[Nixster]

So I thought I’d build up a gravel bike and try out tubeless tyres and discs.  It’s not going well!

I have Hope twenty five wheels to which I’m fitting Conti Terraspeed tyres.  I wrapped with the provided tubeless tape and installed the provided valves – no dice.  Tyres inflate and seat (one with just a track pump) then lose air even after sealant (Stans) was installed.

So, I re-wrapped with Stans tape, pulled super tight to get a good seal on the rim.  Again, no dice, air loss sounded like it was around the valves this time.  Installed new Effeto Mariposa tubeless valves,  these seem to have sealed but now the air loss seems to be around the bead, again even after putting in sealant.  Tyres still inflate and seat relatively easily (CO2 in one but track pump for the other) but deflate after a couple of hours.

I’m now out for rim tape, valves, sealant and two inner tubes (putting those in was refreshingly simple) so reluctant to try again – what am I doing wrong??!!

Topic

[Welsh boy]

“I would add that if you use

“I would add that if you use CO2 to pump up your tyres, they will lose pressure more quickly than if you had used air from a track pump.”

Really?  That is not my experience, I have been using CO2 canisters for roadside repairs (inner tubes and tubeless before I went back to inner tubes because of all the fuss and no noticable improvement) for 10 years and have not found my tyres deflating or needing topping up any quicker than using compressed air from a pump, they can last months before they need topping up.  I believe this “fact” about CO2 seeping out to be a myth.

[Bristol Bullet]

This man knows what he is

This man knows what he is talking about. I would add that if you use CO2 to pump up your tyres, they will lose pressure more quickly than if you had used air from a track pump. CO2 permeates through rubber more quickly than air, even though CO2 molecules are larger than nitrogen and oxygen molecules, CO2 is soluble in rubber and so passes through it quicker than air. So once your tyres are seated, deflate them, inject your sealant and then pump back up with a track pump. I persevered with Muc-Off sealant in my 28mm Hutchinsons at 60 psi but found it didn’t live up to  it’s “no puncture hassles” claim. Basically it was shite sealant, tyres would lose a lot of air over a week, which I thought was normal for tubeless tyres but when it failed to seal a small thorn puncture  I switched to Stans and boy what a difference. My tyres now lose much less air.

[Anonymous]

I’ve run 28mm tubeless tyres

I’ve run 28mm tubeless tyres since 2015 when I bought my first set of Hunt wheels and Scwalbe Pro One tyres.

I’ve never run anything lower than 75 psi (been as heavy as 100kg, now 85kg) and currently run 90 rear, 82 front (Michelin Power Road TLR 28mm on Hunt 48 Limitless). I’ve only ever had 1 puncture when I was using some Veloflex TLR tyres (superb tyres but not winter resilient) and this was easily fixed with one of the worm things. Turn the wheel so the sealant interacts with the worm/puncture, wait 5 mins, blast with co2 and then carried on for 20 miles home.

I’ve had maybe 10 sets of wheels since then and double the amount of tubeless tyres (I’m a confessed wheel/tyre whore) and only ever run in to issues with Specialized Roval CLX 50 wheels. They are a complete dog of a wheelset. No matter what I did I’d come back to them and not only would the tyres be flat but due to the crappy tubeless design the sealant would have leaked out and the tyres would be in the centre channel. I got rid sharpish.

In my experience it all comes down to the quality of the components being used, if they have been designed to the latest ETRTO standards and if you’re willing to put a little effort in to getting them set up perfectly then tubeless just cannot be beaten. Yes, sometimes, like in my earlier reply, you need to faff a bit but that’s an extreme example. 

[wycombewheeler]

Chris Hayes wrote:

There are just too many variables using tubeless tyres, and I have four sets of wheels waiting for them to wear out: valve seating, tyre seating, (in) compatibility of wheel rim and tyre hook, gettting the tape to seal, viscosity of sealant, drying out of sealant when you finally have a puncture….and if the sealant has not dried out or the puncture is so serious it warrants an innertube anyway, then you’re covered in the shite anyway.  

