Welcome to Friday’s live blog, with Jack Sexty, Alex Bowden and the rest of the team.
Live blog: Trying to take a very expensive bike on a GWR train is hard work; Torq’s “extra messy” Brexit Bars; Cavendish signs for Bahrain Merida; Froome, Fuglsang and Bardet recce Japan Olympics course + more
All today’s news from the site and beyond…
Fri, Oct 25, 2019 19:02
SUMMARY
25 October 2019, 19:02
Unbe-leafable...
25 October 2019, 19:02
Struggle with finding your balance on the rollers?
The nutcases at Dafne Fixed and this tractor driver with a forklift have a very practical solution for you.
25 October 2019, 19:02
Teenager who rode through Brighton Asda fined for dangerous cycling
A teenager who was part of a group of youths that cycled through an Asda store in Brighton has been fined £440 for dangerous cycling and £440 for using threatening or abusive words.
25 October 2019, 19:02
Drones warning drivers of hazards ahead would provide a "sixth sense" says Seat
Car manufacturer Seat is working on a system where drones would detect potential hazards in the road and transmit alerts to drivers. The technology could be used in areas with poor visibility, says the firm.
25 October 2019, 19:02
Cavendish officially signs for Bahrain-Merida
He’s followed the McLaren story. Now it’s time for him to write his own chapter.
— McLaren (@McLarenF1) October 25, 2019
It’s been in the rumour mill for a while now, but it’s finally official that Ca is off to Bahrain Merida. he said in a statement: “Joining this team is the fulfilment of a long-held ambition for me… and is super exciting and motivating. You could even say a dream come true. Having worked closely with McLaren in the past, and seen the benefits of their technology and processes, this was an opportunity I jumped at. My relationship with Rod goes way back, and he’s been instrumental in helping me develop as a rider and a person. I can’t wait to join my new teammates and do everything I can to help us achieve the successes I know will come.”
25 October 2019, 19:02
Australia’s mandatory helmet laws "have become a tool of disproportionate penalties and aggressive policing" say researchers
Australia’s mandatory helmet laws have become an exercise in revenue gouging and have also provided a flimsy pretext for police to stop and search people, according to researchers.
25 October 2019, 19:02
New York to welcome cyclists with a ‘green wave’ through traffic lights
Cyclists in New York are to benefit from ‘green wave’ traffic light phasing that will give them priority over motor vehicles. Cyclists who travel at 10-15mph on streets where the speed limit is 25mph will catch a wave of green lights, while drivers (and cyclists) who go faster than 15mph will hit red lights.
25 October 2019, 19:02
This calls for a poll...
25 October 2019, 19:02
Extra messy...
Why wait until April Fool’s Day, when every day is a bit of a joke at the moment? That appears to be the mentality of energy food brand Torq, who have unveiled their special Brexit bar made out of 52% crispy leaves and 48% succulent remainsins. Torq told us: “The bars are formulated by TORQ’s Performance Nutrition team to give the UK population the energy they need to cope with the stresses and strains of the Brexit process. These bars can be purchased by our European friends too, as long as we are able to ship them before the 31st of October, or they might get held up in customs…
“The ‘Organic Hellfire & Brimstone’ flavour and ‘Extra Messy’ formulation is bittersweet and complex – and we’ve almost finalised the recipe, we just need to get it signed off by the TORQ Brexit Committee. We’re taking pre-orders now and we might deliver before 31st October, or we might not ever deliver at all, we’re not quite sure at the moment!”
Of course Torq are just having us on really, and this whole thing was really to draw attention to a special offer on their Explore Flapjacks (*cough cough* #DesperateMarketing *cough cough*)… buy before the October 31st Brexit deadline, and you get a 10% discount and a free bag of Torq Press Coffee. Take advantage of the deal here.
25 October 2019, 19:02
And we've arrived.
I alight at Bath Spa, having smashed the system and got the bike to work without damaging the wheels as GWR seemingly would like me to. Bear in mind this was not a peak service, and I’d question whether I’d have managed to sneak on a train that left a couple of hours earlier without a reservation, that I’m not actually able to make anyway.
road.cc reviews usually use a star-based system, but I’ve introduced another category especially for the purposes of reviewing GWR’s bike storage (opinions my own, not necessarily representative of my employer). Until next time!
