Next year’s 20th anniversary edition of London-Paris, the three-day ride that features on many cyclists’ bucket list, will be the last in the current format, with organisers blaming the decision in large part on increased costs and logistical headaches in the wake of Brexit.
On the event’s website, organisers Hotchillee invite would-be participants to join them “one more time” next June for the iconic event, which covers 520km between the British and French capitals.
While other organised London to Paris rides are available, and many people choose to cycle the route independently, what has set the Hotchillee event apart over the years are its sheer scale – 350 cyclists, supported by more than 100 event crew, are expected next year – as well as the availability of rolling road closures on the French leg and a police motorbike escort into Paris.
In recent years, the status of the event has also been enhanced by Hotchillee’s partnership with ASO, with the event finishing the day before the Tour de France’s traditional Champs-Elysees finish, although that will not be the case next year with the Grand Tour finishing in Nice as Paris prepares to host the Olympic and Paralympic Games.
And while organisers cite issues such as problems securing road closures and the event’s carbon footprint as also being factors behind the decision to bring it to an end, it seems clear that the red tape that impacts movement of goods and people between the UK and the EU – a problem also highlighted by British musicians who now have to account for all their equipment when heading to the continent on tour – is the primary stumbling block, and one that proves insurmountable.
According to Cyclingnews.com, organisers say that the total value of bikes used by people participating in the event last year was £1.7 million, and due to customs changes following Brexit, a carnet for the entire fleet has to be completed to avoid import duties from being applied to each individual bicycle.
No such paperwork was required while the UK remained within the customs union, and the additional costs – plus the prospect of bikes being held at the border if for whatever reason the documentation was unacceptable to customs officials – mean that it is impossible for the event to continue in its current format.
In a statement on its website, Hotchillee said: “Wanting to offer a more sustainable experience for their riders, the increasing challenge of closing roads and securing permissions for race sections, combined with the ever growing complications of Brexit, Hotchillee’s 20th anniversary edition will be the last in the current format.
The company’s founder, Sven Thiele, added: “We, the organisers, crew and riders have enjoyed so many years of inspirational London-Paris experiences.
“For two decades we’ve supported riders with rolling closed roads, mechanical, medical, lead car, motorbike outrider and logistical vehicle support. In recent years we’ve been making some small but significant changes as we move toward a greener future.
“We will use this as an opportunity to celebrate 20 years of a wonderful event in an exciting format that has allowed us to expand our global family far beyond what I dreamt of in the early days.”
Places for the event, costing from £1,950 and including three nights’ 3- or 4-star accommodation, are available through the Hotchillee website, and the company says that it will continue to offer the Gravel version of the ride, the route of which mainly comprises off-road sections, and takes place next year from 19-22 September.





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133 thoughts on “Brexit blamed as London-Paris organisers say next year’s edition will be the last”
road.cc wrote:
Gravel bikes exempt from customs declarations then?
As the problem stated was £1
As the problem stated was £1.7mil of bikes were going through and the majority are road bikes, they can deal with the lesser numbers and cheaper costs from the Gravel/MTB riders. I imagine reducing the amount of road entries to make them manageable loses them money with the need still for the outriders, closed roads and rolling roadblocks they mentioned they used.
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:
I disagree, I think the road event had probably had its day, there are many ways of doing this route now, and I remember reading an interview with Hotchillee a couple of years ago (wish I could find it again) where they were saying that road sportives were becoming passé, and the future market in this sector was based around experiences rather than challenges, and as an organisation, their future was in gravel. So therefore I don’t think the numbers will be less. Regarding the value, the carnet for 350 gravel bikes costing £3k will be the same for 350 road bikes costing £6k. The value will only come into it if import duty is due, and that’s what the carnet avoids.
I don’t doubt there are other
I don’t doubt there are other business conditions, as they mention in the article, but I expect it isn’t the cost of the carnet they are mentioning as a factor but the organising of it. They get all the paperwork, then 3 people don’t turn up, or someone pulls out in the first leg to Dover/ Felixstowe. Paperwork suddently needs changing? Maybe the customs people want to account for each bike against the paperwork on a random check. Several hours of waiting. What happens if someone pulls out once in France due to whatever reason?
The line about Gravel is also on in 2024 is a bit of a red herring as the road event is also still on in 2024, the difference is they are seperating them into two events. This might have been down to the main draw of being on the Champs for the final isn’t happening, or Paris getting full due to the Olympics, or just away of having less paperwork hassles, or just to have less people as the Road Captains can then do the gravel rides instead of doubling up.
How would the potential
How would the potential problems with the carnet be any different with the gravel ride?
One more tariff will fix it.
One more tariff will fix it.
If you’d said ‘cutting one
If you’d said ‘cutting one more tariff will fix it’ it would have both made sense and demonstrated that you at least understood our previous discussion.
As it stands that post does neither.
Nothing you said made any
Nothing you said made any sense, so I went with the catchier version.
Still, the gift keeps on giving huh?
I tried to explain it in very
I tried to explain it in very simple terms but I guess even that was too much.
Where are my Brexit benefits?
Where are my Brexit benefits?
simple enough.
