [Philipsen] in the Tour, he was also super successful,” the four-time monument winner tells Eurosport. “So I think we try to improve every year. We will do so next year, but it will be difficult for the team in general to do better than this year.”
Well, despite those cautious words, I wouldn’t bet against Van der Poel emulating his rival and training partner Tadej Pogačar (who won his first race of the season at Strade Bianche) by starting his 2024 with a bang on the Poggio on Saturday…
“These damn cyclists need to stop before they kill someone,” jokes cyclist, after filming lorry driver ploughing through red light that’s “only protecting pedestrians and cyclists after all”
We’ve all heard it hundreds of times before: ‘Those pesky cyclists never stop at red lights, they’re a danger to everyone around them’ (to be honest, I’ve seen two or three variants of that very phrase on social media this morning).
However, that kind of anti-cycling energy and focus on red light jumping never seems to be transferred to those with the most potential to, you know, cause harm on the roads.
> “Why I skip red lights”: Journalist makes the case for cyclists riding through reds
And that’s the message currently being articulated by Canadian cyclist and TikToker Chris Crond who, while riding his bike at night through the wide, snowy roads of Winnipeg, Manitoba, crossed a junction and looked back just in time to see a lorry driver speeding through a red light.
Let me take a wild guess @cityofwinnipeg, there’s nothing you can do about your contracted semi’s blowing through red lights UNBELIEVABLY dangerously.
I mean this red light is only protecting pedestrians and cyclists after all right? #Winnipeg #biketwitter #bikelane pic.twitter.com/z6FOxdxTvF
— CʜʀɪsCʀᴏɴᴅ 🤟 (@chriscrond) March 11, 2024
“Did they just blow through?” he says in the clip. “F***ing joke.”
Tagging the City of Winnipeg’s municipal government in his post, Chris wrote: “Let me take a wild guess, there’s nothing you can do about your contracted semis blowing through red lights UNBELIEVABLY dangerously?
“I mean this red light is only protecting pedestrians and cyclists after all right?
“And by the way, if you say there’s nothing you can do or don’t respond, I’m going to step out when I have the right of way next time right as one of these guys are blowing though this red light and see what happens. And if I don’t die, I will be suing you.
“And you notice that fence? That very big blind spot before entering this crosswalk when going South. If you’re biking through here and you have a green light, you’re going to be biking fast. I guess our tax dollars are funding the death of our citizens, huh? Great investment.”
These damn Cyclists need to stop before they kill someone. They don’t follow any traffic laws and it’s unbelievably dangerous.
It’s time we license bike use like we do with these drivers. Then our streets will be safe. pic.twitter.com/nuuy9kiXUi
— CʜʀɪsCʀᴏɴᴅ 🤟 (@chriscrond) March 11, 2024
In another version of the video – complete with music and the sarcastic caption ‘Cyclists always run red lights’, Chris continued, tongue firmly in cheek: “These damn cyclists need to stop before they kill someone. They don’t follow any traffic laws and it’s unbelievably dangerous.
“It’s time we license bike use like we do with these drivers. Then our streets will be safe.”
The scary part is the number of people who think that would be the case… Until the next lorry driver blows on by.
Edinburgh’s cycle lanes strike again!
> Cyclists fed up with “ridiculous” lamppost blocking busy cycle lane for five months
‘It’s definitely the cyclist’s fault… because of, err, reasons’
The fault lies with the cyclist, of course. Because of logic and reasons, and namely hmhmhmaahaaaaahmmmmm. pic.twitter.com/1nXkCJ3RyG
— David Rodrigues (@jdrodrigues12) March 12, 2024
Another day, another “who’s in the right?” cyclist versus driver question – with a glaringly obvious answer (while motorists claim “cyclists do this to themselves”)
Ah, don’t you just love it when you’re waiting to turn right at a junction, and a motorist chooses to cut the corner, ploughing straight into you, and then, five years later, some so-called ‘media personality’ shares it on Twitter and asks “whose mistake was this”?
> Mechanic escapes driving ban after cutting corner straight into cyclist
That’s the unfortunate internet fate that has befallen poor Michael Rammell, who was struck by a BMW driver while out cycling in Berkshire back in March 2019, luckily only suffering some “bumps, scrapes, and bruises”.
Rammell revealed at the time that he had been bombarded by anti-cycling trolls after sharing footage of the collision, describing it as “quite chilling just how many people have no regard for road safety”.