25 October 2019, 19:02
Bike compartment? Bin
It’s become apparent the bike storage compartments on these trains simply aren’t very good at storing bikes. Although, they do seem to be pretty useful for harbouring used bottles and coffee cups.
25 October 2019, 19:02
What even is this??
25 October 2019, 19:02
Trying to use the bike storage
The poor bloke I beat to get on the train is now trying to correctly load his into the other storage section next to another bike, a Carrera mtb. I attempt to help, but it becomes quite obvious that there’s no chance both are going to fit.
We wait with our incorrectly stored steeds, hoping a conductor doesn’t come past. Meanwhile, the Carrera has fallen off its hook.
25 October 2019, 19:02
Getting away with it
I arrive at the station, the announcement tells us where first class will be situated on the 10am train to London Paddington, but not where the bike spaces will be. I spy another fella with a full-sized bike, who will become my nemesis for the next couple of minutes while we try to correctly guess which carriage we should stand in front of.
I get lucky and spot the bike sign on the outside of the carriage early (only added to the trains a couple of months ago), and jump in a queue behind a family with a considerable amount of luggage. The train pulls in, and they attempt to stick their luggage in the bike compartments. I roll up behind, they retreat, it’s awkward. Not to worry though, they can take advantage of the really really spacious luggage compartments in the seating area…
As you can see in the previous pic, my bike isn’t hooked up vertically as GWR suggest I do… because my rims won’t fit through the hooks, and in any case, that’s about two grand’s worth of Enve that I’m not about to damage by forcing it through a bit of metal.
25 October 2019, 19:02
So far so good...
I begin by booking my ticket with GWR’s app, which conveniently tends to be a bit crashy when I’m in a hurry.
Wanna book a bike space? No problem! Except it is… the app tells us I’m unable to reserve a bicycle at this time, and after doing some digging I discover that on local journeys, bikes can be taken on the trains on a first come, first served basis. Not knowing if the spaces are all reserved or not, I head to the station with my ticket booked which I may or may not be able to use.
25 October 2019, 19:02
Taking a bike on a Great Western Railway train: a live blog experience
Afternoon, Jack here! You may have seen the news that Scotrail will be introducing new carriages with spaces for up to 20 bikes soon, much to the joy of cyclists who use the Scottish rail network – although some folk on social media claimed certain other train operators have got a lot to learn with their own bike storage facilities.
To assess said bike storage with one of these train companies who have come in for some criticism, I caught the 10am Great Western Railway train from Bristol Temple Meads to Bath Spa, to get a very lovely Argon 18 gravel bike with a snazzy Rotor 13 speed groupset to road.cc towers without getting it dirty. With stress levels now down a bit, I’m in the office and have documented events so you can see what you’re in for if you decide to do the same. The cards are ordered top to bottom so scroll down for more…
25 October 2019, 19:02
Re our train rant from this morning...
This is totally unacceptable @GWRHelp – what is the point of having a bike reservation when you allow luggage to be stored in the same place? Poor bike underneath has been damaged by the weight of all these bags and there is no room at all for my bike pic.twitter.com/knxT1siuWs
— Saddles & Paddles (@SadPadExeter) October 25, 2019
It seems whoever owns this bike wasn’t so lucky in persuading other passengers to avoid using the cycle storage for their bags. See below for our experience on the 10am service from Bristol Temple Meads to Bath Spa this morning.
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Jack has been writing about cycling and multisport for over a decade, arriving at road.cc via 220 Triathlon Magazine in 2017. He worked across all areas of the website including tech, news and video, and also contributed to eBikeTips before being named Editor of road.cc in 2021 (much to his surprise). Jack has been hooked on cycling since his student days, and currently has a Trek 1.2 for winter riding, a beloved Bickerton folding bike for getting around town and an extra beloved custom Ridley Helium SLX for fantasising about going fast in his stable. Jack has never won a bike race, but does have a master’s degree in print journalism and two Guinness World Records for pogo sticking (it’s a long story).
