Cyclists’ helmet cam videos of reckless road users behaving badly or breaking the law are a Youtube staple, but here’s one with a difference those caught on camera are cyclists and it ends with a truly spectacular demonstration of how not to take your jacket off while cycling.
York Cyclists Episode 1, shot over a three week period was posted to Youtube on April 1st ago by a long time cycle commuter calling himself CarefulCyclist, but it's no joke.
Red light jumping, pavement cycling, red light jumping, riding no handed, red light jumping, texting while cycling, phoning while cycling and red light jumping (a bit like Groundhog Day) are all here.
It’s a catalogue of the sort of behaviour that irritates and angers other road users and that divides opinion amongst cyclists between those who believe that the rules of the road apply to everyone and those who say they are the product of a car-centric approach to traffic management and that as long as no-one is harmed the independent minded cyclist should be free to ignore them. Watch the video and judge for yourself.
“Cyclists are taking more risks”, CarefulCyclist told YorkMix explaining his reason for posting his films to Youtube: “I hope the families of those cyclists will see what those cyclists are doing, putting themselves and other road users at risk and prevent them.
“The cyclists involved should stop and think, is this risk I am taking worth it?”
He also explained why he started filming his journeys.
“I have, on a number of occasions nearly been hit by inattentive or poor drivers. if you combine poor driving with reckless cycling more and more people are going to get injured. Some fatally.”
He described those riding badly as “a small proportion of repeat offenders, I see the same faces over and over again.
“Young men seem prepared to take the greatest risks, but all types of road users flout the Highway Code.
“I see cyclists running red lights, weaving in and out of traffic, but even the most minor indiscretions like cycling on the pavement can have potentially severe consequences if the cyclist is in collision with someone elderly or a child.
“Pedestrians have been killed by cyclists.”
While some of the cycling on display is certainly of the eye-brow raising variety some may also raise an eyebrow at the inclusion of a woman using her mobile phone while cycling along a near empty bike path – on the other hand the chap briefly glimpsed riding no handed on the pavement was lucky a hapless pedestrian didn’t step out of a doorway.
The penultimate incident would seem to be an example of both rider and driver inattention although had things played out differently it is certainly the cyclist who would have paid the higher price, and that last crash? Well, according to CarefulCyclist the man got up afterwards apparently unharmed.
While his film highlights some risk taking individual in his conversation with YorkMix CarefulCyclist reserves some of the blame for poor cycling infrastructure too:
“Some of the cycling infrastructure is poorly designed and poorly maintained, cycle lanes are too narrow and sometimes bring road users in to conflict”.
The recklessness of York’s drivers and pedestrians are the subjects of his next two videos.
107 thoughts on “Video: Cyclists behaving badly – helmetcam cyclist turns his lens on other cyclists”
Worth it just for the last
Worth it just for the last clip!
brilliant
The bit of the guy taking off
The bit of the guy taking off his jacket is rather droll. Bet he won’t do that again in a hurry. Red light running isn’t wise on a bicycle in busy traffic either. But I have to say, hopping a kerb and using the pavement when there isn’t anyone around harms no one. Several of those clips shows show cyclists avoiding having to wait by using the pavement and in several, there are no pedestrians. So exactly who was at risk there? As it happens I recognised the junction from when I last stayed in York too and it is a busy one at peak times. Hopping a kerb there when there are no pedestrians reduces congestion for motorists as well as cutting journey times and also reduces risk, as long as there are no pedestrians around.
OldRidgeback wrote:But I have
Unfortunately it’s against the law and annoys onlookers (drivers, other cyclists, pedestrians) which give some idiots ammunition for saying cyclists shouldn’t be on the road blah blah blah.
It’s quite hard to judge the risk to others, what if someone was near the junction or walking towards it or someone stepped out of a doorway, my view is just to wait, like everyone else, for the light to change, that way there would be no ambiguity. How much time are you really going to save?
That last clip is hilarious-
That last clip is hilarious- what did he think was going to happen?
I disagree… behaving like
I disagree… behaving like dutiful little subservients will do absolutely nothing to change the perception car drivers have of cyclists.
Not that I am condoning action shown in this film.
To me, other peoples behaviour on a bike should not bear any relation to how drivers behave towards me when I am on a bike.
Reference the examples shown… there were some out and out shockers in there granted, but equally, a lot were demonstrative of nothing more than potentially irritating behaviour to a minority of already frustrated road users… safety was not an issue.
Picking up on the Porsche analogy…. 180mph will always be unsafe simply because at that speed, you can not possibly react in time to hazards when they come into view…. to make the analogy work in line with many of the examples shown (not including most of the RLJumpers) it would be the same as saying driving at 80mph on an empty motorway is illegal and should never be done end of story…
Yes you’re right it is illegal, but I’d love to know the percentage of UK drivers who have never reached this speed… I can not imagine it is very high at all.
Jimmy Ray Will wrote:I
It isn’t so much behaving like “dutiful little subservients”, it’s obeying the highway code and the law. Lots of cyclists love quoting the highway code when it suits them (myself included), riding two abreast, getting overtaken properly etc. I’m not saying we should “get our house in order”, but I’m saying that if someone wants to quote the highway code at motorists, they should obey it themselves or should be called a hypocrite.
I don’t like the fact other peoples behaviour makes drivers hate me, I think it’s ridiculous, but it’s a fact none the less, it happens. As so many have said, motorists seeing a minority of cyclists jumping lights gives us all a bad name as some people can’t grasp that we can’t affect other cyclists’ actions.
What is this supposed to
What is this supposed to help?
All the videos do is confirm the confirmation bias that all cyclists ride on the pavement and jump red lights.
