Five cool things coming soon from Giant, Castelli, Dexshell, Blinkers and Merlin

froze wrote:

I agree as well with the lack of separation in the signal light device.  Plus the size of the light is so small that from a distance of say more than a car length a motorist won't be able to tell anything other than it's a light of some sort.  I don't understand why they just don't make a light with LED's in the form of an arrow so from behind it will look like an arrow pointing left or right.  Even if they did come out with a usable turn signal light for bike I would never buy one, in over 40 years of riding I've found hand signals to work just fine...even at night.

 

I'm old enough to remember when someone was on BBC evening TV with a set of indicators for cyclists. That was in the 1970s. Maybe there's a reason these have never taken off despite many, many people trying over the years.

PRSboy wrote:

Why do companies keep trying to overcomplicate things... sticking an arm out is such an easy, visible, understandable and cheap way of signalling a turn.

Because putting an arm out momentarily might be fine, but holding an arm out for a prolonged period approaching a turn, while often trying to slow down and/avoid stuff like potholes, while still maintaining control, can often be a problem (and I'm an experienced rider with 25+ years riding on the road and more than comfortable riding one/no handed).

The problem is that a bike is narrow (at the rear, anyway), so there isn't really any sensible place to put indicators. The solution will be clothing or maybe a development of the laser lights so that the ground is used to display the signal.

PRSboy wrote:

Why do companies keep trying to overcomplicate things... sticking an arm out is such an easy, visible, understandable and cheap way of signalling a turn.

Not always possible though. I'd love somone to come up with a solution which works for those of us who can't.

PRSboy wrote:

Why do companies keep trying to overcomplicate things... sticking an arm out is such an easy, visible, understandable and cheap way of signalling a turn.

I take it that because you believe this that you also believe that car indicators have overcomplicated things too so you use nothing but original motorists hand signals?

ClubSmed wrote:

PRSboy wrote:

Why do companies keep trying to overcomplicate things... sticking an arm out is such an easy, visible, understandable and cheap way of signalling a turn.

I take it that because you believe this that you also believe that car indicators have overcomplicated things too so you use nothing but original motorists hand signals?

But really signalling is only beneficial in a very few situations that are actually more about courtesy/helping peope along than actually about safety, except for those morons who are ignorant of road position, have next to zero understanding of how things work, are impatient or simply going too fast, these types might behave differently but very likely not.

I'd rather a cyclist took the lane/correct road position in advance of what they are wanting to do in terms of direction than waving an arm about and have less control and not make as positive a move as they could have. if a vehicle ahead of me decides to turn and just brakes with no indication, how has that endangered me, surely I'll be keeping a distance back and going at a speed I can stop well within the distance I can see to be clear?

That means if the ahead vehicle (of whatever type incl cycle) were to 'slam on' then whilst that might on the odd occasion come as a surprise, you should be sufficient distance back and be aware so that you aren't rear ending them. When it comes to turning, the ahead vehicle with priority can turn left or right with no indication and that should not impinge on my safety whatsoever from behind nor indeed those oncoming.

Turning right across traffic then the vehicle waits until there's a safe gap to turn and that the exit lane is also clear, an indicator makes jack all difference, the road position in itself tells the tale as well as wheels turned in. Even to pedestrians crossing the exit road it's actually a negative because it's seen too often as I need to stay out of the way of the big killing thing (IF they even see the indicator/vehicle wanting to turn) because it's going to turn with the usual BS by the dirver 'well I was indicating' to validate their impatience and ignoring the rules of the road to give priority to peds crossing when entering minor from major.

Can indicating help traffic flow, sometimes yes, but we rely on things like lights at night and indicators when actually all it takes is patience, lowering speeds, being aware of where vehicles are on the highway, analysing what people generally do and thinking about those times when they don't (indicating one way but do something totally different to that signal) and actually looking out for the danger you present to others to get about without their being people getting hurt.

Think about it.

ClubSmed wrote:

I take it that because you believe this that you also believe that car indicators have overcomplicated things too so you use nothing but original motorists hand signals?

Is that a straw man?

