‘Annoyance tax’ suggested as anti-cyclist bingo + two abreast rants roll on; Canyon unveils Grizl gravel bikes with new RockShox suspension; Ned Boulting talks bike paths; Ever been stuck behind a cyclist for an hour?; Zwift with G + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
'Annoyance tax' suggested as anti-cyclist bingo and two abreast complaining continues
People who cycle in the country should be encouraged to ride 2, 3 and 4 abreast like this. For the following reasons:
1. It calms the traffic behind them
2. It makes it less easy for bad drivers to attempt dangerous passes
3. It is more pleasant and sociable for them. pic.twitter.com/vqi4dsuUSs— Jeremy Vine (@theJeremyVine) August 8, 2021
We’ve seen more than our fair share of Jeremy Vine cycling-related posts, but none have blown up quite like this one…
Yesterday we focused on the reaction from ‘notable’ Tweeters such as Paddy McGuinness with their blue tick verifications, something anyone can apply for by the way…but perhaps more disturbing is the sheer amount of anti-cyclist sentiment. We’re used to a spot of anti-cyclist bingo here at road.cc…just not on this scale. A quick spin through the cesspool of comments found eight ‘road tax’ replies, and that was just until I got bored.
We’ve also got a couple of new anti-cyclist themes to chuck up on your bingo cards: disrespecting the Romans and ‘annoyance tax’…
Roman’s built roads for logistics. Not for arrogant, lycra clad cyclists to piss everyone off.
— I kneel to ERIC 🍺🐝 (@Biscuitfrog) August 8, 2021
‘Jammo’ suggested the ‘annoyance tax’…admittedly after being educated on the fact that drivers don’t pay ‘road tax’ either. Oh well, if at first you don’t succeed…
On a more serious note, what have you lot made of the ‘debate’? Vine’s video has been watched 1.1 million times and attracted 10,000 replies. Should we be concerned by the scale of anti-cycling sentiment? Is the reaction representative of the wider population? Or is it a ‘debate’ exacerbated by social media?
Fair Fuel UK founder offers an olive branch
Would love that, but I have no power! First thing is to segregated roadspace in city centres so people can cycle safely. Thanks H
— Jeremy Vine (@theJeremyVine) August 9, 2021
Fair Fuel UK, in its own words, is: “The real independent and not for profit voice in Westminster for 37m UK drivers, who want clean air too, but want this accomplished without being demonised, blamed and continually treated as easy cash cows.”
I wasn’t too familiar with the lobby group so took a dive into our archives for some background info and almost exactly a year ago, Mr Cox made the blog for claiming PM Boris Johnson has “Lycra-clad advisors”…
Then in December, Cycling UK accused Fair Fuel UK of running a ‘how much do you hate cycling’ survey.
UAE Team Emirates continue spending spree with signings of George Bennett, Marc Soler, Pascal Ackermann and Álvaro Hodeg
Welcome George!
✍️ We are delighted to confirm the signing of @georgenbennett on a two-year deal.
📝> https://t.co/w4pVmsSxDE#UAETeamEmirates #RideTogether pic.twitter.com/0LHptiqF3J
— @UAE-TeamEmirates (@TeamEmiratesUAE) August 10, 2021
Tadej Pogacar’s UAE Team Emirates continue to spend big to beef up their support for the two-time Tour de France winner. Marc Soler and George Bennett have joined from Movistar and Jumbo-Visma respectively and will presumably accept support roles after mixed success as leaders in their own right.
On the sprinting side of things, Pascal Ackermann and Álvaro Hodeg have joined, possibly to replace the out of sorts Fernando Gaviria who hasn’t won a race in 11 months and is out of contract at the end of the season.
After securing his second yellow jersey in less than a year, Pogacar signed an extended six-year deal, a contract which has been widely touted as one of the longest in the sport’s history.
UAE team last weeks pic.twitter.com/1MHP4rN0l4
— Mihkel Räim (@mihkelraim) August 10, 2021
Ned Boulting explains why a cyclist might not use a cycle path
Why don’t cyclists use cycle paths?
A) often they do
B) when they don’t it’s because they’re crap pic.twitter.com/ltqHKESmkk— Ned Boulting (@nedboulting) August 9, 2021
Well said, Ned. On a similar note, last month we dubbed the A12 bike path in Suffolk the ‘why cyclists don’t use cycle lanes’ cycle lane. Unsurprisingly the vid of the narrow, overgrown path triggered a deluge of readers sending in pics of shocking cycle routes from where they ride…it turns out there’s a lot of terrible infrastructure knocking around.
Drum & Bass On The Bike #8: Should have packed a towel
For any UK-based riders this will be a very relatable scene this summer…popping out for a spin and getting soaked through. Dom Whitting’s Drum & Bass On The Bike, this time in Nottingham, was the latest victim of our wonderful British summertime. Say it quietly, but the forecast actually looks alright for the next week or so…
Canyon introduces suspension to Grizl gravel bike range
We’ll take a break from social media squabbles to bring you some interesting developments from Canyon’s website… front suspension from RockShox has been added to some new models in its Grizl gravel bike range.
“RockShox are suspension development pioneers – so it was only a matter of time before they got started in gravel,” says Canyon. “Rudy is designed for gravel, with 30mm of travel in a lightweight chassis, and still offering the Grizl-standard 50mm tyre clearance.”
