“I love you guys, but come on”: Jeremy Vine films bin lorry blocking cycle lane AGAIN, as company promises to “keep all road users safe”; Black Friday comes early to Chain Reaction; Helmets and hi-vis, Dutch style; Kuss homecoming + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
“You know you have a mainstream cycling culture when this is how helmets and hi-vis are used around young children”
With so much discussion on the live blog this week focusing on contentious road safety campaigns advising us that ‘safety is a two-way street’ and admonishing vulnerable road users for wearing dark clothing (equating it with texting and driving, no less), I thought it would be worthwhile to hop over to the Netherlands, in order to ascertain what role hi-vis and helmets play in a safe, mainstream cycling culture…
And this oldie but a goldie from Zwolle, shared again on social media this week, sums it up rather nicely:
You know you have a mainstream cycling culture when this is how helmets ⛑️ and hi-viz 🦺 are used around young children.
Meet the worlds happiest traffic controller: Johan Zandvliet from #Zwolle! pic.twitter.com/I7z7IObJVz
— Cycling Professor 🚲 (@fietsprofessor) October 13, 2023
Canada, take notes…
Win a grand tour, lead a group ride, and sign some babies: Thousands turn out in Durango to celebrate Vuelta winner Sepp Kuss
America’s newest cycling star, 2023 Vuelta a España winner Sepp Kuss, returned home to a hero’s welcome in Durango yesterday, as thousands packed the small Coloradan mountain city to celebrate the country’s first grand tour winner for a decade.
The festivities included speeches, GC Kuss t-shirts (obviously), and a massive group ride led by the red jersey winner:
Celebrating Sepp Kuss! Share your favorite picture from today’s celebration in the comments below! pic.twitter.com/YjZwITaxyo
— City of Durango (@CityofDurango) October 19, 2023
Oh, and the very American tradition of – checks notes – signing babies…
The Sepp Kuss parade was so good. Even had a baby signing. pic.twitter.com/bwrA5Mu0TI
— Caley Fretz (@CaleyFretz) October 20, 2023
I have no idea either.
Cycling a potential “pathway to improved health and well-being in adolescents,” study finds
A US-based study has found that taking part in cycling programmes in school is beneficial to the psychosocial wellbeing of children aged 11 to 14, supporting previous findings that have established a positive link between riding a bike and mental wellbeing.
“It was really encouraging to see such a positive student response to a cycling-specific physical education programme,” researcher Fletcher Dementyev said.
“This motivates us, and hopefully others, to continue investigating and developing cycling as a pathway to improved health and well-being in adolescents.”
Read more: > US study finds that cycling programmes at school boost mental health
Black Friday comes early to Chain Reaction, on what could be a grim day for the troubled retailer
No, you didn’t black out and lose a month of your life.
While normal Black Friday – that American black hole of consumerism and sweet, sweet deals that has loomed over our shores in recent years – isn’t set to take place until the end of November, Chain Reaction has decided to jump on board a month early, in what appears to be an attempt to stem the financial troubles currently plaguing the cycling retailer.
> Wiggle reportedly heading towards administration due to parent company funding woes
Yesterday we reported that Wiggle Chain Reaction Cycles looks set to enter voluntary administration in the wake of a funding crisis that has engulfed its parent company, Signa Sports United, after the company that controls it announced that it would be no longer be providing a promised €150 million in funding to the business over the next two years.
Recent Companies House reports by Wiggle and Chain Reaction indicate that the company relies upon the troubled SSU for funding, without which the “group’s ability to continue as a going concern” would be subject to “material uncertainty”.
Mike Ashley’s Frasers Group is currently considered the most likely candidate to buy Wiggle CRC should it be put up for sale.
We’ll have more on this development over the course of the morning, but what is clear for the moment is that Black Friday has commenced early at Chain Reaction.
The retailer will certainly be hoping that particular moniker only applies to the deals and big savings it’s offering…
And now it’s Wiggle’s turn to jump on the Black Friday train…
In what can be hardly be described as the most earth-shattering, shocking news, especially in the wake of earlier developments, Wiggle has followed Chain Reaction’s lead in ushering in its Black Friday sales somewhat early this year.
As of this morning, the retailer is now offering some mammoth discounts of up to 30 percent on bikes, 40 percent off on wheels, and 60 percent off on clothes and bike parts.
A sign of troubled times or just some nice, early savings? You decide…
We’ve also recorded a special podcast episode on the latest developments concerning the future of Wiggle and Chain Reaction, and what all it means for you, so stay tuned for that this afternoon.
Iconic British road race Perfs Pedal cancelled for 2024
While already thanking the many officials and volunteers who made the event such a success, seeing so many spectators around the circuit and especially at the finish for a National B was quite unbelievable 👏👏👏👏@BCSouthRegion @velouk @BritishConti @PortsmouthNECC pic.twitter.com/IbTYknAreh
— Perfs Pedal Race (@PerfsPedalRace) February 16, 2023
After we reported on yesterday’s blog comments from Yomp Bonk Crew founder James Hawkins – a new kid on the block when it comes to organising bike races in the UK – calling for volunteers to help revitalise the country’s ailing racing scene, it was confirmed that one of Britain’s oldest races, the Perfs Pedal, will not go ahead in 2024, bringing an end to its 60-year history.
