[David9694]

Strange, isn’t it Germans, Remainers and cyclists looking on grimly at the last few days of driver hysteria. 

The oddest thing is how badly affected London and the south-east are – the best connected area, ranking high among those having most public transport and other travel options. 

As a cyclist, this doesn’t seem like much of an attitude or behaviour changer.  It does reveal to a wider audience a bit about the weird attachment some people have to their cars; how desperation, violence and abuse lurk just below the surface. 

In the short term, fuel shortages mean more frustrated drivers  scratting around for their precious supplies; more danger, more disruption when they find it. 

Unsurprisingly, the anti-LTN voices purporting to be concerned about emergency ambulances remain silent throughout. 

I take no pleasure in any of the chaos as I have elderly relatives who are highly reliant on twice-daily carers. What if it gets so bad that they can’t do their job? Brexiters seem to suggest this is just a patch of turbulence,  a necessary temporary sacrifice on the way to the sunny uplands. I guess we’ve all got to tighten our belts and believe a bit more strongly. 

As a remainer, petrolgate feels highly potent – whether we on here like it or not, as a politician, you upset the driver lobby at your peril.  Brexit, in the form of not enough drivers is hitting a lot of people in a place it really hurts. “Sort it” will be the terse message from local MPs to the PM. 

Yes I know, it’s an area that had issues before – but one of several where Brexit has been randomly chucked in with no plan.  I get a sense of some parts of industry being inert and saying to the govt – “your mess…”

Sarah Everard  – It’s not the time to highlight this more broadly, but there are parallels at so many levels with road violence and the fight against both. 

The car as a facilitator of the patriarchy might sound a bit far fetched, but a car was a vital tool in perpetrating this terrible crime.  And countless others perpetrated by men against women and girls at a range of levels.  Yes, Against me when I’m cycling – that’s a parallel, a shared interest in countering bullying and worse.

The issue is evderday-ised, trivialised so it goes largely unnoticed.  Victims need to take greater care, more precautions.  Flag down a bus  – how very London.  I haven’t yet heard anyone say “what was she doing out on her own at that hour – silly girl” but you can bet plenty are thinking it.  The police response in the news, despite their having months to think about it, is so far bumbling and inappropriate.  Any “I know my rights” miscreant now has an ideal excuse to evade arrest. 

There are so many things that, as brought home by the e-scooters, could be done to make cars less dangerous, but drivers’ freedoms and privileges matter more than any safety or even crime reduction argument.  We could have black boxes that mean a car won’t go if it is abused in any way, that can’t exceed the speed limit – but we invest instead in ever more roads. 

I’m not qualified to say what needs to change as regards women’s safety and freedom: I’m not going to try and mansplain that one, although men have a major part to play in effecting change. It’s a time to listen, listen to women.

Topic

[mdavidford]

Wait – would that mean I’d

Wait – would that mean I’d have to extol the quality of the research, writing, editing, and proof-reading that’s gone in to the articles? Not sure I can get on board with that.

[Simon E]

Tom_77 wrote:

Tom_77 wrote:

My local Facebook and Nextdoor has been full of anxious people apparently unable to get to work or take their kids to school without a car.

For some it will be difficult or impossible but for many it will be merely an inconvenience.

Lots of kids get driven to school when they could walk or cycle, I’ve seen the parents who live 5-10 minutes walk away still use the car. My two rode to 3 miles to secondary school virtually every day. Daughter now rides 5 miles+ to college, proud of her independence.

Far too many people have assumed that they can live wherever they like and it’s fine to commute a distance to work, up to 50 miles each way. I had to do this briefly many years ago after I had to move house but it wore me out and I grew to resent it. It was a huge relief when I found a job 5 miles away, though the pay was much less, just above minimum wage. The tedium of the stop-start crawl through town prompted me to use my old MTB, a switch that changed my life for the better.

Lots of people could make similar choices if they wanted to. Far from the car bringing freedom, in some ways it’s a huge millstone.

[chrisonabike]

Actually that’s a good idea –

Actually that’s a good idea – for the road.cc commentariat – a bit like the “defend the indefensible” segment of “Fighting Talk”. This could happen once a year or more regularly to liven things up. The rule is that you’ve got to play against type.  So I hope to see eburtthebike banging on about why the government is doing a great job and that we should just let the politicians get on with it (Conservative ones ideally), @RendelHarris moaning about immigration and the prevailing “woke” culture, @nicmason trying to bring the temperature down and @nigelgarage decrying entitled motorists and telling everyone it’s time to stop being polite and take action. And no squirrels or badgers…

[Steve K]

markieteeee wrote:

It feels like the site ought to have a ‘like’ for forum posts so people can register their approval for an article rather than just being able to like subsequent comments. A thoughtful and well-written piece.

With regards to Sarah Everard, the incident was indeed weaponised by the small but well organised anti-LTN lobby in my borough to argue for more driving privileges; despite, as you say, his car being a vital tool in the crime.  Within hours of it happening, and repeated on subsequent days, there were several similar-sounding comments on the ongoing live consultations making claims that without speeding traffic through residential streets, there would be less witnesses around to prevent attacks on lone women. Many specifically referenced Sarah, it was hard to read. She was literally abducted on a main road by a man in a car. 

