“Tramadol was legal and I used it heavily,” Vuelta winner Horner sympathises with Tadej Pogačar’s injury struggles at TdF; “Sometimes we wish he’d slow down” Pogačar’s mother says a sabbatical for her son would be “understandable” + more on the live blog
SUMMARY
Unstoppable Magnier wins again in Guangxi
Soudal-Quick Step’s Paul Magnier continues his 100% win streak at the Tour of Guangxi by winning stage four this morning. The win is the Frenchman’s 18th of the season this morning, only a certain Slovenian has more.
Magnier has also gained a handy 30 second lead on the favourites for the overall but tomorrow’s summit finish is likely to end his perfect record in what is the last World Tour race of the year.
Reducing speed limits to 20mph protects cyclists and doesn’t delay traffic, new research finds
They might have second-best cricketers, but credit where it’s due should go to the Australians for some excellent research published this week.
Modelling reduced speed limits in Melbourne’s residential areas, researchers found cyclists are safer, traffic isn’t affected and more people are encouraged to cycle. Lovely stuff…
> Reducing speed limits to 20mph protects cyclists and doesn’t delay traffic, new research finds
22-year old cyclist retires to work in AI
It’s the time of year where retirement announcements, enforced or not, are coming thick and fast. We might even do a round-up of British retirements later this afternoon depending on the flow of other news.
Not many retirees tend to be young, and if they are it’s usually a combination of illness and injury. But not for Unai Zubeldia.
The 22-year-old (no relation to cult Grand Tour hero Haimar Zubeldia) has announced his retirement in a post on LinkedIn saying he plans to work in Big Data and Artificial Intelligence, having graduated from university earlier this year. His post, in both Basque and Spanish does make reference to the “hidden costs” of professional cycling but they are far from the only thing that has led Zubeldia to making the abrupt career switch. I suppose you really do hear something new every day…
Goat's head for sale!
Yes, this is still road.cc. Yes we’re not talking about Eddy Merckx, Marianne Vos or Tadej Pogačar
It’s a YT industries bike sale…
Fuming residents claim children’s bike track has “ruined living here” – due to kids “peering” into their homes
A laughably depressing story from Ryan here. The ‘Penguins of Madagascar’ ethos of “just smile & wave” clearly gets short shrift in Folkestone
Kilo King Cundy unstoppable at Para-cycling track Worlds
Some nice news from Rio de Janeiro where Jody Cundy has won his 16th (sixteenth!) World Championships gold medal in the C4 kilo at the UCI Para-cycling Track World Championships.
It was a British one-two as Cundy came in ahead of compatriot Archie Atkinson, 26 years his junior.
There were other medals too as Blaine Hunt won silver in the C5 kilo, Fin Graham won bronze in the C3 sprint, along with GB’s team tandem sprint pairs of Lizzi Jordan and Danni Khan, and James Ball and Steffan Lloyd. Kadeena Cox meanwhile narrowly missed out on a medal after finishing fourth in the C4 elimination race.
“We can’t do this without the police”: Tour of Holland stage cancelled after motorist ignores marshals and drives towards riders in chaotic scenes
I’m afraid there will be no racing round-up from me later this afternoon as Stage 3 of the Tour of Holland has been cancelled after drivers joined the course.
The race was led by Brit Ethan Hayter following his victories in yesterday’s time trial and the opening prologue but today’s action was curtailed barely 30km into the stage. Ryan Mallon has the full-story below:
Pro cyclist 'banned' from China after Strava emoji controversy
We reported earlier in the week on Mario Aparicio, the Burgos Burpellet cyclist who was disqualified from the Tour of Mentougou in China after uploading a pig emoji next to the Chinese flag. Well, things have gone further…
Basque newspaper El Correo are reporting that Aparicio has now been banned from entering China for life after a social media storm surrounded the Strava post that has since been deleted.
Burgos Burpellet said in a statement that no ill-intent was meant on Aparicio’s part and that it was a reference towards his teammate who won the opening stage. But that excuse did not cut the mustard with Chinese social media users who demanded an apology for the ‘insulting’ post. The race organisation, in disqualifying the 25-year old, said his actions had “violated the spirit of sportsmanship, damaged the image of the race, and caused a serious negative impact.”
With Aparicio seemingly now unable to return to China, it seems unlikely that any reconciliation is forthcoming. For Burgos, who rely heavily on Asian races to earn UCI rankings points, the move is an additional logistical complication when planning their rider programs for next season.
