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Ribble R872 105SE vs Planet X ProCarbon SRAM Rival?
I've just started getting into Sportives and am currently riding a 2016 Cube Attain. No problems with the bike but I am thinking of taking advantage of the bike to work scheme to make an upgrade, as it's the only way my wife will let me spend a £1000 on a bike and spending any more money on significant upgrades is also out. Two options seem to make sense at the current prices:
- The Ribble R872 105SE which seems to have a very well reviewed frame, albeit with a few complaints of a lack of compliance on longer rides, full 105 groupset and what appears to be a very basic set of Rodi Airline 5 Wheels. I'd guess that Ribble's thought process is that these would be the first thing to be upgraded but as mentioned above, it's pretty unlikely I'll get to upgrade them. another downside is I'd have to pay an additional £100 Admin fee, so save money from the tax man but pay it to Ribble instead.
- The Planet X ProCarbon is a bit lighter and has a better set of wheels, Vision 35's, and a more compliant frame but there is just no up to date review available. It has a full SRAM Rival groupset(I am not bothered about if I have Shimano or SRAM). On the downside there are a few mentions on Forum posts that the bike suffers from high speed wobble at speeds over 40mph (I am not sure I've even gone that fast yet!) and that the front fork is a little springy when sprinting.
I am 40 years old, 5ft10 and currently weigh 14st (that is going down but I doubt I'll ever weigh less than 13). I am looking to enter short and middle distance sportives next year, with maybe one longer distance one and will probably join a cycle club next year. And of course I'll be riding it to work!!
Any constructive advice welcome, particularly if you have experience of the bikes in question. If you do have alternatives to offer please remember I can only buy through the bike 2 works vouchers so please don't suggest anything that cannot be purchased that way or costs more than a grand, regardless of how brilliant it is.
If you're new please join in and if you have questions pop them below and the forum regulars will answer as best we can.
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The cycle scheme C2W voucher, I applied today, does seem to be able to be used for accessories only. If the Tory Cuts don't make cu*ts then in 12 or 18 months time use your next voucher for wheels
I was considering doing that with this voucher as my Cannondale is on stock wheels and looks wise (as in they appear cheap, never ridden an expensive wheels etc to say these are crap) they're definitely the weakest point. However, it was my first full carbon, first decent groupset so it's already a flyer - want to smash another year or 18 months out of these wheels first
Yes you can use the c2w voucher for accessories only, I've just ordered a wheelset through the voucher.
Thanks for the steer towards DCR, Kieron. Definitely a very viable alternative to the Hunt Wheels for when the time comes.
My 2016 105 (58cm frame) weighed about 8.5kg with bottle cages & GPS mount.
I've upgraded the wheels to a pair of DT Swiss RR21's & it's now pretty much bang on 8kg.
I did look at the B'twin's. They certainly offer excellent componentry but they need to do that to get the weight down because the frame and fork are relatively heavy. To compare the Cannondale frame is 1098g compared to the 1200g of the Dolan and the B'twin weighs in at 1400g. A similar story with the forks; CAAD12 is 339g and the B'twin is 550g (I could not find out the Dolan weight).
That's not to say the B'twin is a bad bike but the frame is a little limited for upgrading plus I'd doubt the B'twin would hold it's value if I wanted to sell it on.
I did post about decalthlon Btwin bikes earlier but as a new poster, my comment was delayed for approval, so when it did appear the converation had moved on.
Have ou considered Decathlon's BTWIN brand? The aluminium frame is well reviewed. I have the £800 with shimano 105 AF 900 on my shortlist and plan to upgrade the wheels with a set of handbuilts form DCR Wheels. For £1050, they have the same frame with ultergra groupset and mavic cosmic elite wheels.
https://www.decathlon.co.uk/ultra-720-af-road-bike-ultegra-id_8331274.html
If you want carbon, they are also have a £800 carbon frame with tiagra (I think) groupset
I looked at radon, rose, canyon German bike brands as well as dolan. I am leaning towards BTWIN as a store is about 45 minutes from me and reports are very good regarding customer service
alansmurphy, I am still on the lookout for a company not charging a 10% admin fee but I am awaiting a reply from an email to Wheelsbase who have the CAAD12 at £999, do the bike2work scheme and don't mention the admin fee. Hopefully they won't charge the admin fee which would make the Cannondale a much more attractive choice.
Punches, pretty sure you could get the Cannondale at the price you've seen with £0 admin and at a shop where you could sit and test for size. Both of these make significant differences to your budget.
As a Cannondale convert I agree with the assessment above and trawl the Internet, spec for money it wins hands down and that's at full RRP. However, the paragraph below in your post tells us you don't love it. Therefore unless you can get a proper test ride and fall in love with the performance, you can't buy it. You'll always wonder about "the other one..."
