It’s a horrifying image that makes you do a double take, as Jack Schofield and his bike are sent flying following a collision with a driver who decided to go the wrong way around a mini roundabout without making basic checks. Jack now wants to raise awareness to improve driving standards around vulnerable road users, explaining that he was “immensely lucky” not to have come off worse from the incident.
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The collision happened on Thursday in Ashby-de-la-Zouch, when Jack, a 27-year-old photographer and competitive triathlete who rides for Bath Cycling Club, was in the middle of riding 300km from his home in Leeds to Cheltenham, where he was attending a friend’s wedding the next day. Unfortunately Jack was destined to arrive on crutches, as the driver of the white car failed to spot him going over a mini roundabout, ploughing into him and his now written off Giant Trinity bike.
The driver was actually being followed by a colleague in a separate vehicle, which happened to have a dashcam that captured the moment of impact.
Jack told road.cc: “I grabbed the phone and airdropped the footage to myself, thinking I really want to have this footage on my phone before you leave.
“She hadn’t seen me and carried on driving. I hit the front left of her car trying to miss it. Bent the number plate, bent the front bumper and smashed all the front windscreen with the helmet.
“My bike went up in the air, I hit the ground pretty hard but rolled luckily.
“Because I was rolling it all completely missed me, I was unlucky to be hit but literally couldn’t have been more lucky. Medical professionals have told me I should have a broken neck!”
Jack also posted a small clip of the footage on his Instagram story
Jack said he was incredibly fortunate that his bike took the brunt of the impact, and although he was able to get up afterwards, he was taken to Queens Hospital in Burton for X-rays and further checks. He reiterated how lucky he was to come away without any lasting damage other than being “incredibly sore, bruised and shaken”.
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He added: “It makes you feel very mortal and makes you realise how dangerous it is.
“She [the driver] made an honest mistake, a very stupid one but she didn’t mean it. Unfortunately there are drivers out there who do things like this maliciously.
“For drivers who don’t know cyclists and want to shave 30 seconds off their journey, actually you’ve just put my life at risk. I’m a cyclist but also a brother, boyfriend and son.
“If I can get one person to give a bike an extra metre and therefore miss an accident then I’m happy with that.”
Jack in hospital following the incident
Jack also told his followers on Facebook: “I know 90% of my followers are cyclists or know cyclists – but even if you don’t – please please please think twice about your driving.
“Overtaking a cyclist for a few extra seconds, cutting a corner because you’re in a hurry, or not properly checking a junction because there’s “usually nothing there”. Today I witnessed first hand how a simple mistake can be almost fatal – and not everyone walks away as lucky as me!
“Please look after each other out there – luckily a bike and a smashed windscreen can be replaced – people can’t.”
184 thoughts on “Triathlete urges drivers to “think twice” after shocking dashcam footage shows moment bike was catapulted into the air from collision”
Wow! That picture would be
Wow! That picture would be useful posted on every driving site on the web and a lot of the police forces sites too; the ones who don’t think knocking off a cyclist is a crime.
Unfortunately the victim
Unfortunately the victim seems to be stating it wasn’t a crime. I don’t have an insta account so can’t view the main footage, but from the still at the top and the description of “being followed by a colleague”, she totally cut across the wrong way on the mini island and should be done for dangerous driving, not just carelessness.
I haven’t got Insta either so
I haven’t got Insta either so I can’t see it. Not sure why you’d lock something like this down. Glad he wasn’t seriously injured but that’s clearly more luck than judgement on the part of the driver.
I think a direct link to the
I think a direct link to the insta vid would work for us social outcasts, however Insta always locks viewing timeline items behind the sign in.
Here’s a reupload
Here’s a reupload
Ta. He didn’t help himself
Ta. He didn’t help himself being as middle as he was on the approach. But then I have been knocked off trying to steer behind a car when they didn’t stop for me, so he had no bailout either way once she had comitted to only looking left and travelling the wrong way around the island.
Wow! Totally lack of
Wow! Totally lack of observation by the driver. Looked like they were going to just carry on driving. Of course they would never admit to being distracted. Desperately needs driving awareness course if they want to continue driving.
Jesus. Can’t believe he got
Jesus. Can’t believe he got off so lightly.
Moron of a driver just ignored the roundabout.
I’d love to think they lose their licence but we know they won’t.
You’d have thought that going
You’d have thought that driving the wrong way around a roundabout and hence colliding with another vehicle, hospitalising the other party, would be a serious offence.
On the other hand, it was [i]only a cyclist, [/i]so what the hell.
Exactly. I was reading how he
Exactly. I was reading how he was being all understanding and forgiving, everyone makes mistakes, no malice, and then I thought yeah but they *drove the wrong way round a roundabout*!
And she didn’t make an
And she didn’t make an “honest mistake”, she broke the law and could have killed this guy because of her actions. The victim is probably on some strong painkillers, so his comments/pinch of salt until they wear off.
Am i seeing this wrong but
Am i seeing this wrong but was the cyclist going the wrong way around the r’about as well as the driver ? Seems it when you look at the direction arrows in the road.
No, he was approaching
No, he was approaching correctly and going the correct way around it. I have just watched the footage. The still is misleading as when the vehicle collided with him he got taken across the roundabout.
Awful driving, he was visible and had priority. Then driving the wrong side too.
joeegg wrote:
Yes, you are seeing it the wrong way. The cyclist approaches the roundabout as he should – he even appears to indicate his intention with his right hand – and if he moves further to the right just after that it’s perhaps as a perfectly reasonable reaction to the realisation he is about to be run over by the driver of the white car to his left. (The dark car behind the cyclist follows his line through the roundabout.)
joeegg wrote:
I did think that his position was a bit too far over to the right, but looking at streetview, it’s where you’d need to be given the bad road surface and angle of the exit.
You can also see why he swerved in front, rather than behind the car, as the run-out would be straight into a building.