First held in 1964, the Perfs Pedal National B race – which took place near Portsmouth, often in foul February conditions – quickly established itself as the annual curtain raiser of the British racing season, and lists Sean Yates and Alex Dowsett among its illustrious list of winners.
Jack Rootkin-Gray led home an ominous Saint Piran 1-2-3 at the 2023 edition which, organiser Mick Waite revealed yesterday, will be the legendary race’s last.
Perfs Pedal Race no more: Mick Waite says “After nearly 60 years of organising Perfs Pedal Race, I have taken the difficult decision to stop running this event. Suffice to say that organising a National B Road Race has become more complex over the recent years.”#gutted pic.twitter.com/eAowzUTB5O
— British Cycle Sport (@VeloUK) October 19, 2023
“After nearly 60 years of organising Perfs Pedal Race, I have taken the difficult decision to stop running this event. Suffice to say that organising a National B Road Race has become more complex over the recent years,” the 77-year-old told Velo UK.
“I have only been able to keep Perfs going with the help of my family, friends, and many volunteers. I have great memories from this event over the years and I am pleased we have managed to keep it running for so long.”
Posting on the race’s own social media account, Waite added: “It’s been a great run and there are far too many to thank who have assisted over the decades.”
Legendary Manchester bike shop Harry Hall Cycles closes down after 67 years
While online retailer Wiggle struggles in the face of a turbulent cycling industry, Harry Hall Cycles – one of the most well-known cycle retailers in the UK and one of the oldest businesses in Manchester city centre – has closed down.
The news was announced on the shop’s website this week by owner Graham Hall, the son of founder Harry, the long-time mechanic of the British national team who opened the shop in 1956, with his son taking over in 1985.
“We’ve many fond memories of working with the cyclists of Manchester (and around),” Graham wrote. “We’ve met many nice people and been lucky to work in an industry that was also ‘our past time’.
“We thank you for your custom, support, and friendship over the years. Harry Hall’s WAS a family owned and run business.
“We catered for most aspects of cycling; commuters, children and enthusiasts alike. Our aim was to provide good quality kit with a friendly service. I have been lucky to have worked with some great people who’ve helped the shop immensely on its journey.”
The shop was opened 67 years ago by frame builder and mechanic Harry Hall, who was still working as a lorry driver at the time, on Manchester’s Hyde Road, before moving to Cathedral Street in 1960, becoming the biggest bike shop in the city.
During that early period, Hall also established his reputation as one of the finest mechanics in the country, working for the British national team throughout the 1960s and 1970s.
It was this role that ensured Hall’s name would – tragically – be forever etched into British cycling history. While working for the British team at the 1967 Tour de France, Hall became one of the last people to see Tom Simpson alive, the mechanic helping the former world champion back onto his bike after he collapsed a mile from the summit of Mont Ventoux.
After imploring Hall, who had rushed to his rider’s aid and lifted him up from the Ventoux’s stony bank, to let him carry on and to tighten his toe straps – by faintly uttering “Me straps, Harry, me straps” – Simpson then infamously murmured to the mechanic “on, on, on, on” as he pushed him on up the road.
Just 500 yards later, Hall was there to catch Simpson, as the finest British rider of his age succumbed for the second and tragically final time in the blistering Provençal heat.
After his two decades fixing the British team’s bikes, Hall moved his shop into the basement of the Corn Exchange in the mid-1980s, when it was taken over by his son Graham. Harry died, aged 78, in 2007, while Graham continued to manage the shop, which relocated to its ultimately final location, the railway arches on Whitworth Street, in 2000.
VecchioJo’s latest opinion piece: We need to talk about overtaking
In his latest comment-provoking article, VecchioJo passes judgement on what should be a simple matter, but one that often drifts into what he calls “unnecessary bellendery” (now there’s a phrase for a Friday afternoon) – the etiquette of overtaking, or the lack of it among some cyclists…
Read more: > We need to talk about overtaking: All things must pass, so be nice about it on your next bike ride
Movistar stalwart José Joaquín Rojas set to retire after 18 years as a professional cyclist
Amig@s, se nos va una época… 🥹@jjrojillas se retira tras casi dos décadas de carrera. 17 años, prácticamente la totalidad, con Movistar Team.
Un compañero excelente. Alguien que supo ponerse al servicio de otros y aportar experiencia cuando llegó el momento.
UN CAMPEÓN. 🩵 pic.twitter.com/busrOXAwhV
— Movistar Team (@Movistar_Team) October 20, 2023
Adding to the end of an era theme prevalent throughout this season of professional cycling, one of the peloton’s longest-serving member, José Joaquín Rojas, has announced his decision to retire from the sport after 18 years as a pro.