Whose mistake was this.
The driver or the cyclist? pic.twitter.com/df8dOIfm0M
— Oli London (@OliLondonTV) March 9, 2024
Well, as they say, those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it, and almost exactly five years after the collision, it’s doing the rounds again, having been viewed a whopping 20 million times since Oli London posted it on Twitter on Saturday, alongside the caption: “Whose mistake was this, the driver or the cyclist?”
Let’s just say some of the replies are… predictable.
“Cyclist. He was supposed to stay single file in his lane,” wrote Robert.
“Cyclists do this to themselves—they think they’re invulnerable to the 2000 pound very fast machines around them, and they want to use the same space as those machines. Their collective sense of entitlement is infuriating,” added another user, perhaps forgetting to note that the motorist in the clip in question certainly felt ‘entitled’ to use the wrong lane while taking a corner.
“I’ll go ahead and piss everybody off by saying 50/50. The cyclist is fault because he was in the middle of the road, rather than the middle of the lane or the outside edge. The car is at fault because they cut the turn too close and entered the wrong lane,” said the diplomatic, but still very wrong, TX Dodge Dude.
Thankfully, others had some sense (a rare commodity on social media these days, mind you).
OMFG no wonder the justice system
Is fucked if people like the ones saying the cyclist ever sit on a jury ! When there’s clear video evidence of the car in the wrong lane pic.twitter.com/txBSwh35BB— leilani dowding 🌸🚜 ☮️ (@LeilaniDowding) March 9, 2024
“How is this even a question? Cyclist never leaves his lane, driver cuts the corner,” noted Glenn, helpfully.
“It’s very clear driver was on wrong side of road,” said the very observant Leilani.
“Car clearly goes into the other lane. Car is in the wrong, all day long,” added Matthew.
Alright, that’s enough of that ‘debate’…
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Latest Comments
Saw this while on the BBC. Maybe this is unfair - the police have a job to do, they were investigating a murder, and they can park where they like. But really, did they need to? If even they have just defaulted to parking on the pavement, what hope is there?
Yeah - I've no idea how you ward that off!
And a giant inflatable haribo gold bear...
Will that take some of the heat out of the situation?
The usual misinformation being peddled, an interviewee at 8:21am on the BBC Breakfast news was calling for legislation to "require insurance for these vehicles that can go faster than 15.5mph" - when there already is legislation (it's just rarely enforced, as is the case with a lot of road crime). Then the example of the pedestrian who was hit by an illegal e-scooter rider, who thought she would be safe as she was on a crossing. But she was carelessly crossing on a red man. Had she been mown down by a car driver, she would likely have been far more seriously injured and this probably wouldn't have made the news!
Throw some salt over your shoulder.
@mdavidford That was my assumption, but have just had a look and it does seem to be the case (otherwise MIB would be yet another part of the answer to the "cyclists don't have insurance" complaint). So no, I don't think a 'traditional' 4-8mph mobility scooter has anything to do with MIB.
Gosh, comment counts, remember them?
Is there a sweepstake at road.cc HQ, where the staff member who nominates the closest minute to the timestamp of the first “off-road feature on road.cc” comment to be posted wins the pot?
58 thoughts on ““How is this even a question?” Cyclists slam “who’s in the right” poll after rider struck by corner-cutting driver; Red light hypocrisy as lorry driver speeds through junction; LTN congestion claims blasted; Pog on the Poggio + more on the live blog”
Bywaters Skip lorry driver
Bywaters Skip lorry driver going through red light in London next to a CSH bike lane, years ago.
https://youtu.be/3hNGrZqAck8
The obvious fault of the
The obvious fault of the driver cutting the corner, not bothering to look for a cyclist and hitting him was just what happened to me (imagine the cyclist waiting to leave the Sainsbury’s exit road in order to turn right onto the main road), except that the offending vehicle was going faster to avoid an oncoming vehicle. I was lucky in being only hit by the offside mirror. The police said ‘it was only a momentary loss of concentration-NFA’. So began my headcam career and the increasingly dispiriting dealings with the unapologetically anti-cyclist, pro-motorist LancsFilth
Re cutting corners; never
Re cutting corners; never mind it being a problem when on the bike; it’s a problem full stop. I can guarantee when I’m out in the car, stopped at a junction, a driver will cut the corner. I blame The Bell End School of Motoring!
