Cyclist ordered to pay over £1,000 for riding bike in town centre – after council accused of targeting “old and slow”

I agree.

[Snip]
" ...then my copy of the incredibly helpful & informative "Protect & Survive"
[Snip]

Been a while since I last saw a copy of that.
Along with its excellent companion "Survive to Fight".

Oldfatgit wrote:

[Snip] " ...then my copy of the incredibly helpful & informative "Protect & Survive" [Snip] Been a while since I last saw a copy of that. Along with its excellent companion "Survive to Fight".

I've still got a copy of the Millennium Bug pamphlet that the Govt handed out.

brooksby wrote:

Oldfatgit wrote:

[Snip] " ...then my copy of the incredibly helpful & informative "Protect & Survive" [Snip] Been a while since I last saw a copy of that. Along with its excellent companion "Survive to Fight".

I've still got a copy of the Millennium Bug pamphlet that the Govt handed out.

Wow!  In (checks time on old PC) 1923 that's long obsolete!

Was a Young Ones reference, but I do have a digital copy of it somewhere.  

Stephankernow wrote:

We as road users must obey the law, I cycle and drive and i am sick of cyclists lycra clad normally who go whizzing passed me at red traffic lights, Who seem to think you do not need to indicate on junctions expecially when turning left or at roundabouts? That a sign saying one way street or no cyclists does apply to us? People riding without lights and riding in all black or dark colours in twilight or at night. If we want respect we need to show respect and their is a sizable minority of us that dont expecially in urban areas. We need to do these things and if not the culprits should be fined and righly so. If i drive at night without lights im fined, If i jump red lights or drive up a 1 way street im fined. When we are cycling its no different wether its me on my Pashley or any other cyclists. I

You first few words make a lot of sense but, undortunately, the rest of your comment comes across as what I'd call driver-centric - by which I mean that attitude where a driver as an individual is called out of they do something wrong but cyclists as a collective tend to cop the flak for the wongdoing of an individual cyclist.

tootsie323 wrote:

by which I mean that attitude where a driver as an individual is called out of they do something wrong but cyclists as a collective tend to cop the flak for the wongdoing of an individual cyclist.

AKA out-group homogeneity bias.

Stephankernow wrote:

I cycle

Hmm an 8 post wonder.

Secret_squirrel wrote:

Stephankernow wrote:

I cycle

Hmm an 8 post wonder.

 

I have cycled to work for 40 years how about you? The mystery machine i think you need Velma to help you out.

One thing that is clear cut and black and white here, is the fact that while, yes technically the cyclist was due a fine, the scale of this is outrageous. The cynic in me also reckons this is more about a council getting some of their figures up to look good.

The rest of your nonsense though is far from clear cut, and is litte more than opinonated whataboutery. Cycling in London, I certainly see a fair number of unwarranted red light jumping, but then again I see a lot of drivers do the same, more in my local area. On the flipside there are a couple of places out of london locally where I will myself go through a red as a matter of my own safety, as in these instances the road is clear for me, and in the worse case where I did hold back, I had a driver overtake as the lights changed and then cut across me to turn left nearly wiping me out.

"If i drive at night without lights im fined, If i jump red lights or drive up a 1 way street im fined."

And? So are cyclists. Do you see every driver who breaks the law get fined, no. 

*Edited for a typo. Hope that is Ok!

Love the last line; made me chuckle.

Rather ironically, most of the cyclists I see riding like twats *aren't* in lycra.

They are either in standard soft clothes on hire bikes, or work for fast food delivery.

Maybe you might want to readdress your misplaced rant to them.

At any ! I can only tell you what i see.

Stephankernow wrote:

At any ! I can only tell you what i see.

And your judgement and opinion.

Thanks for your reportage - but you've then declared that some swallows make a summer.  To be specific you've linked "I see cyclists breaking the law" and judgements that "there are too many doing it", "there is a cyclist collective / criminal group - at least in people's minds (to which I don't belong)", "it's *your* responsibility (especially on road.cc!) somehow to right this lawbreaking" and finally "because that will 'win respect' " from drivers" (and presumably make the world a safer / better place).