That’s super-interesting because RockShox hasn’t announced a gravel-specific Rudy fork, so maybe Canyon has jumped the gun here? A the time of writing the news has been announced on the Canyon Spain and Canyon Portugal Twitter pages, but there’s nothing on Canyon’s international or UK social media.
“Rudy has a gravel-tuned RockShox Charger Race Day damper and highly responsive Solo Air spring,” Canyon says. “They combine to keep your front tyre glued to the ground over rough surfaces and loose corners. Keeping you in control. There’s also a lockout for road riding.”
Well, well, well!
Canyon also discloses information on new gearing from RockShox’ stablemates SRAM.
“Core to the system is the new 10-44T cassette and matching derailleur,” says Canyon. “This combo hits a sweet spot for gravel, with light gearing for steep climbs, and tight jumps for fast road cruising, all controlled by SRAM’s logical, wireless AXS shifting system.”
The most affordable bike with the RockShox Rudy fork is the £2,999 Canyon Grizl CF SL 8 Suspension WMN, although this features a Shimano GRX RX810 groupset. The Canyon Grizl CF SL 8 Suspension, also in a Shimano build, is a little more expensive at £3,249. If you want the SRAM eTap AXS 10-44T gearing, you’re looking at £5,099 for the Canyon Grizl CF SLX 8 eTap Suspension. The groupset is SRAM’s second tier Force.
All of these bikes are said to be “coming in autumn”.
Ride with Geraint Thomas, Rohan Dennis, Matt Stephens and Ben Foster at Grenadiers Greatest Hits event on Zwift
Introducing your lineup for @GoZwift Greatest Hits! 📣
Wednesday@GeraintThomas86 & @OJBorg@cameronwurf & @BenFoster
Thursday@RealStephens & Rohan Dennis@_brandon_2103 & @5_henao
Friday@jcastroviejo & @ChristianKnees@swiftybswift & Leonardo Basso
Sign up below 👇 pic.twitter.com/rGBlvJinZg
— INEOS Grenadiers (@INEOSGrenadiers) August 10, 2021
The line-up for Grenadiers Greatest Hits has been announced, giving you the opportunity to ride with some of the team’s biggest names on Zwift. If this was a music festival, Geraint Thomas would be the headliner playing main stage on opening night. G will be taking on presenter OJ Borg in a chase race tomorrow, starting at 1:15pm. ‘What’s a chase race?’ I hear you ask…pick a side and ride as hard as you can to help your team win. Or just turn up for a spin with G.
Later on at 7pm Watford goalkeeper, cycling YouTuber and most importantly road.cc Drink at Your Desk graduate Ben Foster will be hosting a 60 minute ride with Ineos pro Cam Wurf around the London Zwift course. On Thursday, there’s another casual spin, this time with Rohan Dennis and Matt Stephens, as well as another chase race between Brandon Rivera and Sebastian Henao. Jonathan Castroviejo and Christian Knees will then go head-to-head on Friday morning before a more relaxed ride with Ben Swift and Leonardo Basso wraps up the Ineos Grenadiers Greatest Hits on Friday teatime.
All the details can be found over on Zwift’s site…
London traffic management doesn't like cycling cafes
For the Old Street cycle cafe Look mum no hands!, this sign probably isn’t going to be particularly helpful for business. Some of its Instagram followers have suggested simply turning the sign around, with the cafe also suggesting: “Or we could move the cafe to the other side of Old St?”
Seems like the most logical solution!
Jeremy Vine takes two abreast discussion to BBC Radio 2...gets told cyclists dawdling along country lanes could add an hour on to a motorist's journey
Cyclists are selfish? If you have somewhere to be and rushing, it’s simple plan ahead and leave earlier. Especially if you know your going down single track country roads. Rather be late than drive fast and possibly hit or injury another person. #yourtheselfishone
— James (@gillespie_201) August 10, 2021
Listeners to BBC Radio 2 this lunchtime would have heard Jeremy Vine hosting a two-way discussion about the two abreast topic. I say ‘hosting’, Vine had to step in after a dodgy connection stopped Cycling UK’s Duncan Dollimore getting involved. On the other side of the debate was Angela Epstein of the Daily Mail and Telegraph. Epstein of course began her argument by reassuring us “as a cyclist myself”, and delivered such golden nuggets as: “what gives them the right to block the road when there is a 30mph limit?” and “I get incredibly angry when I see cyclists cycling side by side rather than single file – I’m terrified of overtaking but sometimes you simply have to”.
When questioned by Vine on the “simply have to” get in front comment…Epstein justified it with “because sometimes you have to get to a place […] you might be late. If somebody is dawdling along at 14mph and this country lane spans several miles, you could be adding another hour on to your journey.” Right…I think we’ll leave that there…
Jeff Rooney breaks Guinness World Record for the furthest distance cycled on a virtual platform in 12 hours
New Zealander Jeff Rooney has set a new world record by riding 455km in 12 hours. Rooney completed the challenge on a 1km circuit on the RGT platform and presumably had plenty of ways to keep himself entertained during the effort…
He added 15km on to the old record, but had to reassess his original goal of smashing the 500km mark midway through the effort. “I’ve done a lot of 12 and 24-hour mountainbike racing, and for how quickly I was feeling bad and for how long I had to push through, it was probably one of the worst rides I’ve ever done,” Rooney told Stuff. What’s more impressive: the distance or just surviving 12 hours on a turbo trainer?
