Live blog: The end of cars parked in cycle lanes? Government dismisses mandatory helmet/hi-viz and compulsory cycle insurance suggestions; Cav's unique Thanksgiving message, South African cyclist survives knife to the head + more

Canyon48 wrote:

Wait, did the government just make a rational decision based on facts and reasoning?

What is happening and can we have some more?

All the big name politicians are tied up with Brexit shenanigans, so they can't impart their usual wisdom over small issues like this.

Don't worry, normal service will be resumed shortly.

billymansell wrote:

I foresee quite an industry developing in fake insurance reduction claims either through dodgy training courses, downloadable fake training certificates or people just brazenly claiming to have taken the course.

Now if it was a new classification on the driving licence that required you to pass a cycling test it could be more robust and easier to verify on the roadside.

It'd be in the insurance industries interests to make sure that the training courses are effective. They're not going to be happy with fake training certificates if the underwriters have to pay out claims with reduced premiums.

Luca Patrono wrote:

How is that going to work for those of us who cycle regularly but didn't take the Bikeability course? Hoop jumping?

My daughter (just 12) said to me that she'd been offered Bikeability L3 at school, but that she really didn't want to do it. I said that was fine, that I'd never even done Cycling Proficiency BITD, and that she'd pretty much pick up the skills taught by - you know - just riding.

(That said, I think that some sort of cycle training or cycling experience should definitely be mandatory for anyone planning to get an HGV/PSV licence).

Luca Patrono wrote:

How is that going to work for those of us who cycle regularly but didn't take the Bikeability course? Hoop jumping?

Depends on what your insurance premium is and the discount offered. Might be worth taking it - should be an easy hoop to jump through...

Lets say it costs £50~£100 to take the course, and you get a 5 to 10% discount for passing 

£500 insurance premium - 

• 5% discount = £25
• 10% discount = £50

£2000 insurance premium - 

• 5% discount = £100
• 10% discount = £200

So it may pay for itself or at least recover most of the cost at your next insurance renewal. And don't forget to multiply the discount by the number of years you expect to continue driving    

CygnusX1 wrote:

Luca Patrono wrote:

How is that going to work for those of us who cycle regularly but didn't take the Bikeability course? Hoop jumping?

Depends on what your insurance premium is and the discount offered. Might be worth taking it - should be an easy hoop to jump through...

Lets say it costs £50~£100 to take the course, and you get a 5 to 10% discount for passing 

£500 insurance premium - 

• 5% discount = £25
• 10% discount = £50

£2000 insurance premium - 

• 5% discount = £100
• 10% discount = £200

So it may pay for itself or at least recover most of the cost at your next insurance renewal. And don't forget to multiply the discount by the number of years you expect to continue driving    

Fully comp for my Passat was £220, it'd need a fair few years to break even even if the insurers offer it. Those that offer discounts for advanced driving, camera fitted etc IME are more expensive at the base price so negates any 'saving'.

kil0ran wrote:

Interesting and welcome approach. Typically BikeAbility training is free for kids, wonder how much it would be for adults? Needs to be priced right. Doubt that the DfT will fund it, needs an innovative approach from insurance companies/other providers.

How would passing a bikeability course reduce the risk ? bear in mind this is talking about people that have already been trained and passed the government approved driving test, so these people should already be aware of the dangers on the roads, and of how to safely pass other road users.
I can see people simply turning up for the course to get a discount and it making not a blind bit of difference to their driving. It's not about people being unaware of the risks in many cases, it's people who don't care.  Those who would be interested in taking the course to improve their driving are probably the last people that need to be on it as they already consider others.

StuInNorway wrote:

kil0ran wrote:

Interesting and welcome approach. Typically BikeAbility training is free for kids, wonder how much it would be for adults? Needs to be priced right. Doubt that the DfT will fund it, needs an innovative approach from insurance companies/other providers.

How would passing a bikeability course reduce the risk ? bear in mind this is talking about people that have already been trained and passed the government approved driving test, so these people should already be aware of the dangers on the roads, and of how to safely pass other road users.

Might work if the course includes repeatedly scaring them sh:tless by being close passed by an HGV at 40mph.

StuInNorway wrote:

I can see people simply turning up for the course to get a discount and it making not a blind bit of difference to their driving. It's not about people being unaware of the risks in many cases, it's people who don't care.  Those who would be interested in taking the course to improve their driving are probably the last people that need to be on it as they already consider others.

Like people who choose to do a speed advisory course when they've been caught speeding? (apparently, people do sometimes still get caught for speeding!  Who would have thought?!)

kil0ran wrote:

Interesting and welcome approach. Typically BikeAbility training is free for kids, wonder how much it would be for adults? Needs to be priced right. Doubt that the DfT will fund it, needs an innovative approach from insurance companies/other providers.

Not sure they hand out Bikeability badges at the end of it, but my local council (Trafford) offers FREE one-to-one cycle training to adults.

There are also commercial outfits out there that offer Bikebility training to adults, suspect prices vary.