Horse riders are getting in the way of cycling reform as they demand to be included in a blueprint for cycling.
More than 1,500 equestrians have written to the Department for Transport asking that they should not be banned from cycle lanes, which will be protected by wider segregation from traffic.
They say these horse and cycle lanes should be made of softer materials, which would be better for horses’ hooves, but slow down cyclists.
They also want the Highway Code to be rewritten to drop guidance that says riders “should not take a horse on to a cycle track”, according to the Sunday Times.
The DfT is now having to respond to these requests, delaying the cycling blueprint yet further.
The British Horse Society is behind the campaign, running a template letter on its website, which has led to nearly half of the cycling blueprint consultation responses being dominated by horse riders.
The society’s letter said that “routes being developed for walking and cyclists” should be “made available for equestrian use”.
It stated that 4,052 horse riders were admitted to hospital after being injured in 2013/14 compared with 2,820 cyclists.
It added that: “It seems strange that the government does not want to achieve the same for equestrians at the same time.”
Ralph Smyth, head of infrastructure at the Campaign to Protect Rural England, said: “Investing in safer horse riding won’t increase productivity in the way safer cycling can, such as by helping people get in and out of our increasingly gridlocked market towns. But it shouldn’t be difficult to ensure all riders can benefit from giving rural areas their fair share of the nation’s resources.”
Mark Weston, director of access at the British Horse Society, said: “Equestrians desperately need safe provision for the same reasons as walkers and cyclists: many roads are no longer safe due to the speed and volume of traffic.”
48 thoughts on “Horse riders’ demands delay cycling reforms”
They already exist. They are
They already exist. They are called bridleways, and yes we need more of them, many more.
As for roads. Horse riders, ramblers and runners are our friends when it comes to displacing the car from our country lanes.
I’m quite happy to share
I’m quite happy to share cycle routes with horses, it’s their riders I have issues with. A local cycle track becomes unusable in autumn/winter because the owners/riders don’t reshoe their horses with soft surface sheoe and the hard surface shoes destroy the path so that neither cyclists or pesestrians can use it
Gus T wrote:
Soft surface shoes? The only shose I know of (or that my riding instructor and farrier friends know of) for soft surfaces are those with added studs for grip. Not sure that would help preserve the path…
There seem to be conflicting
There seem to be conflicting demands. cyclists want flat smooth surface kept clear. equestrians want soft surfaces that horses can crap on. these things are mutually exclusive.
Yes, call for more bridleways, but don’t say you want access to cycle lanes and please make hem not fit for cycling in the mean time.
I’d like to see the numbers on equestrian injuries if the really are greater than cyclists, are the caused by other vehicles?
In urban areas, cycle paths
In urban areas, cycle paths built to get people from home to shops, or schools, or work – no. They should be asphalt only, designed like a road, with the express purpose of getting people around. But around the countryside I have no problems with equestrian requests for softer surfaces. I’ve never, ever had a problem with anybody on a horse – they’re our friends, they’re on our side. Yes, some bridleways can get into a pretty awful condition, but that isn’t their fault, just as a road covered in potholes isn’t the motorists’ fault. You can’t blame road users for poor maintenance.
That said, I’ve never come across a cycle path anywhere that’s wide enough for everyone. All the ones around Manchester and Cheshire seem to be 3-4m wide, even on old railways. That’s fine on a cold, rainy day when everyone is at home, but on a sunny weekend you can forget cycling with freedom on anything like that, because every man and his dog/child is out there walking in entirely random directions somehow managing to take up the entire path no matter how wide it is. Old railways should be resurfaced to their old widths – for two trains. 3-4m just doesn’t cut it.
Peowpeowpeowlasers wrote:
You’ve hit it on the head here, it’s all about designing to purpose. Urban routes need good surfaces for getting people where they want to go.
Out of town, a well packed gravel base with fine gravel topping (self binding, so we don’t end up with marbles on marbles) can be equally well used by 4 legged and 2 wheeled users, BUT, those with ultra skinny wheels might prefer to stick to asphalt.
