No evidence lack of assertiveness a factor in female cycling lorry fatalities

It's been said before, the main issue I suspect is the left-hand filter lanes leading you to the advance stop box, a traffic feature that leads you into a very risky position. Arriving at or being just short of the stop box as the lights change to green is one of the most dangerous place you can be as you're most likely to have not been seen by or not spot a left-turning vehicle. Same for filtering on the right perhaps but generally a better place to be if there's space.

"I'm gobsmacked that 8 years ago we learnt that women are getting killed for obeying traffic rules yet nothing has been done about it."
I'm very suprised that the filter lane / advance stop design hasn't been looked at as a direct cause, that I know of.

This bit makes me laugh

“When you are on the inside of a lorry, you are hidden. They will turn left and not see you. In order to put yourself in the safest position, you want to get right in front of it and make sure you are visible. Maybe women can be a little bit less assertive in doing that.”

so they want you to go past the truck and get in front of it, so what if your halfway past and the truck begins to turn? what if you get in front but your not forward enough for the driver to see you?

The safest position is staying behind the truck, wait and see what maneuver its going to make and once it has left a clear and safe space for you then carry on, a few seconds delay to your journey or the chance of death you decide

I see so many people going up the inside of other vehicles and risking their lives to save 30 seconds on a journey

Its just madness especially when you see people with kids on their bikes doing it

I wish there was better education on this, maybe a TV commercial to make all types of cyclists aware of the dangers

Ah the old canards about being visible and making eye contact! I've had motorists look at me and yet fail to see me.... and if someone could tell me how I can be INvisible then I'd find uses for it.

Stop the victim blaming, Anna. We're visible and need to start punishing the motorists who don't care to look.

arfa wrote:

The problem isn't HGV's, it's tipper trucks

Yes I agree, or perhaps it's the combination of construction vehicle, City location, congestion and production targets that make the drivers take chances that they shouldn't.

My commute includes South Perimeter Road past the cargo area at Heathrow airport, home territory for HGV's, but these are horse and trailer transporters not construction vehicles. In my experience they are (on average) very good drivers and give me more space than any other vehicle does. That said, it's just not good being on the same road as fast moving behemoths and I would cut that part of my commute out if I could. The occasional close pass by a long vehicle is a terrifying experience.

As arfa above ^^^

I dislike the generalisation about HGVs in the same way I dislike numpties making generalisations about cyclists. There are design issues with lorries which make them unnecessarily dangerous, but most of the drivers are amongst the best on the road.

The construction industry however has many issues.

The problem isn't HGV's, it's tipper trucks. Lumping them all together is a bit like comparing an airline pilot to a moped driver.
The way some of the pay per load toppers barrel through central London is shameful.
In addition to the above suggestions, the government (crossrail), British Land/Hammerson/Land Securities could stop pay per load contracting and introduce a policy of suspending any contracting firm involved in a KSI pending conclusion of a formal investigation. At the moment, the price of a human life resides below the price of one more load. This has to change but I am not holding my breath.

The problem isn't HGV's, it's tipper trucks. Lumping them all together is a bit like comparing an airline pilot to a moped driver.
The way some of the pay per load toppers barrel through central London is shameful.
In addition to the above suggestions, the government (crossrail), British Land/Hammerson/Land Securities could stop pay per load contracting and introduce a policy of suspending any contracting firm involved in a KSI pending conclusion of a formal investigation. At the moment, the price of a human life resides below the price of one more load. This has to change but I am not holding my breath.

Charlie Lloyd is right as usual: the gender bit is a red herring. We think what needs to be done is http://rdrf.org.uk/2015/07/21/what-transport-for-london-needs-to-do-for-...

Is cycling safe? It certainly doesn't feel like it with near misses being a daily occurrence.

Looking at the statistics on this page says being in a car is far safer:
DfT casualty statistics rank driving, cycling, walking and motorcycling by risk | road.cc

Sure, cars do more miles but I don't think you average car driver drives 40 times further than your average commuter. And if you're considering ditching car journeys and going by bike instead then that's a 1:1 thing, not a 40:1 thing.

Cycling should be as safe as driving.

There does seem to be a pattern.

However, if one wants to focus on gender, one could equally well point out that those driving and designing the lorries and allowing them on the roads are disproportionately male (overwhelmingly so for the first one). So I'd be quite cautious about looking at that topic, myself.

I don't buy the argument that more female cyclists stop at red lights therefore they are more likely to be crushed by lorries as they set off once lights have changed to green. Lorries are pretty slow to move off, they are really easy to out accelerate. Even a granny with a whicker basket can out accelerate an HGV from a standing start. Maybe it is the case that women are more likely to ride up the nearside of large vehicles. I have certainly witnessed plenty of this over the years, along with men. I have shouted at cyclists to stop, but they don't appreciate how a large vehicle turns and the huge blindspots they can be trapped in. I have been sworn at, told to "Fuck off!" by morons trying to ride up the nearside kerb on the inside of trucks and buses along a gap less than shoulder width wide, given it is generally the men doing the swearing, but women also do this kamikaze riding, so no wonder there are fatalities when these people don't have the first clue that what they are doing is extremely dangerous and potentially fatal to them. Not saying that trucks or vans, or any other vehicles, don't turn in on you or left hook, but by simply looking and around and having MIRRORS you can anticipate a lot better what traffic around you is doing and greatly minimise such manoeuvres. Get an Airzound it might just save your life!

Quote:

However, a study reportedly commissioned by TfL in 2007 suggests women obeying traffic lights was a contributing factor in the relatively high numbers of women killed by lorries in the capital.

I'm gobsmacked that 8 years ago we learnt that women are getting killed for obeying traffic rules yet nothing has been done about it.