Updated: Anna Kiesenhofer's Olympic gold medal-winning Scott Addict

cdamian wrote:

"This is the American brand’s do-it-all road racer"

Except that it is a Swiss brand.

Actually it's Korean-owned now and the bikes are made almost exclusively in China and Taiwan, though HQ and R&D are in Switzerland.

In terms of the "American Brand"?  You (Rendel) talk of "ownership", not of "brand".  Jaguar may well be Indian owned, but they are generally regarded as a British brand, just as Scott are regarded as a Swiss brand.  

Definition of company brand from investopedia "A brand is an intangible marketing or business concept that helps people identify a company, product, or individual."  Nothing to do with ownership then.

If you really want to get into the "ownership" of Scott, Beat Zaug (Swiss) still owns 49.9% and the remaining 50.1% is owned by the Korean listed Yougone Corporation which in turn has a fair chunk of its shares owned by Western institutions such as Vanguard, Fidelity, Blackrock et al, which makes a complete nonsense of discussing ownership. 

I believe Liam was referring to the fact that Kiesenhofer isn't using the complete, standard Dura-Ace groupset because of the Sram chainset, not that her bike is a standard model. 

If you go down the route of "generally regarded", most people regard Scott as an American brand, as that's where they have their roots - especially people of my generation for whom in the late 80s/early 90s they were the American brand.

Not sure why you are qualified to speak for "most people", but brand is determined by a company, and Scott rebranded as Swiss in 1978 when they moved to Switzerland and under then clear Swiss ownership, promoted the values of Swiss engineering quality.

Griff500 wrote:

Not sure why you are qualified to speak for "most people"

In the same way that you are qualified to say something is "generally regarded as..."

Rendel Harris wrote:

Griff500 wrote:

Not sure why you are qualified to speak for "most people"

In the same way that you are qualified to say "Jaguar....... is generally regarded as a British Brand"

Not at all. I have Jaguar's own branding statement supporting what I said "Jaguar Land Rover will reimagine the future of modern luxury by design through its two distinct, British brands."  You just dreamed up your "most people" nonsense, notwithstanding the fact that I have been at pains to point out, the company determines the brand, not one man's outdated view of what "most people" think. 

I think this falls into the "not important enough to bother about any more" category. If you want to believe that a Korean-owned brand that was a US company for forty years and whose bikes are make in China and Taiwan is a Swiss company, you be my guest.

Rendel Harris wrote:

I think this falls into the "not important enough to bother about any more" category. If you want to believe that a Korean-owned brand that was a US company for forty years and whose bikes are make in China and Taiwan is a Swiss company, you be my guest.

I never said anywhere that Scott were a Swiss company, I said they were a Swiss brand, just as Rolls Royce are a British brand despite being German owned. You still don't understand that "Brand" has nothing to do with who owns the company.  Incidentally, Scott are a 50% Korean, 50% Swiss owned company, that was an American company for only 20 years (1958-78) and for 50 years has been a Swiss registered company, designing it's products in Switzerland, by predominantly Swiss engineers?   As for place of manufacture?  Next you will be telling is that Apple are a Chinese brand.

Fifty years? So Scott moved to Switzerland in 1971 - not 1992 as its own literature says? Okey doke.

No Rendell, you have your dates wrong (along with most of your posts!). Scott USA was founded in 1958, just like they say in their own literature. The Swiss company Scott Sports SA was incorporated 20 years later in 1978 on the move of their HQ to Switzerland, just as they say in their literature.  I note you didn't actually quote a reference from Scott literature so allow me to help: "Les produits de SCOTT Sports SA sont une invitation à dévaler les pentes en été comme en hiver, et à se sentir pousser des ailes. Le fabricant d’équipements de sport s’est établi à Givisiez, près de Fribourg, en 1978." To help your translation "The products of SCOTT Sports SA are an invitation to hit the slopes in summer as in winter, and to feel like sprouting wings. The sports equipment manufacturer established itself in Givisiez, near Friborg, in 1978."  1978 minus 1958 is 20 years as a US company, just as I said. Followed by 43 years of Swiss ownership, Swiss Design, Swiss branding, and manufacture in various parts of the World. In fact in the mid 1990's. Scott withdrew from the US cycle market totally for a period of 7 or 8 years as they were not popular with US customers, before reintroducing the brand to the US market in 2003. Why then would anyone in 2021 consider them to be remotely American?