It's a shame you've discounted Ribble. Here's a review I left for them on Trust Pilot :
Well that's a real lesson in great customer service completed by Ribble Cycles in Preston. Just returned home from meeting one of their team in Worcester to take delivery of a replacement frame.
Basically I've had a nightmare last two months with the same part failing on my bike (press fit bottom bracket for those who know about these things) causing excessive wear in my BB shell in my existing frame. They initially swapped my frame - which in it's own right was great service.
When the part failed again after 100 miles I called them expecting a bit of a battle to correct it. Instead their service manager insisted on swapping the frame over to a different specification frame. This resulted in them having to also replace a number of other parts too.
Due to me riding towards Bath tomorrow morning to take part in the London 100 this weekend Ben from Ribble insisted on dropping the bike down to me in his own time so I didn't have my weekend plans ruined! They've ensured my future loyalty as a customer by exceeding my expectations and truly going the extra mile.
I've used Ribble since the old shop in Watery Lane in Preston (apart from a gap of 20 years when my cycling bug disappeared) - I'd go nowhere else in future after this episode.
From someone who has owned 4 x Ribbles, both carbon and alloy, and a PX carbon, Go for the CAAD12!- just a better bike by far. Especially at this time of year when it is just as cheap, or cheaper than the Ribble and Planet X offerings , which are as old as the hills in any case.
Even if they were half the price of the Cannondale I still wouldn't want them.
I think I have pretty much ruled out the Planet X and the Ribble now. It is looking like a straight up choice between the Cannondale and the Dolan. According to reviews the Cannondale should be the 1st choice. It's a lighter frame than the Dolan, and lighter overall and still has a few areas where I could make significant weight savings at a later date but I hate the aesthetics of the bike with that near horizontal top tube, massive seat stays and little seat post showing. It just looks like such an old mans bike! I'm also not keen on the non Shimano Groupset cranks and chainrings just because I have had these on two previous Spesh Mountain bikes and they ended up being nothing but trouble. (Son of Strongarm cranks rounding out and falling off in a race due to a weakness in the alloy and some chainrings that seemed to take forever to shift) I think I'd getter better customer service from Dolan and a solid bike that fitted me exactly plus something that was a little more unique than the Dale if not quite as good and would be supporting a British bike company rather than a big US/Canadian conglomerate. There is still a possibility that something cheaper comes around as 2017 bikes get cleared so I am keeping on the lookout.
Planet X replied to my email again today but still no definitive answer on the admin fee because they did not know what the voucher amount would be. I have responded it would be the full amount so we will see what they come back with. Interestingly they said it depended upon the scheme and the voucher amount as to what commission the scheme operator charges so the admin fee really is ,at least in part, an additional payment to cover this extra commission cost which is why the percentage charged for the admin fee varies. I don't think it affects my decision at all but if I was to by a Dolan with cash I'd think you'd be able to ask for a bit of extra discount since I'd know that they were making a little more profit than they would via a cycle to work voucher.
Pricing wise:
Dolan L'etape SRAM Rival at £1049.99:
Cannondale CAAD12 on sale at £999.99, there are a couple of retailers now at this price
The Planet X ProCarbon SRAM Rival at £999.99 is a little awkward to work out because of the fitting. They have retul bike fitting and at £125, or £75 on a Planet bike you already own. it is a relative bargain compared with the costs around here of £200-250. If there was a way of getting the fitting done for £75 it'd be worth it as I'd never spend £200-£250 down here on one. Without the fitting it is basically take a guess on sizing or visit the shop 6 hours drive away for some advice from the sales staff.
Making my decision on this is harder than buying a car!
I saw an Old forlorn ProCarbon at work today, fully Ultegra equipped but with a rusty rear mech and a saddle that looked like a dog had attacked it! Somebody loved that once.
I am still leaning towards the Dolan but if anyone sees an significantly good price reductions on 2017 Carbon frames come along then let me know.
I figured I'd probably be a medium on a Planet X frame too. I have a 31" inside leg. My current Cube Attain is a 56 which the retailer recommended for someone of my height. If anything I'd say it was fractionally too big although I think this can be pretty easily resolved by dropping down the stem size on it to an 80mm and maybe teaking the bars up a little.
It's one of the reasons I'd like to get a proper bike fit for the new bike. The Cube is great for the money but it needs a few tweaks and a couple of quid spent on it to get it feeling just right. Avoiding those extra costs and getting it near right first time makes a lot of sense.
Sorry just re-read - at 5'10" I'd say you're likely to be Medium in Planet X unless you're all leg...