The left turn on red featured many times on the first video is an example of a junction crying out for a left filter for bikes so they can perform the manoeuvre legally. Enough measures like this would encourage more cyclists and do a lot to help York’s chronic traffic problems.
The author’s assertion that cyclists are taking more risks is also likely to be his confirmation bias….
It’s terrible that we often
It’s terrible that we often find the pain and suffering of others hilarious. I’ve been watching the last clip (jacket guy) repeatedly for the lat ten minutes to try to understand why this is =))
Try the silly cyclists series on youtube for more of the same thing in London. Ride safe, and try not to be the cycling version of an Audi driver.
Red light jumping really
Red light jumping really irritates the general public. Do a straw poll of people in your office and see how many times it comes up.
Red light jumping is counter-productive to cycling.
The problem with breaking the
The problem with breaking the law “when there isn’t anyone around” is that it’s subjective and changeable. There isn’t anyone around unless they simply weren’t seen or until suddenly, there is.
Some of the behaviour in the
Some of the behaviour in the video is silly.
That said, the person filming doesn’t cover themselves in glory by pointing at the other cyclists and yelling ‘wrong way’ and ‘one way street’. He’s correct, but it’s still sanctimonious and irritating.
This guy is setting himself up as some sort of enforcer of moral standards. Given that, it’s morally dubious to add the last clip -of the chap falling off his bike. It’s not much more than a Jeremy Beadle moment (albeit a good one), which gives us the opportunity to laugh at the cyclist involved. I doubt the cyclist will repeat the trick, I think he’s probably learned his lesson without needing a Youtube video to point it out.
Some pretty shocking riding
Some pretty shocking riding on display there, but…
Yes… about one a year on average. As Martin Porter QC notes, it’s roughly the same number of people killed or injured annually by golf balls, and has the same irresistible novelty factor as far as local media are concerned.
I can’t stop laughing at the
I can’t stop laughing at the last clip. its just brilliant. and reminds me why i always pull over to take a jacket off or put one on… :))
The key problem I have with
The key problem I have with other cyclists abusing the traffic laws is every time they do it in front of other road users those road users lose a little bit of respect for cyclists. That loss of respect makes them less likely to give cyclists a few more inches of room when they pass us. This is the reason it makes a difference. You might get to your destination quicker but somewhere down the line one of the drivers who saw you go through a red might just knock a cyclist off their bike and into the path of another vehicle.
The vehicles cyclists have the most problems with are the inconsiderate ones; the ones in a hurry and the ones who are oblivious to the other road users. The cyclists other road users have the most problems with are the inconsiderate ones. Don’t be part of the problem.
None of them were “behaving
None of them were “behaving badly”, they all found a solution, you just found somebody who seems to be a very angry person at the wrong people.
Have i come across the daily heil here?
northstar wrote:None of them
Not even the guy who failed to notice the car indicating left and almost got himself crushed?
paulfg42 wrote:northstar
Not even the guy who failed to notice the car indicating left and almost got himself crushed?— northstar
*laughs* I suggest you look again at that one.
Mixed views. I do feel the
Mixed views. I do feel the head cam is generating becoming a bit bike nazi. Every day you see crap drivers, the same applies to bikes, what is different.
I occasionally ride on the pavement at certain pinch points – for safety – Ride safely and with consideration, what is the problem?
Riding non handed – I do it all the time -when safe- as I need to stretch a knackered spine. I am good at riding non handed, those that moan about are usually poor bike handlers.
Jacket man – quality, what a turnip, watch dem sleeves!
Red light jumpers, I would happily batter you to death with my carbon soles. high proportion of skinny jeaned hipster, fixie bunglec**ts seem to be the culprits
Wrong way down the one way – you sir are an arse. I have slapped someone for doing this
How much worse is using a mobile to fiddling with your poxy garmin?
Simmo72 wrote:
Mixed views.
The difference is crap drivers kill people a lot. Crap cyclists get killed and then get the blame for it. I know I’m probably not going to get much agreement, but in my view the responsibility not to kill a cyclist – even a crappy one that allegedly appeared “from nowhere” – still rests with the driver.
Reason: it’s convenient to forget this, but there is such a thing as safe stopping distance, which varies depending on your speed. The vast majority of drivers, even those otherwise decent and considerate, simply cannot be bothered to allow for said safe stopping distance between themselves and the rest of the traffic.
Unless the “crap cyclist” literally teleports him- or herself right in front of your car, you are still responsible for not killing them no matter how crappy their riding was.
I agree with the guy &
I agree with the guy & standards of cycling need to improve. But like there are bad drivers, there are bad cyclists & this video is now on the Daily Mail website for everyone to rant & rave about road tax & “cyclists deserve what they get”… not a smart idea to post this vid… :”(
Oh look here’s another
Oh look here’s another brainwashed it seems:
It’s not illegal so step down off your phony perch, would you castigate someone for walking the “wrong way” down the “road”? No? Yes?.
Going through red is very
Going through red is very black and white. When someone does, it’s a very visible transgression, so no wonder it raises the heckles of everyone sitting patiently/legally at the lights. What’s not so visible, are the countless cars that might be driving at 35-40 in a 30 zone. Equally illegal, but very difficult for the untrained eye (especially if they’re in a moving car themselves) to detect. Most importantly, it’s also far more lethal.
dafyddp wrote:Going through
I think you mean green and red… with a bit of orange in between.
dafyddp wrote:Going through
I think you mean green and red… with a bit of orange in between.
Black and white is zebra crossings…
Quote:The key problem I have
Sorry but I disagree. I don’t “lose respect” for all motorists when I see one on a phone, speeding, RLJing, failing to indicate or any of the other thousands of misdemeanors that motorists commit daily. Do you “lose respect” for all pedestrians if you see one cross the road on a red man when there’s nothing around?