Simples – someone had put
Simples – someone has put together a (no doubt 6000% accurate) Brexit benefit calculator here. Now they just need to hook it up to a bus-sized printer:
https://www.omnicalculator.com/finance/brexit
If you refuse to engage when
If you refuse to engage when I post clear explanations and links to objective analysis then continuing to post the same question starts to look a lot like simple trolling.
If you can’t see that lower prices for bikes and bike components is a benefit for cyclists then I can’t really help you.
But it’s just jam tomorrow.
But it’s just jam tomorrow.
Hirsute wrote:
it’s not even that.
Well low alcohol wine is
Well low alcohol wine is going down as well as sparkling wine. A brexit benefit !
Let’s gloss over the change to 27 rates of duty, the highest increase in duty for 40 years at an average increase of 22% leaving us the highest payers of duty in europe.
(already informed my wife that her sherry will be rationed from now !)
Big whoo, Jeremy. Of course
Big whoo, Jeremy. Of course if you drive to the pub, you receive an enormous government subsidy.
Sky News : “For beer drinkers, Mr Hunt is cutting the duty on draught pints across the UK by 11p. It is seen as a measure designed to boost pubs, many of which have been closing.”
Puts me in mind of the old Dover-Calais booze (and fags) cruise.
David9694 wrote:
Borders are good for that – and smuggling of course! IIRC the lack of a *nearby* border didn’t stop smuggling of booze and fags (or people manufacturing knock-offs to avoid local tax) though.
That’s a bit of a specious
That’s a bit of a specious argument.
Once we left the EU it was always going to take time to negotiate new deals whilst the disruption was going to be entirely front loaded. Those new deals are slowly building up now and that disruption is now reducing.
The India deal appears to be on the cusp of final sign off, if it gets over the line the debate about “benefits” will be settled.
It wasn’t an argument, just a
It wasn’t an argument, just a description of what’s happening.
Enjoy your more expensive wine, something touted as a Brexit benefit.
which are you?
which are you?
If someone is still defending Brexit, then they must be deriving some satisfaction from it. Since they cannot name anything that is better in Life for Brexit, that only leaves their taking some kind of twisted revenge on the world.
Unlikely to be settled,
Unlikely to be settled, except possibly by future historians.
There were certainly those arguing at the time benefits would appear in short order, if not immediately. Equally some analysis suggested that it would be “too early to say” until a generation or two.
As we get further from the point of departure any effect becomes harder to separate from (or it’s easier to invoke) “other stuff” – pandemic, not-so-local war etc.
Good and bad likely oversold back when. But thousands of instances of change (or not) being haggled over for decades? Absolutely.
A big trade deal will give a
A big trade deal will give a clear benefit (that can’t be dismissed or ignored) to point to when debating pros and cons and will end the ‘there are no benefits’ line of argument.
Rich_cb wrote:
Any idea when we’re going to see that?
The India deal is apparently
The India deal is apparently very close to sign off, September has been touted as a potential date for this but only time will tell.
Just as an aside, the other
Just as an aside, the other day you picked up on it is better to produce our own stuff (gas/oil) then transport it in due to the carbon footprint. Being as other trade deals (Aus/NZ) allowed items we already had (Beef and Lamb) to be shipped in from 12k miles away, and overall the benefits of the deal are forecast as less then 0.1% of GDP by 2035, surely the Carbon Footprint of these “benefits” are suspect.
Edit: At least we won’t have Johnson screwing up benefits to the UK over an evening dinner anymore.
We’re not actually self
We’re not actually self sufficient in food by a long way.
I’d agree we should aim to be as self sufficient as possible but whilst we’re not we will need to import.
Long distance shipping isn’t actually too carbon intensive and if the original production is low carbon then even after shipping it may still be lower carbon than a UK product.
Even with Lamb where we are technically self sufficient the seasonality of the produce means that we stil import/export through the year.
Rich_cb wrote:
So, our wait is almost over. Just a few more months and we’ll be rolling in our tangible Brexit benefits.
I’m sure whatever deal is
I’m sure whatever deal is struck will be dismissed by the hardcore Europhiles regardless but yes, hopefully significant benefits with this trade deal and hopefully announcement shortly.
Rich_cb wrote:
Don’t mistake an honest appraisal of trade deals for being purely the product of “hardcore Europhiles”. I think you often make the mistake of taking the Govt. claims at face value and they most definitely hype up any slight improvement whilst dismissing the many drawbacks of any policy that they make.
The converse of that last
The converse of that last sentence is also true for government critics of course.
It’s easy to dismiss minor tweaks to existing trade deals and new deals that have large amounts of overlap with previous deals but a brand new FTA with the world’s most populous country wouldn’t be so easy to brush off.
I’m quite hopeful that this will be the first post Brexit blockbuster deal but only time will tell.
Rich_cb wrote:
I’m pretty sure that government critics have no need to exaggerate the complete shit-show that is “running” the country at the moment.
Cheaper petrochemical
Cheaper petrochemical products refined from Russian oil?
More cut-price gemstones? Cheaper generic medicines and rice might be good though.
