[Nixster]

So I thought I’d build up a gravel bike and try out tubeless tyres and discs.  It’s not going well!

I have Hope twenty five wheels to which I’m fitting Conti Terraspeed tyres.  I wrapped with the provided tubeless tape and installed the provided valves – no dice.  Tyres inflate and seat (one with just a track pump) then lose air even after sealant (Stans) was installed.

So, I re-wrapped with Stans tape, pulled super tight to get a good seal on the rim.  Again, no dice, air loss sounded like it was around the valves this time.  Installed new Effeto Mariposa tubeless valves,  these seem to have sealed but now the air loss seems to be around the bead, again even after putting in sealant.  Tyres still inflate and seat relatively easily (CO2 in one but track pump for the other) but deflate after a couple of hours.

I’m now out for rim tape, valves, sealant and two inner tubes (putting those in was refreshingly simple) so reluctant to try again – what am I doing wrong??!!

Topic

[Nixster]

And people say latex tubes

And people say latex tubes are a faff! ?

[Nixster]

Yes, it’s ordered. First

Yes, it’s ordered. First attempt was with the tape that came with the wheels though. Thinking about it if the rim is 20mm at the bead hooks it’s likely 22mm across the base of the bed and effectively a couple of mm wider again when taking the well into account. Stretching the tape will also make it narrower so fingers crossed 25mm will do it. 
Thanks!

[Dexter H]

You need wider tape. 24mm is
You need wider tape. 24mm is recommended by hope. If you think about it the bed is 20mm straight across but the curve of the inside means when it is applied it’s effectively wider..if the 20mm is well stuck apply on top. Good luck

[Secret_squirrel]

I’m surprised no-ones yet

I’m surprised no-ones yet mentioned running a  bead of sealant around the outside of the tyre after fitting but before inflating.   Watch the video on the hunt website. 

Sometimes it just takes a couple of tries. My latest Hunt / Schwable Pro One combo took 3 reseats and and about a month of running in before the losses dropped to 2-3 psi per day. (from 70). Seems to stop around 40. 

 

[paulfrost]

Interesting. I’ve got the

Interesting. I’ve got the same problem. New Hunt 4 season X wide wheels and 40mm Terraspeed tyres. The tyres fitted by hand and seated first time with just a track pump. I was so excited, previous efforts with Panaracer GravelKings on Easton EA70 rims took 10 or more attempts to seat with a blaster tank. I left them overnight just to see what happend, they went down fully. I then added 80ml of MucOff sealant. They both went down overnight, one full and the other about 80% down.

I’ve pumped them up again every few hours and give them a spin to circulate the sealant. The test will be overnight tonight.

I wasn’t able to ride them yesterday after fitting as the weather was cold and wet. Now I’ve just had a cortisone injection in my knee and have been told not to cycle for a few days.

[ktache]

A fine and very comprehensive

A fine and very comprehensive answer.

[Nixster]

I’ve not yet given up

I’ve not yet given up completely!  25mm tape ordered.

I have had Stans seal punctures in tubulars before now so it can work.  I hear Orange Seal is rated too but I’ve yet to get to the point where I can see if Stans seals tubeless punctures! 

[mike the bike]

You and I have two things in

You and I have two things in common Mr Nixter, we have both had trouble with tubeless and we both used Stan’s gloop.  In my case the stuff simply would not seal punctures, large or small, and as it was supposed to be the best available I could see little point in trying others.

After eight months of perseverance I returned to the simple life of tubes and I gave Stan’s finest to a bloke I don’t much like.

[Anonymous]

First off, start with a clean

First off, start with a clean rim bed and by clean I mean wipe with a damp cloth, getting into the bead and then wipe with some IPA. This will give the rim tape the best possible surface to stick to.

If the centre channel is really deep I usually build it up with some insulation tape first. Then wipe the insulation tape with some IPA. 

Get some Tesa 4289 tape. This is basically what every tubeless tape is but you can get a huge roll for a few quid. If the internal rim width is 20mm I usually use 21-22mm width tape. This means the tape will be under the tyre on the bead. If the tape isn’t wide enough and the tape hasn’t stuck properly air will find a way under and the tubeless sealant will actually help to lift the tape.

When fitting the tape I put the wheel on a chair so I can work from above and trap the wheel as I apply the tape and making sure there are no bubbles under it. Once you’ve  applied the tape go round with a clean cloth and make sure it’s stuck down, especially at the bead.