How tall are you, what's your inside leg and do you generally want a tall or short bike (tall being slightly higher front end, short meaning showing a fair bit of seat post)?
PlanetX got back to me today. I can visit the showroom and try bikes out on a turbo trainer but no taking them out for a spin. They tell me the admin fee is variable depending on who runs the scheme. I was sure I told them it was Bike2Work but I have responded so they can tell me how much it is. As far as fitting is concerned they would do a basic fitting if I visited which would get me to pretty much the right size, I could then order the bike on click and collect, then return for a full retul fit. At the moment it does not sound too different from Ribble's or Dolan's offer but at least with Dolan I have no admin fee to pay and I could do all the fitting in the one visit. I'll wait to see what the admin fee is like.
I had seen the Eastway Emitter R3 before, It looks a solid spec at this price point and at 8.2kg the lightest bike with the frame being a couple of 100g's lighter than the Dolan. Not that 200g matters too much to me and the weight isn't on the wheels were it'd probably hurt more (actually around 380g difference as far as I can tell but I would have the SRAM Rival groupset on the L'etape which would save around 190g). As negatives, and this is a personal thing but I hate the Blue/Blue colour scheme, it would have been nice to have two options to choose and reviews seem to swing wildy in opinion about the ride. As far as Wiggle go I'll need to look into their returns policy on bike 2 work but it is unfortunately another retailer that seems to only offer their 30 day trial on normal purchases and then we are back into the argument of at least having seen the bike in the flesh and preferably having a ride before.
Still feel like the Dolan or the CAAD12 are my best options but there is still time to see what crops up as 2017 bikes start to get cleared out for 2018.
Eastway Emitter R3 from wiggle matches your spec at £1039. Seems to get good reviews. Maybe worth checking out.
I do have a little sympathy with Ribble and Planet X - I believe there are issues at play with the C2W scheme and margin. As you say the admin is rubbish but the hassle for virtually no profit probably just doesn't make it worth it.
The bike fit should be less of an issue, if you're comfy on your current bike you should be able to get the dimensions and compare. You really shouldn't be paying money for someone to tell you a bike will fit, and the adjustments in stem, saddle etc. are all pretty straightforward.
My C2W fun is becoming more fun... I fancy my n+1 being a Cannondale Slate Apex which is down from 1700 to just under 1200 and in stock by Cycle Store. Their website says they don't offer C2W on discount bikes only the full RRP and have had conflicting info between their Web and Shop people. This doesn't surprise me though, being just 8 miles form their store and 8.1 from their warehouse I wanted something that was online and they wouldn't let me collect from warehouse or walk it the few hundred yards to the shop, despite them willing to deliver for free. Time was of the essence for a sportive and their solution was they stocked them in the shop at around 30% more. That's another sale they lost!
Well a bit more Ribble news today. A couple of emails pinned about but basically Ribble just reiterated their position, they are just unwilling to budge on the £100 admin fee at all. Paraphrasing here but they claim that as they are a direct to customer manufacturer they do not have any excess margin, compared to Evans (their example) to be able to absorb any of the costs of the bike2work scheme and that it costs them the £100 to administer the scheme. They also seem to think it reasonable to not offer any test ride or refund to bike2work customers but only an exchange for another bike should I be unhappy. I told them that I would not be making a purchase with them as they had left me no way of forming a value judgement about their bike, except from reviews etc. (which don't really set them apart from their competitors) and that their £100admin fee constituted very poor value for money. I also told them I'd tell of my experiences via social media, forums etc.
To be fair to them they have responded quickly to every email and I have no problem with the people I have dealt with at Ribble but their company policies let them down. I think if I was an easy, pay by card purchaser I wouldn't have had the problems, I could have used their 30day return if I was not happy with the bike and the admin fee would not have been a problem.
Planet X started to reply from my resubmitted email by responding that I was now registered with their helpdesk and their goal is to respond to all enquiries within 48 hours. Not a great start so far.
At the moment I'd say that without having test ridden them yet that my preference would be:
1st choice. Dolan L'etape with SRAM Rival (in lurid black and green)
2nd choice. Cannondale CAAD12 (a lot will depend on what price this eventually gets down to and the bike2work scheme conditions from the retailer. Hopefully I can test one next week)
3rd choice. Planet X Pro carbon
In the meantime my chip as chips 2016 Cube Attain is doing the job. It was an absolute steal at £375, I slapped some better cartridge pads on it and a cheap set of SPD pedals and will make a fine winter training bike once I get some more puncture resistant tyres on it and some mudguards.
Interesting as I am in the same boat - kind of.