Plenty of corner cutting
Plenty of corner cutting shown in dashcam videos.
Replace the cyclist with a car and driver and no one would be saying the driver was in the wrong place on his side of the road.
All the people saying that
All the people saying that the cyclist ought to have been in the middle of the lane, or over to the left (to turn right?) and yet you can guarantee that if the road had been slightly wider then motorists would have been happily waiting side by side to come out of there…
Have you seen Mr Neils latest
Have you seen Mr Neal’s latest cycling video on Youtube…. now we know who runs the school of motoring you name. The bloke has not got a clue!
The car cutting the corner is
The car cutting the corner is a result of the driver looking for the gap instead of the road that they’re turning in to (clearly on the wrong side). Had similar nearly happen to me although the driver saw me last minute and had to swerve on to the right side of the road. Clearly in a trance waiting for the gap coming from the opposite direction.
This. People are only
This. People are only looking for other large motor vehicles – that is the “threat” and (human nature) they focus most on that.
How we get beyond that? Perhaps:
a) having an appreciation of the kinds of poor driving which are apparently inevitable (when we have mass motoring) and
b) when designing infra it needs to be very very clear about what to expect where. (It also needs to be standard). Especially where different modes of transport interact. Think level crossings… we’ve collectively learned the hard way there that you can’t be too clear and salient. (We’ve also increasingly realised that it may be better and even cheaper overall to avoid different modes interacting altogether).
Currently cyclists on the roads are still a very rare occurrence (most places). A proportion of drivers “do not expect…” and some “look but don’t see”.
Had a mother dropping her
Had a mother dropping her precious off at the local school do the same to me. Luckily she pulled up just in time. She then scowled at me until I moved out of the way. Now that’s entitlement!
I’ve been on the end of that
I’ve been on the end of that exact corner cutting situation myself a few years ago. Driver (not the car) in question was cutting the corner even more extravagantly and wasn’t even looking ahead & only looked up (presumably from his phone) as I began to shout rather loudly having identified the “oh sh1t” moment and realised that as I was at a standstill there was absolutely nothing I could do. I think I got as far as “OH FUUUUUU….” before the impact. Broken ribs & a dislocated shoulder. Fortunately only superficial damage to the bike. Equally fortunately there were witnesses & a passing paramedic and it ended up with said driver going on an awareness course.
How anyone can think that the cyclist is any way at fault beggars belief, but just speaks to the prevailing attitude on the road.
“Cyclists do this to themselves—they think they’re invulnerable to the 2000 pound very fast machines around them, and they want to use the same space as those machines. Their collective sense of entitlement is infuriating,”
Totally arse about face. The car is the invasive species in a public space. When driving we are wanting to use the same space as other, more longstanding and more vulnerable, road users. It’s the driver & their car that pose the danger (not the road) – hence the requirement for a licence and insurance, and all that infrastructure that’s needed to make roads usable by motor vehicles (the very visible presence of which every inch of the way being what makes the non cycling, non walking, angry drivist belive that “roads are for cars”). The collective sense of misplaced privilege & entitlement…….
Why are you giving that
Why are you giving that utterly digusting oxygen thief london publicity?
I’ve never heard of him. I
I’ve never heard of him. I take it from your comment you wouldn’t recommend I spend this afternoon going through his back catalogue?
“Cyclists do this to
“Cyclists do this to themselves—they think they’re invulnerable to the 2000 pound very fast machines around them, and they want to use the same space as those machines. Their collective sense of entitlement is infuriating,”
I don’t think there’s a single cyclist that considers himself invulnerable to the 2000 pound very fast macines* and, yes, as a taxpayer I do feel entitled to use the space that those taxes have paid for. **
* if we were only dealing with vehicles that weighed just 2000lbs (approx 900kg) perhaps we would feel less vulnerable.
** and I am legally entitled to use.
at a tikme when inflation
at a time when inflation seems rampant in the cycling industry, it’s good to know there are still bargains to be had
Interesting that the corner
Interesting that the corner cutting tweet replies are full of Yanks pulling their puddings.
Can’t beat Rhondda Pickering
Can’t beat Rhondda Pickering for cutting corners!
https://road.cc/content/news/near-miss-day-842-298401
I’d forgotten about that one!
