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allez neg.
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March 19, 2014 at 9:48 am #20981
Eg3ftp1
What’s going on here then?<http://www.teamsky.com/article/0,27290,17546_9221191,00.html>
Is this a pre-emptive measure to avoid a repeat the JTL situation?
http://www.teamsky.com/article/0,27290,17546_9221191,00.html -
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bashthebox
This fascinating article
This fascinating article popped up on my twitter stream earlier today – http://decaironman-training.com/2014/03/19/the-challenge-of-monitoring-altitude-natives-in-professional-cycling/
It’s quite strong on the technical language, so if you’re the sort of person who screams a spittle-flecked “DOPE!” like some cycling-obsessed Father Jack / Digger Forum type every time a bicycle rider wins a race, you might not be able to read until the end without your brain melting.
Anyway, certain populations who have lived in regions like the high Andes and Himalayas are observed to have evolved exceptionally fast to deal with living at high altitude, in slightly different and distinct ways. They’re physiologically adapted, rather than adapted by training at altitude…. but much more than this, science doesn’t seem to know.
Which kind of makes Sky’s statement pretty honest really. Henao is showing odd numbers, drugs exist, so does altitude.Him Up North
stumps wrote:At least Sky
stumps wrote:At least Sky have come out at the earliest opportunity to make it public knowledge rather than it be leaked by someone which leaves Sky answering difficult questions.I commented positively on their proactive attitude on the news page, however now I’m reading Sky issued the statement in reaction to the story being broken by Gazzetta della Sport. 😕
mrmo
Matt_Z wrote:Indeed MrMo. If
Matt_Z wrote:Indeed MrMo. If that is the case we will soon see Nepalese sherpas on pro bicycles instead of Everest 😀 . It would not surprise me if there is some natural effect. The question remains is it genetic or not? There is a study from 97 indicating that altitude training does increase red blood cells though (Levine, Stray-Gundersen, JAP). We will have to wait and see what the conclusion is here. I am very much pro team sky, yet the doping culture is a stigma that chases the sport without respite. Time to wait and see :WThere is always the question why East Africa produces so many good long distance runners… drugs? environment? genetics?
Super Domestique
Colin Peyresourde wrote: The
Colin Peyresourde wrote:The excuse Sky seem to have come up with seems a little weak.Which excuse is that exactly?
Think you may need to read who contacted who again.
Or not, I mean, why let the details get in the way of a good Sky bashing!
mooleur
Colin Peyresourde wrote:I
Colin Peyresourde wrote:I don’t think there is any good way to spin this. Sky are being given time to find a reason for elevated levels under suspicious circumstances. The excuse Sky seem to have come up with seems a little weak – but I wouldn’t expect Henao to be any different from some of his compatriots (Betancur, Quintana, Uran Uran – they all seem to be doing so well don’t they!?).I was just talking the other day about how the JTL thing seems to have been buried.
From what I read on the BBC website this is a new test required by anti-doping authorities. Having watched and enjoyed the Tirreno-Adriatico with a mountain stage finished at an average of over 25mph (including a 600m 25% ramp) I wouldn’t say that I find these findings anomalous. I think I would also ask exactly what the authorities have done to stamp out doping….the answer is not most encouraging.
What excuse is weak? They’ve suspended him from their scheduling – that’s hardly a spin is it??
The JTL thing hasn’t really been buried, it took much longer this for the original results to show up – the fact that there’s now further investigation both from a legal and medical perspective means that this will take time and most of that time will be apart from the chit chat of the public for obvious reasons.
Your criticism/doubt on the subject seems a little ambiguous? 25mph averages for a stage is a very regular average for the pro peoloton.
The ‘authorities’ are actually doing a lot to stamp out doping and the sport has come on leaps and bounds in the last 5 years because of this, the fact that the UCI are carrying out this research is testament to the fact that they are open to ensuring the sport becomes fairer.
farrell
Colin Peyresourde wrote:I
Colin Peyresourde wrote:I don’t think there is any good way to spin this. Sky are being given time to find a reason for elevated levels under suspicious circumstances.Who is giving Sky time?