I commute 26 miles round trip and was looking for a bike to replace my 2005 fuji track as I would like gears to do the odd longer ride. The fuji has been fine with 25c wheels for my commuting but not so great for hills.
I like the look of the ribble CGR but have the same reservations as others. I also wonder if in reality I will actually bother with panniers or changing narrow / wide tyres? I also like the dolans but hate the colours. A solid red or blue etc would suit me.
It' s my first post on the forums so not sure if Btwin is a bad word but I have shortlisted the £800 triban 560 CF (tiagra) and the Aluminium Ultra 900 AF (105). I have £1000 voucher and will use the £200 change for a new helmet and some 28c contenentals.
https://www.decathlon.co.uk/C-359113-road-bikes
Radon are a german brand that have cycle to work distributors in the UK. They have UK distributors but you will have to pay £100 admin. A guy at work ordered one (MTB) and the handler split the £100 admin with him so he only paid £50. They seem to offer good value.
I like the look of radon but leaning towards btwin / decathlon as there is a physcial store not too far from me and they are priased for their customer service.
Watching this this thread and hopefully some suggestions might guide my decision.
I stopped using Ribble due to their attitude and hearing some of the sales pitches.
Where are you based Punches? If you're local to south wales, you are welcome to take my r872 for a test ride.
North of London so it'd be a bit of a Schlepp but thanks for the kind offer skwarczek. To be honest though I think I'd rather not give my money to Ribble, even if it is relatively small fry to them. I know you like your bike, and it probably is a very nice machine but I just get the feeling from Ribble that they won't be very accomodating or easy to deal with and I totally begrudge the £100 admin fee with them.
It's just a cash grab. There cannot be that much additional Labour. Say it was 2 hours total to complete a form, send off the voucher and then check you get reimbursed for it and allocate the funds against the sale that'd still be only £30 labour for an admin memeber of staff. I could probably accept that, or even up to £50, but I bet it is much simpler than that and done on some form of Portal to cut the admin costs down for those running the scheme. I even suggested I pay the £100 and they do the upgrade to the Aksium wheels but they weren't interested. That's their choice obviously and I think the guy at Ribble was aware that I'd likely notpurchase after hearing his response to my email.
In other news no response from PX. I will resubmit my email to them.
I've started to look a little in-depth at how feasible test riding these bikes will be:
Anyways, I am making some progress I feel and have at least ruled out the Ribble.
The L'etape looks like another option I had not considered. I'd have to do a tour of the North East to get around all the shops to try them all! I have a mate in St. Helens so maybe I can visit him and go try out the bikes on the way home, except for the CAAD12 which my local bike shop has. Not having to cough up a £100 admin charge is also very attractive. That is basically pedals and shoes covered.
Sounds like your in the same situation I'm just coming out of!
Sounds like we do similar riding - mid level Sportives and fun solo riding.
I was also looking to spend £1000 ish using a cycle-not-to-work-scheme voucher (my commute is 37miles each way!!)
The Ribble was top of my list until I saw the admin charge, I begrudged spending £100 on admin rather than bike parts so looked elsewhere.
Ive just ordered a Dolan L'Etape. Carbon frame from a well respected frame maker. Small UK company not international 'brand'.
I went for 105 kit and upgraded the sadddle, wheels and tyres and bars from the standard. I liked the ability to select/upgrade parts in the design process.
Whilst I've not ridden it yet! I'm very pleased with my decision and the spec I got as a result.
I've gone for the Etape too for pretty much the same reasons. I kept the build to standard but added pedals and it all worked out at £995 put through Cyclescheme. Customer service was excellent and the bike rides incredibly well. Much stiffer than my Aluxx Giant bike and lighter. It is mega comfortable on long rides too.
As for sale bikes, some will take a deposit whilst the voucher occurs...
Take a look at the Dolan Prefissio. Tried and tested refined frame, and you can pick and choose componentry. Spend a grand and you'll have a cracking, versatile bike.
As for picking up a cheap end of season bargain, that may be tricky with having to use the bike 2 work scheme depending on how flexible the retailer is. Some charge a premium and I imagine others will just flat out refuse. It's the first time I have used the scheme but it appears that I have to select the bike and retailer first, they then supply my employer the details and then I get sent a voucher which I then exchange for the Bike. The whole process takes some time and if I was a retailer I am not sure how bothered I'd be on a product that will be next to £0 profit for them. It's not impossible but I think I'd have to have researched a shortlist of options beforehand that may come down to the sub £1000 mark and preferably have ridden them to make it easier so I could choose and act fast if what appears to be a bargain comes along. The timing is right though as the next window for our bike to work is September 9th and I was planning to order almost straight away.
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