If my actions don’t impede theirs, don’t have an effect on their day then it’s no concern of theirs. Most of the pavement riding and RLJing in that video was done safely and with consideration to the prevailing conditions. In fact the reason they are doing it in the first place suggests that the infrastructure/junction design is too shit to properly and safely cater for cyclists.
The reason you can do it on a bike is cos you’re effectively an upwardly mobile pedestrian. Cars can’t do it (or bloody shouldn’t) for the simple reason that they’re too big. The fact that I can safely jump a light and get out of the way doesn’t make the blindest bit of difference to the driver stuck 5 cars back.
To be honest, him posting that video is yet another step back for the cycling campaign, another excuse for every Daily Mail reading mouth-breather to have a go (while simultaneously ignoring the hundreds of deaths per year caused by drivers or the general atrocious driving standards in this country).
But the jacket guy was very funny. :))
Is this really someone
Is this really someone complaining about cyclists in York? Honestly, after having moved here from Bristol 6 months ago, cyclists here behave like saints, which says a lot considering how crap most of the infrastructure is.
Integrity is doing the right
Integrity is doing the right thing, even when no one is watching.
C.S. Lewis
I notice this numptie who
I notice this numptie who says anything when right on top of the cyclist giving them no chance to respond, I’d tell the tit to eff off.
Clearly some people feel
Clearly some people feel quite strongly both ways. For my money, very few people were doing a great deal of harm here. Random thoughts.
– Jacket guy was foolish and learnt his lesson. Ouch.
– 1:49 red light jumper was one of the biggest examples of behaving recklessly. He is an idiot.
– The recently confirmed home office advice makes it clear that pavement cycling shouldn’t be considered an offence if no pedestrians are in harm’s way and the cyclist is doing it out of fear of busy traffic – I think most examples here could argue that defence, so where’s the big deal?
– I can understand why drivers aren’t allowed to use mobiles while driving, but pedestrians are absolutely allowed to use them while walking and therefore I really don’t think the phone users away from a road are a big issue.
– In many countries cyclists get a free left on a red light (or a right, depending on the country). It’s not a big deal.
– No-hands-guy was nowhere near any doorways, and wasn’t going that fast. Get over it.
– At 2:29 the DRIVER was turning without checking; yes you should take care but srsly, blaming the cyclist?
CarefulCyclist is a sanctimonious wally. Judging all cyclists on the perceived misbehaviour of a few miscreants is prejudice, and prejudice is ugly, but CarefulCyclist, road.cc, and some commenters here fuel that prejudice and are complicit. The day I consider that the legislation and the infrastructure affords cyclists the respect and protection they deserve, I will have a lot more respect for the letter of the law.
I’m also surprised, and less than impressed that road.cc considers this news.
Respect must be earned.
Respect must be earned.
don simon wrote:Respect must
I recall that idea being a constant bone of contention between teachers and pupils at my old school. Comes up with relation to the police also.
I think its really about the ambiguous meaning of the word “respect”. Everyone deserves a certain type of respect whether they’ve “earned” it or not.
Edit – there’s also the related slight-of-hand involved in suggesting that respect for someone with a given trait depends on all the other people with that trait ‘earning it’. Cyclists are not MPs, we don’t have the capacity to be ‘self policing’ or have a standards committee (that we then ignore!).
Quote: Respect must be
Sorry but that is utter bollocks. Read here as to why:
crazy-legs wrote:Quote:
Thanks fot that crazy-legs, it has done nothing to change my opinion. It has helped me understand why people think they can do as they want and generally treat people badly.
Interestingly, the least respectful bunch I come across on the local cycle paths are other cyclist.
Now I know where this idea is being fuelled.
You keep jumping red lights, blossom, and I’ll not, OK?
don simon wrote:crazy-legs
Thanks fot that crazy-legs, it has done nothing to change my opinion. It has helped me understand why people think they can do as they want and generally treat people badly.
Interestingly, the least respectful bunch I come across on the local cycle paths are other cyclist.
Now I know where this idea is being fuelled.
You keep jumping red lights, blossom, and I’ll not, OK?
If you cant give somebody you’ve never meet before a degree of respect just because their a fellow human being you sound like a very dangerous individual, I hope you don’t drive a car.
To me red light = stop when
To me red light = stop when in a car, but give way carefully when on a bike.
Last clip was a funny one,
Last clip was a funny one, surely this guy has something better to do with his time.
The first junction is obviously used all the time for cyclists filtering as a bypass to those lights, because the grass has failed to grow. Why not just put a small section of road there to let cyclists go through. They are going to do it anyway and I agree with it, as long as they are not just jumping out in front of cars.
As for people riding on the pavement, this has been covered to death, it is almost becoming like the helmet debate.
There are a couple of people using their phone’s while on a footpath, ok, its not wise to be using your phone, but they are not in a built up area with vehicles around. Get over it.
Yeah, CarefulCyclist comes
Yeah, CarefulCyclist comes across as a bit more of an arse than most cyclists in that video.
Didn’t take long for the
Didn’t take long for the Daily Fail to latch onto this video… you should see the frothing at the mouth in the comments… first class daily fail anti-cyclist comments…
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2600627/Cyclist-outraged-fellow-riders-bad-habits-installs-helmet-camera-catches-jumping-red-lights-cutting-motorists-using-mobile-phones.html
York looks nice.
York looks nice.
Meh. Having watched the
Meh. Having watched the video I don’t really see what the point is supposed to be. I regularly see pavement cyclists and red-light-jumpers like some of those, and I usually scowl and think something along the lines of ‘coward!’ (in the first case) or ‘tsk tsk’ (in the second) and then forget it.
Some people don’t behave that well. We know that. And? Is there a point in here anywhere?
