- This topic has 80 replies, 43 voices, and was last updated 10 years, 8 months ago by
wycombewheeler.
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- April 29, 2013 at 5:49 pm #18632
spongebob
Ok, so I’m currently researching a new set of wheels, I was primarily looking at the weight of the wheels but during my research I came across a number of articles that would imply that 250g’s off a set of wheels would make a minimal difference.
Here is an article backed with scientific research: http://www.biketechreview.com/index.php/reviews/wheels/63-wheel-performance it shows that reducing a wheelsets weight by 50% has a sub .5% difference in performance. The main gains that can be made by a wheel are in it’s aerodynamic ability.
So I thought well, I will need a 40mm+ set of wheels to reap the aerodynamic benefits, then I stumbled on the following research: http://www.cyclingpowerlab.com/ComponentAerodynamics.aspx this data would suggest that the Campagnolo Zondas are a more aerodynamically sound choice than a Mavic Carbone SLR!
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- May 14, 2013 at 1:27 pm #730949
BBB
SammyG wrote:BBB wrote:SammyG
SammyG wrote:BBB wrote:SammyG wrote:BBB wrote:Thousands, no.. millions, in fact 9 of 10 of roadies are still on pointless 23mm tyres (coz the pros use them…), mistaking vibrations and lack of comfort for speed and ignoring solid research on rolling resistance (e.g. excellent work by Bicycle Quarterly).
I won’t even start on a stupid 19-21mm trend from (I believe) 90’s that people mindlessly followed just like the pros…Bag of worms there, not that simple :x
It is very simple.
Yes the rolling resistance is simple which will save you 0.2 – 0.3 watts going from 23c to 25c, but aerodynamic implications are closer to 6 watts dependent on wheel rim width.
Testing rolling resistance using smooth steel drums and air resistance of wheels/tyres using a TT bike “ridden” at 25-30mph in full aero position is as far to typical riding conditions as it gets.
It makes a very effective marketing, though.
May 11, 2013 at 8:49 pm #730947700c
Training’s free.
The thread
Training’s free.The thread was about whether spending money on lighter and/or more aerodynamic wheels is worth it or not. All other factors being equal.
Wheel upgrades have made a difference for me, therefore it’s worth spending money -to a point. This point will vary for everyone.
No amount of science or theory can convince though, you just have to try them out.
May 11, 2013 at 8:00 pm #730945blablablacksheep20
Sorry guys simple
Sorry guys simple solution:Running, there has been so many” innovations” with running, and yet its proven training gains far out way any performance clothing gains…. Most performance gains from clothing ie compression only give the perceived feeling of better performance.
To sum up, aero=feeling of less effort thus can push harder =actually going harder
May 11, 2013 at 7:54 pm #730943BBB wrote:SammyG wrote:BBB
BBB wrote:SammyG wrote:BBB wrote:Thousands, no.. millions, in fact 9 of 10 of roadies are still on pointless 23mm tyres (coz the pros use them…), mistaking vibrations and lack of comfort for speed and ignoring solid research on rolling resistance (e.g. excellent work by Bicycle Quarterly).
I won’t even start on a stupid 19-21mm trend from (I believe) 90’s that people mindlessly followed just like the pros…Bag of worms there, not that simple :x
It is very simple.
Yes the rolling resistance is simple which will save you 0.2 – 0.3 watts going from 23c to 25c, but aerodynamic implications are closer to 6 watts dependent on wheel rim width.
May 11, 2013 at 7:44 pm #730941SammyG wrote:BBB
SammyG wrote:BBB wrote:Thousands, no.. millions, in fact 9 of 10 of roadies are still on pointless 23mm tyres (coz the pros use them…), mistaking vibrations and lack of comfort for speed and ignoring solid research on rolling resistance (e.g. excellent work by Bicycle Quarterly).
I won’t even start on a stupid 19-21mm trend from (I believe) 90’s that people mindlessly followed just like the pros…Bag of worms there, not that simple :x
It is very simple.
May 11, 2013 at 6:21 pm #730939AndrewB
I agree with Dave Atkinson,
I agree with Dave Atkinson, getting fit is the best way to improve your performance. I have a twenty year old touring bike if I could afford a carbon wonder bike I doubt I would go any faster.May 10, 2013 at 12:19 pm #730937farrell
Dave Atkinson wrote:I’d
Dave Atkinson wrote:I’d suggest that in purely numerical terms there’s basically nothing you can buy for your bike, performance-wise, where the money wouldn’t be better spent investing in improving your fitness.What about an E-Bike?