“The legs weren’t having an ideal day, I was already at three hours in feeling fatigue levels at what you would expect at the 10-hour mark.”
Pokemon Bicycle recreated from the game
The Pokemon Company has recreated the iconic bicycle from Pokemon Red and Blue to celebrate its Japanese Twitter account reaching one million followers. The bike will be awarded to one lucky winner, although you have to live in Japan to be in with a chance. In the original games the bike cost 1 million Pokemon Dollars but will be shipped out to a fan for free. And while it might look the part, the bike can’t actually be ridden…but does play the show’s theme tune. So, pros and cons I guess…
Dylan Groenewegen beats Mark Cavendish on Manx Missile's return to competition after Tour de France success
So close for @MarkCavendish 😫
The @deceuninck_qst rider can’t get the better of his rivals in a fierce sprint finish as Dylan Groenewegen takes victory in the opening stage of the Tour of Denmark 🇩🇰@GroenewegenD | @JumboVismaRoad pic.twitter.com/b9VQFM6jAu
— Eurosport UK (@Eurosport_UK) August 10, 2021
Mark Cavendish is in Denmark this week for his first race since the Tour de France. His Olympic gold medallist teammate Michael Mørkøv is there too, but couldn’t guide Cav to victory today. Dylan Groenewegen took the opening stage, quite comfortably in the end, beating Cav and European champ Giacomo Nizzolo.
Have a day off, Angela
I was delayed so long by cyclists riding 18 abreast I went back in time and ended up fighting dinosaurs. The police do nothing.
— Enya fans 4 communism (@PaulCra33107260) August 10, 2021
Good to see everyone taking Angela Epstein’s ‘analysis’ as seriously as it deserves to be…
Switched onto @BBCRadio2 in my work van just at the moment this was being discussed with @theJeremyVine.@adepstein1 says she “feels terrified” coming across cyclists while she is driving, and another caller said (quite correctly) that Angela shouldn’t be driving.
I agree.
— Mark E (@MarknSid) August 10, 2021
10 August 2021, 08:02
10 August 2021, 08:02
Well well well, it appears Canyon did jump the gun on that new gravel suspension fork! Full story below...
SRAM, Zipp & RockShox launch new XPLR gravel components
Range includes a gravel-specific suspension fork and dropper seatpost as well as rear derailleurs, cassettes, and wheels
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Latest Comments
I'm glad I had my trousers on. If I hadn't I might have been arrested.
Who was responsible for organising the prizes on Bullseye? Tonight's star prize was a luxury fitted kitchen. How are you supposed to split that between two contestants? Absolutely ridiculous.
Oh sir! sir! Johnnys riding his bike without a helmet, he’s going to die when he falls off!, Yes what a silly boy he is ! Anyway jump in the car we’re going to be late for school and I hope no one gets in my way especially bleeding cyclists!! I wonder if AI will see what fools we are..
It's more about the nomex suit, car helmet and five point harnesses (with HANS), but "reply" ain't what it used to be...
'Gotten' ? The word is 'become', as in, I have become sick of seeing 'gotten'.
OK, all the stuff I said elsewhere on this thread in defence of helmets, I take it all back. I'd sooner be seen as an anti-lidder than be associated with that heap of steaming ordure.
Exactly my thoughts. A real shame, they're amazing bikes, same as Islabikes. Really sad to hear the news. Having said that, we probably didn't do enough to help them. My son had one Islabike and two Frogs, all second hand that we resold for about the same amount.
I couldn't agree more, and when we have all that everywhere I might think about leaving off the helmet, but until then if I have to share the road with huge fast-moving chunks of metal, many of them piloted by persons of limited intelligence and even less self control, I'm going to keep the lid, which even Burt agrees can "probably" offer some protection from injury.
And the irony is that helmet promotion and mandation kills lots of people and they don't reduce the death rate of cyclists. The benefits of cycling vastly outweigh the risks, and helmet promotion and mandation deter cycling (the only proven effect) so those deterred lose those benefits and die earlier.
I see Mont Pythons upper class twits have been replaced by male anti helmet twits who probably ride under 10000 km/year while wearing bike gloves, ladies bib capris, power meters to register the watts they dont produce ,gps because they are easily lost on a tiny island, a mobile phone to call the wifey in case the ride gets too hilly or wet or fast or windy, all while complaining their tushy hurts. They always ask for proof..you could crash a few times on purpose without and with a helmet and send us the pictures. Do pros complain about helmets?..if you rode in a country with sun you would know that styrofoam actually keeps your head cool.. Ps ice hockey players say they dont need mouthguards..ask them to smile
81 thoughts on “‘Annoyance tax’ suggested as anti-cyclist bingo + two abreast rants roll on; Canyon unveils Grizl gravel bikes with new RockShox suspension; Ned Boulting talks bike paths; Ever been stuck behind a cyclist for an hour?; Zwift with G + more on the live blog”
Romanes eunt domus
Romanes eunt domus
hirsute wrote:
Yeah but what have they done for us?