Following his disqualification Aparicio, who has a contract with the team for 2026, returned home ahead of his team and competed in the Giro del Veneto on Wednesday.
"Sometimes we wish he would slow down": Pogačar's mother sheds light on son's "exhausted" Tour de France
The Pogačar news keeps coming this morning, as Le Parisien have conducted an interview with Marjeta Pogačar, mother of the best cyclist in the world and a French teacher by trade.
In it, she describes her son as “really, really tired” during this year’s Tour de France. “Exhausted, maybe. And I said to myself: I can understand now if he stops cycling or at least for a year.”
Marjeta went on to say of her son that “he never complains, he’s not like that” before wondering that “maybe he wasn’t in pain because I took his pain. That’s what mothers do, they feel their child.”
The comments are the latest development on the story of Tadej Pogačar’s apathy towards his own success and talent. It first emerged when he rode defensively during the second-half of this year’s Tour de France and suggested he was burnt out before this week it was revealed he was battling a knee injury.
Pogačar is contracted to ride for UAE until the end of 2030, by which point he will be 32, the same age at which Eddy Merckx retired but relatively young by modern standards. He has previously mentioned the Olympic Games in 2028 are also a major objective for him, in addition to winning all five Monuments.
Marjeta’s comments about a sabbatical are new to the conversation and are unlikely to be actioned considering the demands of Tadej Pogačar’s UAE paymasters. But it’s further food for thought as the cycling world tries to better understand the best cyclist in the world.
British rider retirement round-up
Don’t think that the cancellation of the Tour of Holland wasn’t going to stop me from preparing a round-up post for you! Because with the end of the road racing season nigh, it’s a good chance to recap the Brits leaving the pro peloton this year, not least the hitters from what I suppose we could call the ‘golden generation’.
Geraint Thomas and Lizzie Deignan are the biggest British names confirmed to be leaving the peloton with Thomas bidding farewell with a Cardiff homecoming at the Tour of Britain last month, whilst Deignan brought forward her retirement after becoming pregnant with her third child with ex-pro Phil Deignan. But they are from the only ones leaving the peloton.
Though he hasn’t confirmed it, at 40-years old and seriously injured in a crash earlier in the year, Chris Froome is likely to be waving goodbye to the peloton in the coming weeks. In truth, it has been an inauspicious end to a glittering career that saw him win seven Grand Tours including four Tour de France titles. But since another career-defining crash in 2020, he has been a shadow of his former self, uncompetitive and unable to contest at the pointy end of bike races all whilst earning millions of pounds a year on a five-year contract for Israel-Premier Tech.
On the wheel of Froome in this photo is Dan McLay, the British sprinter-turned leadout man who also confirmed his retirement earlier in the week. He rose to prominence with his extraordinary victory in the GP Denain in 2016 and spent most of his career with the Breton team most recently known as Arkea-Samsic, riding the Tour de France four times, before this year working as a domestique for Olav Kooij at Visma-Lease a bike.
Also retiring at the relatively young age of 28 is Lizzie Holden. The Manx rider announced her decision this week, writing on Instagram that she’d “lost a lot of confidence on the bike” in particular following “a crash resulting in a broken collarbone, numerous broken ribs and a punctured lung (to really put a nail in the coffin)”. Holden, a former national Time Trial champion, became a trusted domestique at UAE Team ADQ in recent years, regularly selected for the Tour de France Femmes, Giro Donne and Paris-Roubaix. Here’s wishing for a retirement with distinctly fewer broken bones!
"Tramadol was legal and I was using it heavily," Vuelta winner Horner sympathises with Tadej Pogačar's Tour de France injury 'struggles'
We start today with the latest musings from the oldest Grand Tour winner in history, Chris Horner.
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Speaking on his own YouTube channel, which is the style of the time, the 2013 Vuelta a España champion reflected on the news that Tadej Pogačar was battling a knee injury during the second half of this year’s Tour de France that apparently left the Slovenian close to abandoning the race whilst in the maillot jaune and caused him to ride more defensively in the latter stages of the race.
“You’ve got thousands upon thousands of pedal strokes, and something’s going to give.” Horner said.
“This is the more educated, adult experience now that Pogačar is coming into. If you can’t get rid of Jonas Vingegaard straight away, you don’t want to lose time to him either. So he raced wisely. He backed off the throttle.