Will it be easier for my local curry house to recruit skilled chefs? I wouldn’t object to that – although I’m not personally feeling there’s a shortage IIRC this is a complaint of the industry.
What might we be selling to India? Currently they still get their weapons from Russia. I’m thinking they’re well supplied on the IT front also. Old ships? Perhaps we could sell them good British Assam and Darjeeling tea?
chrisonatrike wrote:
I think it’s mainly whisky that we’ll be selling to them – I’m fairly sure that any trade deal with India will be far better for them than for us as they’re in a much stronger bargaining position and our “expert” negotiators haven’t got a great track record.
India is increasingly
India is increasingly emerging as a manufacturing centre.
Apple have recently announced the start of some iPhone production there as an example.
An FTA would hopefully bring real reductions in the prices of such goods whilst simultaneously reducing our reliance on China.
As for what we’d sell them, the obvious thing is services, we are a world leader in service exports and as India develops further the potential market for those services is absolutely enormous.
What is classed as a world
What is classed as a world leader? Top 2, Top 10? India are currently 7th in Service Exports so there might not be as big a market for it, and surely we would be importing more from them. I’m sure a big company like Infosys for example would want to muscle in on Services in the UK, especially as Trade Deals might allow them to do so cheaper then they currently do.
Top 2.
Top 2.
We export half as much again as India so there is a sizeable gap.
If we can benefit from cheaper service imports as well then that’s even more of a benefit.
Rich_cb wrote:
I’m sceptical that we’ll be providing many services to India. It’s far more likely that they’ll be providing a LOT of cut-price services to us. As I recall, one of their objectives is to get access to our IT industry so that they can directly provide lots of services (e.g. call centres, support services). The only reason that they’d be wanting to pay for expensive UK services is so that they can copy them and then undercut them.
Call centres will be almost
Call centres will be almost entirely replaced by AI within the next few years likewise a lot of other support roles.
Look at the job cuts planned at BT as an example of what’s coming down the line.
We have world leading legal and financial services both sectors would benefit enormously from access to one of the world’s fastest growing economies.
If Indian firms can provide services to UK consumers at lower costs then that is a benefit of free trade.
Rich_cb wrote:
Strange that you think that low skill call centres will be replaced by AI and yet the far more expensive legal and financial services won’t be. More likely to be the other way round as that saves companies far more money.
The lower cost services are unlikely to provide any benefit to UK consumers – that will only benefit the company owners.
Many more regulatory hurdles
Many more regulatory hurdles to replace a lawyer with AI than to replace a call centre worker.
I think all sectors will be impacted by AI but unfortunately customer service roles will likely bear the brunt initially.
Rich_cb wrote:
The easy way round regulatory hurdles is to get the AI to do the work and then just have a lawyer rubber stamp it. Also, there are plenty of examples of AI being used to do legal grunt work already – it’s arguably easier to get AI to write a bunch of similar legal documents than it is to get an AI to answer a phone call from a member of the public. There’s more cost savings to be had by replacing a team of lawyers with one (straight out of law school) lawyer that just uses AI to do all the work, than there is to replace call centre wage slaves with computers that probably cost more in electricity than the employees get.
Initially you’re still going
Initially you’re still going to need a highly experienced lawyer to sign AI generated stuff off as a newly qualified lawyer is likely to miss errors etc.
For large commercial deals and other similarly scaled legal services the consequences of drafting errors can easily run to multiple millions so I can’t see the very expensive lawyers losing their jobs anytime soon.
AI bots are already doing customer service for a lot of firms so widespread change looks both inevitable and imminent.
Im with Rich_cb on this one.
Im with Rich_cb on this one. AI is an enabling tool not a replacing tool. There is no way you can trust and AI even in a simple customer service role, let alone with commercial liablity.
Now obviously there is some cross over but our best use cases are always “free up” for more important tasks + AI doublechecking.
Rich_cb wrote:
That seems a bit optimistic that legal services will go for accuracy over profit. What’ll happen is that some MBA will bring in the AI service as a huge cost cutting improvement and will move onto another company before they get hit with the consequences. I’m not really seeing that India will spend vast sums of money on financial and legal services from the UK – why wouldn’t they just employ a few top people and harness their reputations to sell a much cheaper service than the UK can provide.
I suspect it would depend on
I suspect it would depend on the Legal business, but some Lawyer in America got ChatGPT to put his papers together and it picked out completely made up law cases. The other team raised it to the Judge that they couldn’t find them and so the Judge asked the initial lawyers to trace them. That was when they admitted what they had done.
How to Use ChatGPT to Ruin Your Legal Career – YouTube
I really hope it cited the
I really hope it cited the case of the twelve red-bearded dwarves and also Arkell v. Pressdram (1971).
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:
That’s almost exactly what I was thinking of. If people think that they can turn a quick profit by using AI/LLM then they’ll do that and hope that they don’t get caught out.
No, because those world
I’m sure some or all of the call centres will go – that’s been happening for time.
I’m not with you on the other side either because those world-leading legal and financial services are generating tons of money from dodgy or frankly corrupt companies and regimes (see Private Eye ad nauseam). The AI may need lots of training to be that bent while appearing legit!