Exactly, I had the same
Exactly, I had the same thought originally, but then you see the way the road is setup just on that one mini roundabout there, and there are infact two more feeding into it there, and I’d be surprised if crashes like that werent a regular occurrence.
Also, you do not want to be
Also, you do not want to be left hooked if you are going right (or straight on depending how you view it), so you would want to be where he was. Should also help with drivers who pull out and not give way as you are further from them.
Looking at that view, any one coming from the left driving the wrong way round would immediately enter a hatched area which is another clue as to it being a bad idea.
You wonder whether the
You wonder whether the designers intended for the roundabout to be just white paint. The positioning would suggest that it was designed to slow drivers, from that direction, down. If that’s the case this shows a spectacular fail.
The centre island is really
The centre island is really weirdly off-set. I thought it was just the camera angles, but the overhead satellite view shows it really is that badly positioned. It almost encourages drivers to cut the corner.
I’m guessing that the road
I’m guessing that the road the car emerged from was previously a joining side road. So when they put the roundabout in they put it on the centreline of the ‘main’ road, because if you don’t think much about design beyond ‘need to put a roundabout in’ that seems like the obvious place to put it.
I couldn’t agree more. This
I couldn’t agree more. This picture screams that all uk highways teams and all uk police forces have to urgently address motorised vehicle user behaviour and put safety for all as a priority. The picture paints the truth and the reality, and this pic is impossible to ignore if your job is designing road space and keeping road users safe.
Wow … Good for you Jack,
Wow … Good for you Jack, being able to get away without any major damage.
The below is what I looked like when a driver pulled out on me …
That wasn’t a mistake. It was
That wasn’t a mistake. It was a criminal act.
100% guaranteed glued to her
100% guaranteed glued to her phone.
Our man Jack is a very
Our man Jack is a very forgiving fellow. I’ve watched this ‘story’ on Instagram and the driver makes no mistake, but rather carries out a wilful act and in doing so doesn’t seem to check if her dangerous manoeuvre might endanger another road user. Crazy stuff.
Yes, I felt the same. And
Yes, I felt the same. And from his hospital bed too.
whilst the driver is totally
whilst the driver is totally at fault for this crash, can we take a moment to say what a total
cluster f***mess this particular piece of road design is, two mini roundabouts that are no more than just bits of paint on the road with narrowed exits, fed from another roundabout from the direction the car came from, the way its setup literally creates these types of events by default.Awavey wrote:
I haven’t checked the figures recently, but mini-rbts were a collision hot spot for cyclists, and I can’t see why that should have changed. They are loved by highways engineers because at least one lane of traffic is always flowing, not the case with other types of juction, and they just ignore the fact that cyclists pay the price.
Extremely generous to make
Extremely generous to make the assumption that the driver even thought once.
Giant Trinity is a TT bike –
Giant Trinity is a TT bike – driver is completely at fault but would the cyclist have had a different outcome on a normal bike with better control/brakes?
no
no
Boo and his dislike for
Boo and his dislike for Triathlon bikes is back even though cyclist was on the wider brake bars at the time and could do nothing about driver cutting the roundabout and essentially driving the wrongway on a one way bit of road.
Nigel’s preference is to find
Nigel’s preference is to find a way, however irrelevant, to push blame on a cyclist.
All I see is a photo of a
All I see is a photo of a bike upside down and about 8 feet in the air – have no idea how it was being ridden at the time. If you have more information that’s great.
I said the driver was at fault just looking at how they took the roundabout, but generally I don’t understand why someone would want to ride a bike that is naturally harder to control and stop, just like I wouldn’t choose to wear a pair of roller boots to walk in.
Nigel Garrage wrote:
Given that he is a triathlete, I imagine he does quite a bit of training on the bike he is actually going to ride in competition. That would seem like a perfectly reasonable thing to do.
Nigel Garrage wrote:
Not easy to judge for the
The white car was on the roundabout before the bike.
This is what the RAC says.
“The approaching traffic usually gives way to traffic already on the roundabout, which always comes from the right.”
A bit of prudence would have avoided that accident.
By on the roundabout you mean
By on the roundabout you mean driving around the roundabout the wrong way.
And if you watch the video and bother to look at the various images posted, you will see the cyclist was already on the roundabout using it in the correct manner.
No doubt you will stick with your absurd opinion and repeat your usual group think mantra.
Yep, I’m so glad we have Nic
Yep, I’m so glad we have Nic “not a troll honest” Mason and Boo “Maybe it was the road legal bike to blame” Garrage that shows us why we need random voices otherwise we would just assume it is incorrect for drivers to go round the wrong way on a traffic island. Bloody cyclists following the rules of the RAC.
Here I am on my bike. I’m
Here I am on my bike. I’m approaching a two roundabouts close together. I can
a. back off and cycle prudently through this hazard.
b. no problem go for it everyone will do what they should do. Bang.
FWIW even in my car I would have been slowed down there and anticipating .
Here you are totally ignoring
Here you are totally ignoring the vehicle being on the totally wrong side of the central island markings so you can blame the cyclist and ignore the driver driving dangerously. And then quotes RAC and HC rules as if the driver was driving correctly.
So trolling.
If you ever end up claiming
If you ever end up claiming personal injury after a road accident you’ll find that “no fault” is not very common.
FWIW the cyclist looked like he was going wrong side of the island as well.
Wrong side of the island is wrong but I know several islands i and everyone else goes round the wrong side of because of where they are positioned.
That was addressed earlier on
That was addressed earlier on page 1
“Yes, you are seeing it the wrong way. The cyclist approaches the roundabout as he should – he even appears to indicate his intention with his right hand – and if he moves further to the right just after that it’s perhaps as a perfectly reasonable reaction to the realisation he is about to be run over by the driver of the white car to his left. (The dark car behind the cyclist follows his line through the roundabout.)”
I also commented I thought
I also commented I thought he was too far across initially until shown the layout of the road (although added the collision came as his only avoiding action was to move across her and hope she would brake which she didn’t). If he had been mostre to the left, yes it might not have happened as it did, or she might have seen him approaching, assumed he was turning left and then gone for it. A bit of dammed if do and dammed if don’t.