In the absence of an explicit one, I can only find one of my own.
A lot of the pavement jockeys would probably not be there if there was better infrastructure. Those going the wrong way down one way roads wouldn’t do it if the one-way layouts weren’t designed for the needs and problems of motor traffic, making cycle trips unnecessarily indirect. And so on.
I think I’d take that as the point – that as things are, (a) its designed to select for young, risk-taking males in the first place, and (b) its designed to incentivise rule-breaking by making cycling fully lawfully both dangerous and inconvenient.
Pavement cyclists, for example, have made the (selfish) choice to reduce their risk at the expense of pedestrians. Sadly that’s human nature, just as motorists will always try and reduce their risk at the expense of those outside the vehicle. If you want to stop that happening you need better law enforcement but most of all a correctly designed physical environment.
Can’t believe I watched that
Can’t believe I watched that all the way through.
Yes the RLJ’s are annoying but the only people they endangered were themselves.
The pavement cyclists were all travelling slowly and represented no danger to pedestrians.
The wrong way cyclists should have walked their bikes of found a way to cycle legally.
Mr Jacket should have read Dr Hutch’s item on removing a jacket in Cycling Weekly a couple of months ago. Only real harm was to his ego.
‘Look no hands’ – look so what!
Mobile phone users. Quiet route, no harm.
In fact the only truly ‘dangerous’ manoeuvre that endangered anyone else was committed by the left-hooking car driver!
Carefulcyclist needs to stop being so anal retentive and get himself a life.
I feel awful because I
I feel awful because I laughed at the final clip of the guy going over the bars…that must’ve really hurt. Do hope he’s okay.
Surely this all boils down to
Surely this all boils down to whether cyclist and/or people who ride bikes want to be seen as an equal user of the road systems or as an entity that shouldn’t be on the roads unless absolutely necessary (in the same vein as pedestrians).
Personally, when I ride my bike on the road I’m a road user and therefore follow the laws and rules of the road. Personally, I don’t like shared use paths where pedestrians are put in harms way, as their safety becomes my responsibility, with them being the more vulnerable user.
I particularly liked seeing Darwin’s Law in full effect at the end though!
Mmmm….person on bike shouts
Mmmm….person on bike shouts at other people on bikes.
Not likely to achieve much positive change.
I see dozens and dozens of
I see dozens and dozens of cyclists every day breaking the law by going through red lights, cycling on pavements to save time, coming out of side roads without giving way, weaving in and out of traffic etc, as if somehow the law does not apply to them just because they can get away with it.
They are often a danger to other cyclists and not just to pedestrians. It’s no wonder we don’t get taken seriously enough when we complain about motorists.
Don Simon: I said nothing
Don Simon: I said nothing about me jumping red lights or breaking the law. I pointed out why respect does not have to be earned. Point well missed.
One rule for motorists,
One rule for motorists, another for cyclists. Cycling without hands is ok, but if that was a motorist, then he would have been crucified on here. Yet, we (cyclists) demand respect and better treatment. Oh, the irony!
Some of the above posts tell me why motorists hate cyclists. Its no surprise if that just gets worse with the sort of posts/attitudes above.
My interpretation is simple, if you share the road with cars, follow the rules. Not that difficult is it? And yes it works both ways.
indyjukebox wrote:One rule
Are those the same rules that motorist religiously follow ?
Point is you get rule breakers on bikes and you get them in cars, we’re just the same as motorist it’s just our form of transport is different. Oh, but despite what the daily mail tells you cyclists do not account for thousands of deaths and serious injuries on the roads that the motorists, and as such they should be held to a higher standard.
Housecathst wrote:indyjukebox
Hence what I said, right above your question.
My point was more about the justification going on above. Don’t try to justify the idiots in the video, just accept that there are a whole bunch of cyclists who are absolute t*ats. Just as there are idiot motorists. But it doesn’t make a lot of the things seen on the video correct, “because they are cyclists/ mobile pedestrians/ motorists speed all the time in a 30 zone etc”.
indyjukebox wrote:Housecathst
Hence what I said, right above your question.
My point was more about the justification going on above. Don’t try to justify the idiots in the video, just accept that there are a whole bunch of cyclists who are absolute t*ats. Just as there are idiot motorists. But it doesn’t make a lot of the things seen on the video correct, “because they are cyclists/ mobile pedestrians/ motorists speed all the time in a 30 zone etc”.— indyjukebox
They justify it for the same reason that if you go on the maxpower forum and look at the videos of irresponsible driving you’ll get people defending it there also. People are people regardless of there form of transport.
Irresponsible cyclists very rarely course any degree of harm to other road user. I agree that cycling could make more of an effort to follow the rules but lets deal with the real problem first, which is motorists.
Yes, a higher standard of
Yes, a higher standard of riding. There are a large number of KSI RTC’s on the road involving cars, but they are big ponderous and hard (as in metal). By riding like morons we only increase the risk to ourselves.
By making sure that our riding is to the highest standards possible we minimize the risks (you can never eliminate them). We should be trying to set a good example, not show the car drivers that we are just as bad as they think!
What is this video for? Yes,
What is this video for? Yes, some riders are inconsiderate road users, just as a proportion of any type of road users are – but I see in this video a number of applications of the Boeteng guidance.
I’m a very experienced rider, but since I started riding with my child I use the pavements (considerately) more and more as the roads around us are to busy, too unsafe and too complex for a child to manage. There is also one junction on my work commute that is generally far safer for me to go through on red, which is exactly what I do if there aren’t any pedestrians crossing.
The vast majority of the time you see a rider on the pavement, going through reds, you’re looking at a rider let down by the infrastructure available to them, infrastructure designed for fast moving motor traffic to the detriment of vulnerable road users.
