log in
register

New wheels+tires or NOT

  • Creator
    Topic
  • March 3, 2020 at 8:39 am #30526
    spiroX

    Hi,

    I have a gravel bike and have been wanting to get road wheelset to be a bit faster on the road. I got the money but now I am having second thoughts as I don’t know how faster I would be?
    Right now I have WTB isym 23 wheels (with cheap formula hubs) with WTB 650×47 Horizon tires. The tires are more road+ tires than gravel tires and are smooth on the center with no knobs. I was thinking of getting 700c wheels with road 700×32 tires (for some comfort on day long rides and some light gravel).
    I do not race, and I am still working on my fitness (as my work and family time allows). My average watts (according to Strava) is 210W for an 1h ride and some 180W for an 3h ride after which I feel pretty tired (although not totally exhausted). Also, I live in a VERY hilly area. I cannot go anywhere without first going uphill 🙂
    With new wheels and tires I could loose some 500-600g of weight and should have better aerodynamics and lower rolling resistance.
    My question is will all those 3 things make a significant difference? Only one of those would probably not, but with 3 combined will it make a difference?

    Thanks.

  • Creator
    Topic
Viewing 10 replies - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
  • Author
    Replies
  • March 16, 2020 at 5:21 pm #956497
    0
    Canyon48

    Hi Spirox,

    Hi Spirox,

    I upgraded my commuter bike wheels from a set of cheap alloy wheels with 30mm Continental GP4Seasons to a set of deep-section carbon aero wheels with 28mm Continental GP4000’s and Latex tubes, the difference in rolling resistance alone was very noticeable and there was without a doubt a gain in speed.

    Switching from your large 650b wheels/tyres to some skinnier 700c wheels/tyres will make a noticeable difference (improvement) on the smooth stuff – it will also make the rough stuff feel…. rougher.

    Two wheelsets make your bike even more versatile, one for the rough stuff and one for the smoother tarmac/road rides.

    March 14, 2020 at 5:57 pm #956495
    0
    spiroX

    OK, I managed to borrow some

    OK, I managed to borrow some wheels to put on my bike and do a direct comparison.
    Couple of things to notice:
    – The wheels are almost the same as the ones I was looking at. The difference is in the hub and the tires. They are not dt Swiss hubs and the tires are some Specialized turbo pro 28mm road tires that came with the friends Roubaix.
    – I wasn’t my top when I did this, I might be coming with a cold.
    – I had head wind about 1/3 of the way up because why not! It wasn’t very strong but I could feel it slowing me.
    – I don’t have a power meter so I rode against my heart rate. If it would go below 168 I would accelerate and if it went higher decelerate. Not the best way but that’s what I did when I did a PR on this uphill.
    – Tires were at 80-85psi or around 6bar. Not tubeless.

    And the results? My time on an 5% ~8.5km uphill was exactly the same at 37min! (give or take a few seconds) as with 650b 47 tires. I was very surprised!

    Observations :
    – The bike felt very different, it felt quicker and more maneuverable.
    – It actually didn’t feel more uncomfortable, in fact the road felt smoother! The potholes and speed bumps though were a lot more noticeable.
    – Braking is noticeably worse. I had to brake sooner on downhill.
    – When going back down I did a PR without even trying. That was VERY surprising as I didn’t even pedal all the time. It might have had something to do with wind as on downhill it was in my back.

    Conclusion:
    With these wheels/tires I am probably a bit faster. I would say 3-5% judging by the headwind and the fact that I didn’t feel my best. I definitely like the feel of them, but will I buy them? Actually I found those same wheels for 200€ with rotors which is a great deal so I will buy them 🙂 Although I am not that faster they do feel better on the road and when I’m fully recovered if I can be 5% faster on uphills that is a BIG increase. Maybe not worth 5-600€ or more, but definitely worth 200! If I hadn’t found this deal though I probably wouldn’t switch. Or at least not yet, but might have waited for my current tires to wear out completely and then buy new wheels + tires.

    Thanks for the help, maybe this will help other people looking to make the switch.

    March 10, 2020 at 9:55 am #956493
    0
    peted76

    Not sure I’ve much to add

    Not sure I’ve much to add here apart from a resounding, yes to getting new wheels and tyres. The bike will handle differently and feel more spritely accelerating.