“It wasn’t a lack of motivation. What we were watching was a rider in pain, protecting his GC.”
So far, so normal. But as an ex-pro, Horner probably realised the key to get people to engage with his content was to share his own lived experience of racing through pain, although he maybe went a degree too far.
“Whenever your body goes into trauma, it always gains weight,” he explained. “I’ve been in hospital after crashes where I didn’t eat for a week and came out seven or eight pounds heavier.
“Instead of losing weight as the race goes on, like you normally would, you’re gaining it. Every little bit counts when you’re climbing Ventoux or the Loze.
“[At the 2009 Tour of California] I was taking Tramadol aggressively to get through every stage,” he said. “In those days it was legal and I was using it heavily.
“But it was clear — I was gaining weight. I could see it day after day. I told my teammates: don’t wait for me on Mount Palomar. My form had just dropped away.”
As a reminder, tramadol is a strong painkiller that was banned by the UCI (in 2019 -thanks to user Rendel Harris in the comments) for a suspected link between its use and crashes in the peloton. Former Endura Racing and Team Sky rider Jonathan Tiernan-Locke claimed that the drug was freely offered by British Cycling in and around the 2012 World Championships.
However, it took several years until it was added to the World Anti-Doping Agency’s banned substances list due to a lack of clear evidence of performance enhancement. This meant Nairo Quintana’s UCI-imposed disqualification from the Tour de France in 2022 did not result in an additional doping ban from WADA. WADA added tramadol to its banned substance list later that year.
> World Anti-Doping Agency set to ban painkiller tramadol (from 2022)
Horner also used his channel to remind viewers of his own injury struggles during that race that encouraged his more aggressive racing strategy.
“In 2013 when I was racing the Vuelta I had an issue behind my left knee. My
wife was taping it up for me. She literally came into the team bus and the team staff was going berserk bringing a woman up into the team bus at a grand tour while I’m racing for the race leaders jersey. They couldn’t believe I was bringing my wife in the bus.”
“I said I don’t have time to explain it to you. I need my wife to tape my knee up. I started racing crazy tactics at the finish of stage eight so I could try to win the stage because I didn’t think I was going to start nine.”
For a rider like Horner, whose Vuelta triumph arrived at the age of 41 against the likes of Vincenzo Nibali and Alejandro Valverde, his tramadol use is not a great thing to be admitting. During his career, Horner never stayed at a team for longer than three years. He had spells at FDJ, Saunier-Duval, Lotto, Astana and Radioshack among others.
Despite winning the 2013 Vuelta, his contract wasn’t renewed and he left Radioshack to race for Lampre-Merida before gradually dropping out of the pro ranks altogether. His previous career highlights include overall victory in the Tour of the Basque Country in 2010, a year where he also finished eighth overall in the Tour de France.
This whole story is all rather murky, and you have to question the wisdom of Horner choosing to disclose this chapter of his medical history. Still, at least we know Tadej Pogacar has an ally should he ever need to comment on a sore knee ever again…
17 October 2025, 09:08
17 October 2025, 09:08
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Latest Comments
There was never really anything to say about le col kit. Most of it was alright. Some of it was poorly designed/made. Trying to position yourself as a Rapha competitor whilst always offering 40% or more off doesn't scream premium though.
Up next in the MucOff product line; for when the cassette won't budge, (chain)whip-it!
(Plus I'm pretty certain TDF team leaders don't drive themselves to the start nor bring their own bicycles)
@MaxiMinimalist Absolutely, and there is not one inch of middle ground between cycling there and using an incredibly selfish and wasteful supercar, is there? Fortunately I suspect the whole thing is AI, as the footage on his Instagram shows the numberplate GT3...
That Dogma colour scheme...Don't hate it - but reminds my of the Orange Clorkwork I had in '95!
My last collision with a car happened like that too, except we were pulling from a red light and she didn't signal til I was next to her. But I wasn't hurt, damage to my bike and clothing was minimal, and she stopped and apologized profusely, explaining she had a brain fart and simply forgot I was there. Fair enough. I already knew her insurance adjuster, and we had a good laugh.
@wtjs I got an NIP ref and subsequent update saying "The case has been transferred for court proceedings." but nothing after that (request to attend as witness or result). I've chased the police for an update but I won't be surprised if I get no response.