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Latest Comments
Gkam84 11 minutes ago
I cannot edit my post; the need for a clear distinction between the two is not for semantics, but for those of us who are convoy drivers, who are licensed for that role. We take it very seriously and can incur fines and punishment from the UCI for wrongdoing. Those in front, in the caravan, are just normal everyday drivers and do not have the experience of driving in a race convoy, sometimes at speed, with riders all around us. Therefore, should not be taking risks on any part of the route.
Gkam84 14 minutes ago
Your wording on this needs to be clear, you've mixed up two different parts of the race. The vehicle was from the publicity caravan (Out in front of the race), similar to what you get at the Tour de France, they throw out merchandise to roadside fans, but later in the article, you say "Tour du Rwanda’s official convoy". The convoy on a UCI race is the vehicles which travel behind the race "in convoy" which include the team cars, officals cars, neutral service...etc. You need to have clear distinction between the two. This was not a convoy vehicle, it was a caravan vehicle.
Rome73 42 minutes ago
“when the government confirmed that Nottinghamshire County Council will receive £6.7 million for active travel over the next four years, with part of this funding to be used to repair the greenway” Wow - 6.7 million for the WHOLE council for a WHOLE four years for active travel. And once this one shared route has been repaired and the barriers paid for, there could be a WHOLE five million left for the rest of the county. For four years! Astonishingly generous. Imagine how much excellent infrastructure they will build.
Rendel Harris 1 hour ago
Standard journalist protection against any possible action for libel or defamation when mentioning any accusation that hasn't been proven in court. Obviously it's pretty unlikely that an unidentified person (it doesn't even say in which country the incident occurred) would be taking legal action over this but it's good practice always to include it. While there is no reason to believe Swenson has made up the story there are always different perspectives: the driver or passenger might well claim that the door was already open before he arrived and he wasn't paying attention. Unless/until a case is proved in court or by admission it remains an allegation and so it's safest to add the "allegedly" proviso.
cmedred 2 hours ago
Swenson was hit by "a motorist’s car door, which was 'allegedly' swung open into his path." Allegedly swung open? Is there some reason to believe Swenson is making up this story?
RayG 7 hours ago
And to show the sleeves with the dummy in the riding position.
RayG 7 hours ago
The people who would listen to them aren't much of the problem. What're needed are for [insert high profile sportsball people of your choice] to do this.
mark1a 10 hours ago
Get some help you tedious fool.
Backladder 11 hours ago
No, now everybody can see the space after your opening bracket!
Backladder 11 hours ago
What he means is there's nowhere to park all day for free! Morrisons has a 2 hour limit and the shopping centre is pay and display.
25 thoughts on “Live blog: Trying to take a very expensive bike on a GWR train is hard work; Torq’s “extra messy” Brexit Bars; Cavendish signs for Bahrain Merida; Froome, Fuglsang and Bardet recce Japan Olympics course + more”
I hope Grayson’s got some
I hope Grayson’s got some good trouser clips, if he’s planning to wear that outfit on his bike!
Good to see Cav beating top
Good to see Cav beating top class opposition again. Doing it on the road next year is a different proposition but here’s hoping,…
jasecd wrote:
… indeed, but maybe that was putting a marker down saying “2020 Madison….” ?
jasecd wrote:
Agree that it’s a little different on the track, but the confidence of performing well, and the fact that it should help inspire team mates to work for him could be an added bonus. Cav seems to have more speed enurance than in the past (a part of getting older perhaps) a slightly lower top speed but he seems to be able to keep it going for a long time.
The Madison at the olympics really could be an exciting event with some of the riders that may well be targetting it
I did wonder why Jack had
I did wonder why Jack had gone Retro with a set of Smoke Lites until I read the full blog post.
Although maybe a set in 700c or 650b for the gravel generation isnt such a bad concept – they were great all rounders in their day?
At an old skool skinny 1.9″ they’ll probably fit a lot of gravel and adventure bike frames – at least at 650b.
Secret_squirrel wrote:
I’ve changed the lead pic… although I’m sure the Carrera is very valuable to someone!