I’m bored of it and can’t be arsed to describe some of the many travails I’ve suffered. They are great when they work. Terrible when they don’t.  

and then there is TSS where there is no tyre hook and the only interface between rim and tyre is on the paralell inner rim wall.

[wycombewheeler]

hirsute wrote:

hirsute wrote:

What size tyres and pressure though? A tentative view is that it doesn’t work very well for high pressure or less than 32mm tyres.

running 28mm Pirellis at 60psi, no issues. Remember that removing the tube allows you to drop pressure for the same tyre size because a) some of that pressure is taken up stretching the tube b) you can’t get a pinch flat.

[moneypit]

Secret_squirrel wrote:

“I’m surprised no-ones yet mentioned running a  bead of sealant around the outside of the tyre after fitting but before inflating.   Watch the video on the hunt website. 

Sometimes it just takes a couple of tries. My latest Hunt / Schwable Pro One combo took 3 reseats and and about a month of running in before the losses dropped to 2-3 psi per day. (from 70). Seems to stop around 40.”

This worked for me – after much effing and blinding in an attempt to get Specialised Pathfinders seated on some DT Swiss rims , my LBS told me to try this and the tyres went on easily with a track pump and don’t lose any significant pressure in weeks now.

[Hirsute]

I put 32 as they seem to have

I put 32 as they seem to have a lower max than any 25/28s I have had (and you have to factor in the minimum too).

Reading previous articles and topics, lower pressures work better.

Would be worth an article by road.cc on it with more data, as what I have read previously is only a straw poll of views/experiences.

[Chris Hayes]

I’ve no experience of

I’ve no experience of anything over a 28mm tyre – though most of my bikes are old so run on 25s – but intuitively I agree with you.  They’re run at 70-80psi – enough, it seems, to force most of the sealant out through any small hole regardless of viscosity.  

Interestingly, the pressure limits on the 5000TLs are the same as the 4000s…. so the manufacturers don’t think that it makes a difference. 

[Sriracha]

Tyres always specify their
Tyres always specify their pressure range, particularly the upper limit. Surely tyre sealants should do the same? It seems obvious that there must be an upper pressure beyond which the sealant can not be expected to work (and possibly a lower limit too?)

[Secret_squirrel]

I’d tend to agree on pressure

I’d tend to agree on pressure 70 psi is a good upper limit. Disagree on 32mm – 28 is fine.

[Hirsute]

What size tyres and pressure
What size tyres and pressure though?
A tentative view is that it doesn’t work very well for high pressure or less than 32mm tyres.

[Chris Hayes]

In my experience there are

There are just too many variables using tubeless tyres, and I have four sets of wheels waiting for them to wear out: valve seating, tyre seating, (in) compatibility of wheel rim and tyre hook, gettting the tape to seal, viscosity of sealant, drying out of sealant when you finally have a puncture….and if the sealant has not dried out or the puncture is so serious it warrants an innertube anyway, then you’re covered in the shite anyway.  

I’m bored of it and can’t be arsed to describe some of the many travails I’ve suffered. They are great when they work. Terrible when they don’t.  

[Secret_squirrel]

Nixster wrote:

And people say latex tubes are a faff! ?

TBF these are my 3rd set of tubeless wheels and none of the others were that much of a faff. 

[IanEdward]

I did two years on latex
I did two years on latex tubes and only went tubeless after a run off bad luck with Hawthorne clippings and paper thin race tyres.

I can report I’ve had just as many (well, just as few) punctures tubeless as I had with latex tubes. Basically I reckon if your tyre is soft enough that you can bang your rim then you’re just as likely to pinch the tyre as you are to pinch the tube!

[IanEdward]

My Pacenti rims are 20mm
My Pacenti rims are 20mm internal and Pacenti recommend 25mm tape. I always give it two wraps to be sure. Once the tyres have seated (a different battle…) they’ve always stayed up.

Also someone mentioned MucOff sealant, I think that is universally considered to be the worst of the lot! Too thick to distribute properly.

[Author]

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