Is this a 'filler' article to get content out? Opinions are like nostrils we've all got them but out of the bikes in this opinion piece, laying down power on real roads and not being beaten up I would rate the Bianchi and the Lapierre.
Why would one expect a nearly 27-yo professional with millions at the bank, who rides a bicycle for a living and wins cycling races, to cycle to the start of TdF?
@mitsky But the left hook definitely was actioned With what action?
37 thoughts on ““Tramadol was legal and I used it heavily,” Vuelta winner Horner sympathises with Tadej Pogačar’s injury struggles at TdF; “Sometimes we wish he’d slow down” Pogačar’s mother says a sabbatical for her son would be “understandable” + more on the live blog”
Quote:
Someone wasn’t following yesterday’s match then…
Quote:
I think to be fair to Horner you need to point out that in-competition use was not banned by the UCI until 2019 (WADA didn’t follow suit until 2024), rather than just saying it was banned for “many years”, and so Horner’s use was completely legitimate. There may be other questions to be asked about his surprising Vuelta triumph but it’s entirely unfair to say “his tramadol use is not a great thing to be admitting” – he took legal painkillers, there’s nothing to “admit”.
I dont think theirs anything
I dont think theirs anything wrong with coming out with what Horner has, least he’s been transparent…on the subject of Pogs knee prob – so expanded it and his cycling, it’s called ‘conversation!
Quote:
Apparently Gemini thinks different. Although I’m not entirely convinced by its quoted source material for that…
Had the misfortune to come
Had the misfortune to come across one of these today
https://www.saicmaxus.co.uk/our-range/new-vans/eterron-9/
2.9 T, high flat front end. Real pedestrian killer although has a 84% Euro NCAP rating. How is this allowed on the roads ?
That’s a disgrace. I believe
That’s a disgrace. I believe that back in the day some people charged with breaking into nuclear weapon installations or submarine bases were acquitted on the grounds of a “necessity defence”, i.e. that they were acting to prevent greater harm; couldn’t someone incapacitating such a vehicle as this use the same defence that allowing this vehicle onto the streets represented an unacceptable level of danger to the public?
Not an entirely serious suggestion, before the barrackroom lawyers jump on me, but just because it wouldn’t be allowed doesn’t mean it shouldn’t be.
I thought those cases were
I thought those cases were dropped to make the events non-stories as to not give their causes undue publicity. Exactly as didn’t happen when the members of P.A. gave the air force planes new paint jobs.
Maybe some of them, but I
Maybe some of them, but I think it has been used successfully in court, much to the disgust of the judiciary. There were definitely some Extinction Rebellion protesters a few years ago (during the pandemic I think?) who broke some windows at a Shell office, the judge told the jury that their claim that they were acting to prevent the climate emergency had no basis in law but the jury still acquitted them. I think some pro-Palestinian activists were acquitted by a jury more recently for occupying a drone factory and stopping production, if memory serves in that case the judge told the jury that they could consider the defence of necessity as the defendants claimed they had to act to stop war crimes.
Last year an elderly lady was
Last year an elderly lady was hit by someone driving a Ford Ranger while crossing a road near me and later died. The vehicle was turning into a side street in a very busy local high street area. It’s an area with a lot of pedestrians, and
When it happened, the local Facebook page was full of people offering their sympathy to the driver, and discussing how old people can’t be trusted not to jump out in front of cars wearing their invisibility cloaks. This assumption was often repeated as a matter of fact whenever any issue of road safety and driver behaviour came up in the area.
Last week the driver was in court and admitted to causing death by careless driving, and the collated evidence, including CCTV footage, showed the lady had already been crossing the road for five seconds with the aid of a zimmer frame when the driver turned right into the side street without indicating. He said he was only going at 1mph, but didn’t see her. Something to do with the low sun. The court was told he would have hit her zimmer frame before hitting her.
Who knows what would have happened if he’d been in a more sensible car, but the ignorance regarding the safety of such vehicles is so pervasive that I doubt many will be wondering.
It does have 360 cameras and
It does have 360 cameras and front and rear sensors. But 0 to 60 in 5 s and 0 to 30 in 3 means anything or anyone it hits is going to be seriously damaged/injured.
Its an aggricultural vehicle
Its an aggricultural vehicle
I think that’s the loophole they use.