I’d forgotten about that one! Thanks, hirsute! 😀
Regarding the corner cutting,
Regarding the corner cutting…
I think the question to ask is “Would the driver’s manouver have resulted in them failing the driving test?”
Given how dangerous it is, I would say “Yes.”
In which case, anyone denying it is the driver’s fault should burn their own licence.
Ultimately, it is worth considering that if a driver’s actions caught on camera (or with other conclusive proof) would result in a failed test… should the law be that they immediately lose their licence?
I also remember this one from a few years ago.
I was legally waiting in the ASZ/bike box to turn right when an approaching tram driver thinks I’m in the way…
https://youtu.be/7mOl-62dSbo
Was Lambeth Council a LABOUR
Was Lambeth Council a LABOUR council?
I’m sure Flintshire Lad would
I’m sure Flintshire Lad would have let us know in the traditional manner…
I thought I’d better mention
I thought I’d better mention it seeing as road.cc, the most left leaning, woke and loosely cycling related politics website omitted to state the fact.
very woke of you
very woke of you
I agree.
I agree.
Labour is woke? Good one.
Labour is woke? Good one.
Do you know, I’ve been on the
Do you know, I’ve been on the internet for years and years and I’m still not half way through all the websites out there. Keep trying, and I’m sure you’ll find one you like.
.
.
LOL!
.
Gosh, it’s been so long, but still you remember the good times that we had together, don’t you, Babe. (Although it does rather seem that you have forgotten my name. All men are beasts, aren’t they?)
.
OK, here goes, by special request and for one night only:
.
‘A Lay Ba Council. A Laaaaaay Ba Council.’
.
Happy to oblige! Regards, FB.
Flintshire Boy wrote:
Alas… as the bishop said, my apologies.
Yet each man kills the thing he loves,
.
By each let this be heard,
.
Some do it with a bitter look,
.
Some with a flattering word,
.
The coward does it with a kiss,
.
The brave man with a sword!
… but the smart money just runs it over with a car.
.
.
Nice one, Chris, but don’t you be going Wilde with me!
.
All in good spirit (unlike some!). ‘preciate it.
.
Not bad, but IIRC Stephen Fry
Not bad, but IIRC Stephen Fry topped yours when interviewed about his role in an Oscar biopic – “I was born to be Wilde”.
chrisonabike wrote:
Very good, Oscar himself was fond of a pun: he once boasted when giving a talk that he could make a pun on any subject; someone in the audience shouted out “the Queen” and he replied “Oh but of course the Queen is not a subject.”
Shame Fry didn’t win an Oscar for the film (I’ve known worse performances win it), he could really have gone to town with the puns then.
Quite possibly, as a
Quite possibly, as a Conservative council wouldn’t even have trialled an LTN unless some corrupt Big Oil, Big Tech or stupidly rich tw@t businessperson/industriallist/thief had paid them to do so.
Oh, and I’m still a Woke, Snowflake, Left Loser FYI!
You missed out racist and
You missed out racist and mysoginist from your list of Tory donors.
SimoninSpalding wrote:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-68546206
So even Tory MPs agree that at least one of their donors is exactly that.
It’s not racism if you do a
It’s not racism if you do a lot of business in Jamaica, Malaysia and Bangladesh.
In fact, some of my best friends are black.
MattieKempy wrote:
Good to see LABOUR pull yet another u-turn on something.
As Boris said, they’ve got more flip flops than Bournemouth beach
Also sorry to hear you’re still heading down the rabbit hole of woke leftness, good luck picking up the pieces when you find out what a flop it is.
CycleGaz’s own evidence
CycleGaz’s own evidence showing the difference made to congestion during school holidays and term time…
Now what is it that is causing traffic gridlock again…?
Oh yes, cyclists and LTNs…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z57UgWLCfRg
Thanks.
Thanks.
I really enjoyed that for the “traffic jamming”. I missed the quiet side and was rivetted to the normal day ride.
Streatham LTN? pulled out you
Streatham LTN? pulled out you say, no doesnt ring any bells
stonojnr wrote:
wish the parents of the one streatham campaigners had “pulled out”
Another case of “how on earth
Another case of “how on earth have all these people got licences” and “holy shit I share the roads with people like this” moment. The mind boggles. I think you could actually remove a large proportion of bad drivers from the roads with an online questionnaire on road safety and fault. Show them clips like this and ask them to rate who is at fault on a scale of 1-10 and see what happens.