The thing that becomes
The thing that becomes obvious when being on the newish GWR trains is that they were essentially picked for a single purpose which is cramming as many commuting sardines (I am one of them) in during the morning and evening rush hours. Hence the reduced luggage space and the reduced bike spaces.
Which just goes to show how short sighted that policy was now that more and more people are working from home, especially on a friday, when all the but absolute core peak trains are half empty.
Gawd knows what the poor tourists must think of them.
And dont get me started on the random mix of paper and electronic seat reservations going on….
The trick to using the train
The trick to using the train ‘bike cupboards’ is to hang one bike front wheel up ( the one on the inside) and the one next to it, front wheel down, and to slacken off the stems on the bikes, and turn the bars, so that they fit in properly, then re tighten the stems. Unfortunately, that is a bit of a faff, and ideally you need to have done that bit, before the train arrives. Another way to do it is to leave the stems alone, and remove the bars, and hang them on the frame of the bike. The problem is that if they fall off the frame and start flapping about, it gets interesting. I tend to carry some gaffer tape, if I know I’m using one of these trains. You can use the black loop thing, in one of the pictures to hang the bars of the bike with its front wheel down, on.
I used a South West train
I used a South West train with one of the bike areas shown at the top of the page here: https://totalwomenscycling.com/commuting/commute-bicycle-train
Rubbish really because the wheel holders are too wide for 25mm tyres, and too narrow for 2 inchers. Also the front wheel has to be at an angle for the two outer bikes, and all three bikes bash against each other during acceleration and braking. I spent the short journey stood holding onto my bike (should have just ridden that 18 miles!).
A straight forward wheel bracket against a wall and straps to secure around the seatpost to prevent movement would be better use of the same space.
Judge, that’d be a bit like
Judge, that’d be a bit like having a great big spring sticking out of the seat and suggesting Joe Public carry a hoist to lower yourself onto it…
Our intrepid bike and train
Our intrepid bike and train correspondent has misunderstood when he says GWR does not require reservations on local services. This actually refers to the type of train (rolling stock) not the distance travelled. Reservations are required for all journeys on the new! shiny! fast! electric (except when running on diesel)! IETs, even just from Bristol to Bath. On the (generally smaller) trains, which have bike accommodation consisting of either tip-up seating or wheelbenders in the corridor, reservations are not required even if travelling from Bristol to Didcot or, say, Exeter to Worcester (which would require at least two, probably three, trains, but is doable by small trains all the way if not in a hurry).
Bmblbzzz wrote:
This is why trains are rubbish. Who is supposed to know all this?!
David Arthur @davearthur
Especially as its nigh impossible to look up the type of train beforehand online.
Secret_squirrel wrote:
Especially as its nigh impossible to look up the type of train beforehand online.— David Arthur @davearthur
Well my simple rule of thumb would be anything that ends up in London going from Bristol,isnt going to be considered a ‘local service’, so just avoid those trains.
Bmblbzzz wrote:
I haven’t misunderstood, they’ve just chosen not to tell me surely? When I tried to book it on, the app just said no without explanation.
Jack Sexty wrote:
Our intrepid bike and train correspondent has misunderstood when he says GWR does not require reservations on local services. This actually refers to the type of train (rolling stock) not the distance travelled. Reservations are required for all journeys on the new! shiny! fast! electric (except when running on diesel)! IETs, even just from Bristol to Bath. On the (generally smaller) trains, which have bike accommodation consisting of either tip-up seating or wheelbenders in the corridor, reservations are not required even if travelling from Bristol to Didcot or, say, Exeter to Worcester (which would require at least two, probably three, trains, but is doable by small trains all the way if not in a hurry).
— Jack Sexty I haven’t misunderstood, they’ve just chosen not to tell me surely? When I tried to book it on, the app just said no without explanation.— Bmblbzzz
Not quite right.
1) you can only reserve a bike space on a train that has seat reservations. This is a fudge to deliver the service without having a massively expensive job on the rather old National Rail ticket sales system, which pre-dates (ie written in base code!) the modern ability to add and patch software.