One of the bunch’s more charismatic riders (and arguably the owner of the most famous legs), the 38-year-old turned pro with Liberty Seguros in 2006 (the less said about that team and that year the better, however) before joining the then-Caisse d’Epargne team, with its super-cool black and red kit, the following year.
Rojas would spend the rest of his career with the long-standing Spanish squad, which became Movistar in 2011, earning a reputation as a solid if unspectacular sprinter – winning stages at the Tours of the Basque Country and Catalunya, and securing a handful of top threes at the Tour de France – before later developing into one of the team’s most reliable domestiques and road captains, supporting the likes of Alejandro Valverde and Enric Mas at the grand tours.
“17 years, practically all of it, with Movistar Team,” the Spanish team said today of their retiring rider. “An excellent teammate. Someone who knew how to put himself at the service of others and provide experience when the time came. A champion.”
Cyclist who rode through red light and was hit by taxi driver awarded €190k damages
A Dublin cyclist who sustained serious head injuries after he rode through a red light and was hit by a taxi driver has been awarded more than €190,000 in damages.
The High Court in the Irish capital set the amount of damages the 64-year -old will receive after the parties to the action agreed that he was 80 percent to blame for the crash.
Read more: > Dublin cyclist who rode through red light and was hit by taxi driver awarded €190k damages
“I hope anyone who bought recently used a credit card”: Rumours spread that Wiggle Chain Reaction has stopped paying suppliers and is refusing to receive goods until further notice, as Black Friday turns blacker for beleaguered retailer
Wiggle and Chain Reaction Cycle’s Black Friday – in more ways than one – continues as unconfirmed reports, stemming from people within the cycling industry, suggest that the beleaguered retailer has cancelled orders and stopped paying supplier invoices, and is also refusing to receive any more stock until further notice.
Those reports come as another of Signa Sports United’s companies, tennis and outdoor e-commerce brand Tennis-Point GmbH, has filed for insolvency following the withdrawal of funds from SSU by its parent company.
According to a statement to investors released today, other companies within the SSU umbrella “are currently in the course of preparing the initiation of insolvency proceedings”.
A letter sent by Wiggle CRC to business partners also asks “not to hand over new goods”, and that they are kept in the recipient’s warehouse “for the time being”.
As uncertainty increases around the future of Wiggle CRC, we analysed the current situation, giving you some tips on how not to lose your hard-earned cash should Black Friday turn blacker, with one chartered accountant – who assessed Wiggle’s predicament – telling us: “I hope anyone who bought recently did so on a credit card”.
British cyclocross champion Cameron Mason joins Cyclocross Reds team after four years at Trinity Racing
British national cyclocross champion Cameron Mason has signed for pro Belgian team Cyclocross Reds (formerly Team 777), after four years at Trinity Racing.
The 23-year-old multidiscipline rider, who also finished ninth in his first elite world ‘cross championships in Hoogerheide in February, will make his debut for the Cyclocross Reds at this weekend’s Superprestige event in Overijse, where he hopes he can build on his promising performances in the British stripes on the biggest stage.
“I’m really excited to join The Cyclocross Reds team for this season”, Mason said in a statement today.
“To be in a top Belgian team with top riders, equipment, and knowledge would have been the dream of a young Cameron coming to Belgium for the first time as a junior. I’m looking forward to showing off my national stripes at the front of the biggest races.”
What the hell is going on in the bike industry? Wiggle Chain Reaction turmoil discussed on the latest special edition of the road.cc Podcast
Yep, I know we’re a week early, but desperate times call for special podcast episodes, as they say, and we managed to quickly gather around the microphone to discuss this week’s massive cycling story (no, I’m not talking about Jeremy Vine) in time for a bonus Friday episode…
In this week’s episode, George and Jack are joined by Rory Hitchens, a long-time bike industry stalwart and the founder of brand new agency Greenleaves Cycling, to break down what on earth is going on at Wiggle CRS, how it compares to trouble and strife within the bike industry in the past, especially this year, and – crucially – what might happen next.
You won’t want to miss it…
“I love you guys, but come on”: Jeremy Vine films bin lorry blocking cycle lane AGAIN, as company promises to “keep all road users safe”
Considering the sheer scale of Jeremy Vine’s online database of cycling commuter clips and dodgy driving, which he publishes on social media on an almost daily basis, it’s understandable that a sense of déjà vu will creep in from time to time.
And that was certainly the case this week, when the pedalling broadcaster posted another snazzily edited video showing a bin lorry blocking a cycle lane in Camden – just over two months after Vine shared a clip of a driver working for the same company heading the wrong way down a cycle lane in, you guessed it, Camden.
While the waste collection company in question, Veolia, thanked the presenter last month for reminding their drivers of the importance of keeping bike lanes “clear at all times”, Vine claimed this week that they appear to be “quietly” resuming the “illegal and dangerous” practice.