I’ve no doubt the same lawyers who assisted (and continue to do so) folks wishing to use SLAPP tactics, or act as fronts for Russia, or financial concerns acting to launder funds will be interested in a large market in India. I suspect they may already be actively engaged there though.
OTOH I’ve no idea just what *fraction* of our legal and banking sector is questionable in this way. What we do know is that some of the largest firms are “at it”.
chrisonatrike wrote:
The usual process is to have experts start to provide the service and sell it to people whilst it’s being run well. Then they simply move the experts to a new different service and plug the old service into an AI system so that people pay top prices for a cut-price service.
Rich_cb wrote:
Not “world-beating”, as Boris the Liar would say?
But surely this briliant free trade also means that those apparently world leading services can move abroad as well. Particularly as some of these companies’ employees and contractors will be foreign nationals who may decide – or have already decided – that the UK economy is on a downward trajectory and that the growing resentment of foreigners/immigrants/refugees/non-white people since 2016 means they can take their skills (and likely superior education) with them to other countries… some of which may even be inside the EU. Sacre bleu!!
I have been told that Severn Trent Water are in the process of setting up a call centre/customer service facility in South Africa and that other firms are looking to do the same. So a good number of the employees in Shrewsbury and other STW sites can go fuck themselves while our water bills go up, and up, and up. And at the same time water quality continues to go down, and down, and down….
Aah, the wonders of privatisation and the benefits of Brexit blended into one inedible smoothie. Isn’t it great!
Not sure how Brexit has made
Not sure how Brexit has made it easier to move call centres to S.Africa?
Rich_cb wrote:
I didn’t say that. Brexit has resulted in a large number of people with a non-UK passport leaving this country to work elsewhere.
Call centres for banks other large organisations were already being relocated abroad a long time before Brexit. HSBC closed my local branch many years ago so I took my account elsewhere.
I remember discussions in the early & mid-90s about contracting out my department’s function (IT helpdesk, data backups etc for a high street brand) out to some supposedly ‘cheaper’ outfit. It failed mainly because as soon as they examined all the things we were required to do they very quickly realised that even a really skilled team, whether 100 or 1000 miles away, couldn’t possibly do half of what we did. Even if their staff were paid much less (although our wages were already very low) that company would still want to make a profit and charge the business a tidy sum for the service. But if the service quality was shit (or if the contractor pulled out at any point) the company could do nothing about it because they would have lost the experienced local staff they depended on.
Executives almost always undervalue the humans they hire but they themselves (and their remuneration) do not suffer as a result of such decisions.
Been there.
Been there. People cost money, get ill, have children, go on holiday, are lazy etc. Just reduce all of those “cost centres” (employ valuable consultants to do that) and presto – profits are up!
Didn’t we all think that
Didn’t we all think that Dilbert was funny as he joked about businesses behaving like this, then realised he was writing it straight when he outed his political beliefs in the last few years.
Simon E wrote:
Net migration must be down significantly.
Rich_cb wrote:
If the provision of said services involves large numbers of British workers losing their jobs then that’s not going to be much of a benefit, is it?
That’s the standard
That’s the standard protectionist line.
Free trade leads to lower prices, increased productivity and greater economic growth. That drives living standards higher.
Protectionism does the converse.
The average wage in India is
The average wage in India is around £5000 per year. No British company providing services will be able to compete with the prices people paying those salaries can offer. It’s no good just saying “that’s the standard protectionist line”, do you accept that opening up a free market to Indian services will involve British workers losing their jobs and if you do do you think that’s a price worth paying?
Yes and Yes.
Yes and Yes.
In much the same way that opening up to the EU led to the loss of British jobs.
What was the average wage in Poland when they joined?
I don’t know.
I don’t know.
So doing it in Poland was bad
So doing it in Poland was bad, but doing it in India is good. So what is the Brexit benefit again?
I didn’t say it was bad to
I didn’t say it was bad to allow Poland in to the EU. I was simply offering up Poland as interesting comparator.
If you supported free movement from countries such as Poland (with an average salary of £5k when they joined EU) it seems strange to oppose limited access to specified sections of the economy for Indian workers (with an average salary of £5k).
And I was just stating that
And I was just stating that we have endured the extra cost to the economy, plus the extra level of beauracracy travelling 21 miles across the sea (just a gentle reminder what the initial topic was, especially as you never commented on the Carnet posts but told someone else there were no facts in the article to support Brexit being a reason for the changes announced).
So the Benefits you have listed on this thread is that we can ship Lamb 12k miles across the sea instead of 21 miles across the sea, and we replace Poland with India for cheap wages IF businesses are moved there. I would also state that unless nefarious practices happened (I’m sure they did and still do), the movement of the person from Poland WOULD not mean they were on £5k annual wage (neither if an Indian came here).
The Aus/NZ deal is predicted by the Government to be less then 0.1 to GDP in 10 years time, which is when you did state we would see the benefits. The Pacific Pact is less then that, although I understand it might be more in hope that China joins it (remind me again that the Indian deal will help reduce reliance on China when the goverment is hoping China joins another trade deal). In fact the majority of our trade deals we have made are literally carbon copies of the ones made with the EU so with those, there was no actual benefit to leaving (although I suppose extra wages for the hirelings and lawyers to make the documents up. Is it a benefit when a government spends its money with private companies?)