Sky found the results, Sky contacted the UCI.
If they wanted/needed time to hide something surely they’d have just kept quiet?
mooleur
Gkam84 wrote:He’s not been
Gkam84 wrote:He’s not been suspended, he’s off to altitude to help the UCI figure out tests I think. :?Not suspended by UCI but suspended from the team’s race roster for now.
Wouldn’t trust the UCI to do anything properly atm!
(did I say that out loud!?)
Colin Peyresourde
I don’t think there is any
I don’t think there is any good way to spin this. Sky are being given time to find a reason for elevated levels under suspicious circumstances. The excuse Sky seem to have come up with seems a little weak – but I wouldn’t expect Henao to be any different from some of his compatriots (Betancur, Quintana, Uran Uran – they all seem to be doing so well don’t they!?).I was just talking the other day about how the JTL thing seems to have been buried.
From what I read on the BBC website this is a new test required by anti-doping authorities. Having watched and enjoyed the Tirreno-Adriatico with a mountain stage finished at an average of over 25mph (including a 600m 25% ramp) I wouldn’t say that I find these findings anomalous. I think I would also ask exactly what the authorities have done to stamp out doping….the answer is not most encouraging.
Gkam84
He’s not been suspended, he’s
He’s not been suspended, he’s off to altitude to help the UCI figure out tests I think. 😕Matt_Z
Indeed MrMo. If that is the
Indeed MrMo. If that is the case we will soon see Nepalese sherpas on pro bicycles instead of Everest 😀 . It would not surprise me if there is some natural effect. The question remains is it genetic or not? There is a study from 97 indicating that altitude training does increase red blood cells though (Levine, Stray-Gundersen, JAP). We will have to wait and see what the conclusion is here. I am very much pro team sky, yet the doping culture is a stigma that chases the sport without respite. Time to wait and see :Wmooleur
mrmo wrote:Which is where you
mrmo wrote:Which is where you may or may not be wrong, the question which needs answering and there are studies on this, does being from a population that lives at altitude result in genetic(for a better term) changes. Would a Nepalese tolerate oxygen at high altitude and sea level differently from a Dutch person, does blood composition change, etc.Reading the statement, something’s not right, and we haven’t got a clue why. Better be safe suspend the rider and get some tests done.
Completely agree, no point jumping to conclusions yet. That’s not naivety either (before anyone decides to jump on the whole sports corrupt wagon and start giving it beans!) – there’s a lot of science still to uncover with this sort of thing.
I hope it’s a good outcome, not a bad one, for the sports sake.
I think Sky have dealt with this very well, good statement. Good on them.
mrmo
Matt_Z wrote:Regarding
Matt_Z wrote:Regarding altitude it would be the same as living in Lombardy or Hautes-Alpes. I personally doubt that there is much effect unless he is constantly climbing above that in training as due to the lower oxygen levels the body may try to compensate. I hesitate to say this is natural. However, if it would be we will soon see pro-teams training in the Andes during winter.Which is where you may or may not be wrong, the question which needs answering and there are studies on this, does being from a population that lives at altitude result in genetic(for a better term) changes. Would a Nepalese tolerate oxygen at high altitude and sea level differently from a Dutch person, does blood composition change, etc.
Reading the statement, something’s not right, and we haven’t got a clue why. Better be safe suspend the rider and get some tests done.
Stumps
To be fair his recent form is
To be fair his recent form is not that good which kind of points towards a natural complaint rather than a chemical / drug misuse. At least Sky have come out at the earliest opportunity to make it public knowledge rahter than it be leaked by someone which leaves Sky answering difficult questions.othello
From the statement (what it
From the statement (what it says, and reading between the lines), he has readings which don’t look good. Sky are checking to see if those readings can be replicated at altitude, or are due to altitude. If not, then the readings can’t be explained naturally, which leaves un-natural reasons.notfastenough
The sky-haters will be along
The sky-haters will be along in 5-4-3-2…. -
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