[OldRidgeback]

If a cyclist had been involved in so many deaths, you can bet there would’ve been howls throughout the right wing press. But this….

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/article/2024/jun/26/wimbledon-school-crash-driver-will-not-face-prosecution-says-cps

 

 

Topic

[Hirsute]

Although it is important to

Although it is important to note Mark Hodson’s comment

“Drivers medical report at the Coroners Inquest should be interesting , as will be the evidence from the examining physician.”

I think following bin lorry man in scotland, people are a little sceptical.

[Rendel Harris]

Hirsute wrote:

Hirsute wrote:

Raptor : Bird of prey. Just the mindset required when driving on UK roads.

See also Warrior, Grenadier, Touareg, Defender, Renegade…even names like Macan (Porsche, means tiger) and Kodiaq (Skoda, largest brown bear) have fairly unsubtle “I’m the biggest beast in the jungle and can rip you up if I want” connotations.

[Rendel Harris]

BikingBud wrote:

I am  more concerned about the provision of a new blanket claim for drivers to add to thier list of excuses:

• Had an eplieptic seizure 

Having an epileptic seizure is not something somebody can simply claim as an excuse in the same way as the other things you mention, it is a provable condition and sadly some people who were not aware they had the condition will suffer their first seizure when driving. As I said on another thread, some form of medical episode always seemed the most likely explanation once the possibility that the woman was on drink or drugs or was deliberately acting maliciously were ruled out. I’m afraid I find it a bit disappointing the way some people have automatically gone for the “she must be lying” line, it does happen and sadly in this case it has had appalling consequences but that does not mean it’s not the truth. In such a high-profile case with such a tragic outcome the CPS will have undoubtedly carried out a very thorough investigation and they would not refuse to charge the driver unless they were convinced the mitigation is genuine.

[Hirsute]

Raptor
Raptor : Bird of prey.
Just the mindset required when driving on UK roads.

[giff77]

The other day a Ford Raptor

The other day a Ford Raptor was parked up beside me. The bonnet came nearly half way up my windows. The tyres pretty much up to my bonnet. I walked past and  it was frightening that if the driver lost control or was distracted and hit a human or vehicle everyone was dead bar the driver of the beast. The driver himself was well dressed and his vehicle was all shiny so obviously not being used for work of any description. 

[giff77]

You forgot the “have no

You forgot the “have no recollection”

[BikingBud]

But that can apply to many

But that can apply to many vehicles that people buy, are they really necessary?

I am  more concerned about the provision of a new blanket claim for drivers to add to thier list of excuses:

• Momentary lapse
• Sun in my eyes
• Looked but couldn’t see them
• Came out of nowhere
• The road is dangerous
• The road is too narrow
• Had an eplieptic seizure 

 

[chrisonabike]

According to the standard

According to the standard understanding those both count no?  Different and defined start and end, whereas if you cycle and stop for a coffee you’ll still just have done a purposeless loop from your house…

Snark aside I think this is sort of the common understanding – people drive cars *to* places even if for leisure when they get there.  Transport.  Bikes?  Apparently not – that’s more like “going for a jog” but less worthy.  Apart from a few places which are all in Europe anyway and can be dismissed for “reasons”.

[andystow]

HoarseMann wrote:

I also wonder what this trip involved and whether use of a 4×4 was really necessary?

We don’t even know whether it was a proper journey yet. Was she going to work, or had she popped out for coffee?

[HoarseMann]

I also wonder what this trip

I also wonder what this trip involved and whether use of a 4×4 was really necessary?

[OldRidgeback]

The case highlights that

The case highlights that these vehicles are inappropriate for urban use if nothing else.

[Brauchsel]

I’d hope that she doesn’t

I’d hope that she doesn’t drive again, and she won’t be legally able to without demonstrating that her epilepsy is under control. And I absolutely agree that there’s no place for such vehicles in an urban (or really any) environment and they should be banned. 

But this does sound like an incident where (from the point of purchasing the car at least) the driver couldn’t have done anything different. It’s a tragedy for her, as I imagine it would be for any of us had we caused the deaths of two small children. Nothing compared to the tragedy they and their families are going through, but I can’t imagine how anyone “normal” wouldn’t be haunted by having done that for the rest of their lives.

We’re not affected by any of this, we’re just consuming a news story. Nobody involved is under any obligation, and it doesn’t make anything any better, to be issuing public statements of contrition or the like. The public policy of whether these cars are acceptable (they aren’t) is the public’s business: how anyone involved in the actual event feels about it isn’t. It might be an unsatisfying narrative, but we’re not the ones with any right to that information. 

[Hirsute]

of our toughest sign-off
“One of our toughest sign-off tests was to get the Defender to overcome hitting a 20cm high square-edged kerb at 25mph”

Parents walking their kids to school tomorrow morning will feel extremely reassured by this bragging.

[Hirsute]

As the car managed to easily
As the car managed to easily go over the kerb and through fences without any deceleration, then these cars should be banned in cities.

“Drivers medical report at the Coroners Inquest should be interesting , as will be the evidence from the examining physician.”

[chrisonabike]

Terrible tragedy … not

Terrible tragedy … not possible to have prevented it … these are thankfully incredibly rare … thoughts and prayers …

I imagine that while people are driving vehicles which can’t automatically take over and safely halt them in the event of driver incapacitation there’s a certain baseline rate of this.  As Rendel has pointed out, this and other medical conditions can and do just strike at any point in life – some with no prior indication (certainly none that we can currently assess).

But perhaps it might be possible to reduce that somewhat (not to zero) by having periodic medical checks as per pilots or perhaps like the HGV equivalent we have?  But is that logistically practical for the current number of drivers (although noting the D4 medical is staged by age) – e.g. mass motoring?

Certainly totally incompatible with our current “you pass, and you’re in for life” licencing.

As to vehicle size … unfortunately we’ve been successfully conned by the motor trade AND it’s a bit like a “status AND safety” arms race now.

[Author]

Replies