Captain Badger wrote:
Well, apparently they not only invented the bicycle, they built roads for them, so I think that’s pretty significant.
An annoyance tax? Sounds
An annoyance tax? Sounds fantastic, because the cause of most driver frustration is other drivers. The war on motorists can just be infighting, instead of blaming the person taking the least amount of road space.
I think the whole “debate” is
I think the whole “debate” is utterly bizarre.
What amazes me is the number of times you see huge long tailbacks of miles of motor vehicles all stationary or travelling very slowly in fits and starts and yet people seem to accept that as normal and expected. If most of those same drivers were on bikes instead of in large motor vehicles, then there would barely be any congestion/traffic jams.
I bet if someone analysed the typical car journeys made by these anti-cyclists, then they’d find that those journeys are delayed far more by other motor vehicles than the occasional cyclist whether alone or in a group.
hawkinspeter wrote:
That would mean they’d have to accept that when driving cars they are teh problem
https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2020/07/01/cyclists-dont-cause-congestion-must-get-in-front-maneuvers-by-motorists-pointless-finds-study/?sh=40a6ddd61e3e
When I used to cycle to work
When I used to cycle to work in the good old days, I would be held up by cars for the last 2.5 miles. The drivers didn’t seem to want to move out of my way even though I was the faster vehicle.
Going home I had to weave in and out of stationary cars on the roundabout outside the office to make any progress.
hawkinspeter wrote:
remember it is OK to be delayed in your car because
(listed in order of my estimate of amount of time lost by the average driver)
It is not OK to be held up for even 30 seconds behind cyclists travelling on the road.
I don’t know why this is the case, but it is known.
there is no question that all drivers are delayed far more in every year by others drivers as per the above, than they will be by cyclists.
No one who has blocked the motorway by causing a crash will ever recieve the abuse cyclists will get, despite having delayed many more drivers for far more time.
I just drove pretty much all
I just drove pretty much all the way home from Cambridge in a long queue of traffic behind a tractor. Can I apply for an annoyance tax rebate?
Or maybe there will be an annoyance offset scheme, e.g holding up traffic behind as I wait to turn right in a car = equivalent time holding up traffic waiting to pass when I’m on my bicycle. I do hope there will be an active market in annoyance credits, I reckon I will be quids in.
I’m pretty annoyed about the
I’m pretty annoyed about the climate crisis, the 5 a day or more meeting violent deaths at the hands of motorists, and the 10s of thousands annually facing lingering deaths due to vehicular pollution.
Can I have a rebate please Mr Sunak?
I loved the number of people
I loved the number of people saying that “tractor drivers always pull over to let people past”.
I used to work on a farm and we held an informal leaderboard to see who could get the longest line of cars behind a tractor. I’m embarrassed now, but it did seem funny at the time.
As for road tax – well, let’s assume that all the riders in the picture there are six-figure earners playing around on their bikes at the weekend (‘cos stereotypes). Then that’s roughly 10 * 120,000 * 0.35 = £440,000 in tax moving in the space of one car. So by that argument anyone behind should frankly sit and wait, and when they do overtake safely they should fucking salute.
The size of modern tractors
The size of modern tractors makes it virtually impossible to pull over anymore on most country roads and it’s rare you find one going ‘slow’ thesedays.
But even if they could pull over it’s certainly not my experience anymore, and hasnt been for many years that tractors are these politely driven vehicles that are conscientious about not holding traffic up.
That seems very much a thing of the past that people are remembering that no longer applies.
When I’m driving I find there
When I’m driving I find there are a staggering amount of annoying drivers on the road, can we apply this annoyance tax on them?
No, thought not.
How about an ‘arrogance tax’?
How about an ‘arrogance tax’? Highest charge on BMWs, Audis, Mercedes & Range Rovers etc. plus 50% when its an urban assault vehicle (sorry, SUV) dropping down to zero for the more mundane vehicles – Smart For2 etc.
Sorry to break it to you but
Sorry to break it to you but
You have to pay an extra £335 a year if you have a car or motorhome with a ‘list price’ (the published price before any discounts) of more than £40,000.
plus
151 to 170g/km £555
171 to 190g/km £895
191 to 225g/km £1,345
226 to 255g/km £1,910
Over 255g/km £2,245
I had to nip home to get
I had to nip home to get something earlier, and upon driving back to work, I joined a queue of about 15 cars doing 20 in a 60. I was annoyed, until I realised that the causes of the queue was a cyclist. Once I realise, I chilled back down and enjoyed the pootle. Cyclists don’t cause me annoyance. I was held up for a couple of mintes, but so what? I queue for much longer on that road everyday due to cars
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-58155928
I don’t usually follow sports
I don’t usually follow sports cycling, but I just came across this article on BristolPost (which struck me as being a strange place to see it): https://www.bristolpost.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/olympic-cyclist-olivia-podmore-dies-5764364
Unfortunately, Olivia Podmore (a New Zealand rider who represented her country at 2016 Olympics) has passed away at the very young age of 24.
As always, condolences to her friends and family for their loss.