2) bike spaces are virtual seats, in an imaginary coach X, which are allocated to a journey ticket … in an illegal transaction, as the system is set out to only allow ONE seat reservation per ticket/trip. Hence some staff/call centres struggle where they are not trained/frequently making bike reservations. (and there us no % payment for doing this for independent resellers like Trainline)
NB there could be a way that bike spaces, wheelchair spaces, and even passenger loading details for every train COULD be provided, linked to the every train’s unique identity, tracked through the railway’s own systems (TRUST) and fed out with the Customer Information System (CIS) feed (DARWIN – currently v.16, or a successor in development). This system is available as open data to licensed developers (IT-nerds) who are already delivering very useful apps like Real Time Trains, and Open Train Times (Watch that space?)
3) no seat reservation for part of journey = no bike reservation & similar algorithm I suspect for local journeys even where the trains have seat reservations. Split the bike reservations, and suddenly spaces appear!
We ‘tested’ the IEP mock up in 2014 with #CyclingUK members and various bikes, and have a current project with LNER and Hitachi to sort issues out on their Azuma fleet, noting that the interior layout and arrangements for Agility Trains (Hitachi with Bankers) to supply a contracted number of trains for service every day, was largely specified by DfT. This is unravelling rather badly as the trains are now having to operate in the real world where flexibility is required, rather than with a rigid fixed (maximum) seating specification.
Between 2014 and 2019 we made comments on the design, although it was very much a Blue Peter consultation, as the basic design was pretty much not for changing. We asked for that *??1* fold-down bar to get taken out (this was refused) as this really gets in the way – even for bikes that can be hooked in.
However it seems to be that a design change, made AFTER we tested the bike module with a variety of bikes (including a tandem, a recumbent, and a sit up and beg Raleigh) – the easy to load design was replaced with a hideous and totally unnecessary hook.
@jacksexty please e-mail me (or #CyclingUK) with your photos – to add to out portfolio on IEP woes. See also the albums on my A V Lowe Flickr account covering the abominations which have been delivered for the IEP, Scotrail Class 156, Scotrail HST’s (IC7), CrossCountry and Virgin WC Voyagers, an the new Caledonian Sleeper. This is a topic on the agendas of the All Party Parliamentary Cycling Group (#APPCG), and the Cycle Rail Working Group (#CRWG)
Happy to work with/for those progresssing cycling WITH rail and bus services just contact me direct
Picture = easy to load – 2014 design of IEP ‘hooks’
A V Lowe wrote:
I suspect even those hooks may struggle to fit around aero rims or x-large tyres. Surely a couple of pieces of velcro would be far more flexible (literally) although they may need replacing every so often. The other alternative would be to allow the metal hooks to pivot.
hawkinspeter wrote:
A system with this design has been used, and works for almost every type of cycle (including tandems & most trikes), both vertically and near horiziontal, on trains, trams, and buses, for over 30 years – it also uses the weight of the cycle to hold it square to the bracket, and not swing around, with both tyres pressed against the wall/floor.
Despite my efforts to persuade rail industry to use this proven system, they screw it up by designing something new every time!
My only successes putting slots in the panel behind seats next to bike space = extra 6″ & holds wheel at 2 points plus 5 tip up seats as ‘standard’ bike space on new Scotrail electrics 380 & 385 with wider access gap = 4 bikes (also a tandem will fit)
Jack Sexty wrote:
Our intrepid bike and train correspondent has misunderstood when he says GWR does not require reservations on local services. This actually refers to the type of train (rolling stock) not the distance travelled. Reservations are required for all journeys on the new! shiny! fast! electric (except when running on diesel)! IETs, even just from Bristol to Bath. On the (generally smaller) trains, which have bike accommodation consisting of either tip-up seating or wheelbenders in the corridor, reservations are not required even if travelling from Bristol to Didcot or, say, Exeter to Worcester (which would require at least two, probably three, trains, but is doable by small trains all the way if not in a hurry).
— Jack Sexty I haven’t misunderstood, they’ve just chosen not to tell me surely? When I tried to book it on, the app just said no without explanation.— Bmblbzzz
That’s all too believable. I’ve avoided booing spaces on the app since some time before the IETs were introduced. Not that face to face humans in big stations always get it right but they can at least explain things.