And you can bet that a driver
And you can bet that a driver like that, if there was no queue of cars looking to exit the junction that the car that hit the cyclist would have turned so early they would have nearly mounted a kerb (if there was one) – Seen it all too often from distracted or impatient drivers. Imagine if Give Way lines had alligator teeth to within 2ft of the centre line – drivers wouldn’t cut corners then, would they? ( I know that long or abnormal load vehicles would not have manouvring space at many junctions for this to be viable)
Someone did exactly the same
Someone did exactly the same thing to me, cut the corner and smashed into me. Only difference was that I was also in a car (as a front seat passenger)…
In the case of it being car vs car whose fault is it, the car driver or the car driver? It’s a super simple question; if the bike were are car, who would be at fault? Clearly it would be the car that drove into the stationary vehicle, there’s really no argument.
“Clearly it would be the
“Clearly it would be the DRIVER that drove into the stationary vehicle…”
http://rc-rg.com
Lots of similarities between
Lots of similarities between this article about ski helmets and cycle helmets.
https://www.skimag.com/gear/50-year-stud-on-helmets-and-injury-prevention/
Thanks, interesting, and as
Thanks, interesting, and as you say, the parallels are striking (pun intended).
ride2smile wrote:
I’m curious now about why the men had leg injuries and the women had knee injuries
hawkinspeter wrote:
I wondered that too, but concluded that women must have knees other than on their legs: don’t ask me where.
They come after their names
They come after their names when married? Mrs Smith, née Jones?
eburtthebike wrote:
Must be their kidneys
‘”Cyclist. He was supposed
‘”Cyclist. He was supposed to stay single file in his lane,” wrote Robert.’
It would certainly be worrying if a solitary cyclist were to do anything but stay in single file in his lane. Maybe Robert was very drunk.
Re: the cutting of corner
Re: the cutting of corner video….
I’ve said it before and i’ll keep saying it but its STUPID in the extreme that we only have to take our test once, unless we do something stupid and get a ban with a retest…. not very likely given how few Police there are on the streets now.
Its time for a re-test every five years. I have to prove I still have the skills to do my job every year and all I do is push paper” from one inbox to another!
Wouldn’t more enforcement be
Wouldn’t more enforcement be better? Eg what will happen to this driver? A test just proves you can pay attention for 45 minutes, after which a lot of people will drive completely differently.
bikes wrote:
Absolutely.
I don’t care how someone drove during a test – I care how they drive around me. Due to the lack of traffic police and the lackluster treatment of dangerous drivers by both the police and the courts, most drivers think they can just drive as selfishly as they want.
You can’t blame the BMW
You can’t blame the BMW driver for cutting the corner, he’d just read online how dangerous ebike batteries are and was rushing home to check his ebike riding neighbour hadn’t burnt down his house.
I think yet again it’s “both”
I think yet again it’s “both”.
Repeat testing does have benefits:
Agree that more enforcement is also vital. If there’s very little chance of getting nicked we know that substantial fractions of people will “bend the rules” (break the law). Far more than 50% for some speed limits and likely nearly everyone for driving on the footway.
I think the problem is things
I think the problem is things like this are seen as ‘bad, but not that bad’. The chances of getting caught for texting, running lights, not paying attention etc are low and the fines or bans are tiny or nonexistent.
Quote:
Victoria Lebrec can’t be sure if what she knows about 8 December 2014 is from her own memory, or the BBC video cameras that captured her bleeding heavily at the side of the road, tyre marks visible across her crushed pelvis from the lorry that knocked her from her bicycle. Or maybe what she knows is from the CCTV footage that was reviewed first as evidence in a criminal case and then in a gruelling, victim-blaming struggle for the compensation she urgently needed. How else would she buy the £70,000 prosthetic leg her injuries required? And how else could she find closure and move on in her changed reality and changed body?
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2024/mar/13/lost-leg-after-being-crushed-by-lorry-victoria-lebrec
I cycled to and from work in
I cycled to and from work in London for 48 years, starting from 1958 – I can tell you from experience that we had huge traffic jams in London a long time before bus /cycle lanes and LTNs. The only way to reduce the traffic jams in London is to reduce the amount of traffic considerably – motorways and motorway-type roads that lead into London have made the traffic jams a lot worse.