Of course we now know PC Nic will intentionally drive the wrong way on a mini roundabout because “others do it”.
“his only avoiding action was
“his only avoiding action was to move across her and hope she would brake which she didn’t”
if the driver hasnt seen you then going in front of them in the hope they may suddenly see you isnt a great idea.
Also he could have braked.
He did brake but as you didn
He did brake but as you didn’t even notice a blatant illegal manouvre by a car (“we all do that manouvre by me”), you just ignored it. I got knocked off on a roundabout by a car not stopping to give way but decided that overtaking the lorry who did stop was more of a priority. My avoiding action then was to brake and also aim behind him, unfortunately my wheel caught his rear wheel arch and I was thrown to the ground.
I also had a similar situation later where again, a car decided the others were nerds for being stopped to give way and even though she couldn’t see through the van, decided it must be clear. That time I turned into the island with her and had just enough space to stop before contact.
So his avoiding action was a slim hope but if he had taken none he also would have hit her right in the side of the car and might have had even more serious injuries coming to a direct stop head first into the door.
nicmason wrote:
while deciding to pass behind a pedestrian who hasn’t seen you on the assumption that they won’t suddenly jump back into your path is also a bad idea.
In that still they cyclist is
In that still they cyclist is approaching the roundabout and the motorist is already on the roundabout. Their poor (but far from uncommon) choice of line around is obvious for the cyclist to see. In the video, the cyclist seems to be negotiating the roundabouts much faster than the motorist – at the point when the motorist would be checking for approaching road users, I doubt the cyclist would even have entered the first roundabout.
The motorist should (must, to use highway code terminology) have driven around the markings, but the only differnces I can see would have made are:
jh2727 wrote:
On 2), that’s my exact point. On a TT bike, riders typically ride with their hands and arms on the aerobars in a straight line, with their heads tucked, making it difficult to deviate their line and requiring large arm movements prior to slowing down. They are completely unsuitable for these kind of urban environments. You can see the danger in the YouTube video I shared earlier.
I don’t think you have looked
I don’t think you have looked at the other views if you think the cyclist hasn’t passed the give way lines
As to 1/2/3 you have made no allowance for the much reduced speed for the motorist by taking the correct legal route.
So happily break the law.
So happily break the law. Naughty from a copper.
nicmason wrote:
“The white car was on the roundabout before the bike.”
Only because the driver was breaking the law by entering the roundabout illegally.
And who gives a flying flamingo what the RAC thinks; it’s the law that counts.
But you are right about a bit of prudence avoiding the collision; but why don’t you seem to accept that it was the driver who needed to act prudently? And it wasn’t an accident; an accident isn’t perfectly foreseeable, and anyone with more than one brain cell could have predicted it, given the illegal, dangerous, and completely callous behaviour of the driver.
nicmason wrote:
“which always comes from the right” where was the bike coming from in relation to the car? from the right.
nicmason wrote:
You mean if the car driver had the prudence not to drive the wrong way round the roundabout?
Here’s some helpful hints
Here’s some helpful hints that cyclists with the mindset that “accidents are things that other people do to me” could also take on board.
https://www.rospa.com/rospaweb/docs/advice-services/road-safety/motorcyclists/ridesafe.pdf
“Research shows that drivers have difficulty spotting a bike approaching, judging its speed correctly and estimating its time of arrival. As you approach junctions, try to see where the driver’s eyes are pointing and whether its wheels are beginning to turn. Consider how you would deal safely with the vehicle unexpectedlypulling out in front of you.
That last sentence is very helpful in avaoiding cars.
nicmason wrote:
There you go . I post
There you go . I post something well intentioned and researched and your reply is exactly the problem so many have on this forum.
nicmason wrote:
nicmason wrote:
Like hell it was well intentioned, it’s victim-blaming trolling as usual. It’s also totally irrelevant as it’s referring to watching carefully to see if someone’s going to pull out in front of you at a roundabout, not what to do if some utter spanner decides to drive the wrong way round a roundabout straight at you.
you mean Rospa are victime
you mean Rospa are victime blaming. ? who knew.
nicmason wrote:
I think actually, RoSPA were making a reasonable point that you have taken out of context in order to victim-blame in a situation RoSPA were not considering.
Really ? Saved my bacon a few
Really ? Saved my bacon a few times.
” As you approach junctions, try to see where the driver’s eyes are pointing and whether its wheels are beginning to turn. Consider how you would deal safely with the vehicle unexpectedlypulling out in front of you.”
Whats your context then ?
“As you approach a motorway
“As you approach a motorway bridge, try to see where the pedestrian’s eyes are pointing. Consider how you would deal safely with them unexpectedly dropping a concrete block on top of your car.”
And I expect you can’t see
And I expect you can’t see why some car drivers would react aggressively to cyclists. Yet you have just happily advocated something that could cause serious injury or death.
Have a think about that.
If you’d have had a think
If you’d have had a think about it before putting fingers to keyboard*, you’d have realised that I wasn’t advocating any such thing. I was drawing a parallel between the suggestion that motorists should bear some responsibility for avoiding the wholly intentional and illegal act of dropping a concrete block on them, and your suggesting that the cyclist should have been responsible for avoiding the wholly intentional and illegal act of driving a vehicle the wrong way around a roundabout at them. Which is a much better comparison than the RoSPA advice you quoted, which is talking about drivers making misjudgements or having a moment of inattention.
[* Giving you the benefit of the doubt that you were just being hard of thinking here, rather than deliberately misrepresenting what I wrote – although, given your previous comments, I’m not sure why.]
nicmason wrote:
Don’t be so ridiculous, s/he did nothing of the sort and you know it.
‘advocated’… Bollocks! I’m
‘advocated’… Bollocks! I’m reluctant to get involved in these spats, but you know damn well that was not what was meant. mdavid is obviously pointing out the ridiculous nature of the RoSPA advice…and I suspect you are well aware of that.
