[AfterPeak]

I have been cycling/commuting for many years in London now and I have to say the number of cyclists going through red lights is getting ridiculous. It hurts us all when people do this.

I propose we all shout a chorus of “Loser” when someone goes through a red light because I am not sure they know. I did have ruder words but I am saying them for close passes.

Topic

[Sriracha]

brooksby wrote:

brooksby wrote:

and I’m really trying not to get annoyed when one of those scooters undertakes me or jumps a red light only for me to be cycling faster than them so catching them up but having no easy way to overtake

replace you the cyclist with a motorist and the scooterist by a cyclist and I guess you see the motorists’ perspective.

[Ihatecheese]

Agree with the op. Living in

Agree with the op. Living in central London I see people jumping red lights and near missing at most junctions every few minutes.  It pains me as it does reinforce the stereotype that the some cyclists believe the rules don’t apply to bikes. Like always the actions of a selfish few affect the many.

I see cars still passing as a light turns red a couple times a day but I cannot remember a time I saw a motorist just plainly ignore the lights unlike some idiot cyclists over the past few years. 

[quiff]

Of course, amber gamblers are

Of course, amber gamblers are endemic. I was just saying that it doesn’t stand scrutiny to suggest that lack of opportunity is the only thing holding people back from ignoring red lights. There is always someone who decides to stop at red, and they must be in the majority, otherwise we’d see constant streams of cars sailing through on long-established red (seem to recall a video on here of this happening in London somewhere around a cycle superhighway, and it’s actually very strange to watch), rather than a small number of people at every junction chancing it just after the lights have changed.

Markieteeee’s suggestion is a little more mischievous – can’t fault that technically (damn you), other than by defining my own terms and saying I’ve always thought of RLJing as actually proceeding through the junction, rather than just overstepping the line.    

[hawkinspeter]

markieteeee wrote:

Using a similar logic: because there is always a first driver at the lights, on my route to work the majority of drivers who have the opportunity do indeed jump red lights, because the majority of those at the front go over the ASLs. 

Don’t forget about the actual first drivers at lights – the ones that speed up when they see amber and then jump the red light.

[markieteeee]

Using a similar logic:

Using a similar logic: because there is always a first driver at the lights, on my route to work the majority of drivers who have the opportunity do indeed jump red lights, because the majority of those at the front go over the ASLs. 

 

[quiff]

Well yes, but… There is

Well yes, but… There is always a first driver at the lights. Presumably the first driver at any given set of lights did have the opportunity to ignore an amber or red, but chose not to. This is repeated time after time so that everyone will at some point be that first driver at the lights. If it was just lack of opportunity due to traffic, then you would expect to see more drivers proceed through solid red lights when they finally realise their chance of being the first driver in the queue. But IME it is exceedingly rare to see a driver arrive at established red lights and then proceed anyway – when you do see it it’s quite shocking. 

[Captain Badger]

quiff wrote:

How so?

Don’t ask awkward questions…

[quiff]

How so?

How so?

[brooksby]

Its a bit OT, and possibly

Its a bit OT, and possibly demonstrates the psychology of these things, but I actually notice far more of those rental e-scooters being driven through red lights than either cyclists or motorists…

 

(and the speed thing is interesting, and I’m really trying not to get annoyed when one of those scooters undertakes me or jumps a red light only for me to be cycling faster than them so catching them up but having no easy way to overtake because of the wands along the cycle lane).

[wycombewheeler]

EddyBerckx wrote:

One final thing – as infrastructure has improved and a lot more people cycle, the proportion of jumpers has gone down considerably,

Who would have thought? Once cycling is safer and people who are more risk averse are prepared to try it, the people who are more risk, joining the ranks of cyclists are less likely to break traffic laws.

Personally I tend to stop at most traffic lights, but at quiet (late nights/early mornings) times I’m more likely not to because 

1) timings between consecutive sets of lights are set for the convenience of drivers, and so penalise (slower) cyclists, watching the third set in a row go to red just as you approach is frustrating

2) sensor controlled lights are problematic and I’m never sure whether the lights are going to change or will sit on red indefinately

3) less risk of conflict with other drivers – why stop and wait at a red light when no other road users are even visible?

4) no one to see.

In all cases though, I would treat the lights very much as a give way and ensure I was not about to come into conflict with another road user, driver, cyclist or pedestrian.

[Captain Badger]

hirsute wrote:

Not an equivalent comparison though.

Yes it is. 

[EddyBerckx]

I don’t do it myself and I

I don’t do it myself and I get peed off when other cyclists jump them only to then hold me up further on (normally on cycle paths) – I find it rude, akin to queue jumping. Goes without saying anything dangerous towards others inc. pedestrians is also a big no no…but whenever I hear other cyclists complain about red light jumping, I think ” what about the 13.5 million people who break the LAW speeding every time they get into a car? I don’t think I’ve ever heard a motorist campaign for more speed cameras, in fact you constantly hear the opposite.

And I see red light jumping motorists on EVERY commute into london, not just amber gamblers but full on speeding, red light jumpers. The only reason is doesn’t happen at least as much as cyclists is the opportunity – cars take up so much space only one or two has the opportunity to jump a red light at each set, whereas cyclist can and do filter to the front.

One final thing – as infrastructure has improved and a lot more people cycle, the proportion of jumpers has gone down considerably, in fact probably the same as cars if you include the amber gamblers. I routinely see 10 -15 cyclists queuing at a light with 1 or 2 jumping it at most

[Captain Badger]

PRSboy wrote:

I frequently ride through a red light which controls traffic over a narrow railway bridge down the road from me.  Its a stupid light with ideas above its station which deliberately turns red if there is no one coming the opposite way (and there is a clear view for over 200 yds), and it deserves to be ridden through.

That’ll teach it. These traffic lights are often too big for their boots I find. They need taking down a peg or two.

[Hirsute]

Not an equivalent comparison

Not an equivalent comparison though.

[Captain Badger]

AlsoSomniloquism wrote:

I do find it funny that the ones who claim anti-cyclist bingo for “Cyclists going through red lights” are also some of the ones justifying cycling through red lights. 

Anti cyclist bingo also includes “doesn’t pay road tax”. 

I indeed do not pay any road tax, and am quite willing to justify it…..

[Author]

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