Sara_H wrote:
I’m a very
My son got knocked down last week by another child riding on the pavement. The boy who ran into my son did have his parents in tow. Thankfully my boy was ok. Let me tell you that I wasn’t too impressed. He has yet to be knocked over by a pedestrian. Interpret that however you want, but I would rather see people riding on the road than posing a danger to my 5 year old. So what you see as considerate use of the pavement, I see as a danger to my child. Why should I have to accept that just so that you and your child can ride on a pavement?
indyjukebox wrote:Sara_H
My son got knocked down last week by another child riding on the pavement. The boy who ran into my son did have his parents in tow.
So what you see as considerate use of the pavement, I see as a danger to my child. Why should I have to accept that just so that you and your child can ride on a pavement?— Sara_H
Then your son has also been let down by the infrastructure. There shouldn’t be any need for this conflict, there should be safe provision for pedestrians, cyclists and drivers. Sadly, planning has focused far too long on the convenience of drivers to the detriment of everyone else’s safety.
Fortunately, collisions like the one your son had involving a pedestrian and a cyclist are rare, he was very unlucky.
Why should you have to accept my son and I riding on the pavement? Because we don’t pose any danger, we don’t incovenience anyone, we ride safely and considerately, to force a child into busy roads with fast moving traffic would be stupid beyond belief.
If you don’t like it, campaign for safer infrastructure that everyone from age 6 to age 96 can use safely.
Sara_H wrote:indyjukebox
My son got knocked down last week by another child riding on the pavement. The boy who ran into my son did have his parents in tow.
So what you see as considerate use of the pavement, I see as a danger to my child. Why should I have to accept that just so that you and your child can ride on a pavement?— indyjukebox
Then your son has also been let down by the infrastructure.
If you don’t like it, campaign for safer infrastructure that everyone from age 6 to age 96 can use safely.— Sara_H
No, the point is that you need to campaign for safer infrastructure for cycling. Not the pedestrian. The pedestrian already has a safe infrastructure. It is the cyclist who makes it unsafe by choosing to ride on a pavement.
Again you pass the buck onto the pedestrian for a lack of cycling infrastructure. That is what bothers me bout everything said above. It is ok as a cyclist to break rules because “we don’t have an adequate infrastructure, or the motorists are horrible people or I am very considerate cyclist” etc etc. Stop with the excuses, man up and learn to do things properly rather than taking short cuts.
indyjukebox wrote:
No, the
Pedestrians don’t have safe infrastructure, how else would you explain why drivers kill c70 pedestrians on the pavement each year and more are killed using crossings.
indyjukebox wrote:
No, the
I mostly agree, but perhaps not entirely.
I agree that you can’t say “it’s OK for the cyclist to break the rules in a way that causes problems for pedestrians, because we don’t have adequate infrastructure”. That’s a bit like saying its OK to bully your children because your boss at work is bullying you. Its not OK to pass on the problem to someone else.
However, it is correct to note that there will _always_ be people in every group who break the rules, and that you are never going to have cops present on every street (and who polices the police anyway!) and so, pragmatically, the best hope of reducing the problems the selfish can cause is by changing the physical environment.
So even back when I was a pedestrian (who didn’t even consider cycling as a possibility) I would have liked to have seen proper cycling infrastructure in place.
The other point is that better cycling infrastructure means more cyclists and fewer drivers, and the reality is that cars are still the bigger threat to pedestrians because they can do so much more damage.
indyjukebox wrote:Sara_H
My son got knocked down last week by another child riding on the pavement. The boy who ran into my son did have his parents in tow.
So what you see as considerate use of the pavement, I see as a danger to my child. Why should I have to accept that just so that you and your child can ride on a pavement?— Sara_H
Then your son has also been let down by the infrastructure.
If you don’t like it, campaign for safer infrastructure that everyone from age 6 to age 96 can use safely.— indyjukebox
No, the point is that you need to campaign for safer infrastructure for cycling. Not the pedestrian. The pedestrian already has a safe infrastructure. It is the cyclist who makes it unsafe by choosing to ride on a pavement.
Again you pass the buck onto the pedestrian for a lack of cycling infrastructure. That is what bothers me bout everything said above. It is ok as a cyclist to break rules because “we don’t have an adequate infrastructure, or the motorists are horrible people or I am very considerate cyclist” etc etc. Stop with the excuses, man up and learn to do things properly rather than taking short cuts.— Sara_H
Not passing the buck, better infrastructure for cyclists will benefit everyone by removing conflict.
Maybe I’m an anarchist, but I don’t blindly follow rules if they put people at risk.
My son and I frequently ride the pavement where the road is unsafe, we doi it without causing risk or inconvenience to others. If we can’t, we get off and walk.
To put ourselves at risk for no reason whatsoever other than blindly obeying the law would be stupid.
I’m a very experienced rider,
I’m a very experienced rider, but since I started riding with my child I use the pavements (considerately) more and more as the roads around us are to busy, too unsafe and too complex for a child to manage. There is also one junction on my work commute that is generally far safer for me to go through on red, which is exactly what I do if there aren’t any pedestrians crossing.
The vast majority of the time you see a rider on the pavement, going through reds, you’re looking at a rider let down by the infrastructure available
What a load of cack- jump a red light and it’s illegal pure and simple any way you try to justify it, I would love someone to show me where it says you can go through a red light if you think it’s generally safer.
This attitude is part if the reason why drivers get wound up and start doing things them selves, where do we draw the line on justifying doing illegal things? Can I carry an automatic rifle cos I walk in places where I feel generally safer with one?I never have and never will jump a red light as I value my life too much. How can it be safer to put yourself at risk crossing a junction when it’s red than with the traffic on green? I bet if you did jump a red light and get hit by a car you would say it’s their fault,
The majority of the time you see a rider going through a red light or riding on the path is because they don’t want to held up by the inconvenience of traffic. God the naff reasoning does my head in. As for respect how about just common courtesy?