September: rubbish collectors @VeoliaUK apologise for sending their vans the wrong way down cycle lanes in @CamdenCouncil.
October: they quietly start the practice again. This is illegal and dangerous.@sianberry @club_camden @WeAreCyclingUK @London_Cycling pic.twitter.com/sT8szvXGTf
— Jeremy Vine (@theJeremyVine) October 16, 2023
“Bin operators do a hard job with great dedication and I respect them… But don’t park in cycle lanes!” the Strictly alumnus wrote in the video.
During the clip itself, captured by the ‘drone’ flying over Vine’s head at all times, as he says (because why not, it keeps the internet on their toes), the broadcaster – upon noticing the lorry blocking the lane – mutters to himself, “And now I have to go out into oncoming traffic here”, before telling the operators: “Guys, you can’t park in a cycle lane, I’m really sorry. People have to pull round you and they could get hit here.”
Meanwhile, recognising the cyclist (I suppose the so-called ‘drone’ helmet camera is a giveaway), one of the workers joked, “Where’s your bike? Didn’t it get mangled?” – a reference to an incident from last month which left Vine desperately banging on the back of a van as the driver reversed over his bike having turned onto a stretch of cycling infrastructure.
> Jeremy Vine’s lucky escape as bike run over by reversing driver who turned onto cycle lane
“Listen I love you guys, but really come on, it’s not safe,” Vine said, before departing.
While his post elicited the usual complaints on social media – with some noting that the operators would only be stopped for a “short period” and that stopping in the road and wheeling the bins across the lane would still prove an “inconvenience” – Veolia yesterday apologised and promised to review its procedures while collecting bins near bike lanes.
“We continue to work closely with Camden Council and their highways team to determine best practice that keeps all road users and our frontline teams safe when collecting along busy roads with cycle lanes,” a spokesperson said.
“Health and safety is paramount to the work we do and we want to ensure the crew have limited contact with both cyclists and vehicles. We apologise for any inconvenience caused as we develop the safest course of action.”
Meanwhile, a spokesperson for Camden Council added: “We are clear that cycle lanes must not be used or obstructed by vehicles and we are working with Veolia to ensure that our waste and recycling vehicles follow their set routes at all times and that drivers understand the importance of keeping cycle lanes clear.
“Where cycle lanes are repeatedly being obstructed by lorries, vans, and other vehicles we will seek to add additional road safety measures that keep our cycle lanes clear and all road users safe.”
Anyway… Same time, same place in December?
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Latest Comments
@kinderje Are you aware that -ise endings are actually the newer form, having supplanted -ize (as used by Shakespeare, the King James Bible and Jane Austen, amongst many others) in the mid 19th century? Etymologically there is a far better argument for -ize endings for words with Greek and Latin roots than the -ise ending which arose from Victorian publishers imitating French verb endings. Both endings are now regarded as acceptable in British English, although the Oxford style guide recommends -ize. It is most certainly not incorrect.
@Backladder Given that the makers are selling it as being useable on any ride on open roads, it doesn't seem unreasonable to try to test it in those conditions.
'Leasting'? That's a whole 4 letters less.
Although usually the easiest thing of all would be for them just to stop for a few moments while you cycle past them (which requires a lot less space to do safely than them passing you), but most people seem allergic to stopping, even for the briefest time.
@Backladder Oh I think I can guess - the nearest indoor velodrome to road.cc HQ looks to be some distance away in Wales, whereas Odd Down Cycle Track (where this test was conducted) is just 2 miles away.
There are a number of causes of "the divide between motorists and cyclists". Only one is to do with the technology (of bicycles and cars) and that's the nature of the car, which is designed to induce the sort of dangerous and careless behaviours that providing humans with a lot of power and glamour fetches out of us. Other causes are much more insidious - A culture of hyper-individualism bordering on solipsism, with violently ultra-selfish and aggressive anti-heroes being promoted in every mass media channel as the ideal. A "news" media that overwhelmingly seeks, creates and offers pariahs and scapegoats to the rabid individualists, which pariahs and scapegoats includes all kinds of those perceived as less powerful and therefore easy victims, including cyclists. The near complete lack of any curb upon the dangerous antics of vast numbers of media-maddened motorists by the forces of law and order, many of whom are actually members themselves of the mass media maddened motorist ilk. ******** No amount of a more rational discourse about active travel or the means of making it safer will change these root causes of the vast numbers of deaths and maiming due to inept, incompetent and deliberately violent antics of vast numbers of motorists allowed their dangerous "weapons of choice". Yet many other highly damaging aspects of modern societies would be solved by a much more effective curbing of mass media mob-building and goading along with a serious attempt to prevent motorists and a whole range of other damagers from behaving as badly as so many do. It'll not happen, of course. Large and powerful elements of the modern world obtain far too much ultra-riches and power from current conditions for them to allow any significant change. And vast numbers of the population have long had their minds, attitudes and behaviours captured and directed by various oligarchical monsters and their mass media propaganda horns. About the only chance of safe active travel becoming extant is for the population at large to become mostly too poor to afford a car, ironically one other likely outcome of the machinations of those same power and money-mad monsters that have created the car-issue in the first place. Their need for zero-sum socio-economic arrangements degrades everything, including the wallet-contents of the masses.