And the one you are laying all the hopes on you actually have no idea what it contains. As the big stumbling block seems to be immigration (whispers of a schism in the cabinet over it, especially as Kemi has already ruled it out) then it would need to be a massive boost to the economy of the UK, (especially with yourself mentioning too much migration and it being one of Sunaks five cornerstones pledges) for it to include any migration and again actually be a benefit to “taking control”.
My point was that if the
My point was that if the carnet problems had genuinely made the road event untenable then how was the gravel event, which would require exactly the same paperwork, able to continue?
That strongly implies the problem was not just with the carnet despite the article implying that this was the overriding reason.
We’re still able to import lamb from the EU if we wish, we now have access to more NZ lamb which, even after accounting for shipping, is lower carbon than EU lamb.
I agree that no Polish worker could have been legally employed on £5k a year in the UK but that doesn’t mean there were no opportunities for outsourcing work to Poland. There are a lot of coding jobs now based in Eastern Europe as an example.
The UK definitely does not want China to join CPTPP and would almost certainly veto it as would Australia.
CPTPP is as much a geopolitical entity as it is a trading bloc, it’s designed to act as a bulwark against Chinese economic hegemony in the area. The ambition on both fronts is for the US to join, they were due to be a founding member until Trump nixed it.
I don’t have a problem with skilled migration, my department at work is full of highly qualified people from all over the world, I’d happily extend more Visas to Indian professionals.
India’s economy is likely to be comparable in size to the USA’s within a generation and is then predicted to surpass it, building closer economic ties now has the potential to reap enormous rewards in the future.
That was the point of Brexit from my perspective, it allows us to be far more ambitious on trade, to eschew protectionism in favour of growth.
If we can get the trade deal with India over the line then we’ll have taken a huge step towards making that a reality.
And yet you ignored multiple
And yet you ignored multiple times that the reason one can go ahead more easily and one is stuggling is the AMOUNT of paperwork needed to supply for taking 350 bikes compared to 20 (based on the 2022 videos, we can review number again once they post the 2023 up), especially as you need to get manufacturer, model , frame number, weight, purchase price and country of origin for each bike at a minimum. And if the Gravel ones are as low as that, they might just tell riders that they need to travel with their own bike their and back rather then the seperate bike transport that is offered on the road ones previously. We shall see when they announce details of any significant changes
And as I mentioned previously, they run two other similar rides in Italy and one in South Africa which are going ahead fine with the only difference being cyclists do travel with their own bike (or hire one at the destination). So but gravel argument is easily debunked. So where one event that needs carnets is being canned (although other reasons are also mentioned in the press release and both articles) and two other EU events which don’t need them are going on with no changes, the extra Brexit requirement probably do have an impact.
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:
If they can run similar events in a way that would not require carnets that also suggests that the carnets weren’t the decisive factor.
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:
TAKING BACK CONTROL!
BLUE PASSPORTS!
Rich_cb wrote:
Did it?
how do you explain the massive prosperity increase of the country during the EU years followed by economic decline following brexit?
Are you arguing that no
Are you arguing that no British jobs were ever lost to the EU at any point?
Rich_cb wrote:
Shurely only possible before we joined or after we left? Unless you mean “to other countries in the EU”?
I guess this just shows for many in the UK the dividing line was very hard not to see.
Odd that some cannot see the Irish sea but can see the Channel. (Though I suspect that e.g. going for a visit across the former is much more popular than the latter.) Mind you it’s only 12 miles to the island of Ireland at the closest point… EDIT for pedantry yes, this is the North Channel…
Rendel Harris wrote:
Alarmist nonsense, will never happen. And if it does it’s because those British workers simply chose not to do those jobs to pursue more profitable alternatives, or were not productive so were holding us back.
chrisonatrike wrote:
Sir Humphrey Appleby : Then we follow the four-stage strategy.
Bernard Woolley : What’s that?
Sir Richard Wharton : Standard Foreign Office response in a time of crisis.
Sir Richard Wharton : In stage one we say nothing is going to happen.
Sir Humphrey Appleby : Stage two, we say something may be about to happen, but we should do nothing about it.
Sir Richard Wharton : In stage three, we say that maybe we should do something about it, but there’s nothing we *can* do.
Sir Humphrey Appleby : Stage four, we say maybe there was something we could have done, but it’s too late now.
Tell me about those lower
Tell me about those lower prices, do – cheaper food was one of the many lies told in the run-up to the ballot. Weekly shopping trolley attached, up £15 per week from June 2022 (Sky NEWS). £900, it’s cost me, and counting. I know you’ll tell me it’s a global thing, but we’re ahead of the Eurozone and it feels like we’re struggling more broadly.
Glad I’m not myself a borrower – any new receipts there look like they’re already swallowed-up.
What an increasingly unwell and drab country we are becoming now for many people; people who are already low, dogs and cats are paying the price. I don’t see a deal with India perking up this lot. Rejoin the SM and CU would be a atart.