This person should not go to
This person should not go to Amsterdam, there almost all cyclists run red lights, ride against traffic, call on their mobile while cycling etc, pedestrians run lights here also. The big thing is you have to be more liberal: what point is there in waiting for a red light when there’s no traffic? what point is there against riding on the footpath to steal a light while not posing any dangers or hindrance.
The real and only point of traffic rules is to make traffic safe and flowing, the person who makes this video’s his grievances are only in his head, because in most cases no danger or hindrance was caused.
Also: in Holland most one way traffic streets are only one way for cars, not for cyclist: the same rules can apply on streets in england also
KnightBiker wrote:what point
Shall we let lorry drivers do the same? Cut red lights and ride on footpaths? Next will you start advocating letting people carry knives?
indyjukebox wrote:KnightBiker
I do hope you don’t mean anything you have typed. if you did, my god…
but to the original quote. I think more to the point is if you want to deter cyclists from jumping red, what is the point of the video that has been put up? it is not educational nor is it helpful. it simply reinforces many people’s opinion that red-light jumping can be done and it is safe at times. if you want to show reasons of not red-light jumping…show something that shocks and that will put people off. not great for viewing but shock tactics will work for a percentage of people, the rest well it will have to be intervention.
my take of the video taker is that he is definitely a moaner of life and has too much self-righteousness and has a massive passive-aggressive personality.
What really annoys me is that
What really annoys me is that some cyclists can do no wrong in the eyes of other cyclists. Some people are far too willing to defend the reckless actions of bad and anti-social riders – they say things like, “Yes, it was bad, but car drivers need to learn too” etc.
Yes, car drivers need to learn, but so do many cyclists. Many, many cyclists. Stop trying to pass the buck, it’s time that we accepted that behaviour like this is not good for the image of cycling.
People that act in the way shown in the video will give the anti-cycling lobby more fuel for their hate and rants, and yes, many more car drivers will lose what respect they have for us.
I entered an event a number of years ago – and I was shocked to see just how many supposed serious cyclists flouted the rules of the road and the highway code. It wasn’t even a timed event, but a charity one. Yet riders still took massive risks shooting red lights, not waiting for suitable gaps at traffic islands etc. I was so horrified at what I had seen that I have not entered that event again. I have seen it in so many others I’ve ridden (admittedly not to the same extent).
It’s time we took a good look at ourselves and realised that we are not as perfect as we would like to think we are – and car drivers aren’t as bad as we think they are.
Rich
All behaviour I’ve seen
All behaviour I’ve seen recently in Belgium, no-one seems to give a wotsit. In fact much is expected/anticipated.
Dear god! Some comments are
Dear god! Some comments are so sad, all those perfect perfect drivers and riders who never make errors on the road never jump red lights, forget to indicate and most certain never kill people and get a smack on the wrist. No I don’t jump red lights unless there traffic activated, because I might be there all day! So hold on.. I do jump red lights don’t i? But I never ride on the pavement! Well unless it’s a flooded road or there is broken glass on the road.. Oops I do ride on the road don’t i?
I simply do not accept that there are any perfect cyclists or drivers, we ALL make mistakes or take the safe option sometimes. Even careful cyclist acted unwisely taking his hand from his bars to point and shout at other road users, or is it ok if you are perfect?
I suspect that most drivers who get aggressive think they are perfect drivers and everyone else is awful! unfortunately it’s spreading to the cycling community, what’s that biblical saying, let he without sin cast the first stone.
I’m not saying bad riding is right but please don’t be conned in to thinking we are any worse than drivers we defiantly are not.
As for kids on pavement I will continue to let my 7 year old ride with supervision on the pavement as I have yet to see evidence of people being thrown six feet in to the air resulting in a brain injury or death from a cyclist riding on the pavement unless u want to be silly and talk about 30mph professional cycling accidents.
IMO it’s all back to front, give pedestrians right of way then bikes then cars then HGVs not the other way round machines appear to have greater priority than people. With great power comes responsibility so if you have a ten tone vehicle I think your responsibility to behave properly is greater than a ten kg bike, I know which will do the most damage.
I’m surprised that anyone
I’m surprised that anyone tries to justify going through red lights, as ‘why wait if there is no traffic’. You wait because the lights are red which means stop. If all road users took that attitude, then it would be chaos. If it’s ok for cyclists to go through red lights, then it should be ok for other road users too.
Irresponsible cyclists can cause collisions through other road users having to avoid them. It doesn’t make it ok because you’re on a bike instead of in a motor vehicle. Most motorists are no more of a problem than most cyclists. It’s the ones who ride or drive as if they have the right to do so however they like who cause problems to all road users out there.
Now you’ve done it! Lead
Now you’ve done it! Lead story on the Daily Mail app. All the rabid anti-cyclist “entitled” drivers are out in force. Sigh.
i hate headcam wankers.
they
i hate headcam wankers.
they should be banned people strap one on and think they are the law and own the road.
but the guy with the coat, priceless! i mean who wears a wifebeater under a wool lined coat?
have to go with some of the
have to go with some of the comments posted…the video is pointless, other than the hilarity of the last guy face planting into the tarmac.
red light jumping offences…most of the time the junction is quiet, the cyclist can simply jump off the bike and push across the road, which is completely legal and would have caused no issues. only issue is they are pedalling, so what’s the big deal.
one way street…quite a wide road to fit cars and road. i would guess they chose to go up one way road because the natural cycling route is a detour which doesn’t necessarily get them to where they need to go. maybe these roads should have cycle lanes installed that allow bi-direction travel for bikes. like a lot of busy town centres.
pavement cycling…government has set guide lines on this, long as you are not endangering anyone then it shouldn’t be seen as a problem. the video captured during rush hour it would appear and I would suspect some of the offenders aren’t comfortable with filters through traffic. the royal mail man may well be going to every door on that side of the road. I shan’t think I would like to push a bike loaded with parcels and letters all the way down the road and he was going ever so slow so no harm there.