“I’m reluctant to get
“I’m reluctant to get involved in these spats”
but here you are.
Reluctant…not scared.
Reluctant…not scared.
Yes, here I am, pointing out your deliberately provocative post and accusing you of deliberately misrepresenting a post, the meaning of which was perfectly clear.
Are you suggesting I should keep my mouth shut?
no . Pointing out the irony
no . Pointing out the irony of your moral posturing. feel free to say what you like.
The only ‘moral posturing’
The only ‘moral posturing’ was your nasty suggestion that mdavidford was advocating the dropping of concrete blocks from motorway bridges, in an attempt to shut down the argument that making eye contact and watching where wheels are pointing would have had no positive effect where a driver has approached a roundabout way too fast to make proper observation, taken the racing line and flown across a roundabout in the wrong direction.
Irony?
Did you actually watch the
Did you actually watch the video ?
The car was moving quite slowly.
Not slowly enough to
Not slowly enough to negotiate the roundabout on the right side of the road.
Not slowly enough to observe properly and check for approaching cyclists.
Not slowly enough to avoid cutting across the hatched markings at the roundabout exit.
mdavidford wrote:
In all seriousness, if possible I will change lanes away from pedestrians overhead on bridges, after exactly this happened to a friend of mine.
nicmason wrote:
It wouldn’t be the first time. CUK, or CTC as it was then, have in the past withdrawn from co-operation with RoSPA because of their pro-car, anti-cycling stance.
Do you work for Police Scotland perchance?
The article is about
The article is about motorcycles which are somewhat faster. Nowhere in there does it talk about how to deal with people driving the wrong way round a roundabout.
So much for ‘well intentioned’
As it was, the cyclist gave as much distance as possible from a driver pulling out who would use the roundabout correctly. The fact that there were 2 mini roundabouts is irrelevant for driver given their direction of approach and the first roundabout was irrelevant at the point the cyclist was at the second roundabout.
In traffic a cyclist is often
In traffic a cyclist is often going at the same speed as the other vehicles so thats a nonsense.
The articlel is about avoiding risk . Something that a vulnerable road user should be aware of. Presumably your all for waking up in hospital saying “I had right of way”
If you are in traffic, at the
If you are in traffic, at the same speed, then the risk is lower and the situation is much less likely to arise. The problem is where a motorcycle is going at 30/40/50 and driver fails to notice.
The article is not about avoiding risk – you would do that by not using the roads. You can reduce or mitigate risk but not eliminate it.
Can you point out where the article helps with people doing illegal things? As ever, you fail to deal with the main point – in this case driving the wrong way around a roundabout.
What next – cyclist fails to accommodate left hook or right hook.
As before, the cyclist reduced risk with their positioning.
Q Can you point out where the
Q Can you point out where the article helps with people doing illegal things?
A Consider how you would deal safely with the vehicle unexpectedlypulling out in front of you
Turning right or left isn’t
Turning right or left isn’t illegal. It may count as careless driving in certain circumstances.
Driving round a roundabout the wrong way is illegal.
How would you reduce risk on a dual carriageway when confronted by a driver towing a caravan coming at you head on ?
(I have already answered dealing with people pulling out unexpectedly 3 times in this article)
nicmason might have been
nicmason might have been better trying to find something from RoSPA explaining how a motorist on the motorway should always be keeping an eye out for and taking avoiding action from stolen cars being driven at them head-on.
I mean – it could happen, and if the motorist was not paying proper attention then it would clearly be their fault.
Doesn’t even have to be
Doesn’t even have to be stolen. Could easily be by a confused person who should have been medically disqualified from driving but as there is no providence for that to happen until they drive 20 miles down a motorway the wrong way, they could still do it. Then yes, all th drivers going correctly up the motorway are stupid and would clearly be their fault.
Cyclist could have decided to
Cyclist could have decided to ride a child’s bicycle with handlebar tassles and spokey dokeys. He could have got off and walked it along the pavement asking the local Scout troop to assist him at every junction. He could have just stayed at home in bed or altered any of a myriad of other choices that would have avoided this collision. Your “good intentions” in commenting about making eye contact with drivers are basic roadcraft, you are pointing out the bleeding obvious skills which we all have with the transparent attempt to place a proportion of blame on the cyclist on account of you simply don’t appear to like cyclists using the road.
There is an adage taught to me by my advanced motorcycle instructor. If you are involved in a collision and your vehicle was moving then there is definitely something you could have done different to avoid the incident. If your vehicle was stationary at the time then there was probably something you could have done different. I expect anyone who sees the footage of this particular crash will be extra aware at roundabouts at least for a bit and that itself is a good enough reason for NMOTD as an ongoing feature. However, whilst taking every care, it is not unreasonable to have an expectation that other road users, especially those who require training and a licence on account of the danger their vehicles pose to others, will at least make some attempt to follow the rules.
“you simply don’t appear to
“you simply don’t appear to like cyclists using the road.”
as a cyclist that would be odd.
Ahhh classic case then.
Ahhh classic case then. Explains why you only ever see what a cyclist must have done wrong as all the MSM and twiter and others say cyclists are a scourge on society.
not really. But theres
not really. But theres plentty on here calling car drivers the anti christ so its useful to have a little balance.
nicmason wrote:
No, no, no – you’ve got it all wrong! Nobody here believes that car drivers are the antichrist. They are just the heralds of the antichrist. It’s different, see?
Mungecrundle wrote:
Which is why I hate the phrase ‘expect the unexpected’ because if you do believe that, the only solution is to stay at home. People use the roads on the basis that people follow the rules, then experience shows where to be cautious to reduce but not eliminate risk.
I tried to find an earlier nmotd where a cyclist is approaching a side road with a car driver waiting at the junction. Everyone expected the driver to do something daft only what happened was the driver behind overtook the driver waiting at the junction and turned right into the main road from completely the wrong side of the road. The idea that anyone could anticipate this is laughable.