@Astralstroll The hierarchy of road users does not mean priority of road users except in certain circumstances, e.g. stopping to let pedestrians cross junctions before turning. It doesn't mean that cyclists have priority over motor vehicles at all times any more than the pedestrians have priority over cyclists at all times. It certainly doesn't mean that you have priority in the circumstances you describe; personally, unless the driver is being a complete dick, on a narrow country lane I accept that it is easier for me to turn around and go back to the nearest passing place, which is never that far if you're on a bike, than for a tractor or other large vehicle to reverse back down the road for my benefit.
If you were spending that much money on the device the obvious thing to do is to book a couple of hours in a velodrome for testing in a stable environment, I can't understand why Road.cc tried to do it outdoors.
@Astralstroll The Hierarchy of Road Users, announced with great fanfares in 2022, has been rendered into complete fiction by the attitude of the police: there is this hierarchy/ priority list but we don't take it seriously and if drivers ignore it we don't care! The same applies to the ludicrous notice of close-passing - No KSI'd cyclist = No Offence ttps://upride.cc/incident/lwa190_minicooper_hierarchy/
61 thoughts on ““I love you guys, but come on”: Jeremy Vine films bin lorry blocking cycle lane AGAIN, as company promises to “keep all road users safe”; Black Friday comes early to Chain Reaction; Helmets and hi-vis, Dutch style; Kuss homecoming + more on the live blog”
OMG, Jeremy: please please
OMG, Jeremy: please please PLEASE stop adding all these “wacky” animations. A basic video with – maybe – some text to highlight your point is sufficient…
(maybe I’m just getting old…).
I think the youngsters find
I think the youngsters find it even more ‘cringe’
‘During the clip itself,
‘During the clip itself, captured by a drone flying over Vine’s head (because why not)’
Please tell me you’re in on the gag here and furthering it, rather than falling for it?
Vine still gets the
Vine still gets the occasional perfectly serious genius on Twitter quoting the law about flying drones within certain distances of pedestrians or buildings and asking why he should be taken seriously for criticising other people for breaking the law when he’s clearly doing it himself.
Ha! I never even imagined
Ha! I never even imagined anyone would think it wasn’t a joke! Inverted commas now added to make that very clear… Can’t be too subtle these days, I suppose.
Given there isn’t a
Given there isn’t a specifically designed waste collection facility and its a retrofit on an existing street I don’t really see they have much alternative. That van though
The alternative is to stop on
The alternative is to stop on the carriageway as they would if there were no cyclelanes. This may delay traffic as bin collections do most places but doesn’t put cyclists lives at risk.
Perhaps but its not really a
Perhaps but its not really a practical alternative in this location, perhaps on a smaller side street (I would be all for it there) but its not really a reasonable balance in this location, especially with things just retrofitted, not designed properly like the Dutch, etc would do.
Why is it not practical that
Why is it not practical that motorists have to wait a few minutes while essential work is being done, it’s not as if they empty the bins every day or even week? You wouldn’t expect the lorry to mount the pavement to allow impatient motorists to pass. The convenience of drivers shouldn’t come at the expense of the safety of cyclists.
In the right place it is and
In the right place it is and a very good solution but I don’t think that the right place. Ideally the place would have been designed to ensure that was the right solution but this is only a retrofit solution and folk sometimes have to weigh up the bigger picture IMO.
Genuinely – where is this
Genuinely – where is this “right place”? Been hearing this for years now – “of course we’re in favour of more active travel / road safety / more pleasant streets, but…”
And it turns out that it is *never* the right place, wherever it is!
Further – although I’m sure any retrofit design will have issues I’ve looked at quite a lot and would say that while better or worse some are good enough. And yet it turns out I’m completely wrong! Every single one is fatally flawed according to some folks. Having analysed this it seems the key problem in each is it makes things marginally less convenient for drivers, even if that is simply learning a new layout.
Be honest – complete redesigns are going to be very rare.
If you’ve been hearing that
If you’ve been hearing that for years it should tell you something. The right place for me is 90% of places and I’d rather concentrate/focus on getting them perfect (or at least the best it can be and be safe for all) than trying to retrofit 100% of places. I think thats a reasonable balance to encourage the mode shift we need to save the planet. Other folk will say the balance needs to be more orientated to movement but I’d rather concentrate on the sence of Place as I don’t think their approach is enough to even start to address the ‘Climate Emergency’ that practically everyone has recognised.
I think it tells me that
I think it tells me that motornormativity is a thing and people don’t like change – but we specifically see any change which *might* reduce driving convenience as a threat.