Perhaps it’s time for me to bring Deliveroo to my village? There’s only the fish & chip shop at the moment.
Over-50s looking for work should think about delivering takeaways, minister says
Job-seekers over 50 should consider delivering takeaways, the work and pensions secretary has said.
Soaring mortgage costs affecting mental health of almost third of people
New research reveals that around a third of people in England and Wales have attributed a significant decline in their mental health to the substantial increase in mortgage costs in the past year.
Nearly four in 10 people living with existing mental health problems said the rising costs had worsened their struggles.
The UK’s prominent mental health charity, Mind, noted a remarkable 55% surge in inquiries to its Infoline over the past 18 months, largely related to financial hardships like welfare issues, unemployment concerns, and personal debt.
Conducted with Censuswide, the charity’s survey involved 3,015 participants in England and Wales during March and April, predating the recent decision by the Bank of England to raise interest rates from 5% to 5.25% in its pursuit of curbing inflation – an action that will add pressure to mortgage holders.
Mind’s survey indicates that roughly 29% of respondents were affected by the experience or knowledge of mounting mortgage expenses in the past year, with 10% noting a substantial impact on their mental well-being.
Cost of living crisis leads to ‘fun deficit’ in Scotland
The soaring cost of living crisis has led to a significant “fun deficit” in Scotland, prompting people to sacrifice their cherished social interactions, hobbies, and even beloved pets.
Recent research revealed that a considerable number of people are forgoing activities that add value to life due to financial struggles.
According to a YouGov survey conducted for Citizens Advice Scotland (CAS), 41% of respondents have quit some form of social engagement, such as dining out, in the past financial year.
Moreover, 23% have given up certain hobbies, and around 3% (137,000 people) have been forced to part with their pets. An additional statistic showed that some 36% of Scots couldn’t afford a holiday.
– as predicted by Remain, we’re going back to the pre EU bad old days of my early childhood, aren’t we: there was a holiday – one week at a holiday camp, a few days in a b&b or a chalet and we almost never, through the year, ate out.
https://news.sky.com/story/cost-of-living-latest-rent-soars-by-fifth-in-some-parts-of-england-mortgage-rate-hikes-worsen-mental-health-12615118
Rich_cb wrote:
There are still very considerable stumbling blocks with a UK-India FTA, particularly regarding the matter of worker migration. Last time I looked the Indian side at least were saying it was highly unlikely to be signed off before the Indian elections of spring 2024 and then it could all be up in the air again. Meanwhile the EU is negotiating its own deal with India which is also facing stumbling blocks, particularly in the area of medical patents, but if it comes off one would naturally expect, given the massively bigger market to which it would give India access, it to be on much more favourable terms than any India would grant in any single nation deal.
India and the EU have been
India and the EU have been negotiating, on and off, since 2007 (IIRC).
I wouldn’t hold your breath for a swift resolution of the issues at hand.
I’ve read that they hope to announce the UK India deal during Sunak’s upcoming visit to India for the G20. They were apparently incredibly close to sign off last year, the announcement was due to take place on Diwali.
Given both sides face imminent elections they will both be motivated to have a major deal to trumpet.
Rich_cb wrote:
Well, last week the UK Government ended their statement regarding the end of round eleven of negotiations with “The twelfth round of negotiations is due to take place in the coming months.” Given that the G20 is just over a month away either they’re deliberately hiding their massive success from us in order to spring a big surprise or it’s not happening.
The previous round of talks
The previous round of talks concluded in June, then this most recent round concluded in July.
It’s not unreasonable to assume a further round could be concluded before September, if that were the final round then it would be possible for the deal to be announced at the G20 summit in India.
It’s all speculation untill it’s actually announced of course.
Indeed, time will tell. This
Indeed, time will tell. This Indian report certainly seems sanguine as to the chances of success but also states “both sides are looking at concluding talks by the end of the year.”
Report confirms 12th round of
Report confirms 12th round of talks in early August which would leave space for a 13th round immediately prior to the G20.
19/26 areas signed off so looks like it’s getting pretty close.
Hmmm…if after 12 rounds 25%
Hmmm…if after 12 rounds 25% is left still to be agreed on the chances of all of that being signed off in one go would seem unlikely, particularly as it’s most likely the most contentious matters that remain. I’ll be happy to be proved wrong.
That’s assuming no progress
That’s assuming no progress on the remaining areas to date.
It’s more likely that each area is someway along the route to sign off so the remaining work is much less than 25%.
Could be possible in 2 meetings with the final meeting coinciding with G20.
We’ll have to wait and see but definitely positive that both sides are still targeting sign off this year.
Let’s say the India trade
Let’s say the India trade deal does indeed slot nicely into place. It won’t make Brexit worthwhile.
If I cut off all my fingers
If I cut off all my fingers and then have one sewn back on to the back of my knee…does that count as an overall benefit?
Probably not but might stop
Probably not but might stop you posting nonsensical stuff on the interwebs.
Definitely worth a try.
Closing people down isn’t
Closing people down isn’t making the Brexit case really, is it?