I’m glad to see Cardiff has managed to get their case through to charge them more for parking at least.
Cardiff becomes first UK council to impose higher parking charges on larger vehicles | Cardiff | The Guardian
Hirsute wrote:
It’s a pickup truck, so counts as a commercial vehicle. In other words, a loophole, since most of these perform very little if any “commercial” activity, whilst their double-cab body tells you that they are in fact used in lieu of properly regulated cars. It’s a disgrace.
I thought this loophole was being closed, but not sure?
Sriracha wrote:
Not this one – to be classed as a commercial vehicle it must have a payload of at least one tonne. The payload of these is 620kg, presumably due to the weight of the batteries (it’s an EV).
Sriracha wrote:
It has been, since April anything with a payload capacity under one tonne now does not qualify for commercial vehicle tax relief.
Banned from entering China
Banned from entering China for life, no doubt the BH pro rider did hurt the feeling of the Chinese people. A nation that loves its Ju-Ju and eats it immoderatly. There are “pork towers” in China that can house 650,000 pigs. Crikey!
As I said yesterday when you
As I said yesterday when you pulled the same “joke”, why do you think this is such a gotcha? British people eat plenty of pork and calling someone a pig is still highly offensive in Britain.
If Magnier wins the last two
If Magnier wins the last two stages of the Tour of Guangxi and clinches the GC, he will have 21 victories under his belt, beating Pogi by one unit. With the young guns taking big on their first or second year in the pro peloton (del Toro, Brennan), one can’t remain the GOAT more than 2 years. Retiring at 26 makes sense. To be continued.
MaxiMinimalist wrote:
Yeah…perhaps we need to look at the UCI points for the year, 11680 for Pogacar, 2279 for Magnier, don’t think Tadej’s looking over his shoulder just yet. I read somewhere yesterday that if Pogacar was a team on his own he would rank ninth in the UCI world team rankings!
Pogačar’s mum: “he’s not the
Pogačar’s mum: “he’s not the Cycling Messiah, he’s a very naughty boy”.
I thought vehicles turning
I thought vehicles turning into a side road had to give way to pedestrians.
kingleo wrote:
Only an HC “should”, not a “must”, so they don’t actually have to. It really is time the HC was revised to remove the “shoulds” which are really little more than “it would be awfully nice if you would…”
I’m not sure how you
I’m not sure how you rationalise a “should” when the ped is actually crossing. Surely the hierarchy has force at this point & the vehicle user “must” yield?
Many, many years ago (lol); I was taught that traffic of any sort (ped, horse, cycle) on the main road had pririty over traffic leaving or joining. I supose you could say that is stil a “should”, but in those days “Should” seemed to carry more weight.
ChrisA wrote:
There are no ‘MUST’s in the Hierarchy of Road Users – it’s just a ‘Be nice, m’kay!’
I know, that’s why the
I know, that’s why the recommendation in H2 is so ridiculous. As a bare minimum it should be changed to the same rules as a zebra crossing, “should” give way to those waiting, “must” give way to those already crossing.
If I’m walking along Alpha
If I’m walking along Alpha Road and Bravo Close adjoins it with an uncontrolled junction, I decline to describe what I am doing as “crossing Bravo Close”. I’m walking along Alpha Road; I’m passing Bravo Close, not crossing it.
GMBasix wrote:
I like that as a point very much; it’s perfectly logical and in fact would be a good reason for give way lines to be painted in line with the inside boundary of the pavement rather than in line with the kerb and drivers having to give way to all traffic, motor, cycle, or foot before crossing. I have seen a few raised junctions around London where this applies, usually with the paving colour going straight on across the junction to provide a visual signal of the fact that the pedestrian space still exists going across the road. Should be a default.
I like it too, but I would
I like it too, but I would have liked it better if it had been Alpha Boulevard and Charlie Drive.
mdavidford wrote:
… leading to Echo Freeway and the Golf Hotel, India.
As a slight aside – I like
As a slight aside – I like the Dutch system where any junction where priory is not trivially obvious or that has signals has small “shark-tooth” give way markings, which also act as a fall-back to guide behaviour if signals are not working.
Since we have legal give way markings already in the UK it doesn’t seem to be a stretch to propose those here. (Albeit I am not an expert / apparently these rules can get complicated / somehow have to get all road users used to them which is the main issue anyway…)
Greater Manchester (Chris
Greater Manchester (Chris Boardman/TfGM) trialled zebra road markings at side junctions.