Is suspect (and certainly
Is suspect (and certainly hope) that the vehemence of the “debate” is amplified by the nature of social media – it’s the vocal minority on both sides that feel compelled to jump in (I suppose I would have to count myself in that group by commenting here on a regular basis!) That said, I do think the rhetoric does spill over into “real life” and I suspect most people who ride bikes have been subject to real anti-cycling behaviour at some point (punishment passes, road rage, objects thrown out of windows etc.).
I’m not quite sure what the solution is… There probably is no single solution. I guess I think the best place to start is keeping on banging on about cycling for urban mobility. I think there are a lot of arguments that more people should do more journeys by bike, and the more people we get on bikes some of the time, the more cyclists stop being “others” and start being a friend, relative or colleague.
I like Jeremy Vine and I know
I like Jeremy Vine and I know he means well but I do wish he’d stop posting these type of tweets. All it does is enrage people and literally no one will ever change their mind because of the sense he comes out with – this is twitter – people have made up their mind long before coming onto that platform. All it does is give people an excuse to post hate, see others post hate and feel like what they are saying/thinking is normal and not fucking batshit mental.
As bad as it is…all the recent attention (by which I mean, hate) towards electric scooters has been a godsend (as in, people stop hating on cyclists for a few seconds…). I feel awful saying that but there’s never been a time I’ve been cycling when I haven’t been demonised by idiots despite a) obeying the highway code and law vastly better than them and b) paying more tax than the vast majority of them. Just going a few days without all this crap being thrown at cyclists (sometimes literally) feels nice…sorry electric scoot peeps but as you can see, you haven’t made a sensible transport choice, you’re part of the Evil Cycling Lobby* and thus you’re no longer considered human.
*Electric scoot divssion
I’m no longer cycling on the
I’m no longer cycling on the road but if I was I’d be pretty pissed off at Jeremy Vine. It just incites hatred and whilst the more extreme accounts are quite satisfying to report to Twitter for application of the banhammer (they’re actually very good at this in my experience) the likely outcome is cyclists becoming a KSI statistic. It’s also exhausting trying engage with the debate and inaccuracies posted – that Windsor Tri incident is everywhere for example at the moment. As a road rage victim when I saw him post it I was genuinely anxious for people still riding on the road. And the responses just confirm my reasons for switching to MTB.
kil0ran wrote:
It’s not JV who incites hatred, it’s the act of jumping on a bike and riding on the road that does that. We’re all to blame as it happens by that metric.
These mouth breathers aren’t normal until they come across JVs tweets, they were always w@nkers. They’ve just been triggered into expressing it.
Captain Badger wrote:
Thats naive and doesnt agree with the wealth of evidence that social media amplifies and encourages extreme behaviours and opinions. As does most advertising led media tbf.
Secret_squirrel wrote:
Oops, sorry. I meant to say these mouth breathers are actually skilled drivers until they see one of JVs tweets, when they become psychotic cyclist killing loons
Secret_squirrel wrote:
Yes, easily led people are easily led.
However, to suggest that we shouldn’t post pro-cycling information because of a minority of idiots is just risible. It’d be like suggesting that people shouldn’t post positive ethnic minority stories to avoid antagonising the KKK.
hawkinspeter wrote:
I agree and would never suggest otherwise. However if we actually want a majority positive response from posts they need a lot of thought put into both content and tone – just as you would an ethnic minority story.
My opinion of Vine is that he sometimes chooses to publish something to get a reaction rather than usefully progress a debate, his tweet that started this being a case in point.
Secret_squirrel wrote:
I suspect you’re right about Vine wanting to drum up a bit of controversy.
My opinion is that the time for debate is over and the myth of private, personal motor vehicles for mass transport has clearly outlived its usefulness. Following on from the IPCC report yesterday, it’s obvious that developed countries need to make a major shift in attitudes and behaviours (and I don’t mean just move manufacturing to another country so that we can then blame them) and one small part of that is to get people out of cars and onto scooters/bikes/feet.
Whether Vine chooses to antagonise or supplicate makes no practical difference. What we need is a major political rethink.
kil0ran wrote:
I mainly cycle on the road and I don’t care what Jeremy Vine tweets about. Dangerous drivers might try to use him as an excuse, but ultimately drivers bear responsibility for their own actions. If someone is that easily provoked into violence, then it would have happened with some other incident (e.g. they thought a cyclist looked at them funny), so let’s not blame Jeremy Vine and give poor drivers an excuse.
(I wouldn’t count myself as a fan of Jeremy Vine, but I agree with his tweets more than I disagree)
While I was driving home
While I was driving home tonight, ABC Radio Adelaide played a recorded clip of a cyclist recounting how a few days ago he was one of three separately crashed into entirely deliberately by a car driver (i.e. the motorist performed a u-turn to take a run at the first, and then drove entirely in the murder-strip cycle lane to run into the other two). The police response? The motorist was driving “recklessly”! No, he/she was commiting assault, potentially attempted murder. If they do manage to track the driver down (the car having been, in the words of the police, “allegedly stolen”) my expectation is that SAPOL will treat it as a traffic offence, rather than the hate-crime it would seem to be. We’ll see how it pans out.
EddyBerckx wrote:
I detest Vine’s his radio show, but am mildly supportive of his twitter antics.
I would question whether he always means well or occasionally likes to drum up contraversy when he goes too much into “radio host” mode.