So far so normal – “if you’re privileged modes towards equality feel like oppression”.
Question for you – If you feel like 90% of places are “right” why do *you* think that lots of people think 0% of places are right? (Or more specifically – 100% of places that they may drive through / park in occasionally are the wrong place for changes other than more roads / more parking?)
It is a serious challenge to move from where we are – there are lots of forces keeping the status quo in place. So for any change we’ll require multiple things working together, not just one “fix”.
Specifically for cycling (and also reducing motor traffic – these are linked) there are places where this *has* happened. And what was required was not “perfect” but “enough everywhere – of *sufficient* quality”. This has been the case in NL, parts of Scandinavia, Seville… it’s not likely to be different here.
https://www.aviewfromthecyclepath.com/2008/09/grid.html
It also takes managing and reducing the motor traffic.m (and because driving is private transport we will need in part a private alternative eg. cycling).
Talkng of “place” this is something that can work in favour of this kind of change.
Of course in the UK we are used to even “nice places” being dominated by parked cars. And we will fight to ensure we have the ability to drive through *everyone else’s places* to get to our destinations. Or even get there just 10 seconds quicker…
You’ll need to ask them why!
You’ll need to ask them why! FWIW, To get change its all about reasonable balance, I don’t think 0% is any sort of balance!
This would totally block car
This would totally block car traffic (there is a central island) for a couple of minutes or maybe more, as the cars would have absolutely no other choice, but to stay still and immobilized. Cyclists, Vine including, could either wait without any emissions (a internal combustion car staying still, will pollute if it doesn’t have a start/stop system) or could simply dismount and walk and lose like 10 seconds. I know dismounting is uncomfortable, but still an option.
So please mr Vine (and supporters) give me all the alternatives in this exact case.
I will try to have a few:
1) Lorry parks in cycle lane as in video, cyclists may wait, dismount walk, causiously overtake, or just pretend it is 2005 and no cycle lanes exist.
2) Lorry parks in car lane as ChasP proposes. Car gets stuck for minutes, total manhours lost in travel time increase compared to previous scenario, angry drivers mob cyclists increases even more, air quality worsens, cyclists get lung cancer and everybody wanders how they got it if they were never smoking and athletic.
3) Lorry parks in car lane as ChasP proposes, but now the Veolia HR department has hired olympic weightlifters from peaceful okinawa so that they are both super fast and having to be stressed from blocking car traffic. Instead of minutes they finish in seconds, everybody happy, but the tax goes +10% to hire these exceptional athletes.
4) 40000 drones of the video keep the lorry on the air, everybody happy, but now the tax goes +15% to keep all these drones running.
5) Any other solutions?
Maybe they do the action
Maybe they do the action which is not illegal?
AlsoSomniloquism wrote:
…and also the action that produces a slight delay to traffic rather than introducing a danger to some traffic (and potentially a much greater delay if someone is injured)
Quickly followed by a Vine
Quickly followed by a Vine video, a vineo? Of the bins being chucked back across the cycle lane towards the kerb from behind the truck unsighted
stonojnr wrote:
That’s clearly dangerous behaviour whether or not there’s a cycle lane. Certainly the recycling/bin people around my area don’t throw the bins around.
Playin ‘Devil’s Advocate’ is
Playing ‘Devil’s Advocate’ is it illegal though (there’s double yellows but its impossible to read a timeplate) and whilst its not preffered it might not actually be illegal. See chapter 8 (p24) of the TfL’s guide on protected cycle lanes and parking https://content.tfl.gov.uk/guidance-for-the-use-of-traffic-wand-with-cycle-infrastructure.pdf
HLaB wrote:
My interpretation of that is that it’s illegal as that’s a mandatory cycle lane which does not allow for vehicles to drive in them. Parking/loading could presumably be allowed in marked bays, but that does not appear to be the case from the picture above (apologies – I don’t use Twitter so won’t watch the video).
Section 8.2.4: Formal provision of parking/loading bays within a cycle lane requires breaking of the mandatory cycle lane marking.
I cant guarantee its
I cant guarantee its definitely illegal or legal, for instance if you read the earlier paragraph:
8.2.2 Parking/loading can take place formally, in designated bays, or could be permitted informally by the presence of parking and loading restrictions.
HLaB wrote:
Can you see any of those restrictions (which would be unusual for a mandatory cycle lane) that would allow the bin lorry there?
Thats what I said previously
Thats what I said previously, its impossible to see the details of the parking an loading restrictions so hence playing Devil’s Advocat it is impossible to say from the vid definitively if its illegal or not :-/
HLaB wrote:
Mmmm Devil’s Advocaat
Lol, typo
Lol, typo 😀
hawkinspeter]
Is that where the expression “snowball’s chance in hell” comes from?