The other one was the driver on the roundabout (somewhere in Europe). The next thing that happens is a bmx rider appears from over the top of a hedge and lands in the road in front of the driver.
Can’t even stay at home. It
Can’t even stay at home. It would be unexpected that the ISS could suddenly crash through your roof at home. That way lies madness and the belief it is ok to drive the wrong way around a mini roundabout.
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:
Personally, I lie awake worrying about that every night.
mdavidford wrote:
Rather like the dyslexic, agnostic insomniac; he lay awake all night worrying about the existence of dog.
Liked (reluctantly). ?
Liked (reluctantly). ?
Eton Rifle wrote:
Oh come on! It’s good!
So it your view that the
So it your view that the cyclist could have avoided this crash by different observation.
Effectively they shoud divert their attention from the two roads which may enter the roundabout from their right and which the cyclist must give way to, and instead look at the road to their left on the assumption that a driver may ente the roundabout from the left, failing to give way to the cyclist on their right, and go the wrong way around the roundabout?
Remember you own words
“The approaching traffic usually gives way to traffic already on the roundabout, which always comes from the right.“
(My emphasis)
Except in this case, the car involved in the collision came from the left, because it was illegaly driving the wrong way round a roundabout.
Strangely I’ve just been out
Strangely I’ve just been out (in a car) and as I approached a mini roundabout I checked all directions not just where the rule book says where the traffic is coming from.
You should try it.
And then you drove over it in
And then you drove over it in a totally illegal way as “we all do that around here”.
I don’t think I will try that.
nicmason wrote:
Yeah normally I’m checking for people from my left failing to give way to me, once I’ve already confirmed no one is joining the roandabout upstream of me. I am certainly not checking for anyone driving the wrong way, hitting me from the left as I enter, as a prioority over looking for those who may be coming from my right.
Again your own text fromt he RAC not the highway code
“The approaching traffic usually gives way to traffic already on the roundabout, which always comes from the right.”
Note the approaching traffic USUALLY gives way (despite this being the rule) so be cautious that they may not. BUT the traffic on the roundabout ALWAYS comes from the right. (except of course in this case) .
At cycling speeds there is time to look for those failing to give way once on the roundabout, and when driving I would not be driving faster than that anyway.
This is akin to a pedestrian getting taken out by a driver passing the wrong side of a traffic island, and then asking the pedestrian why they didn’t look both ways before stepping out. Despite the road being marked “look right” or “look left” as appropriate to the direction the traffic should be coming from.
And this you term “a bit of balance”
nicmason wrote:
Thank you! The first sentence here is factually correct and the advice following is sound – but surely the timing is rather important? The following sentence (by me) is also relevant:
Cars accelerate more quickly than bicycles and attain higher speeds.
So while it’s useful to be reminded of these things maybe you can help? The last two times when I had people pull out on me, when I was looking them in the eyes (while obviously switching between looking them in they eyes and watching their tyres as per this guidance) was I saved by my thoughtful preparation, my quick reactions, by their quick reactions when they woke from their trance, some kind of telepathy or just chance? Also how content would you be content with an explanation of “these things happen” or “our chap was just having an off day” if something went wrong in another field e.g. rail accident, your bank lost your money etc?
You seem big on “individual responsibility” for cyclists. Surely a greater proportion of the responsibility should rest with the people who are “getting the benefits” e.g. the convenience of their motor vehicle? Drivers also bring more danger to the situation – I’m not aware of any motorists seriously injured or killed by cyclists while driving?
Its odd how agitated people
Its odd how agitated people get when you suggest they can help themselves by being more observant of everything thats happening around them and reacting accordingly.
Driver of the white car at fault. certainly.
Could the cyclist have helped himself through reacting to the car ? yes he could.
The only responsibilty you can manage is your own so maximise that and minimise your accidents
nicmason wrote:
Surely it’s more odd that you spent so much time here when you could have stopped at:
its not the whole picture
its not the whole picture though is it . and much as you may hate it cyclists can help themselves more by being more in tune with whats happening all around them.
That none of you can accept that is odd.
He did react to the driver
He did react to the driver and was as far away as possible for a legal manoeurve. The trouble is you make stuff up such as ‘he could have braked’. Perhaps you could link to this 4k video you have watched.
No point banging on about accepting stuff when people are doing completely illegal stuff. You write as though anything can be avoided.
Any advice on avoiding drivers towing a caravan the wrong way on the M40 ?
Yes.
Yes.
When I tow my caravan the wrong way on the M40 i look out for cyclists who have accidentally got on a motorway.
That’s a no then.
That’s a no then.
Any link to the 4k video you watched ?
nicmason wrote:
“Women can help themselves avoid rape by dressing differently and carrying rape alarms.”
“Teenagers passing through dodgy neighbourhoods could help avoid harm by wearing stab vests.”
Just fuck off with the victim-blaming.
Youre a lttle charmer arent
Youre a lttle charmer arent you.
Thats such a ridiculous comment.
You are comparing motorists to rapists and murderers.
No he isn’t. All he is doing
No he isn’t. All he is doing is pointing out your blatant victim blaming. If you watch the video, you will see that the cyclist takes note of the tonsil entering the round about incorrectly (or correctly according to you) and tries to avoid the car.
If he had paid attention to
If he had paid attention to what was actually happening in fornt of him rather than waht should be happening he would have had a better chance of avoiding the car.
As I have said before. The white car caused the accident. I am talking about what you as a cyclist can do to minimise your risk.
He was paying attention, he
He was paying attention, he did try and avoid the driver/car. There is only so much you can do and looking for a vehicle coming from the correct side would have taken most of his attention.
Hi Ernie, I wouldn’t bother
Hi Ernie, I wouldn’t bother engaging as Nic drives on mini roundabouts just likes this woman so is just as dangerous as she is. He even admitted himself on the thread that it is wrong but he still does it.