Nobody's saying you haven't seen Bad Cyclists.  The judgments / opinions that come after are increasingly questionable so I and others have questioned them.

Mt Suburb has escaped from Tunbridge Wells.

Ha ha ha where i live is in my name Kernow i suppose your Mr Sanctimonious of Islington?

I'm genuinely delighted to hear that cycling has grown so much down in the South West - where it is very beautiful (must revisit) but which is rural with "unfriendly roads" with some of the worst visibility in the UK and presumably some dodgy surfaces, lots of extremely steep gradients, some very changeable weather etc.

Meanwhile in Edinburgh - where those things are very moderate* I am usually the only cyclist waiting at the lights.  That is not because others are speeding past me either, just not many cycling.  (We do have the usual salient food delivery riders doing it wrong some places though).

* Some of our road surfaces rival the worst in the UK for quality though.

chrisonatrike wrote:

Meanwhile in Edinburgh - where those things are very moderate* 

* Some of our road surfaces rival the worst in the UK for quality though.

Sadly true IME, and particularly bad given it's a relatively wealthy city with a moderate climate (although I suppose you could say that about many parts of the UK).

Edinburgh makes a pretty good potential cycling city - tourist-focussed centre, some helpful demographics (e.g. university), not too sprawling, moderate climate etc.  The council is no longer asleep exactly - although it's still a bit dozy (with not a few active travel nightmares sadly).  Yes the city is hilly in places but there's plenty of flat parts.

We have a great inheritance of old railway lines which have been repurposed as totally traffic free routes.  These are mostly fast to use and attractive environments to be in.  Unfortunately I think this contributes to the council's complacency.  Worse - instead of developing this as the central part of a genuine network it seems they're viewing these as resource to "fix transport" by adding tram lines.  In the final analysis that is probably sensible.  However there doesn't seem to be a good plan - or possibly any - to replace this brilliant active travel resource with anything half as decent.

With e.g. CCWEL, Roseburn to the canal (hmm... canal paths...), Leith Connections etc. I hope we are getting to the "London about a decade or so ago" stage.  Where they've grasped that a minimum quality of infra is needed AND it has to be convenient AND there needs to be lots - to connect wherever people want to go.

I agree that we  (cyclists) need to show respect and abide by the law. 
However, in this instance the issue was the huge fines that were being dished out to "easy target" cyclists. Surely a simple fixed penalty ticket of say £10 would be more appropriate?

I do however find your comments stereo-typical and rather naive.

As cyclist with over 50,000 cycling miles, 100,000 motorcycling miles and 500,00 car driving miles under my belt (including many years of long cycle commutes through towns and cities, such as London), my experience says that the cyclists that jump lights are least likely to be wearing Lycra. In my experience the "Lycra Clad" cyclists tend to be law abiding. 

I won't counter every one of your examples, and like you, I really do wonder what inspries cyclists to wear dark colours, especially at night.

You say that if you drive (a car) at night without lights, jump red lights or drive (the wrong way) up a one way street that you are fined. That is not true. There is a risk of being fined, but you have to be caught first, and even then it's likely you'd just get a warning. I see car drivers doing it all the time without attracting a fine. 

Yes, cyclists should indicate, but sometimes it is safer to keep your hands on the handlbars. There again, there are plenty of car drivers that don't know how to indicate either. Does that annoy you as well?

They do seem somewhat obsessed by signalling.

Probably explode watching drivers on Reading's larger roundabouts.

Ynotmi wrote:

However, in this instance the issue was the huge fines that were being dished out to "easy target" cyclists. Surely a simple fixed penalty ticket of say £10 would be more appropriate?

It wouldnt have been a huge fine if she had paid up on the FPN.  Only a bit excessive at £100.   

She either challenged the FPN or ignored it otherwise it wouldnt have gone near court.  Frankly if you choose to take something as trivial as this to court you're either stupid or deserve the random act of judgery you're likely to get.  Is it fair - no.  But its unlikely to be biased against cyclists at this point, more just luck of the draw.