Lots of the commuter cycle routes near me are also open to horse riders. The big issue is they need regular scraping and rolling to keep it in good condition. The problems we get are the horse riders that ignore the “no riding” signs on some of the routes, and they are thereforenot maintained as often as it shouldn’t need it, so horses churning up the top layer (especially on the hills) make it hard for the many commuter cyclists to make the top of some of the short sharp climbs.
StuInNorway wrote:
You know, some of us country types would also prefer not to commute on churned up horse toilets. I never have understood why dog owners are told to carry plastic bags, but horse owners are allowed to leave steaming piles everywhere.
As for ‘horse riders are our friends’. The other one has bells on.
StuInNorway wrote:
Tyres on my (full-suspended) recumbent are 40mm but up at 90psi, even fine gravel ain’t great, and surely the whole point is it’s an alternative/faster/safer route than some of the tarmac around…again, fitness for purpose, recumbents generally don’t run mtb rubber…
I empathise with equestrians
I empathise with equestrians but unpaved cycle facilities are impractical for utility cycling. If equestrians get their way the result won’t be cycle paths, but bridalways that leisure cyclists can share in fair weather.
This is silly, horses can’t
This is silly, horses can’t ride bikes.
As far as the surface goes,
As far as the surface goes, all it takes is about 6 months of persistent dumping to turn even the shiniest shared-use tarmac into a turdy, slippy mess unrecognisable as tarmac. Equestrian types know this and are merely seeking permission to helpfully cover new cycle lanes in their special brand of carpet.
This is somewhat confused
This is somewhat confused reporting; are we talking about cycle paths or cycle lanes? Cycle lanes are not generally wide enough for a horse (they’re often not wide enough for a bike) and it’s also unusual to find horses ridden alongside urban traffic, which is where cycle lanes tend to be. And what about those “cycle lanes” which are actually a shared pavement?
Cycle paths out in rural areas, away from roads, could be made shareable, but it would depend on finding a compromise surface – not too difficult as long as we don’t expect to go too fast or on skinny tyres and equestrians don’t demand something like a field or muddy bridleway; in fact many such paths already are shared, often with a gravelly bound-type surface.
Bmblbzzz wrote:
“cycle lanes, which will be protected by wider segregation from traffic.”.
So in towns and cities, that’s cycle tracks as we’re starting to become familiar with in London. Out in more rural areas, and which probably interests them more, look at things such as the new (and quite good) cycling routes that have been built parallel to the A23 as it was widened.
Image via Mark Treasure. https://twitter.com/aseasyasriding/status/790188421759246337
Why not convert a section of
Why not convert a section of all car parks to accommodate horses, just put a couple of poles across the bays & and people could tie them up and go to work. Parent & child spaces could be used for people with carriages (for those who currently car share). Petrol stations could diversify and sell hay & oats.
TimOFEE wrote:
Why you don’t want to encourage horses as a form of urban transport. Been there done that not pleasant.
http://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofBritain/Great-Horse-Manure-Crisis-of-1894/
Tony wrote:
From this we can infer that people would rather wade through shit, literally, than ride bicycles.
A lot of cycling, especially
A lot of cycling, especially out of towns is for leisure use but a significant amount, especially in urban areas is for actually getting to places, whether that be work, the shops, leisure facilities or what have you. With the exception of Police horses surely virtually all horse traffic is for leisure use? It is and always will be a minority leisure activity and should be treated as such…
This came up about ten years
This came up about ten years ago in the Bath area, with BHS pushing heavily to share the Bristol Bath path, and since the leader of the council was a horsey type, they allowed a trial. They didn’t bother consulting any of the path’s existing users, and when they found out, they weren’t all that happy, so the council organised an emergency hearing to listen to the objectors. The BHS had about a month to prepare, while the cyclists were given a week.
Incredibly, one of the council’s own staff had been killed by a horse the previous year while riding his bike, and when I pointed that out in my address, I was called disgraceful by a windbag of a councillor. The BHS referred to a report done by a university investigating conflict between horse and bicycle riders on bridle paths, and it found none, but the researchers didn’t actually witness a single horse/bicycle passing incident, instead relying solely on a few interviews with users.