This was the best I’ve had
This was the best I’ve had train wise but is all too rare, not sure on what type of actual train as they vary massively on the regional lines but was one of the Northern rail stock in July going from Sheffield to Bridlington via Doncaster & Hull.
I’ve NEVER had a normal non fold down seat next to a bike space in almost 30 years of using the trains and never had such an easy access/egress due to not having to jam it into a space that clearly was less than a second thought on bike design and security! But still, there’s a resuss unit with a no putting baggage in front sign, yet it’s a designated bike space, the mind just boggles with the people who do this kind of stuff!
Those wheel benders are the devils spawn but have used them when I’m actually sat holding the bike so it’s not going to move but otherwise they are worse than useless. And yes, also encountered the luggage people who are too lazy to put it into the luggage compartment, my resolution is to just shout into the carriage that whose ever luggage it is could they kindly move it into the appropriate space or I’ll move it for them, only had to move bags once so not that common a problem, also told the train manager regarding the problem when it arises – they don’t call them conductors anymore, not for a long time from what I was told.
CyclingInBeastMode wrote:
That’s a refurbished Class 170 (ex Scotrail) and has at least 4 bike spaces* (2 at each end) thanks to Transport Scotland (the DfT for the Scottish Government, which is run from the Scottish Parliament – which governs most functions of an independent Scotland (including NHS, Land Access, etc)
* the second space has dumped the stupid & ridiculously expensive Calyx bike rack , and has over 2.0m of clear space, AND a wider opening to the door vestibule. With good packing tamdems will fit bit spaces, and 3-4 bikes too, plus a safety case, developed for GWR/Scotrail and other trains with no bike spaces, that 2 bikes per (double) doorway on the side opposite to the platform, provided that the user stays with the bikes. This is generally for local trains, short journeys, no seat reservations etc. Using this – for a managed operation a 3-car Class 170 can carry 16 bikes for say a group bike ride outside peak times.
Happy to work with/for local projects delivering cycling WITH rail and bus services – reach me through RoadCC or Cycling UK
I had the ‘pleasure’ of
I had the ‘pleasure’ of booking a spot on one of the GWR trains leaving Paddington for Chippenham in the first week or so:
Fuck GWR
“Are you here for the tour?”
“Are you here for the tour?” PMSL
AV Lowe, Thanks for all of
AV Lowe, Thanks for all of your train/bicycle information and hard work.
I cycle/rail commuted for several years on the Reading-Guildford line. The 3 carriage 166s were excellent, with space for 2 normal size bikes in their own area and large seperate luggage spaces, handy as this line ran on to Gatwick. Unfortunately most of them went to the South West area (Bristol, grr, carpeted and warmer in the proper cold too) leaving many 3 carriage 165s, with no provision, but with a bit of niceness to the generally friendly staff many bicycle could be place in the vestibule area. (unless outrageously busy, when I would wait for the next service) The 2 carriage 165s fairly recently had a weird bicycle area added with space for 4 bicycles and luggage above, down one side, but you have to get past passengers on seats and through a narrow gap to get into and out of the vestibule area. Better than nothing mind.
Occasionally I use the trains on the Farnbourgh Main line, big fast electric South West Train jobs. The 3 wheel wrecker racks by the toilet are alright, like the ones Alan Sherman linked to, but I preferred the 3 fold up seat bit, next to the old style toilet, which sometimes needed a bit of cooperation with fellow passengers.
I have gotten on alright with the hooks on the Virgin Voyagers, with 2 inch mtb tyres. Bike swings a lot mind.
I loved the old HST guards van on GWR, space for maybe 6 bicycles. And a bit of peace of mind.
My favorite was once using an East Anglian service, their version of the HST, I think, where the opposite end to the driven unit had maybe 10 proper “bike rack” sheffield stands that I could even lock my bike to. No booking requirement either.
There is also something very strange about taking ones full size bicycle on the not-deep sections of the London Underground, only when it’s very quiet though.
Somehow
Somehow they seem to do bikes on trains better in Denmark ….