Chicanes on bike lanes - why are we still building this rubbish? ask frustrated campaigners

JonD wrote:

bikeclips wrote:

I don't know about Hackney or Manchester but near where I live in Liverpool, some public spaces with nice shared-use paths are plagued by young scallywags on scrambler motorbikes. The non-cycling users and neighbours find it very distressing and so the council install heavy-duty barriers which sometimes help a bit. In those circumstances, I accept the need to dismount or even lift my bike over.

Every city (or otherwise) has an element of that, but not everyone is fit/able to lift their bike over such obstacles - in particular, those that ride trikes (recumbent or otherwise) due to physical issues may well find it impossible.

Best solution ? - I honestly don't know, but penalising legitimate users doesn't seem to be the way to go.

As it is, I'd have to lift a 40lb-odd (19+kg) of touring recumbent over many of the obstacles around...just as well I'm able to...

So if a road is signed no hgvs but hgvs use it anyway, do the put in bollards to stop all motor vehicles? No this is effectively what they do to cycle paths all the time.

bikeclips wrote:

some public spaces with nice shared-use paths are plagued by young scallywags on scrambler motorbikes. The non-cycling users and neighbours find it very distressing and so the council install heavy-duty barriers which sometimes help a bit. In those circumstances, I accept the need to dismount or even lift my bike over.

The problem is that not everyone can lift their bike over. These things make bike paths inaccessible to the less abled (I'm surprised thats even legal in this day and age) or people with heavier loads.

I certainly remember touring in the UK with a trailer and frequently finding I need to disconnect it and lift it over barriers. Once, luckily whilst I was in a group, we found a barrier so high (and that you couldn't pass underneath) that we needed one person on either side and one on the top to manhandle the bikes over. Luckily we were on holiday, young and fit, and up for a bit of an adventure but I wouldn't commute on these paths. God knows what happens to disabled cyclists, people with kids, kids themselves, people on tandems or those with cargo bikes. But then I guess most bike infrastructure is designed for kids under 16. I recall the bike stands outside the library in Putney (or somewhere near there) that were so close to the wall you couldn't park an adult bike.

On the topic of motor bikes using bike paths - if they are causing a real problem then you just have to get the police involved. Police enter the bike path from both ends, and trap the motor cyclists in the middle. IIUC UK law allows the motorbikes to be seized in these circumstances (I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong - maybe it needs a bylaw). Repeat a few times and either the "scallywags" get the message or they run out of motor bikes. There was a report a few years ago about this having been successful somewhere up north. Interesting to hear if they needed to repeat it and if so how often.

cqexbesd wrote:

On the topic of motor bikes using bike paths - if they are causing a real problem then you just have to get the police involved. Police enter the bike path from both ends, and trap the motor cyclists in the middle. IIUC UK law allows the motorbikes to be seized in these circumstances (I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong - maybe it needs a bylaw). Repeat a few times and either the "scallywags" get the message or they run out of motor bikes. There was a report a few years ago about this having been successful somewhere up north. Interesting to hear if they needed to repeat it and if so how often.

I tried complaining about motorcycles on the cycle path over the Avon, alongside the M5 motorway. Police wouldn't touch it unless I could give them registration numbers. And that isn't teenagers on scooters but fat dockers on Harleys

brooksby wrote:

I tried complaining about motorcycles on the cycle path over the Avon, alongside the M5 motorway. Police wouldn't touch it unless I could give them registration numbers. And that isn't teenagers on scooters but fat dockers on Harleys

The Avonmouth M5 Road Bridge lane? Isn't that a cycle/ped/motorbike lane? Always used to be.

morseykayak wrote:

brooksby wrote:

I tried complaining about motorcycles on the cycle path over the Avon, alongside the M5 motorway. Police wouldn't touch it unless I could give them registration numbers. And that isn't teenagers on scooters but fat dockers on Harleys

The Avonmouth M5 Road Bridge lane? Isn't that a cycle/ped/motorbike lane? Always used to be.

Sort of... it's a cycle/pedestrian shared use path + mopeds, motocycles under 50cc and invalid carriages apparently - never really noticed that before tbh.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/16ye4u9gy49lt4x/M5%20cycle%20lane.png

No explicit mention of Harleys...

fukawitribe wrote:

morseykayak wrote:

brooksby wrote:

I tried complaining about motorcycles on the cycle path over the Avon, alongside the M5 motorway. Police wouldn't touch it unless I could give them registration numbers. And that isn't teenagers on scooters but fat dockers on Harleys

The Avonmouth M5 Road Bridge lane? Isn't that a cycle/ped/motorbike lane? Always used to be.

Sort of... it's a cycle/pedestrian shared use path + mopeds, motocycles under 50cc and invalid carriages apparently - never really noticed that before tbh.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/16ye4u9gy49lt4x/M5%20cycle%20lane.png

No explicit mention of Harleys...

Its one of these things where there are rules but where the rules are never enforced.

I suspect the idea was that the only vehicles allowed on it would be those which *aren't* allowed on the motorway itself.

There are a few kids on scooters - my son was learning to ride his bike on the cycle path on the Pill side, and fell off after being buzzed by a kid on a scooter - but it is usually larger motorcycles going across, ridden by blokes who really should know better.

I'd presume that the blokes are commuting to and from work at the docks (the Portbury docks on one side, the Avonmouth docks on the other), and just go along the cycle path because its a shorter route than going out to the motorway.

All the police need to do is stand a couple of PCs at one end or the other for a couple of hours around 'rush hour' and have a stern word.

(Unfortunately, the last time I saw police on there was when I had my panniers searched when NATO were meeting in Newport and some of the delegates were going to be crossing the motorway bridge and "we just want to see whether you have anything that could affect the fabric of the bridge"...)

bikeclips wrote:

I don't know about Hackney or Manchester but near where I live in Liverpool, some public spaces with nice shared-use paths are plagued by young scallywags on scrambler motorbikes. The non-cycling users and neighbours find it very distressing and so the council install heavy-duty barriers which sometimes help a bit. In those circumstances, I accept the need to dismount or even lift my bike over.

I'd had similar arguments in favour of barriers. Problem is that most of the chavs with bikes are in gangs, and can easily manhandle bikes past them. I've even seen full size petrol quads lifted over by lads.

meanwhile people with pushchairs, luggage, or bikes are completely scuppered.

gazza_d wrote:

But the prize for the most useless bit of 'infra' I know goes to this splodge of green paint, presumably the intention is to get cyclists to go onto the pavement and then across the road. https://goo.gl/maps/PtjyP

l

So not only do you need to shimmy left from the road to the pavement. But in this case they have made it harder by having the kerb turning away from you at the same time. Where they expect movement from road to pavement they need to make the pavement wider so cyclists cross a dropped kerd perpendicular to line of travel.