Those 'indicators' are sh*t. They look ugly, they are too close together and give the impression that they could snap off with little force.

Some people love inventing stuff just to make money, not to make anything worthwhile. As long as enough fools buy some they're sorted.

As for indicating/signalling one's intentions on a bike, I agree more with BTBS' comments about positioning etc. Recumbent riders seem to manage without waving their arms, or perhaps they still do it 18" above the ground, where it is surely even less effective.

Simon E wrote:

ClubSmed wrote:

I take it that because you believe this that you also believe that car indicators have overcomplicated things too so you use nothing but original motorists hand signals?

Is that a straw man?

Those 'indicators' are sh*t. They look ugly, they are too close together and give the impression that they could snap off with little force.

Some people love inventing stuff just to make money, not to make anything worthwhile. As long as enough fools buy some they're sorted.

As for indicating/signalling one's intentions on a bike, I agree more with BTBS' comments about positioning etc. Recumbent riders seem to manage without waving their arms, or perhaps they still do it 18" above the ground, where it is surely even less effective.

I did not say that the indicators shown in the article are the answer (I have similar views as yourself to the usability), I am pointing out that the original statement was flawed.

I do think that there is a market for such things though, and BTBS' comments about positioning are right, but they assume that everyone is on a road. Positioning on a dedicated cycle lane or shared path is either not possible or not indicative of intention. Cycling with a small child on your bike often means that you do not want to remove your hands from the bar to indicate and the advent of suitable indicating system could be beneficial.

Just because a solution does not work for you does not mean that it does not work for anyone. Just because the design of a solution is poor does not mean that a solution is not needed.

ClubSmed wrote:

Just because a solution does not work for you does not mean that it does not work for anyone. Just because the design of a solution is poor does not mean that a solution is not needed.

Just because a claimed 'solution' is made available doesn't mean is it either (1) suitable or (2) necessary, never mind whether anyone thinks it desirable to own or use it.

I'm not thinking of myself but trying to consider whether there are those who might benefit from some kind of indicators, hence the mention of recumbent riders. But I expect you will continue to assume that I said something I didn't.

Surely if these things were genuinely beneficial (or manufacturers could scaremonger us into buying them) then the market would be awash with them.

Simon E wrote:

ClubSmed wrote:

Just because a solution does not work for you does not mean that it does not work for anyone. Just because the design of a solution is poor does not mean that a solution is not needed.

Just because a claimed 'solution' is made available doesn't mean is it either (1) suitable or (2) necessary, never mind whether anyone thinks it desirable to own or use it.

I'm not thinking of myself but trying to consider whether there are those who might benefit from some kind of indicators, hence the mention of recumbent riders. But I expect you will continue to assume that I said something I didn't.

Surely if these things were genuinely beneficial (or manufacturers could scaremonger us into buying them) then the market would be awash with them.

I did not assume that you said anything that you didn't, I can't see anywhere in my comment where I said that I did! Is it a case of you assuming that I said something that I didn't?

I agree that my point also works in reverse, I was just putting that side of the arguement here for balance.

Simon E wrote:

ClubSmed wrote:

Just because a solution does not work for you does not mean that it does not work for anyone. Just because the design of a solution is poor does not mean that a solution is not needed.

Just because a claimed 'solution' is made available doesn't mean is it either (1) suitable or (2) necessary, never mind whether anyone thinks it desirable to own or use it.

I'm not thinking of myself but trying to consider whether there are those who might benefit from some kind of indicators, hence the mention of recumbent riders. But I expect you will continue to assume that I said something I didn't.

Surely if these things were genuinely beneficial (or manufacturers could scaremonger us into buying them) then the market would be awash with them.

to be fair the market is awash with them, in the sense that there's a new one on kickstarter pretty much every week

bechdan wrote:

And what do I do when Ive sold all expendible organs? Christ some people must have way too much money 

You can likely donate small chunks of your liver to children.

bechdan wrote:

And what do I do when Ive sold all expendible organs? Christ some people must have way too much money 

The turn signal lights or the gloves?

I've got Raynauds (mostly hands) so no price tag for gloves is too much if they actually work!