Maybe I’m watching a
Maybe I’m watching a different video to the everyone else, but it looks to me like the motorist was already established on the second roundabout, when the cyclist had barely cleared the first roundabout (first and second from the cyclist perspective). Yes, you give way to road user approaching from the right, but not once you have already emerged and are established on the round about. The way that the motorist drove through (rather than around) the roundabout was a bit shit, but I can’t see how this was caused by anything other than the cyclist try to get infront of a vehicle that was already on the roundabout and being operated by a motorist who wouldn’t be aware of his approach (no one is going to be checking their A-spot for idiots approaching from the right, trying to overtake road users already on the roundabout).
Had the motorist been less doddery, they probably would have been through the roundabout without issue, but I doubt that if the motorist had taken the proper line around the roundabout it would have helped much in this situation.
nicmason wrote:
The cyclist was distracted from what was happening in front of him by using the force to try to predict what might be about to happen.
You seem to be on the receiving end here. If you’d only pay attention to what’s being posted around you rather than what you’d like to read I think you would do better.
In a relaxed and friendly spirit if you do have any advance on the ROSPA guidelines for avoiding this kind of thing then this is the place to post it. Most people here are “advanced cyclists” so should be up for continued learning.
“The cyclist was distracted
“The cyclist was distracted from what was happening in front of him by using the force to try to predict what might be about to happen.”
yes. eyes work quite well for me.
also thanks for the advice .
also thanks for the advice . I do appreciate it. (not being sarcastic) but part of a vigorous chat column has to be debate and difference otherwise its just a lot of people nodding over their beer .
TBH the most interesting comment was that cycling organisations cut themselves off from Rospa becuase they felt Rospa where victim blaming.
I have just read through all
I have just read through all of the comments and nicmason you are victim blaming IMHO. In fact reading your comments I interpret them as “Any cyclist involved in any accident must be at fault because they should have stopped and taken evasive action for something that the driver might do.”
As a driver nicmason do you slow down and stop your car whenever you see a car at a give way junction and you have priority on the road? Because by your logic if you run into a car that pulls out of a junction in front of you, you must shoulder some of the blame becuase you should have anticipated that the driver would pull out in front of your car.
Or if you are on the motorway and you are travelling in the middle lane on passing a slip road joining the motorway, and a suicide jockey comes from the slip road and moves straight across into the middle lane and hits your car. You must be to blame because you should have anticipated that a driver might make such a maneuver.
Both of those examples as a driver you spotted the car at the junction/on the slip road, so if you “had paid attention to what was actually happening in fornt (sic) of him rather than waht (sic) should be happening he would have had a better chance of avoiding the car.” or would that not apply in those circumstances because you were driving in a car?
Unlike `you perfect human
Unlike `you perfect human beings i have always reflected after any accident (not that many before you jump in) and think about what could I have done differently to avoid or mitigate even when it was in no way my fault.
nicmason wrote:
How to avoid accidents on the road – never go on the road.
As for mitigating the risk, there are limited things that you can do without putting yourself in further danger.
So a hypothetical scenario if you were riding along a road on your bike with a stream of traffic coming the opposite way, and a car directly behind you, and there was no opportunity for the car behind to pass. You are approaching a junction which has a car indicating to turn right. The road is not wide enough for the car behind you to pass you into the face of oncoming vehicles
do you
Cover the brake and pay
Cover the brake and pay attention. thats hard isnt it.
Of course you are happy with
Of course you are happy with her driving as you have readily admitted it matches yours on these mini roundabouts, but she didn’t seem to be covering her brake. A good second or two after the collision before she braked.
I dint thank anywhere have I
I dint think anywhere have I said I was happy with her driving. I would say that having watched the video if I was in a car or on a bike I wouldnt have been hit by her because I would have seen her coming even though she was on the wrong side of the roundabout not coming from the expected direction . She was going quite slowly and he could have braked more.
I see someone else has commented on the brake issues with these sporting bikes.
nicmason wrote:
Yip, and he is a well known victim blamer who enjoys taking contradictory positions to get a reaction. Not sure that strengthens your position.
tbh Im not at all interested
tbh Im not at all interested in “strengthening my position” I am interested in what people think and facts. And thats a fact.
nicmason wrote:
Pardon me, but I’ve quite lost track; which version of the resident troll are you? V5.1, V6.2, V8.3 or what?
Resident ? Apparently
Resident ? Apparently occupying space in your head and thats about it.
And also both victim blamers
And also both victim blamers have failed to notice his hands are on the controlling brake levers all through the manouvres from the time he is appears on video to the time he is ploughed into.
I’m sure that niges handlebar tape must be pristine on the “tops” as apparently he never grips there. After all he seems to be adamant that you never ever hold anywhere on the bike where there isn’t a brake lever straight there.
Really ? you can see that
Really ? you can see that from that video . I dont think so.
Yes, as someone in a tri
Yes, as someone in a tri position is normallty tucked in and hands are on the centre bars. His was wide so on the outer bars where the brakes are.
So fuck off with the type of bike led to the situation antics you and him are trying to make with this.
The whole situation is down to a driver deciding they are too privelged to want to go the proper way around a mini island as it is too slow to do that and why have a car if you have to go slow. Of course, as been mentioned many many times, you have no problems with this self same illegal and dangerous driving so have to blame the cyclist in some way in the same way juries of drivers seem to be less likely to find someone guilty of dangerous driving.
.
maybe I should collect every
maybe I should collect every time you tell someone to fuck off and use it as a sig.
nicmason wrote:
Tellng people to fuck off on an internet forum isn’t against the law (not that I can recall ASQ doing it much) and doesn’t risk killing people; driving the wrong way round a traffic island just because you’ve decided it’s not in the right place, as you admit you do, is and does.
Your ability to drive exactly
Your ability to drive exactly to the highway code in every situation is matched only by your dishonesty in claiming such.