The reason he does it though
The reason he does it though is in the article, 1million video views and 10,000 interactions, from 1 main tweet and a bunch of follow ups for sure, but that’s some big social media influencing stats right there.
And that’s alot more people than watch his Channel 5 morning show.
I was enjoying that drum and
I was enjoying that drum and base video with all the cyclists. Some tips for future though:
Interesting that Canyon has
Interesting that Canyon has blurted out both a RockShox new product and the well rumoured AXS Xplr 44t rear mech. First time I’ve seen it confirmed as a Force Mech though.
Mr Boulting looks like he
Mr Boulting looks like he really needs to get more sleep…
It might just be me but I
It might just be me but I find it ironic that, on the day that the IPCC release a report that says that if we don’t do something now the planet is going to go shit, so many people should choose that moment to get exercised about cyclists.
The report says we need to do something NOW. I know we are all hypocrits when it comes to the climate crisis but the msm seem obsessed by what will happen at the cop26 in Glasgow. They don’t seem to understand that there’s stuff we can all do today – cycle more, walk instead of driving to the local shops, eat less beef and lamb, buy less shit that you don’t need etc. Railing against cyclists seems to me to be using energy on the wrong issues.
IanMK wrote:
That’s because the msm know that they’ll get more people reacting to cyclist related articles than those on the climate crisis, probably not by much in many articles, but they know the discussion will be more heated (pardon the pun).
It’s also a sad state of affairs and far too many people will conveniently dismiss the issue or place the responsibility solely onto the government to sort out, to absolve themselves of having to make personal lifestyle changes in order to significantly reduce their own carbon footprint.
The two issues obviously are inextricably linked and is summarised by the people who feel under threat (motorists) with having their privileges/rights reduced or taken away.
Everyone needs to take responsibility for their own carbon footprint RIGHT NOW, otherwise it will simply be too late. The pandemic should be the catalyst for everyone to reduce their carbon footprint but unfortunately many will rush to return to their pre-pandemic privileges. I am a pessimist by nature and have seen nothing to suggest otherwise in the face of a global catastrophe, I hope I’m proven wrong!
On that subject, I’ve been
On that subject, I’ve been looking at carbon offsetting. If anybody has any good tips on this I’d appreciate it. Otherwise, I was just thinking of giving to a rewilding charity. BBCs countryfile on Sunday was quite interesting.
IanMK wrote:
I’m not sure how good carbon offsetting is when the trees planted for it go up in flames.
you buy another carbon bike.
you buy another carbon bike. It’s carbon offsetting, honest
Pyro Tim wrote:
crap, my last bike was not carbon. I didn’t consider the benefits of using carbon for a bike, rather than for fuel.
naughty step for me.
I think it’s generally
I think it’s generally nonsense, a salve to the conscience maybe.
Sometimes worthwhile causes, but as a way to reduce say a jet flight to carbon zero, nah.
We need to fly less, drive less, eat less red meat and stop buying huge amounts of stuff. Just because it’s made in the far east doesn’t mean there is no carbon footprint. We need to repair more and keep stuff going longer.
The JV tweets, whilst stoking
The JV tweets, whilst stoking the fire usually bring a satisfactory outcome. What I mean by that is that “whataboutery” always loses out to “logic”. The anti-cyclist idiot that shouts loudest usually gets absolutely destroyed the most on social media and yes, that runs the risk of them taking out their prejudices out on the road but it serves far more to educate and learn (because many of those anti-cyclist drivel spouters don’t know the basics). The noticeable difference for me is that in the past a cyclist would have very little help defending their position on social media, whereas often now the trend is the opposite.
Going back to JV, for sure he could go about his Twitter activity in a much less divisive and more constructive way, but that wouldn’t bring out the real issues that need to be discussed in the same way. And so the method to the madness is – enrage, inform and conquer. He has my support.
I would easily estimate of
I would easily estimate of all the anti cycling stuff I experience on the road, only a tiny tiny fraction is caused by people with Twitter accounts, and an even tinier fraction of those who use twitter to air anti cycling sentiments.
So no I’m not remotely concerned by Twitter users views on cyclists, twitter is not this health pulse check of the nations/worlds hive mind its purported to be.
I’m getting increasingly
I’m getting increasingly depressed and frustrated with the anti-cycling debate. It’s everywhere, social media, real life. My wife doesn’t cycle or drive, even she complains when we are driving and I slow down and wait for a safe place to pass a cyclist.
But I won’t back down about close passing. I shout and gesticulate every time it happens. I used to swear and bang door mirrors, but haven’t done that for a long time. In my experience, cars following the incident then give me more room, and if you just accept it, it will keep happening.
I also don’t let it go on social media. I always post that “60 people a day are killed or seriously injured on our roads. By drivers. And you think cyclists are the problem?”
The JV story has been picked
The JV story has been picked up by some of the media, including this rather misleading Mirror headline “Jeremy Vine’s video of bunching cyclists sparks so much outrage police get involved”
The usual comments are all there https://www.mirror.co.uk/3am/celebrity-news/jeremy-vines-video-bunching-cyclists-24724523?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=mirror_main&fbclid=IwAR1Vl64rJ_YLcZ6xvwqFqxrNpln_Spweb3HqmV4P9m0XDfWqbgJi5xgmNOU
eburtthebike wrote:
but crucially, the give prominance to the police response of “nothing to see here, good drivers can overtake easily and safely”
In fact I quite approve of the bait and switch headline leading petrol addicts to click to see the police berating those inconsiderate cyclists, only to find the law is on the side of cyclists.