Oh also weaving in and out of traffic is called “Filtering” and this is one of the advantages of having a bike as we can squeeze between traffic and get ahead of slow or stationary motor vehicles…it is entirely legal! so if you are sitting there in a car going no where and crying about the fact then ditch the car and get on a bike.
mobile phone usage…quiet cycle path, no one around, no issues.
cycling without hands…ok, not having 100% control, give you that. but seriously, do you want to see these sort of behaviour being put on the same agenda as dangerous drive causing death??? really.
I think the video maker needs to get his priority right and maybe declare his Daily Mail royalty.
Quote:
red light jumping
It’s cycling across a road where the light is red FFS!, you cannot seriously tell me pushing a bike across is the same as cycling so what’s the big deal? ITS AGAINST THE LAW
So in your way of thinking if I am driving and the road detours away from where I need to be I can just nip up the nearest one way street the wrong way as it wouldn’t otherwise get me where I need to be, I mean is that the best reason you can come up with? It is simple if you ride a bike drive a car or whatever we have highway laws which apply to everyone not just drivers etc so stop trying to advocate breaking the law with weak poor thought out justifications
So in your own statement the guidelines say if it isn’t likely to endanger others it’s ok but in rush hour doesn’t that become more likely to endanger others? if you don’t feel safe riding in traffic fair enough go on the path and push your bike until you can ride without endangering others.
Let me ask one question where in a lane should a bicycle be? I am pretty sure it isn’t wherever the cyclist feels like cos he is filtering
Just plain stupid do you think we should text whilst riding as well? But only if it’s quiet?
No but you are incharge of a vehicle and in essence are operating it carelessly; what if for the sake of the example you were riding without hands and lost control and veered into traffic and were killed would that be the fault of the other party? Of course not you had no control. But then I guess they should have been more aware and accepted more responsibility.
Stereotyping don’t you just love it? In the same way I love getting tarred with the brush that I jump red lights.
I hate the broadsheets and do not read any paper but I think that there is a group of individuals on here who feed their descriminations and do more harm than good to cyclists across the span. If you want to run red lights,ride up one way streets on the footpath weaving in and out of traffic; whilst phoning or tweeting or whatever whilst not having your hands on the handlebars good for you. At some point it will go wrong, epically wrong. But then I guess you can always blame the infrastructure.
Oddly enough, it would seem
Oddly enough, it would seem to be that some people should get out less……
He’s achieved nothing except
He’s achieved nothing except a “Reckless York cyclists flout the law” headline in the York populist press. His videos about drivers and pedestrians got no coverage. Poor work, not helpful, naive fellow.
Given that helmet cams and
Given that helmet cams and Internet video sites are a relatively modern phenomenon, it can be filed under Cyclist Uses New Technology or an appropriate acronym thereof.
There is some spectacular
There is some spectacular hysteria on this thread. I was having a fairly miserable morning but after reading some of the comments on here I’m now just super glad I’m not some of you.
Roboplegic wrongcocks, to borrow a phrase.
Tell you what though, if that
Tell you what though, if that guy or someone like him started filming others and getting shouty about it like this round where I live I doubt it’d be long before he’d get a smack. I don’t condone violence but I’ve no time for this self-appointed judge of all things cycling either.
24 hours later, and the
24 hours later, and the jacket clip is still funny.
bikebot wrote:24 hours later,
Very true. =))
Riding along a narrow one-way
Riding along a narrow one-way street the wrong way or red light jumping is annoying, but that’s their decision to break the law and put themselves at risk.
So some cyclists in York were riding like fools. I don’t feel any reason to feel guilty about their behaviour, or to feel that it affects me.
I like to think that I am a rational (-ish) human being, and I can separate one from many: I don’t think all bus drivers are insane just because of the actions of one of them, nor white van drivers, nor SUV drivers, NOR CYCLISTS.
It looks more like “Dumb &
It looks more like “Dumb & dumber” than “Groundhog day” =))
I had stopped watching
I had stopped watching through boredom, so thanks for pointing out the jacket clip, it’s comedy gold, a beautifully layered piece, from the jacket/vest combo to the grunt of impact, perfect.
More of this stuff and less tedious footage of people going about their business, much of which would be perfectly normal in the Netherlands. Ooh ooh! look, shes using a phone and has a some shopping hanging from her handlebars, get her.
It’s now on Yahoo as “Cyclist
It’s now on Yahoo as “Cyclist Video Guaranteed To Infuriate”.
You can argue RLJ “gives us all a bad name”, but it’s nothing compared to making up little press pack videos of bad cycling for tabloid consumption. What did CarefulCyclist imagine would happen?
^ Nail.Head
It pales in
^ Nail.Head
It pales in comparison to the number of MV registrations floating around on YT though ; )
What a twat CarefulCyclist
What a twat CarefulCyclist is.
Massively agree with everyone
Massively agree with everyone saying this vid is pointless.
It’s also damaging, and only really serves to stir the pot even more.
Since it’s release I’ve had about three people post it to my Facebook wall with the hidden implication of “see what you people have done!?” – not least had countless colleagues pipe up with “Have you seen that video?” Followed by inane criticism of why cyclists should stop to let busses past etc etc etc etc etc etc.
SIGH. Videotrolls.