I don’t think that the law
I don’t think that the law maker was thinking a refuse truck, on a single lane road next to a cycle route when the law was written. There are many stupid laws, and that is why laws change. Some are of such minor importance or so easily broken because there are no realistic other alternatives (as in this example) that no one bother to change them.
And to people worrying extremely about safety, and don’t want to do Vine’s swerve that can compare only with base jumping from Big Ben in levels of danger, they can just wait like the car drivers they dream of waiting in their unicorn world. But on top of that they have the super safe option of just dismounting and walking.
Wel, there’s an issue, I can
Wel, there’s an issue, I can see that.
But in a more general view – how on earth did we cope before when e.g. a refuse truck was collecting on a one-way street (I presume this is what this one is)?
Pretty sure people have been travelling in London and also delivering / collecting stuff for thousands of years. And for all of that time there have been “narrow streets”. How come people haven’t deserted this terrible impractical city for the country, or massacred the bin men / gong farmers / carters?
I mean – I know it’s London so presumably everyone’s 5 minutes is worth most of my year’s salary, and that people being delayed by any time at all probably means the mayor or maybe the prime minister is summoned to answer questions…
cyclisto wrote:
ftfy
If the cyclist just stop then
If the cyclist just stop then the bin lorry cannot proceed to drive the wrong way on the cycle lane and therefore gets nowhere.
cyclisto wrote:
There are numerous streets in London, particularly in the City, that are too narrow or winding for bin lorries, so the residents/business owners take their bins to an agreed point on a wider street where they are collected. You might say that sort of effort isn’t justified here, but it is a perfectly good alternative that is used in numerous locations across the capital. In this specific case Vine is on Tavistock Place near the junction with Marchmont Street; the latter has no cycle lanes and no parking and would allow the refuse collectors to empty the bins with minimal disruption to traffic, motor vehicle or bicycle.
cyclisto wrote:
Which is exactly what they do on the 98.5% of their round that doesn’t have cycle lanes on it, so it’s not exactly something new or unxpected.
Comprehensive cycle infra is rarer outside of London than you think – in the rest of the country, drivers have to wait for bin lorries to do their thing in the main carriageway every day.
Vine stopping in the middle
Vine stopping in the middle of a ‘dangerous’ road to reprimand the operatives is as daft as a road-rager stopping to get out of their car to remonstrate with a cyclist for holding them up.
Sometimes Jeremy Vine sounds unbelievably entitled, and this is one of those occasions.
PRSboy wrote:
There’s no traffic coming in either direction, if there had been I expect he would’ve pulled round the lorry before speaking to them. No harm no foul.
PRSboy wrote:
Well, it wouldn’t make sense to stop in the cycle lane as that was blocked. I haven’t watched the clip (I don’t do Twitter/X), but as I understand it he wasn’t so annoyed about being held-up, but by the danger that cyclists are being subjected to by blocking the lane. The problem is that the cyclists wouldn’t be part of the usual flow of traffic on the road and so have to negotiate joining the existing traffic – that’s usually the more dangerous part as most drivers are only looking for big car-shaped objects and often won’t see a cyclist trying to merge from their left side.
I don’t follow, listen or watch Jeremy Vine apart from reading about his exploits here, so I’m not defending him per se, but it doesn’t sound like he’s being unreasonable in this instance. I’ve got no problem with bin lorries or their crews as they’ll often need to temporarily block roads, but blocking the cycle lane does introduce danger to cyclists. If the bin lorry leaves the cycle lane clear and blocks the road, it doesn’t create any danger for the drivers and cyclists can watch out for the bin lorry crew as they cross the cycle lane (I’d give them priority and stop if necessary).
So what happens to a baby
So what happens to a baby once it has been signed? Not framed and put on the wall I hope…
I believe they become
I believe they become teenagers and get emancipated from the parents that held them down as a baby and allowed a stranger to scribble on them…
NickSprink wrote:
If they can avoid washing it, until they’re 18, they can get it tattooed over
Occupational hazard for some.
Occupational hazard for some. The birth of a messiah is often accompanied by signs. Same for the children of George Foreman – they were so good he put his name on each of them.
RE: Cycling a potential
RE: Cycling a potential “pathway to improved health and well-being in adolescents,” study finds
I’m always glad that someone checks these things but I’d suggest this is getting towards “no shit Sherlock” territory.
One possible example: kids in NL (and then parts of Scandinavia) are apparently some of the happiest in the world. Now there are lots of different things which could contribute there but the importance of “personal autonomy” is noted. Perhaps being able to get about without your parents driving you (plus “incidental exercise”) is an important part of that? (Plus much less traffic noise – increasingly recognised as a major stressor etc.)
This. One does get the
This. One does get the impression that those studies are kicks into the long grass.
I love the photo of Harry
I love the photo of Harry Hall Cycles providing race support in one of the smallest cars available at the time. Quite a contrast to today’s racing teams.
andystow wrote:
Must have had a very limited supply of spares as the wouldn’t stop for me when I had a puncture in the Manchester div champs back in the 70’s.