May 10, 2013 at 11:46 am #730935
dave atkinsonI’d suggest that in purely
I’d suggest that in purely numerical terms there’s basically nothing you can buy for your bike, performance-wise, where the money wouldn’t be better spent investing in improving your fitness. With the possible exception of TT bars, if you TT.we’re emotional beings though, not robots. let us have our carbon bottle cages, dammit.
May 10, 2013 at 11:27 am #730933notfastenough
Very emotional and well-put,
Very emotional and well-put, bashthebox! There’s nothing wrong with feeling good. If you think you’ll get the benefit, go for it.Ultimately, no-one wants to be seen as an idiot wasting their time on £4k of bike, so any upgrade makes you want to do it justice and not look like you have all the gear and no idea.
May 10, 2013 at 11:19 am #730931BBB wrote:Thousands, no..
BBB wrote:Thousands, no.. millions, in fact 9 of 10 of roadies are still on pointless 23mm tyres (coz the pros use them…), mistaking vibrations and lack of comfort for speed and ignoring solid research on rolling resistance (e.g. excellent work by Bicycle Quarterly).
I won’t even start on a stupid 19-21mm trend from (I believe) 90’s that people mindlessly followed just like the pros…Bag of worms there, not that simple 😡
May 10, 2013 at 10:47 am #730929bashthebox
It doesn’t matter. You buy
It doesn’t matter. You buy fancy shit because it makes you feel more awesome. This hobby is so much about the emotions. Performance is directly tied in to that. Feeling more pro is part of the fun.
The aesthetic of cycling is what makes it so wonderful. Down the generations there’s things cyclists just do, because it looks right and because it feels right.
I’m as likely to buy a pair of shoes because they match details on my frame as I am to buy them for their performance. Genuinely, my new shoes made me faster because I felt great wearing them.
So you get the new ultra-lightweight wheelset. People pick up your bike to do that approving thing. Your bike’s more awesome. You push yourself harder to do your bike justice. You look at your bike some more. You swap out your stem for one that works just a tiny bit better. You feel good. You push harder. You train more.
You’re getting marginal gains all the time, not just physical but psychological too.Any sport is as much heart as it is head. Just accept that shiny things affect your heart too.
May 10, 2013 at 10:23 am #730927No offence but road cycling
No offence but road cycling community is known from riding and thinking in a pack.Thousands, no.. millions, in fact 9 of 10 of roadies are still on pointless 23mm tyres (coz the pros use them…), mistaking vibrations and lack of comfort for speed and ignoring solid research on rolling resistance (e.g. excellent work by Bicycle Quarterly).
I won’t even start on a stupid 19-21mm trend from (I believe) 90’s that people mindlessly followed just like the pros…It’s one of the many examples in the cycling world and in life generally how the majority is often wrong and how their strong convictions are based on assumptions, subjective impressions and opinions of others rather than on scientific facts.
In assessing (meaningful) performance gains I’m only interested in research not fairy tales so I will appreciate if someone points me in the right direction. Links, articles please… (independent, not “sponsored” ones, normal, NO TT setup, just a typical bloke on the bike).
I’d like to know how much faster exactly on a varied route a typical non-competing bloke putting 250-300W and cycling at 15-18mph, mostly on hoods is going to gain from more aero or lightweight wheels exactly?
May 9, 2013 at 4:42 pm #730925I’ll give you £40 for your
I’ll give you £40 for your unbranded wheels then, if they are as good as £800 carbon Mavics!May 9, 2013 at 4:25 pm #730923My current are 2200g so
My current are 2200g so around a 500g difference between them and my mavicsMay 9, 2013 at 3:19 pm #730921SammyG wrote:
As I saidSammyG wrote:
As I said before I had Mavic Cosmic Carbone SL’s (£800 wheelset) I’m now riding a £40 unbranded crappy wheelset. I can’t notice a difference.TBH at 1720g those Mavic’s aren’t particularly light -and weight is the subject of your post – so, aerodynamics aside, this is my experience over past few years.
FSA RD-60 – 1980g upgraded to campag Zonda -1555g: Big difference in climbing ability and acceleration. Better under power and no flex
Campag Zonda upgraded to Reynolds 46T – 1180g: a further increase in ability to sprint up hills, faster to accelerate on the flat and to hold speed.+1 mph on my recent average speeds recorded on my usual 10 mile commute.
Of course the more expensive wheels have come with better hubs but I am certain that reduction in rotating weight has been a significant factor.
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