That was funny though…
That was funny though…
Not sure if you are replying
Not sure if you are replying to my first reply or second. But my second reply states several reasons why the paperwork needed for 300 bikes can build up and cause issues where paperwork for 50 might not be as bad. (As well as other business reasons).
Easy enough to see the difference in group sizes in the videos at the bottom of this page.
https://www.hotchillee.com/events/london-paris-road/
The gravel bikes will,
The gravel bikes will, presumably, need the exact same paperwork as any road bikes.
Is the gravel ride limited to a lower number than the road ride?
Could the road ride not have been split into smaller groups for custom purposes?
Is the whole Brexit angle being rather over-egged?
The video shows numbers on
The video shows numbers on the road compared to the admittedly inaugural gravel ride last year. There might be more on the gravel this year but as I have already posted, the gravel event happening anyway is currently a red herring.
As for splitting the rides. They used to split them on the road between racing and riding groups. However ferry travel and hotels were for all people. The point of this L2P used to be for the ability to cycle the TdF finish route on the Saturday and to be in Paris for the Sunday.
Who knows, the new format they hinted at might be smaller groups or multiple runs a year without the TdF.
As for your last question. Maybe someone more knowledgeble on the paperwork needed can confirm that having to provide an ATA Carnet to be completed for each bike including all bike details; manufacturer, model , frame number, weight, purchase price and country of origin is just overegging an angle. Of course then you have to hope that the person booked turns up on the same bike, they have the same equipment fitted, they turn up at all, they don’t have a medical episode AND customs don’t decide to do a spot check on the bikes against the Carnet. The new format might even be you have to travel there and back with your own bike as a solo traveller as you shouldn’t need a carnet then either as for ease of use, they currently supply vehicles to transport the bikes across on the ferry and then return transport for the bikes whilst riders fly or Eurotunnel back.
It is inconvenient when the
It is inconvenient when the Brexit facts contradict your Brexit ideology, isn’t it? I almost feel sorry for you.
If someone is still defending
If someone is still defending Brexit, then they must be deriving some satisfaction from it. Since they cannot name anything that is better in Life for Brexit, that only leaves their taking some kind of twisted revenge on the world.
It’s inconvenient when, under
It’s inconvenient when, under a story in which the facts very much contradict the anti Brexit narrative, you try to make a point about facts.
Keep on trying, one day you’ll put a coherent argument together.
Like
Like
where are my Brexit benefits
?
I’ve tried to engage and have
I’ve tried to engage and have a debate in good faith.
You refuse to acknowledge any of the posts I’ve made clearly outlining benefits from Brexit. I even made sure the benefits I highlighted were cycling specific so as to be most likely to benefit the reader of a cycling website in a further effort to engage in a good faith debate.
You clearly aren’t interested in such a debate and just wish to troll.
I won’t be engaging with any of your posts on Brexit in the future.
What facts have contradicted
What facts have contradicted the AB Narrative that part of the reason they are changing the road format is because of extra paperwork now needed for Brexit?
I have also pointed out why a Carnet for 350 bikes is adding loads of paperwork compared to prior to brexit. (Plus the risk that an over-enthusiatic border person might want to account for all the bikes against the carnet which they have also raised as a potential issue). Hirsute has also pointed out a twitter thread from someone who had to list 350 items to account for the seperate supplies for a scouts trip. Where are your facts that either of these are wrong?
Instead you have picked on a throwaway line about a different event they run that has considerably less bikes to transport so less paperwork to fumble with.
Edit: They also run events in Italy and South Africa which no changes have been announced about as of time of writing. Neither of those have any need for Carnets as the bikes are transported to them by the riders. My personal theory on the format change will be that the ride will start in (Nice/ Bordeaux/ Lyon) and the riders will need to travel with their own bikes to the starting route.
It’s the exact same paperwork
It’s the exact same paperwork for the gravel event.
If it were the paperwork that’s led to the demise of the event then how can the gravel event continue?
If it’s the size of the road event that’s the issue then splitting the group into groups that are sized similarly to the gravel groups would surely solve the issue.
Blaming Brexit paperwork for the end of the event whilst a similar event that requires the exact same paperwork continues doesn’t make a whole lot of sense.
The fact that the gravel event can continue contradicts the assertion that the paperwork makes the event impossible.
Is the Arch to Arc still on?
Is the Arch to Arc still on?
I’ve still not finished the
I’ve still not finished the Birmingham to Mandalay road race. I got lost after getting stuck at temporary traffic lights near Edgbaston.
Oh, you’re nearly there!
Oh, you’re nearly there! Right at the one-eyed yellow idol to the north of Khatmandu, once you get to the old Moulmein Pagoda, looking lazy at the sea – you’re on the road to Mandalay.
I was thinking about taking a
I was thinking about taking a shortcut through the leafy Essex lanes and then on to the great wall of China.Via Preston.
Have you been to Essex?
Have you been to Essex? Horrible, backwater of a place.
As to Preston…. its railway station is the only place a pigeon has tried to mug me for my bike!
Hang on – I thought Essex was
Hang on – I thought Essex was a crime free utopia where undesirables were turned away at the border and speckled unicorns roamed free. Have I been misinformed?