The trial went ahead, but was judged a failure and access to horses was withdrawn.
As somebody who has a
As somebody who has a daughter who rides horses, the reason they want ‘soft’ paths is that it allows them to gallop. Galloping is fun. Riding on roads you need to take it slow and have your horse shoed.
What soft paths do do is exclude people with disabilities who find soft paths a nightmare if you are in wheelchair and change a route from being usable all year round into one that is only used after a dry period.
awjr wrote:
Is it my imagination or do galloping horses cause more surface ‘movement’ ie dug-up surface than at walking speed ?
JonD wrote:
Yes a shoed horse can only get traction through digging it’s hooves into the surface. Hence you can follow a group of horses trotting/walking along and see little damage, but a horse that is galloping will be gouging out the dirt surface and throwing dirt everywhere.
One of the reason you see jockeys covered in mud after a race.
Gallopping on a hard surface can be extremely dangerous for the horse.
I noticed in the Netherlands
I noticed in the Netherlands they have seperate automobile roads, bicycle roads (paved), bridleways (unpaved) and pedestrian paths (some paved and some unpaved). It works well and leads to absence of conflict between different types of users. Horse riders don’t actually want to mix with other road users, and neither do cyclists. The problem occurs when we only cater for one type of road user (automobile driver). Let’s just cut out all the angst and arguing and do what works? The attached photo shows a paved rural cycle road near Amsterdam, with a soft bridlepath on one side and a soft pedestrian path on the other.
Ramz wrote:
I was going to chip in with exactly this.
The problem is that the council ends up being handed the bill for building both sets of paths.
However, the BHS is quite correct there needs to be provision designed to meet the needs of many of the more vulnerable road users who would in many cases prefer not to be on the roads.
The numbers of riders killed and injured is a bit of a red herring as very few of those injuries/deaths take place on the road.
Does anyone know what the
Does anyone know what the problem is with the UK that arguments like this occur. On the continent it may not be perfect but there’s plentiful cycle routes mostly logical and in good condition, horse-ists seem to have plenty of riding opportunities and drivers, for the most part, are tolerant of other road users. Contrasting with the UK, what’s the big difference that makes Brits so confrontational.
Horse riding should be banned
Horse riding should be banned. Note the number of times the air ambulance programmes show them attending horse riders, it’s obviously a dangerous activity and a drain on the NHS.
What percentage of cycle path
What percentage of cycle path users are using a horse? It’s so small their argument should be instantly dismissed. The horse is not a means of transport for the working masses, elitism has it’s downfalls as well. Now stick to moaning at MTB riders on bridleways and being a danger to all and sundry when your horse gets out of control.
Sadly because the average horser is also a moneybag, they have enough money and time to devote to their cause through silly legal challenges.
Yorkshire wallet wrote:
My thoughts exactly. Horse riders are cash- and time-rich, making an animal carry them around for something to do. If they’re trying to get somewhere they can take the Porsche or Land Rover. Skint people like me are on a bike trying to get to work in a cheap and environmentally friendly manner, which I also manage to achieve without s***ting everywhere (most days).
Not even sure I find horse
Not even sure I find horse riding ethical. Definitely believe horse racing is unethcial. The death toll is too high for me to stomach.
http://www.horsedeathwatch.com
Definitely don’t feel like horse riders and cyclists are some sort of in-it-together family. Cycling is an efficient, clean mode of transport. Also a way of keeping fit and reducing the NHS burden. Don’t buy that we have to like them because they’re ‘not cars’.
unconstituted wrote:
Maybe it’s that people like horses more than they like cyclists ( I await a legal opinion on that comparison). Maybe it’s because a horse will really wreck your car if you drive into one. But I’m always happy to see them out on a Sunday morning, on the local backroads acting as mobile chicanes and reminding drivers that there is a reason not to hoon round blind corners, because you might just get unlucky and hit a cyclist (me) or you could get real unlucky and hit a horse. You won’t get much sympathy or understanding from anyone for doing that.