I was thinking what a waste
I was thinking what a waste of 3 minutes of my life until I saw the face plant. lmfao :))
Funny how the film maker is
Funny how the film maker is getting more blame than the people in the film.
Scoob_84 wrote:Funny how the
He’s the one damaging my safety, not them.
vbvb wrote:Scoob_84
No its the bad cyclists flouting the hgihway code doing that
Scoob_84 wrote:vbvb
Well they both are and neither are. I don’t think its fair to hold either responsible for the irrational way others choose to react to it.
I think on reflection this
I think on reflection this video has raised a valid point around blame.
Do you know what, there are some people out there who are doing some stupid and dangerous stuff on bikes… this video is a great demonstration of the sort of behaviour that is going on around us all the time…
Its true, cyclists aren’t perfect.
There, its done, the ‘cat’ is out of the bag.
With that admissions, can we move on? Instead of blaming each other, RLJ’s or whatever for the tiny minority of drivers that behave awfully around cyclists who in turn blame our attitudes to justify their actions, can we look for a uniformed response to…
“you cyclists, you think you are so superior, but actually, you are the bane of the roads’.
The answer is not ensuring everyone rides perfectly, its negating the argument in the first place… Just because a drug enriched teenager rides the wrong way up a one way street swigging cider and chatting on his phone, does not mean my kids should be put in a situation where their father is taken away from them.
In any other context this would not be accepted… replace the term cyclist, with woman, gay, black etc etc and you’d see how ugly the argument that ‘we’ all have to behave properly or ‘we’ deserve it’ is.
Its time we moved on.
Bugger me, its a happy place
Bugger me, its a happy place here isn’t it?
Frankly I think anyone who
Frankly I think anyone who believes the law applies to me but not to them is an ar$e and whether either of us is driving a car, riding a bike or sitting on a sofa is irrelevant.
Are the risks worth it?
(|:
Are the risks worth it? Probably.
And it’s not illegal to use your phone whilst cycling. It’s a non-motorised vehicle. Also cycling on pavements is not against the law in some areas of Scotland.
Liberty
undoubtedly as cycling
undoubtedly as cycling becomes more popular, so will the number of idiot cyclists increase. The only solution will be to police cycling more. If necessary create new laws to criminalize obviously dangerous behaviour. Just because there are bad drivers this does not excuse bad cyclists. Those who love cycling should condemn , not condone, the wanton acts of stupidity this person has filmed. I’m glad the guy taking his coat off wasn’t badly hurt, eg run over. I hope he wont be so dumb again.
That helmet guy is a pleb,
That helmet guy is a pleb, thanks for jacket guy though
Anyone else notice how the
Anyone else notice how the jacket guy hits his head really hard, and WASNT wearing a helmet?
I’m taking this as “proof” and counter argument to the usual anecdote garbage from some cyclists that have hit their head, but the helmet *definitely* saved their life
sfichele wrote:Anyone else
You MUST be seeing things.
However, you can’t take it as proof. You can take it as part of evidence to support your case….
EDIT: deleted
EDIT: deleted
He isn’t seeing anything,
He isn’t seeing anything, he’s right.
To me it looks like he lands more on his upper back / neck area so debate that away helmet worshippers…
Fucking prick filming
Fucking prick filming everything like a cunt. Get a life.
Maybe they were all going for
Maybe they were all going for KOMs. No one gets in the way of a KOM.
Stupid video, common sense
Stupid video, common sense prevails, I live in Bridgwater, Somerset.
I ride a lot, generally most cars drive too fast and attitudes to cyclist is poor to aggressive. Regardless how you ride.
I cycle a main trunk road to work Bristol Road (every week people are hit off there, several in work have been knocked off, one hurt badly, the driver didn’t stop and was never caught) its a death trap for cyclists, as is Taunton Road. The pavement is usually the only safe place…
The more aggressive you are as a rider or positive, the safer you are, I always wear a helmet, ride with a bright yellow reflective jacket and lights and still get swiped( I don’t mean generally aggressive)
I’m not going to be bait or a statistic.
Mark
Stupid video, common sense
Stupid video, common sense prevails, I live in Bridgwater, Somerset.
I ride a lot, generally most cars drive too fast and attitudes to cyclist is poor to aggressive. Regardless how you ride.
I cycle a main trunk road to work Bristol Road (every week people are hit off there, several in work have been knocked off, one hurt badly, the driver didn’t stop and was never caught) its a death trap for cyclists, as is Taunton Road. The pavement is usually the only safe place…
The more aggressive you are as a rider or positive, the safer you are, I always wear a helmet, ride with a bright yellow reflective jacket and lights and still get swiped( I don’t mean generally aggressive)
I’m not going to be bait or a statistic.
So bollox to gentlemanly conduct, you jeopodise my safety you be getting it
Mark
Salmoning – wrong-way cycling
Salmoning – wrong-way cycling has become widespread. It’s stupid and dangerous. I’m quite happy for the Police to stop any stupidity by cyclists, but they mustn’t just focus on cyclists. They need to pull and prosecute all those incompetent-dangerous drivers out there.
Having recently seen a TV programme about drivers who have obtained a licence other than by the traditional and official route – education, training, and examination, but instead via deception / impersonation etc., I would like to see all motorists involved in traffic violations subjected to compulsory testing.
This might explain why I encounter so many utterly clueless-incompetent drivers out there.
zzzzz
zzzzz
Brilliant! It’s like a crazy
Brilliant! It’s like a crazy urban circus and certainly like any day on the streets of Bristol.
On a positive note, it’s
On a positive note, it’s great to see so many people choosing to get around by bike. If 1 RLJing pavement cyclist = 1 less car that can only be considered a good thing. Lets not get too distracted by minor infringments of the law.