Sometimes I don’t use a cycle
Sometimes I don’t use a cycle path because it’s full of slower cyclists. If I’m cracking on and the lane is busy there’s not much point being in it and constantly moving out of it.
Rick_Rude wrote:
I do the same if there’s an e-scooter in one of those pop-up lanes as there’s not really space for overtaking.
some bigoted driver wrote:
Please please get this formulated as a maths question at GCSE
Captain Badger wrote:
Si Clist is riding his bike at an average speed of 14 mph down a country road. Dick Head is in a car averaging 30 mph before he comes up behind Si and is stuck behind him for seven miles. Dick writes on Twitter that he was delayed by Si for an hour.
a) How much longer does Dick’s journey take as a result of being stuck behind Si?
b) What would Dick’s average speed have to be in order for his statement of his delay to be true?
PRSboy wrote:
That’s a great start. We need to know the length of Dick’s journey (quiet at the back!)
PRSboy wrote:
a) How much longer does Dick’s journey take as a result of being stuck behind Si?
b) What would Dick’s average speed have to be in order for his statement of his delay to be true?— PRSboy
The answer to (b) is simple: there is no possible speed that he could have been averaging that would allow Dick’s journey to be delayed by an hour from being stuck behind a 14 MPH cyclist for seven miles (30 minutes.) Worst case, had he been previously travelling at the speed of light, he’d be delayed by 29:59.99996 seconds. Unfortunately, at anywhere close to the speed of light in an atmosphere, most cars turn into energy and exotic forms of matter, along with a lot of the other material in the surrounding few miles.
Just for fun…
Just for fun…
Each mile “stuck” behind a cyclist travelling at 14 MPH takes 4:17 (and never happens.) If you would otherwise be traveling at 30 MPH, it would have taken you 2:00, so you’d only add 2:17 to your journey per mile. At 40 MPH, that’s 2:47/mile, and 50 MPH, 3:05/mile.
So for a 50 MPH motorist suddenly stuck behind a 14 MPH cyclist, they would have to be stuck for 19.45 miles to add a single hour to their journey. The time spent behind the cyclist would be 1:23:20.
Captain Badger wrote:
John is riding his bicycle at 14mph and is saving the planet and making himself slim and healthy. Jean is driving behind him in a gas-guzzling SUV and wants to pass John because she left late because she’s badly organised and incompetent, but is unable to do so because she chose to use a country lane instead of the motorway, and is adding to climate change while endangering other people with her huge vehicle.
How long will it take Jean to wise up?
eburtthebike wrote:
Ooo – sir! Sir! Is the answer, “Never”?
I haven’t listend to the full
I haven’t listend to the full Radio 2 show and I don’t intend to because I think it would make me despair… Shame Duncan Dollimore couldn’t make it as generally he seems to hold his own pretty well in a debate, which is high praise as cycling “debates” tend to be a bit like playing chess with a pigeon.
what gives them the right to block the road when there is a 30mph limit?
OnYerBike wrote:
Nuts isn’t I?. The original vid showed some cyclists studiously not blocking the road
I haven’t (and won’t ) listen
I haven’t (and won’t ) listen to it. I do wish JV would not do these kind of shows, they are just designed to promote argument and the producers know this and it draws in lots of angry Daily Mail readers. I have in the past heard some of his similar cycling phone in shows whilst driving for work and end up just getting angry and stressed and switching off in annoyance.
It gets the listener numbers up though I suppose.
‘cycling “debates” tend to be
‘cycling “debates” tend to be a bit like playing chess with a pigeon’
Or ‘never argue with a stupid person – they’ll drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.’ (Attributed to Mark Twain I think).
At what point does a gravel
At what point does a gravel bike with suspension forks become a hard tail mtb
Nick T wrote:
Flat handlebars
Nick T wrote:
At the point where the manufacturers think that there’s just enough difference to make people like me want one of each……
Nick T wrote:
about £3000
Not sure if this was
Not sure if this was mentioned here already:
[I]”TV presenter Storm Huntley has urged cyclists to wear helmets after she was knocked down by a car on Monday.
The co-host of Channel 5’s Jeremy Vine show tweeted an image of her damaged helmet saying she was thankful it wasn’t her skull that was cracked….
…Huntley said her partner had got rid of her bike after the incident, telling her: “No more cycling for you.”[/i]
(Yeah – I’d suggest getting rid of the motorist)
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-58156994
Sriracha wrote:
Yup, someone posted about it on fb, but I haven’t seen the prog yet as it hasn’t been put up, but the BBC coverage is its usual unquestioning promotion of helmets with no consideration that it might not have saved her life. The usual focussing on the helmet being so beneficial, with very little examination of the cause of the collision, the driver. I had thought the BBC was getting better, since they’ve had a couple of articles about cycling which were quite positive and no mention of helmets, but I see I’m mistaken.
Since it’s C5 but reported by the BBC, that’s two complaints I’ll have to make.
