[Daveyraveygravey]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-59477788

The report just gives statistics, it doesn’t give any explanation as far as I can tell.  As someone that chooses rural roads wherever possible, I’m a bit baffled by this.

Do drivers take more risks because they are “out of the way” or there are less witnesses?  Why would quieter roads cause more accidents?

Topic

[the little onion]

and rural roads are further

and rural roads are further from hospitals, which will increase casualty rates

[Rendel Harris]

One thing that I have noticed

One thing that I have noticed when I’m out in the country is that drink-driving seems to be more frequent, and perhaps more accepted, than in town; not uncommon to see guys drinking three or four pints and then getting in the car. Presumably multiple causes including lower density of police operations, lack of public transport, more dispersed population et cetera. This is only an impression, might be completely wrong and don’t mean to imply that everyone in rural areas is a drunk driver!

[Sriracha]

brooksby wrote:

brooksby wrote:

That’s right, boys and girls and non-binaries

I’m not sure it’s possible to be non-binary, since either you are non-binary or you’re not.

[brooksby]

chrisonatrike wrote:

Trigger warning!

If you’re aware of vehicles waiting behind you, pull in only when you consider it is safe to do so and if the speed limit will allow a safe overtake

That’s right, boys and girls and non-binaries: the onus is on the cyclist to decide if they think it is safe (and, by implication, have space) to pull in.

[Bungle_52]

If you can’t stop in the

If you can’t stop in the space you can see to be free then you are travelling too fast whether you are a cyclist or a driver. The problem is that the consequences for failing to observe this rule are very different for the two. When on country lanes I cycle on the outside of bends while listening for cars. So far I’ve been lucky. I’m out to enjoy the freedom and the fresh air though and I’m not interested in travelling as fast as I can. I drive on these lanes as if there is a car coming at me round every bend. Progress is slow but if I want to get somewhere quickly I don’t use country lanes. As soon as you put speed above safety then you are going to get “accidents”.

[brooksby]

chrisonatrike wrote:

I understand the horse bit but why can you zoom past, hoot and rev around cyclists and motorcyclists?

Just cyclists, innit?

[chrisonabike]

Trigger warning!

Trigger warning!

brooksby wrote:

If you’re aware of vehicles waiting behind you, pull in only when you consider it is safe to do so and if the speed limit will allow a safe overtake

I understand the horse bit but why can you zoom past, hoot and rev around cyclists and motorcyclists?

brooksby wrote:

Give cyclists, motorcyclists and horse riders plenty of space when overtaking – and only overtake when it is safe to do so – on straight stretches of road with good visibility. Don’t accelerate rapidly, sound your horn or rev your engine when passing horses and watch out for sudden movements as horses can be easily spooked

 

[AlsoSomniloquism]

You can tell there has been

You can tell there has been significant input from the other organisations into the cycling, driving and horse riding ones, however I do feel sorry for runners. It seems someone has just whittled some of their head and tbh, half of those would have probably been on the cycling one until Cycling UK got involved. 

[Daveyraveygravey]

Duncann wrote:

Relevant data here: www.gov.uk/government/statistics/reported-road-casualties-great-britain-pedal-cyclist-factsheet-2020/reported-road-casualties-in-great-britain-pedal-cycle-factsheet-2020

You’ll see that rural roads are those outside settlements of 10,000 – so includes A roads, etc. I think fatality rates tend to be higher on ‘open’ roads because of the higher driving speeds often involved (and less anticipation of vulnerable road users’ presence).

Notably, while numbers of fatalities have sadly increased, the fatality rate per mile cycled seems to have dropped substantially.

 

Will have a look at the data.  That definition of “outside settlements of 10,000” caught my eye, it’s a bit vague.  I don’t think I go near a settlement that size very often! 

[Hirsute]

IanMSpencer wrote:

 

The real test is: would they like to meet themselves coming the other way? Would you?

I don’t think that question arises for most drivers.

[Captain Badger]

hawkinspeter wrote:

…..A lot of drivers will assume that they can happily go along rural roads at 30mph, ……

Oh HP, bless you….

 

[IanMSpencer]

I think both cyclists and

I think both cyclists and drivers contribute to the problems.

Two cyclists I know had accidents on single track roads – one had just set a KOM (and he is an out and out overweight rugby player on a bike – so tends to suggest he was going faster than even the local fast cyclists, just a few hundred yards from home) came round a corner to be faced with a tractor where he slid underneath but fortunately missed the wheels. He initially complained about the tractor filling the road, but then it dawned that it wasn’t by choice (though they are too big these days). The tractor did stop rapidly – faster than the cyclist was able. The second was a friend who met a white van man at the worst place on a corner, neither had time to react and matey redesigned the windscreen of the van.

However, generally, we don’t have problems riding as a group – on low visibility corners, the person on the outside will ride ahead to be ready, we may single file on particularly narrow roads, reduce pace for corners, and generally ride expecting a lunatic.  It is unsurprisingly not unusual to be abused for forcing a motorist to slow down, and we have had instances of drivers accelerating at us where there is clear visibility to force us out of their way. We will ride two abreast on single track roads and it takes a small amount of time to re-organise when a car comes along. Motorists seem to think that we should ride low traffic routes just in case they will arrive, when often there is no traffic on these roads which we use frequently.

Locally we have very good relationships with horse riders who approeciate our early calls, covering flashing lights and friendly banter as we pass. I think we have only had one incident in about 5 years of a rider being abusive to us after we had come to a complete halt after they had lost control of their horse on an unrestricted 2 lane B road even after we had slowed as soon as we could see the horse a long way ahead.

In the end, the main problem on country lanes is motorists (and cyclists!) not understanding that they don’t need to drive within their stopping distance speed on a road, they need to drive at half that speed to account for the oncoming traffic. A decent driver will be accelerating when they can see and braking when they can’t. Too many drivers work to the “I am passing a cyclist therefore I do not need to consider blind bends” theory of driving.

The real test is: would they like to meet themselves coming the other way? Would you?

[mdavidford]

And meanwhile, there’s been

And meanwhile, there’s been no notable change in slight or serious injuries, so relative to cycle traffic those were down a lot.

[brooksby]

Thanks, mdavidford – now why

Thanks, mdavidford – now why couldn’t I find that page…?

EDIT: Interesting, given the comments from certain parties on that recent NMOTD, that point one on the cycling page says

Ride defensively but respectfully – on narrow, winding country lanes it’s important that you don’t ride in the gutter. Instead make sure you ride in a visible position away from the edge of the tarmac. If you’re aware of vehicles waiting behind you, pull in only when you consider it is safe to do so and if the speed limit will allow a safe overtake

and the car page says:

Give cyclists, motorcyclists and horse riders plenty of space when overtaking – and only overtake when it is safe to do so – on straight stretches of road with good visibility. Don’t accelerate rapidly, sound your horn or rev your engine when passing horses and watch out for sudden movements as horses can be easily spooked

[hawkinspeter]

It’ll be a combination of

It’ll be a combination of poor visibility (e.g. high hedges) and most likely excessive speed. A lot of drivers will assume that they can happily go along rural roads at 30mph, but sharp corners and poor sight-lines would make 30mph too fast to be able to suddenly stop before hitting someone.

[Author]

Replies