Scott is generally regarded as Australian, surely?

Rendel Harris wrote:

If you go down the route of "generally regarded"

Hmmm, I wouldn't do that. Lots of people have misconceptions that are difficult to align with the facts.

Comparable with "common sense", which seems to be far less common than one would hope. And "received wisdom", which it isn't always wise to follow.

The view of Scott as an American brand for readers of cycling magazines 30 years ago (as the adverts are surely where you'd get that idea from) probably means absolutely zilch to anyone under 40. I have to admit that I didn't realise Scott was originally American, it's not a brand I took any notice of before the Greenedge team entered the pro peloton. Although I'd seen articles about the Addict and Foil on road.cc, yesterday was possibly the first time I'd taken any real interest in their bikes.

I may be imagining it, but isnt't there some link between Ridley and Scott, brought about by the Ridley founders enthusiasm for Ridley Scott films and having had something to do with Scott previously?

Simon E wrote:

The view of Scott as an American brand for readers of cycling magazines 30 years ago (as the adverts are surely where you'd get that idea from) probably means absolutely zilch to anyone under 40.

Y'all know that people over 40 are also people too?

Rendel Harris wrote:

Y'all know that people over 40 are also people too?

There's only one of me and yes I did know - I'm already well past 50.

I didn't buy cycling magazines as a yoof, though I spent plenty of time poring over Raleigh catalogues from the LBS. Raleigh was the only brand on my radar until I started reading about road racing in the mid-80s (which mostly meant a quick scan of Winning or Cycling Weekly in WH Smiths, looking for names and photos of riders I knew of). Even then the bike brands still didn't hold any significance for me.

Branding is really just marketing spin to differentiate a name from its competitors. Most prominent brands are owned by large companies that buy or create brands and brand identities to sell more of the product because it won't outsell its rivals purely on merit. Selling an image or association obviously works so now everyone has to build a brand identity, whether they are selling chocolates or supercars. But an awful lot of it is bullshit.

Agree with all you say - Raleigh was really the only brand I knew until CH4 starting showing the Tour in '86 (?). Still miss my stolen (from me, not by me, obvs) Road Ace with Shimano 600...guess my point is that wherever Raleigh are HQ'd now and wherever their bikes are made (afraid I don't know) they'll always be a British brand to me, just as Scott will always be a US brand in my mind, wherever they've moved.

Raleigh bikes are made in the Far East like virtually everything else mass produced, even the frame of the limited edition Joop Zoetemelk 40th anniversary bike recently featured in CW:

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/reviews/road-bikes/ti-raleigh-40th-anniver...

It's properly retro with specially commissioned 753 tubing, toe clips and downtube shifters. As a diehard fan of skinny steel and looking at the photos in a paper magazine it was almost like going back in time, making me nostalgic for my own 12-speed Record Sprint (also stolen, a long time ago now).

I think C4 started the Tour coverage in 1985, Hinault's last win.

Simon E wrote:

I think C4 started the Tour coverage in 1985, Hinault's last win.

That's right - Hinault, LeMond, Roche, Kelly, Anderson, Delgado...what an introduction!

You both are yappy muppets posting like 8 year olds, 'no im right"

We all know the brand is Scottish

If I'm trying to get the author more lashes then I'd pick on their statement that the CeramicSpeed OSPW is 'saving a few watts' as being an inaccurate over-exaggeration.

Scott may no longer have American HQ or ownership, however once-upon-a-time it was literally called 'Scott USA'.