I was most saddened by her OH
I was most saddened by her OH’s solution – stop cycling. The BBC failed to make anything about the hostile environment cyclists are routinely expected to contend with and the consequent chilling effect on the uptake of cycling more generally.
No comment on the infrastructure, no censure for the driver – just one of those things, and wear your helmet otherwise it would have been the cyclist at fault.
Storm Huntley: about a
Storm Huntley: about a thousand people are killed falling downstairs every year in the UK – so always wear a crash helmet if you are going up or downstairs, that means indoors as well.
Why is there like 5 copies of
Why is there like 5 copies of everything in this blog. It takes forever to load and scroll to through.
Motorists are always causing
Motorists are always causing huge delays to cyclists in cities and towns – so it appears it’s ok for motorists to cause delays to cyclists but wrong for cyclists to cause delays to motorists.
Nearly all the delays that
Nearly all the delays that happen to motorists are caused by motorists, and that includes all the accidents they cause.
If cyclists are riding two
If cyclists are riding two (or more) abreast on a single carriageway road, how can that be making it easier for a motor vehicle to overtake than if they were riding single file? Surely it’d be impossible for the driver to give the recommended 1.5 metres between vehicle and the nearest bicycle?
If the road is that narrow
If the road is that narrow then it almost certainly isn’t safe to overtake a single cyclist, so single file or 2 abreast makes no difference except that doubling up definitely makes it clear to a following motorist that there is not enough space and not to take a chance. If the cyclists feel it is safe to do so and from their better vantage position, they may single out and wave a vehicle past. Being prepared for the closeness of the vehicle makes the pass safer for everyone.
Most cyclists are decent human beings and have no wish to hold up traffic just for fun. Unfortunately on narrow singletrack roads, if you bring a vehicle that uses all the road space then you have to accept that sometimes you are going to have to wait to get past slower traffic. Then again, if you are in a rush then you are probably on the wrong type of road or may have been issued with emergency blue lights and sirens, the use of which will have those pesky cyclists looking for the nearest place to pull over and stop while you pass.
Thanks for your answer. I’m
Thanks for your answer. I’m not sure if I’ve explained the question clearly, as on a single carriageway road (one lane in each direction), there’s enough room to overtake cyclists riding single file, but there wouldn’t be room to overtake cyclists riding two abreast. Surely it’d be impossible to overtake cyclists riding two abreast whilst leaving the recommended distance on anything other than roads with more than 2 lanes?
If there’s enough room to
If there’s enough room to overtake another car safely, then there’s enough room to overtake two cyclists riding side-by-side, who will take up less space than a typical car.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen
I don’t think I’ve ever seen a car overtake another car and leave anything more than two or three feet of space between it and the other car!
I have seen 3.65m quoted as
I have seen 3.65m quoted as an example lane width. A VW Golf for example is just over 2m wide. Two Golfs passing one another would therefore have over 1.5m between them, even if each of them was travelling in the middle of their lane. Obviously there are plenty of variables, but I would suggest on a great many single carriageway roads it’s therefore perfectly possible to pass either another car or cyclists riding two abreast while still giving 1.5m passing distance.
1.5m is <5ft, so, given that
1.5m is <5ft, so, given that the offside cyclist would typically be >1 ft further towards the centre of the lane than the offside of a car, the same position that would give a car 3 ft of clearance would likely give the cyclist 1.5m.
In any case, though, I think you’re underestimating the typical clearance given when passing another car.
Nagai74 wrote:
if you were driving and a car overtook you at 2 feet you would be shocked. Thats probably closer than cars would be in a car park. Do you really think overtaking cars are as close to each other as parked cars?
If you overtake other cars as close as that you should surrender your licence driving is not for you. No allowance for the overtaking car to deviate for any reason
If you are using the picture
If you are using the picture linked to the JV article above then the outside cyclist of the staggered pairs is approx 2/3 of the way into the marked lane. This is exactly where a motorcyclist would be and where the driver of a standard RHD car would be. The positioning of the group is textbook. A passing car has an entire lane to use and because the cyclists are bunched together the total time on “wrong side of the road” is commensurately shorter.
There seems to be an issue for some less confident drivers in thinking that moving entirely to the “wrong side” of the road for a shorter period of time is somehow more risky than straddling the centre line for a longer period of time.
Nagai74 wrote:
I believe that the minimum passing distance does not apply if the motor vehicle is completely in the opposite lane, something I discovered from the Met when I complained about a lorry passing me unnecessarily close when I was in a bike lane (paint only): their interpretation, at least, was that as long as vehicles are in separate lanes and the overtaking vehicle doesn’t cross the dividing line then passing distances don’t apply.
Nagai74 wrote:
with the first cyclist 1m from the edge, the second cyclist 1m from the first and the overtaking car 1.5m from the second, that comes to 3.5m, which is not unusually wide for a single carriageway lane. In reality the cyclists will be closer to the left edge and closer together, especially when they know a car is about to pass. Cars are typically less than 2m wide, giving plenty of room to be further into the other lane than the centre line anyway.
I don’t know why this is in anyway contentious, I often see horses being ridden side by side and cars manage to pass them wide and slow. I don’t know why this suddenly becomes difficult with cyclists who are lower and narrower than horses.