The Regulations for That Sort of Thing require beacons, zigzags and the like, so it was a punt, because [what I shall call] terminal zebras didn’t have those.
Any local authority implementing them runs the risk that any confusion could be a point of litigation in the event of damages arising.
Nevertheless, the trial results were promising, as TfGM and TRL state. Indeed, Sheffield is keen to conduct a similar trial.
Personally, I think it shoudl not need zebras, but drivers have become accustomed to think of pedestrians as a secondary observation target, especially when emerging from a junction. I like the idea of give ways being set back to the edge of the major highway at a junction, but drivers will still roll forward for visibility where parked cars restrict the view, and they will do that regardless of pedestrians passing the end of the road from which they are emerging. The trial data indicate a significant compliance.
I guess we’ll see whether
I guess we’ll see whether “invented here” is a help or a sideshow – see Ranty Highwayman/Robert Weetman collab on safer side street junctions.
https://therantyhighwayman.blogspot.com/2025/10/what-makes-side-road-junctions.html
I also like “continuous
I also like “continuous footway / cycle path” at minor side-road junctions *. And in fact these can be done and have been done ** . But also as you note they still are affected by:
– a horror of LTNs and/or refusal to help reduce traffic flows through what *should* effectively be “access only” areas. Culprit is partly our default “open both ends” streets / “fully permeable to motor traffic” residential areas.
– vehicle parking (either compliance with that or the design going through with sufficient parking removed – and not creeping back in because vociferous objections).
– if drivers ignore everything they are passing over and through and keep rolling forward until they are immediately adjacent to the main lanes these don’t help (still the majority behaviour I’ve observed).
* And driveways! Looking at you yet again Edinburgh council (Leith Connections, huge driveways interrupting the footway and cycle path next to Sandport Bridge)
** eg. Edinburgh, West Coates to Haymarket section of the CCWEL – though as usual they’ve still managed to avoid having a standard design over a few hundred metres and still not quite got all the details “right” (as eg. judged against Dutch or using Robert Weetman’s evaluation guide).
Some drivers don’t like you
Some drivers don’t like you taking your side road priority at the best of times. They particularly dislike it here! Am I being unreasonable ignoring the zebra now the code has changed?!
Only an HC “should”, not a
Only an HC “should”, not a “must”, so they don’t actually have to. It really is time the HC was revised to remove the “shoulds” which are really little more than “it would be awfully nice if you would…”
It hardly matters when the police view ‘musts’ as entirely optional points about which they are dedicated to taking no action when respectable drivers are the offenders. You ‘must’ Stop at red traffic lights (never mind ambers, which they won’t acknowledge as existing at all), you ‘must not’ cross unbroken white lines or interact with a handheld mobile device, your vehicle ‘must’ be covered by a valid MOT etc. etc- all of these, you are tired of me stating, are ignored without acknowledgement by Lancashire Police and, no doubt, many other forces as well after they’ve gone through the fobbing-off procedure where they just say they were too busy to deal with the offence within 2 weeks, or whatever other dodge from The Idlers Handbook they’re using this week.
Rendel Harris wrote:
Yes – but I believe that would actually require new law (eg. possibly amending the Road Traffic Act or whatever) to mean anything. Which we know is currently even less of a political priority than increasing *possible* penalties for the couple of cyclists who kill a pedestrian every year or so.
… and would still be moot until the police can be persuaded to actually enforce this (plus we’d need more road police, and some of those might instead decide to concentrate on RLJ cyclists, assisting in enforcing PSPOs or cautioning cyclists for public order offences like swearing…)
Rendel Harris wrote:
100% agree that the law should be brought into line with the highway code. It seems a waste of time having a set of rules which everyone is supposed to abide by, for the safety of all road users, if it can be ignored at will with zero consequence from the police.
If I have understood correctly, however, the HC kicks in for civil procedings, so I asssume they would be found liable under those circumstances. So not completely without consequence if something is damaged or someone is injured as a result of breaking the rules and someone decided to pursue the matter in the courts. Potentially a bit late for any victims though.
I get where you’re coming
I get where you’re coming from, but unfortunately the same analysis can apply for the law – you’re not supposed to kill someone by driving far below the standard of the careful and competent driver, but it still happens * a lot* and the prosecution comes too late for the victim.