Weird for someone so adamant
Weird for someone so adamant the cyclist didn’t follow the highway code but the car driver did in most videos on here seems to state it is now ok for cars to not follow the highway code as everyone does it. Of couse it normally means someone is either going to be seriously hurt or be very close to being that when cars decide mini roundabouts are just pretty pictures on the road. But still it is the other persons fault for it as they should have done better.
I didnt say the cyclist didnt
I didnt say the cyclist didnt follow the highway code. But I do say he reacted poorly to what was happening in front of him .
And my earlier reply also applies to you.
Your ability to drive exactly to the highway code in every situation is matched only by your dishonesty in claiming such.
I know I don’t perform
I know I don’t perform dangerous illegal manouvres everytime I approach a mini roundabout. You are acting like it is just a recomended part of the highway code like giving a cyclist room or wearing hi viz. You have freely admitted to being a fuckwit on the road because you would be inconvenienced to slow down and take them legally.
Is that a little bit of
Is that a little bit of sunlight on the ground between your legs ?
Anyway end of this thread for me I think.
Bye then.
Bye then.
I hope you honour your word more than Nigel.
So someone who literally
So someone who literally comes on each thread to claim how superior they are on the road in all circumstances then any other cyclist and how the car driver is absolved of every blame is claiming I’m superior because I don’t drive around mini roundabouts in the most dangerous way possible?
Wow.
not sure but this might be a
not sure but this might be a clip of nicmason driving at a mini roundabout https://youtu.be/xIKfdiEl9Ys?t=252
Same video but a few mins
Same video but a few mins later
https://youtu.be/xIKfdiEl9Ys?t=483
Yeah i saw that….. shocking
Yeah i saw that….. shocking bad driving by the driver – from the comments it was a hit and run and is in the hands of the police
Is that the cyclist at snout
Is that the cyclist at snout 8’10 in? Yes awful and as others pointed out in the comments, side windows looked like they had condensation on so pretty good chance the front just had a peering space allowed. Hence the direct line take out.
Yes, plenty of Nic’s driving
Yes, plenty of Nic’s driving in those videos over the weeks and plenty of people with your experiences on taking mini roundabouts where Nic’s think because you haven’t cut the corner, you must be going straight on as well.
lets get this straight
lets get this straight nicmason….. you are preaching to people here about how you mitigate risk on the road……all the while saying you actively endanger other people on the road by going the wrong way round islands?
whats the word I’m looking for…… oh yes hypocrite.
Ahh yes its the end of the thread for you because you have shown your true colours that you expect cyclists to be held to a higher standard as motorists and that you are happy to break the rules in your car because other people do.
I’ve had plenty of near misses at mini roundabouts in my car because I use them properly, but because other people choose not to use them properly they assume that I am just signalling incorrectly.
I’m off this but that has to
I’m off this but that has to be the funniest thing Ive read today.
“I’ve had plenty of near misses at mini roundabouts in my car because I use them properly, but because other people choose not to use them properly they assume that I am just signalling incorrectly.”
If you have lots of near misses your are the common factor in all of them
Nope nic, he probably is
Nope nic, he probably is using them properly but comes across you and your ilk also arriving at the same time and wanting to just cut across the wrong way.
nicmason wrote:
Ahh right, so it’s my fault that when I come to a mini roundabout with 3 exits, that when I am indicating right to take the 3rd exit, but go round the roundabout instead of doing what you advocate in driving over it and people at the 2nd exit decide that because I have not cut the roundabout I am not going to the 3rd exit?
Funnily enough that is nothing to do with my ability to drive but their inability to drive
I guess on the road you are a
I guess on the road you are a man with a fork in a world of soup.
nicmason wrote:
No I am just someone that knows how to drive unlike you.
But again your response tracks…. try to victim blame me for having near misses because other people can’t drive
You are not a man of his word
You are not a man of his word then.
your word. But now I am
your word. But now I am
nicmason wrote:
Good job I didn’t claim that then – be odd if I had seeing as I don’t drive. But what I don’t ever do on a bike is decide I have a right to ignore traffic law because I’ve decided it’s “wrong”, as you freely admit you do.
Please do. I mean if I was
Please do. I mean if I was espousing how you shouldn’t use coarse language it might actually mean something. But you are the one defending bad driving multiple times and claims you are great at everything on the road but then admit you drive the wrong way on a roundabout because you do it all the time near you on multiple locations.
nicmason wrote:
That’s right – TT bikes ridden on the aerobars have no easy access to brakes and have poor manoeuvreability. They are banned from sportives and normal cycling events for good reason – because they are dangerous. The UCI also banned people apeing the TT riding position in tour events for the same reason.
Now where these people are just a danger to themselves I have no issue – that’s Darwin’s law at play. But when they could interfere with pedestrians and other vulnerable road users it’s not really on. Just do a Google Search for “TT Bikes Dangerous” and you’ll see loads of articles on them.
A perfect illustration is on this YouTube video – look at the guy having to reach down to the brakes without sufficient mobility to avoid a collision.
Could you start a campaign
Could you start a campaign for people to permit the use of these things in time trials / triathalons? Hands will always be on the brakes. As a safety feature, they are arguably safer than standard bikes – excellent braking, hit things feet first, less far to fall in a crash. Additional benefits – extremely aero while giving you a far better view. (Having ridden a few types I’d add that they’re more comfy too but that might dissuade your target audience).
Ridden with a cricket box if you’re really concerned…
I’ve seen a few of those
I’ve seen a few of those recumbents out and about. Aren’t they usually ridden with a big flag coming out of the back? Apparently they work wonders for men with impotence…
Big flag? To many people you
Big flag? To many people you’ll look odd enough without. The other ones are going “cooool!”. In my experience visibility is only a problem in that people drive alongside you pointing their cameras. And we have all experienced the “looking straight into their eyes and knowing that they can’t see you” – being something strange-looking can only improve that. I wouldn’t position right in front of / beside a truck at the lights. But I won’t do that on anything smaller than an elephant and even then you’re risking it.