    I ride a 23mm, 25mm and 28m tyres, the smaller ones being against the tide of bigger is better trend. 23mm on a 17mm internal measure 25mm, the 25mm on a 17mm internal measure 29mm and the 28mm on a 18mm internal are maooosive.

    For me 25mm tyres run tubeless at about 75-85psi is the all rounder sweet spot for tyres (I’m 72kgs BTW). I find they can handle the English NCN routes which are as cross/gravel as it gets!

    March 9, 2020 at 8:50 pm #956491
    0
    spiroX

    I managed to borrow some

    I managed to borrow some wheels from a friend. He’s not riding next weekend so weather permitting I will try them out. They are DT R470 which should be the same as ER1600 db in 23mm (maybe jus different hubs). His are fitted with some 28mm tires. I’ll see what are my times on those and if the difference is significant I’m buying 🙂

    March 9, 2020 at 7:02 pm #956489
    0
    Anonymous

    what did you decide?

    what did you decide?

    March 4, 2020 at 8:29 am #956487
    0
    Anonymous

    Might as well get the 32mm

    Might as well get the 32mm height then.

    Those tyres seem really good actually, Id not heard of those but checking on my usual source, they have good puncture resistance for their rolling resistance, and tubeless is a bonus.
    https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/road-bike-reviews/pirelli-cinturato-velo-2018

    They seem to come in a size 26mm (which would be my choice), 28, 32 and 35.

    March 4, 2020 at 7:35 am #956485
    0
    spiroX

    I was thinking of getting DT

    I was thinking of getting DT Swiss ER1600 in 23 or 32 height (20mm inner width) with Pirelli Cintaruto velo tires…or something in that price range. Those wheels seem to be very rugged but not too heavy and the tires have good puncture resistance without being heavy or having high rolling resistance.

    March 4, 2020 at 7:14 am #956483
    0
    spiroX

    No, I have a Kona. It is

    No, I have a Kona. It is really good all-rounder. Unfortunatelly that also makes it jack of all trades, master of none. My friends are very slow and affraid to venture off tarmac on their road bikes where as I feel quite confident, but as they have “normal” road bikes it means I get droped on our tarmac rides and they have to wait for me. So I was hoping to gain some speed with new wheel+tires combo, especially as I live in a very hilly area.

    March 3, 2020 at 7:28 pm #956481
    0
    EddyBerckx

    Do you have a whyte Glencoe
    Do you have a whyte Glencoe by any chance?

    I used to have one – it came with those exact wheels and tyres. Lovely to ride below 18mph (and normal-ish wind)…but an absolute pig if you wanted to go faster or uphill.

    The glencoe allowed me to change to a spare 700c wheelset I had with 28mm tyres and immediately there was a massive difference, around 2mph – although bear in mind if all you do is pootle about or easy cruise then you won’t find as big a difference

    March 3, 2020 at 6:40 pm #956479
    0
    Anonymous

    Sounds like a solid plan to

    Sounds like a solid plan to me to get a 2nd wheelset

    The weight makes most difference further away from the hub so lighter rims and tyres will make a difference for climbing and accelerating but as has been discussed a lot, more aero is better than lighter for most (apparently only starts to make a notable difference over 12mph). That said my friends bike has Schwalbe Marathon tyres on all year round and its hard going up hill.

    As you say you arent racing or competing so its up to you how much you want to spend on these improvements. Ive got 30mm depth rims and internal width 19mm which seems to work fine for all conditions for me with 25 or 28mm tyres (wider rims give a better tyre profile for aerodynamics).

    All depending on the condition of the roads near you for the tyre width – if theyre quite decent then 25-28 will be faster, but if its pretty rough then 32-35 may be more suitable. 

    There are loads of options of tyre which will make a difference to your riding, again depends on the road surface condition. As an example I use 28c Schwalbe Durano (race guard) in winter and 25c Continental Grand Prix or Michelin Pro4 in summer. In general there is a trade off between rolling resistance and puncture resistance, those I use sit in the middle of both ranges. 

  • Author
    Replies
Viewing 10 replies - 1 through 10 (of 10 total)
  • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.