Backladder wrote:
I rode many LVRC (League of Veteran Racing Cyclists) races in the early 90s in which Harold was also a participant. He was nice enough but not inclined to suffer any kind of cycling foolery – could be a bit “superior” towards any breaking the conventions of his racing cyclist generation.
On the other hand, he pitched in with organisational help as well as mechanical rescues. A chap worth knowing, despite his prickles and the odd bit of ankle-biting.
His bike shop was also typical of the age. Rather like Huey’s Ribble Cycles shop in Watery Lane, Preston, but better informed albeit always very ready to take yer money and get you out of the door with your new shiny thing. 🙂
Cugel wrote:
There seemed to be something alike in all the old fashioned cycle shops, my local one was Cowans cycles on Hyde road, Gorton and if you went in to ask for a puncture kit they would hand you a nail! But if you were in one of the local clubs you would get invited into the back room where the kettle was always on and they were great for Saturday morning repairs before a Saturday afternoon race.
Ain’t this it? I mean, why
Ain’t this it? I mean, why would you get in to the business? It seems to involve long hours to make a slender living, and deaing either folks with no idea (but who expect things fixed for free) OR opinionated “cyclists” like ourselves who are also very “careful with their money”!
Was taking to someone who’d been in the business and he was reminiscing about friends he had – but commented that there seemed to be an excess of what he termed “neurodivergence”!
Probably Vine at his most
Probably Vine at his most entitled. The binmen are in a no win situation, what’s the alternative, stop in the road and then they are crossing the cycle lane with rubbish to get to the back of the vehicle. They’re doing a job and not “parked up” it was zero effort to pass them (he had time to stop in the road and moan, to get another click bait vid for X, formerly Twatter). It would have been worse IMHO to try and pass them on the nearside between pavement and dustcart if they were stopped in the road as they are working. Basically if you want your rubbish cleared, whatever vehicle you are in, once a week if you time it badly (or maybe deliberatly to get a video?) you may be inconvenienced for a couple of minutes.
The van though, that is a different story and clearly a bellend.
I think your point about
I think your point about crossing the lane is important. More chance of a collision with people moving bins to and fro and being unsighted as a natural outcome.
It seems obvious and common
It seems obvious and common sense. You can see the oncoming traffic far easier than you would see the binmen working at the back of the dustcart. Sadly common sense is a rare thing today.
Adam Sutton wrote:
I’d say that you should always approach bin lorries with caution (and reduced speed) as they usually have people working around and behind them.
Absolutely, a lot could
Absolutely, a lot could happen. Overfilled bin spill etc.
There isn’t a cycle lane in
There isn’t a cycle lane in any residential area that doesn’t have delivery vans stopping on it constantly. It’s rare to ride in a cycle lane and not to have to pull into the road to get past one. The rules are clear, they aren’t allowed to stop there, and doing so creates danger for cyclists. It doesn’t matter that they’re doing a job, or how they are parked up for, they’re creating danger for me when I need to be passing them. I don’t care that they’ll be gone in 30 seconds, so will I, if I survive.
Sure so have them stop in the
Sure so have them stop in the road and ride up the cycle lane between the truck and the rubbish their collecting. This is nothing more than vine level entitlement with no common sense.
Well, I think it’d maybe be
Well, I think it’d maybe be better for the bin lorry to be going the correct way up the street, but maybe this is for better driver visibility between them and any approaching vehicles?
Regardless, we’ve had a massive expansion in the delivery industry over the last decade or so. That is different – I guess the question is just to accept it’s now a thing* and adapt our streets and rules to catch up. I’m not sure we can turn the clock back and say “do we need this? Why should private industry get a free pass in this way to drive the most dangerous vehicles ** through dense urban areas and park for free, often where they shouldnt?”
*… although countries with better support for localism and active travel seem to show that a slightly different model is possible.
** According to the PACTS analysis of UK fatalities vans and light goods vehicles are proportional the most dangerous. Not surprising given their patterns of use and design.
More wankpanzers
More wankpanzers
“And all kids should wear stilts to be seen”
On that Abrams tank point,
On that Abrams tank point, there’s a diagram I saw out there on the internet which compares the sight lines for various modern “pickups” and SUVs vs the tank. They don’t come out well…
When I were a nipper we were
When I were a nipper we were taught the green cross code and to check before crossing. And that was in the days of cars with solid metal bumpers, non deformable front ends, no forward collision detection and north south engines under bonnets the length of football pitches.
Is this what you were
Is this what you were thinking of
Anyone else notice that the
Anyone else notice that the let the world burn, 15 minute city prison conspiracy nutter pro-drivist policies didn’t seem to get the vote out.
What stopped them being able to drive to the polling stations…
ktache wrote:
Well, they won’ta changed their tiny minds so it was either the price of oil or a traffic jam. Or perhaps they were so eager to get to the voting that they became entangled in a vast “accident” so spent the day blaming each other, unsuccessfully?