I’ve certainly had some strange looks from them.
Nic, no matter what you ever
Nic, no matter what you ever post now, my reply answer will contain this admission that you regularly drive dangerously because other people happen to as well. So you are happy to appriach a mini roundabout and go around it the wrong way, hence happy with her driving.
After all, your first post on this subject was blaming the cyclist as the car was “first on the roundabout” and the cyclist needed to give way to people coming from the right.
There is a difference between
There is a difference between vigorous chat and simply being contrarian or making stuff up such as claiming the cyclist didn’t brake.
Reading your comments it is as if no one else on here criticises cyclists for their roadcraft whereas this happens regularly. In fact, on the recent one where the driver turned between traffic I posted that I agreed with you that the cyclist should have been more cautious.
hirsute wrote:
I agree if a cyclist is in the wrong then the vast majority of people on here would criticse the cyclists road craft to varying extent. I would however add that I would tend to consider what effect the change in roacraft would have had.
To use the example of the car cutting through the gap in traffic, I doubt anything other than the cyclist significantly reducing their speed coupled with moving being on the left of the lane would have made any difference.
If they reduced their speed there would still have been a chance that the crash would have happened. If they were at the left of the lane, I doubt the car would have stopped or even seen the cyclist as they would have been obscured by the door pillar and even given the better line of sight for the cyclist the relative speed of the cyclist would still have meant a collision in my opinion.
We’d have to deabte that in
We’d have to debate that in the other one but here I don’t see what more could be done.
You would end up stopping at every mini roundabout if you thought every driver would drive round it the wrong way. Then you would either get rear-ended by a driver who didn’t expect you to stop or be cut up and punished passed by the drivers behind you who did stop.
nicmason wrote:
I’m happy to agree on that. Doubt there is an internet without some people gnashing their teeth or taking exception. No-one’s going to agree exactly about how much effort you put into challenging a (dangerous) system vs. how much you try to mitigate the effects of that. I’d say we all put some effort into mitigation because at least you can do something quickly and if bad things then don’t happen you feel your action was effective.
If there’s genuinely someone cycling around not caring about cars, they’re probably high. Or a child of course…
Thanks, I missed the comment about cycling organisations canning ROSPA but that is interesting, I’ll dig that one out.
nicmason wrote:
I agree. The other part of the picture is that the driver could have planned in advance for there being other road users and even ones who might have been more vulnerable.
Logically this must be true and I wouldn’t want to confuse you a shitposter so I’ll only nibble. Me as an example – I’m not an adrenaline junkie and I’m keen to continue living. Like most people though I think I’m better than I am at stuff – cycling, driving, being amusing. So obviously I think I’m taking due care when cycling. I’m not inside a metal box, my bike doesn’t have door pillars, I don’t have a phone or entertainment system plugged in (I like the wind…), almost never going flat out. I even passed a driving test once. So how do you propose I become more in tune with the environment? Would you suggest I redo my cycling proficiency? More mirrors (I ride with one)? Laser rangefinders? Pre-visualisation and meditation before my ride? (Actually stuff writing to you I think I’ve a business plan).
You could stop being such an
You could stop being such an angry little man . Thanks for calling me a shitposter. Do you find that helps you ?
Look, Nic has admitted on
Look, Nic has admitted on this thread that he drives the wrong way around mini islands even though he knows he is wrong. So lets just leave any moans and just know that whatever he posts now or in the future we know he is a dangerous driver who only backs other drivers at the detriment of cyclists because at some point, he will be the one who knocks some vulnerable road user down
Good advice, it’s time to
Good advice, it’s time to move on!
The car driver was at fault.
The car driver was at fault.
But how could she be nic, she approaches mini roundabouts the same way you admitted you do? Oh yes, that is illegally.
Expect the unexpected! I
Expect the unexpected! I think I’ve found footage of our Nic educating road users about road safety by driving the wrong way down the M5.
https://www.facebook.com/143233165824638/posts/2179635278851073/
‘She made an honest mistake’
‘She made an honest mistake’
Piss. Off.
Putting the wrong milk in your brew is a mistake – what she did was dangerous, lazy driving fuckwittery of the highest order.
Great stuff guys! Bogbrush
Great stuff guys!
Bogbrush
Dear road.cc admins,
Dear road.cc admins,
We’re at 120 comments and counting on this and nobody’s even yet mentioned how he wouldn’t have suffered any injuries at all if he’d been wearing a plastic hat
Please can you just draw a line under this one?
Many thanks,
brooksby
brooksby wrote:
Or suggested that it’s just too convenient that it happened to be on camera, so the whole thing must have been staged.
Except he was !
Except he was !
He rips it off at the end and throws it down. Then wanders about – I would be sitting down quietly waiting for the ambulance !
You might not be at your most
You might not be at your most clear-minded after landing square on your head, though (plastic hat or no plastic hat).
Adrenaline probably.
Adrenaline probably.
Come on, people, I’d really
Come on, people, I’d really not wanted to start up a plastic hats discussion. Can we just leave nicmason to shout at clouds on his own, here?
brooksby wrote:
I like plastic hats, especially pink ones
odd. clouds dont usually
odd. clouds dont usually reply quite so promptly
nicmason wrote:
Oh yes we do
brooksby wrote:
What about a plaster cats discussion instead?
(Possibly with bonus demonic possession.)
brooksby wrote:
Do plastic hats have more status than tin foil hats?
Cannot see video. I don’t use
Cannot see video. I don’t use facecrap instantgram.
Also Nic is a lowdown troll!
Blodadtand posted a reupload
Blodadtand posted a reupload on page 1
thnx!
thnx!
Still, at least it was
Still, at least it was conveniently close to a bike shop 🙂
arowland wrote:
Well I was going to make some ‘witty’ comment but FairPlay arowland you got in there first. So at least I can start the argument on this site for wearing helmets, so all the bellends who are anti wearing of can chip in.
But let’s all agree it is good to see Jack smiling.