As for bridleways and byeways; horse riders, cyclists and ramblers may have differences, but fundamentally we all want more and better maintained access to the countryside.
so just a query when the
so just a query when the horses dump their waste products all over the roads where I live do these riders pick it up ?
I think the answer proves who needs to sort themselves out first.
As a responsbile dog owner I off course always take a poo bag with me !
I don’t think we should
I don’t think we should discriminate against horses. Accordingly, I think it only fair that any horse riding a bicycle shoudl be free to use cycle paths.
surly_by_name wrote:
Oooh, an excuse yo buy a
Oooh, an excuse yo buy a gravel bike…
https://www.evanscycles.com/cannondale-slate-105-2017-adventure-road-bike-EV254012?esvt=872-GOUKE1756606&esvq=&esvadt=999999-0-981800-1&esvcrea=107174171936&esvplace=&esvd=c&esvo=EV254012-M-GRN&esvaid=50080&gclid=CjwKEAjw19vABRCY2YmkpO2OzTsSJAAzEt8swHzK-0JioAKiREmf2MfhUo_w8uyh0aAiej-n1jMpmxoCCfPw_wcB
Horse riders seem to be an
Horse riders seem to be an ungrateful bunch anyway. Last time I passed a couple I made an effort to shout a ‘hello’ ahead, rather than ‘excuse me’ or ‘coming through’ or something that could be taken as unfriendly or whatever. All I got was a passive aggressive telling off “don’t go down through your gears passing a horse”.
Go fuck yourselves then!!! It’s a sad say when I’ve got to upgrade my drivetrain as not to upset a horse with clunky changes.
Looks like Gravel Bikes are
Looks like Gravel Bikes are going to be everywhere soon then!
Why on earth do horse riders
Why on earth do horse riders want to share with bikes? I always slow right down when passing a horse and call out but I can guarantee a sizable proportion won’t.
Horses really don’t like being suddenly passed by a near silent machine that’s doing 15mph.
So what about the bridleways
So what about the bridleways that are churned up by horses and un-cycleable? Can’t see the horse community agreeing to have them made fit for bikes. We’ve all had the icy looks when out on an MTB.
Horse riding is a leisure activity and, whilst a lot of cyclists use cycle paths for leisure as well, if we want to see a big change in attitude towards cycling then these paths have to be seen as part of the transport network ie ‘getting from A to B. Most of the time I’m on a traffic free path, I’m commuting and pleased that I’m away from cars; I’m not on it for leisure. Don’t see many horse owners riding to work?
Chris Boardman did a piece during the Tour de France on cycling in Holland (I think). His great line was, “I didn’t see cyclists; I just saw people in normal clothes riding bikes”. If motorists think they should just have to tolerate us at weekends in the summer (ie leisure) and we should clear off the rest of the time, then we’ll get nowhere.
Last few horse and riders I
Last few horse and riders I rode past was actually about 40, not sure why a hunt is still allowed? What do all the hundred or so dogs do? Never bee that close to the hounds before, really mean scary animals with blood in their eye, of course they wouldn’t let them tear other animals apart would they, it’s banned isn’t it? The hunt hunting that is not allowed.
Not a fan of horse riders or riding, bit like open road motorsport, arcane and a bit last century.
provide horses with closed circuits, it’s seems that is what BC want for cycle racing! Only seems fair
Presumably they’ll be willing
Presumably they’ll be willing to concede priority to cyclists on designated cycle ways as cyclists are required to for horses on bridleways? I’m not so sure given some of the horsey types around here.
Not meaning to tar all horse riders with one brush of course. Most that I know are lovely and way above average in terms of consideration for other road users. Unfortunately some of them seem to have friends/fellow horse enthusiasts whose position on cyclists is “run them off the road!” and “they don’t pay road tax!” (irony much?) or as one lady put it “give them the same treatment motorists give us!” (WTF?). And I can’t count on two hands the number of times I’ve almost been clipped by Land Rovers pulling horse boxes.