That’s the “real” Essex,
That’s the “real” Essex, inhabited solely by people with an FTP of 320 who have a merit at grade 4 piano and were milk monitor at school at least twice. I was informed long ago on here by someone who for some reason no longer seems to be around, can’t recall the name, that the belt of nasty Barratt homes inhabited by minor gangsters, local radio weather forecasters and accountants who don’t have the talent to make it in London isn’t the “real” Essex but, and I quote, “Just an outlier of London where its poison has seeped out into the counties.”
essexian wrote:
It was in a hurry to get home.
I am sure wtjs has some
I am sure wtjs has some advice on how to report the incident to the finest members of Lancashire’s Constabulary
essexian wrote:
Tried? In Preston? That was a dove, mate. If a Preston pigeon had ‘tried’ to mug you, you’d have stayed mugged and he’d have had it on Gumtree before you could board a train to Carnforth!
Aren’t you supposed to start
Aren’t you supposed to start on the dock of Tiger Bay?
Who would have thought that
Who would have thought that self imposing barriers to free movement (and trade, education, investment etc) with one’s closet neighbours would inflict costs and extra bureaucracy? I mean, all that EU ‘red tape’ of just turn up at Dover, get on the train/ferry and get off at the other end was such a pain when now one can sit in a queue for hours chatting with the lorry drivers and coach passengers waiting to get a passport stamp or to defecate in port-a-loo, fill in a carnet, make sure the bike is packed in a bag for customs check, wait for the customs officer to check it (and all the others) . . . . . that’s proper fun now.
The Brexiters seem to be
The Brexiters seem to be almost universally the types to hark back to the good old days of the war and the 1950s, do you think maybe they decided that what Britons needed was to go back to an era where you had to queue up for hours for virtually everything, thereby putting some much-needed stoicism and backbone back into the British character?
The Brexiteers look back at
The Brexiteers look back at the 1950s with rose coloured glasses. By modern standards those times were pretty awful. The good thing about the 1950s were that they were a lot better than the war period of the 1940s and a lot better than the extreme poverty of the depression era 1930s.
The UN and WEF thank you for
The UN and WEF thank you for your service and unpaid advocacy on this issue. 4th booster shot queue on the right, feel free to eat some bugs from the bowl, thank you.
Roulereo wrote:
The manufacturers of Bacofoil thank you for yours.
The non stick Bacofoil is
The non stick Bacofoil is incredible stuff. But I think he’s on the cheap stuff that rips too easily, the rays appear to be getting through…
I don’t know what you are
I don’t know what you are talking about. But then again I don’t think you do either.
The fact that the gravel
The fact that the gravel version is continuing makes this quote a bit ridiculous:
The gravel one is running
The gravel one is running next year the same as the road one is running next year.
No mention of the year after for Gravel yet.
It says in the article that
It says in the article that the gravel version will continue.
I’m assuming that meant beyond 2024.
The wording is very vague
The wording is very vague though and can be interpreted lots of ways. Their press relases just states
Cyclingnews states
So neither currently states what they are doing about the gravel, just that it is still happening at the moment.
For someone who normally doesn’t just jump onto assumptions…….
The last quote definitely
The last quote definitely implies that the gravel event is continuing after the road event stops.
If they were both stopping then they’dsurely make that clear?
“will aim to continue”. In
“will aim to continue”. In theory the wording is correct as well as it is 2 months after the road event so that would be ended when the next gravel event happens.
That would be a very strange
That would be a very strange way to word it if they were only referring to the 2 month gap.
The most reasonable assumption based on the information we have is that the gravel event is intended to keep running.
It is also not a direct quote
It is also not a direct quote from the official company either.
Rich_cb wrote:
“gravel” mark up means events cost double road events, which gives budget for all the cross border admin.
Cartnets are great
Carnets are great
https://twitter.com/steve_way/status/1685210342459072512
Can’t read your thread on
Can’t read your thread on Shitter as not a subscriber, only get served the intro post… So if you cover this on Dimmer, I’ve already got my excuse in.
While I can appreciate that a carnet is a pain in the arse, surely having to pay excise on it again at the border would be an even bigger pain in the arse?
Isn’t that what happened to that (Welsh?) charity ride?
Accuracy will be your friend, so whoever has told you to make the corrections, is doing it out of your best interest.
Yes, Brexit is a shit cake with double diarrhea icing.
“Total cost £600 plus freight
“Total cost £600 plus freight ferry tickets. Total mandays to research the process, sort the load, complete the paperwork, get the physical documents & wait at various customs facilities – 9. It used to be a case of load the van and go!”
Not my twitter thread by the way – Stephen Way is the author.
Hirsute wrote:
Not sure why the author mentions this, a 3.5t van is always going to be freight on the channel crossing.
In his larger thread he
In his larger thread he states
So I believe it is an addendum for people who have never taken a large van before that it comes under freight even if not actually taking goods to sell.
Fried Breakfast = Brexit
Fried Breakfast = Brexit Benefit…have you told Frosty and his gang?
Hirsute wrote:
“We hold all the cards”?
Seven two off…
Seven two off…?
ktache wrote:
Had to Google that!
Is it a cricket score?
Is it a cricket score?