Use a toothpick, something round and sharp to create the valve hole but not too big. Push the valve through the hole and let that make the hole fit it. Don’t screw the valve down too tight just yet as this means the tyre will have the fit around a wider part of it.

I usually let the tyres sit in some warm-ish soapy water then the beads are nice and pliable. The soapy water helps the tyre slip up on to the rim bead.

Work from the opposite end of the valve towards it. Make sure the tyre is in the centre channel all the way around, especially near the valve.

By now, all of the above should mean the tyre will inflate with just a track pump. If it doesn’t then I sometimes use a co2 cartridge.

Once the tyre is seated, leave it for 10-20 mintues. After 10 minutes, let the air out, the tyre shouldn’t slip in to the centre channel. Remove the valve core and apply the sealant. I re-use the little bottles you get some sealants in that fit over the valve stem or you can get a medical syringe. Once the sealant is in the tyre, the valve core fitted and the tyre inflated you need to make sure the sealant gets everywhere inside the tyre and rim. Not just a gentle spin or a ride. You need to systematically shake the wheel as you rotate it. Both sides. I can’t stress how important this part is as it will get the sealant everywhere.

I love doing tubeless tyres, it’s my thing ?

[Nixster]

Thanks all for the helpful

Thanks all for the helpful responses. 
I have tried some of the things suggested. I made the valve hole with a soldering iron 2nd time to avoid splits and have tried the valves finger tight and plier tight. And I’ve sloshed the sealant round and ridden them briefly too. Had to be briefly…

I suspect the answer is another wrap of tape, clean up the rims and try again. The rims are 20mm internal which is the limit of the width of tape I’m using. Any thoughts on whether the next layer should be wider? I have no bubbles but the well in the centre of the rims is pretty deep so the tape isn’t lapping up the sides of the rim bed.

Tyres are 40mm and I was starting at 40psi after backing off the pressure when the tyres popped over the bead seats.

[oceandweller]

It sounds like you’re almost

It sounds like you’re almost there. I have a TerraSpeed, tubeless, on the back of my do-it-all bike & it’s a super tyre, at tubeless pressures it works well on everything from road to some gnarly rooty bridleways, & stays up well (I top up the air every week or two), so it’s definitely worth persisting.

My first suggestion would be a +1 for h-peter’s 2nd point, don’t overtighten the retaining nut on the valve. Finger tight does it. Any tighter & you’ll get leaks around the valve body.

Next, try adding another layer of tape. The tighter the tyre is on the rim, the better the seal. This has fixed several slow leaks when fitting new tyres in the past. It goes without saying, get the existing tape dry & super, super clean before adding the extra layer, so it can stick easily!

Another point is, when applying tape really *s-q-u-e-e-z-e* it onto the rim. If you’re not sweating when you finish, you’re not trying hard enough. It needs to be smooth & as near bubble-free as you manage or the tyre beads won’t sit absolutely flush.

& don’t give up. The first time you set up tubeless wheels is always going to be the hardest! It never gets easy exactly, but it does get easier.

[hawkinspeter]

As you can get the tyre to

As you can get the tyre to seat, it must be just a slow leak probably due to the rim tape or valve. When you make the hole for the valve, you should be careful to use something round and pointy rather than a knife as otherwise the tape can split a bit when you put the valve in rather than just stretching around the valve.

If you’ve got any bubbles in the rim tape, that can cause a slow leak, but if you top up the sealant and give it a good slosh around than eventually it should seal properly. Also, over tightening the valve lock ring onto the rim can cause a leak – it should only be finger tight.

[Miller]

Always hard to diagnose bike

Always hard to diagnose bike problems from afar, but anyway.

First, it’s good you can get the tyres to mount and inflate. With that done, it’s good to go for a ride immediately, even if just round the block a couple of times. This splashes sealant around inside the tyre and gets it where it’s needed. Try this and see if it has a good effect. 

 

[Rich_cb]

When I’ve struggled to get a
When I’ve struggled to get a tubeless tyre setup I’ve found running tyres with a tube for a few rides helps to mould(?) them to the rim shape making it much easier the next time.

Seeing as you’ve already put tubes in I’d just ride like that for a few weeks then give it another go.

When you remove the tube try to leave one side of the tyre attached to the rim as well.

[andystow]

Did you turn the wheels

Did you turn the wheels sideways, roll them, and flip them to distribute the sealant? Even then, I’ve sometimes had it take a few days for new tubeless tyres to settle in and stop losing some air daily. Not a big deal.

What size tyres, and what pressure?

[Author]

Replies