I’m not sure why they’d want to share a path with bikes anyway, horses seem especially freaked out by bikes, but whatever. I’m all for supporting the rights of people to enjoy their hobby safely. Can’t help but feel that a better solution is more bridleways or opening up access to footpaths.
All new cycle lanes to be
All new cycle lanes to be installed with additional 2m wide soft track for horses. Preferably between hr road and cycle path.
?
Oh dear, so many emotive
Oh dear, so many emotive comments! I commute 100 miles weekly, AND also enjoy horse riding. I drive an ordinary car, rely on horse hire as cannot afford to own one. The main point is live and let live. Some cycle routes are suitable for sharing with equestrians, others are better for one or the other. Rather strange comments about about the mess too! Horse poo is basically partially digested grass, and relatvely odour free and certainly not like dog mess. Again I have dogs and also collect horse muck for my allotment – usually about 1/3 of a ton in bags in the back of the car. It ain’t that bad! Mutual tolerance and understanding, and ignore the ignorant people who just have to be objectionable. Their loss. Car drivers though do put horses and riders at risk by passing too close and too fast so we do have a shared objective – safer leisure time.
ianrparsons wrote:
That’ll be off comfort if I have a spill due to lack of traction. When was in bruges all the horse and carriages for tourist rides were rigged to collect the manure. Here covering the roads is acceptable.
As to drivers close passing, my experience is that it happens far more to cyclists. I have had drivers buzz me despite the oncoming lane being clear before moving right over for the horse in front. I’m sure there are some nutters who close pass horses, but far fewer than will close pass cyclists. Probably because 1) they don’t want their precious car to br kicked 2) hitting a horse will mess their car up and could injure them, unlike hitting a cyclist.
Bridleways for horses cycle paths (with smooth tarmac) for cyclists. ideally both would be provided.
ianrparsons wrote:
Not actually sure about the rest of it, but can’t agree on the horse dung. It might not be as much of a disease vector as dog crap (and, come to think of it, not as much of a health hazard as what cars pump out), but it still has the consistency of damp mud (with a bit of extra ick factor) and is not something it’s any fun to ride into or even walk through.
I don’t really see why a desire to engage in a leisure activity gives any group the right to dump tons of rubbish on other people’s transport infrastructure. On first thought I’d say share the paths but only on condition you leave them exactly as you found them.
ianrparsons wrote:
“Leisure time ” is when I (unfortunately) don’t get to ride my bike. I use mine mainly to go to work or to the shops so I don’t need to get the car out. Does your hired horse do that?
I don’t care what it’s made
I don’t care what it’s made of: it’s shit, and great mounds of it are created in each single movement. Whatever its composition, a hobby’s side-effect dumping piles of it on public paths is unacceptable.
I’m sure it’s great on your allotment. It’s less than great on shared-use paths. It’s most often dropped at gates, stiles, subways and passings, making it difficult to avoid. It gets rained on and flattens and spreads, covering the path, literally, in shit. I and others commute along these paths, when it has rained, covering us, literally, in shit. And the properties that are great for your allotment also encourage growth on the path, so it quickly doesn’t resemble a path anymore.
So yeah: I’ll be a bit more tolerant of your hobby that gets shit on me, when mine get shit on you.
Personally, I do a 20 mile
Personally, I do a 20 mile each-way commute on the back of my pet hippopotamus, Gerald. Therefore I think all bridleways should be flooded.
Great. We can look forward to
Great. We can look forward to great steaming piles of horse shite on our cycle paths.
No no no
No no no
I do not want horses anywhere near cycle paths or footpaths. Having seen the damage horses do to footpaths when the riders get fedup of their animals walking through the mud exetera on the bridalways that they have cut to pieces by being used when to wet (and then lay the blame on 4×4 users with not a tyre track in site). We would end up carrying our bikes not riding them!
Anyway when you look at the amount of greenroads right of ways and bridleways in the UK to the amount of dedicated cyclepaths as opposed to multiuse footpaths they are doing very well already thank you very much.
And as for horse shit no, no thank you.