Sarah Everard’s tragic death was also weaponised by anti-lockdown protesters such as Piers Corbyn and Kirstie Allsop.  It’s really depressing how some people have no sense of perspective.

[Bmblbzzz]

No way I’d remove it from the

No way I’d remove it from the list! As I said, it’s one of our greatest achievements (or activities or whatever way you want to describe it). One of a dozen or so that are more important than the motor car. 

[brooksby]

I remember reading a novel a

I remember reading a novel a few years ago, Last Light, IIRC. A secretive cabal organises a selection of “accidental ” disasters to make the price of oil go up. The main character, a specialist in logistics, is brought in after things start spiralling out of control, and informs them that there is no way of fixing it, that everything is so “just in time” that they’ve successfully killed our “Western” civilisation. Quite a depressing read, IIRC.

[Rendel Harris]

Well, shall we say the

Well, shall we say the discovery of music then (or we can say the invention of musical instruments or counterpoint if you like)? In a sense you could say everything we invent predates us, e.g., the invention of a nuclear fusion reactor won’t be us inventing nuclear fusion but us finding a way of replicating something that already exists in nature.

But you can remove it from the list if you like, it would still leave many other inventions that are significantly greater and more important to humanity than the motor car.

[David9694]

I guess it’s my turn to feed

I guess it’s my turn to feed the troll. Come on, then. 

An enabler – yes. Cars just mean we just look out for ourselves, rather than for each other. 

[Steve K]

It wasn’t my central point. 

It wasn’t my central point.  It was the relevant UN organisation’s point.  But I guess you’ve had enough of experts.

[wycombewheeler]

I disagree, it is the

I disagree, it is the prevelance of large, fast moving motor vehicles on our streets which prevents women, children and many men from utilising the bicycle as the roads are considered too dangerous.

Prior to the car, the bicycle bestowed all those benefits or mobility and autonomy on women.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycling_and_feminism

If the motor vehicle were invented today it would like not be permitted.

Pros

Convenience (sometimes)

Cons

Congestion

Pollution

road accidents

poor health of drivers

[wycombewheeler]

Tom_77 wrote:

As a cyclist, this doesn’t seem like much of an attitude or behaviour changer.  It does reveal to a wider audience a bit about the weird attachment some people have to their cars; how desperation, violence and abuse lurk just below the surface.

My local Facebook and Nextdoor has been full of anxious people apparently unable to get to work or take their kids to school without a car.

I’m not sure if the current fuel supply issues will cause anyone to rethink how utterly dependent they are on a car. I think it would take a prolonged crisis to do that, and this one is likely to be quite short.

Remember

“Electric cars are neccesary to save us from global warming”

car drivers – “the infrastructure does not support charging up electric cars”

Infrastructure does not seem to support filling up ICE cars

Car drivers – “fix this now, I must use fossil fuels to get to work.”

Am I missing somethng?

[Bmblbzzz]

Rendel Harris wrote:

Nigel Garrage wrote:

humankind’s greatest invention

Not the printing press, or music, or vaccines and cures for numerous diseases, or electric light or computing, but something that kills over a million people globally every year, seriously injures fifty million and sends countless more to an early grave with pollution related diseases…what a depressing worldview.

Incidentally, if you’d care to research some history you’d find that the bicycle has done far more for female liberation than the automobile ever has. As the suffragist and anti-slaver Susan B.Anthony said in 1896, “”Let me tell you what I think of bicycling. I think it has done more to emancipate women than anything else in the world. I stand and rejoice every time I see a woman ride by on a wheel.”

 

I love the idea of music being humankind’s greatest invention – it’s certainly one our greatest achievements – but I think it actually pre-dates humanity. 

[Rendel Harris]

Nigel Garrage wrote:

Victorian women did wear trousers though. It’s a completely fake story. And not only is it a completely fake story, it couldn’t possibly be classed as either an “invention” or “innovation” in any case if women simply wore the same attire as men.

Of course a few working women did, for example a famous group of women who worked in the mines in Wigan. However, it was socially taboo certainly for anyone from the middle or upper classes and for most of the working classes as well. Search any collection of photographs of the Victorian era and you’ll find virtually every woman in a dress or skirt.

An innovation can be the introduction of something that already exists into a new environment. If somebody entered Paris Roubaix on a mountain bike that would be innovative, even though the mountain bike itself would not be an innovation.

[Anonymous]

Forgive me but I think I will

Forgive me but I think I will take actual photgraphs of real Victorian women wearing trousers as a more authorative source than your fake news. Sure, there might have been fewer women wearing trousers in those times (as fashion changes across the ages), but your central point is demonstrably false.

If only you paid as much attention to what’s actually going on in the world today, you might be able to make a difference to people’s rights both in the Western world and globally.

Anyway, you’ve successfully dragged the discussion off at a tangent, so I won’t be taking part in any further discussion about attire!

[Steve K]

Nigel Garrage wrote:

Victorian women did wear trousers though. It’s a completely fake story. And not only is it a completely fake story, it couldn’t possibly be classed as either an “invention” or “innovation” in any case if women simply wore the same attire as men.

Forgive me, but I think I’m going to take the “United Nations entity dedicated to gender equality and the empowerment of women” as a more authoritative source than you.

[Author]

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