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New road bike or change tyres on CX for (faster) century ride?

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  • February 24, 2016 at 2:26 pm #25421
    SuperSharks

    Hi guys,

    I will be riding the Ride London 100 for the 2nd time and my current (and only) bike of choice at the moment is a Specialized Tricross Triple cyclocross bike. I rode the same bike for last years Ride London and being my 1st ride, took it easy to avoid any bonking\blow-outs and completed the time in 6 hrs 40. In fact, I am still riding on the same 700x35c Specialized Borough tyres that came with the cyclocross bike. They are pretty much slicks now.  

    I’m 44 years old and 6’2″ tall and reasonably fit. I commute 22 miles in a day about 2/3 times per week for which the cyclocross is perfect for.  My reason for contemplating the tyres\bike change is that my rather competitive and serious cyclist brother will be joining me on this years ride and says I need to get fitter and faster. He has already quoted from the Velominati Rule Book. Especially rule number 5. 

    What I need advice on is whether changing my Borough tyres to something like Continental Gatorskins at 700x28c will show a significant increase in speed or whether I should be looking at a new road bike that is more sportif themed or a comfortable but fast long distance bike? 

    Any suggestions greatly appreciated. If Conti’s are not the best, would like to know what you would recommend instead.  

     

    Thanks

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  • February 29, 2016 at 2:37 pm #867319
    0
    AEB
    john1r1simmons wrote:
    I run two wheel sets on my cross bike, one for off-road/cross and the other for on-road use.

    Ditto here. Makes sense for me. I have a set with 35/32mm CX tyres for commuting and riding in crap weather and then a set of Cosmic Carbones with 23mm slicks on for club runs and sunny days – bike runs great on both 🙂

    February 27, 2016 at 7:15 am #867317
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    CXR94Di2

    Just noted you did it in 6.40
    Just noted you did it in 6.40 first time. To go around in 5 hours is a massive jump in performance, obviously 20mph average. You will need to be doing 22mph for long periods. And don’t forget there will be 30000 other riders on the route. You will remember how busy the Surrey lanes were and had to go with the flow mostly.

    February 26, 2016 at 11:16 pm #867315
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    john1r1simmons

    I run two wheel sets on my

    I run two wheel sets on my cross bike, one for off-road/cross and the other for on-road use. For on-road use I am finding that 32mm gator skins are not bad.   I have mixed feelings on the gators skins. On my road bike I used to have 23mm ones and on cold wet days I never felt confident on front wheel grip. I swithed to 25mm GP’s and they are better. But on the cross bike the 32mm Gators roll well and the grip is good.

    Regarding new bike or stick with what you have. If you have the money and want one, go for it. Is the weight that important?, I think it depends on your weight. My cross bike weighs about 10Kg, my road bike just under 8Kg. I weight 84Kg so me and bike about 94Kg on cross, 92Kg on road bike.  About 2 to 3% difference in all up weight. Remeber a 500ml bottle adds 0.5Kg. add two for a long distance event 1Kg. It is easier (in principal) to take 2 kg off me than the bike.  Iam not convinced I am much slower up the hills on Cross bike.  But road bikes can also have a more aero position. 

    a good bike shop should let you roll up on your existing bike and take a new one for a spin.  It all becomes very personal, and what is one persons responsive darting bike is another twitchy nightmare. 

    February 26, 2016 at 11:42 am #867313
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    graybags

    I’ve got 25mm schwalbe ones

    I’ve got 25mm schwalbe ones on my summer bike, done about 2000 miles, one puncture so far and wear is minimal, just put Conti gp4000ii’s on my winter bike and had my first puncture last week, but the flint was sizeable, som no fault of the tyre, grip is great, particularly in the wet.

    February 26, 2016 at 11:04 am #867311
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    CXR94Di2

    Simon E wrote:

    Simon E wrote:

    CXR94Di2 wrote:
    if you weigh 85 kg+ use 28mm. Less than 75 kg use 23/25mm.

    Why should lighter riders use narrow tyres? Doesn’t make sense to me.

    Get some 28 or 32mm tyres (“wider is faster” is the mantra). Starting with the recommendations in this Michelin chart, try experimenting in 10 psi steps either side to find your preferred setting.

    SuperSharks wrote:
    The Tricross has a carbon fork and alloy frame and comes in at about 10kgs. 2kgs less over 100 miles will make a difference I’m sure.  

    There only real difference will be to your bank balance. I ride 10kg and 8kg Giant road bikes and the difference is insignificant, even on hills. The calculations I’ve seen indicate 2 secs for every kilo over 100m of vertical ascent. On a ride with 2,000m of ascent that’s 1 min 20 secs quicker on the lighter bike. CW found that, on Box Hill (2.5 km @ 5%), adding 5 kg meant it took 16 secs longer, 6:59 vs 6:43.

    Reminding yourself of “rule 5” or telling yourself to HTFU can be useful at times when you’re cursing the weather, your route choice or tired legs. But only insecure people feel the need to be live by a mildly comical made-up list and tell everyone else they should do the same.

    If your brother was smart he would be saying: “Come on, you will feel so much better if you’re that bit fitter. It’s such a great feeling, so rewarding, the effort is worth it, I promise”. IMHO he would be right, because it is.

    I am not saying he should go smaller, but lighter riders can, as they don’t deform the tyre as much as fatties do. He could use 28 or 32mm and have uber plush ride with speed

    February 25, 2016 at 11:06 pm #867309
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    Simon E

    CXR94Di2 wrote:

    CXR94Di2 wrote:
    if you weigh 85 kg+ use 28mm. Less than 75 kg use 23/25mm.

    Why should lighter riders use narrow tyres? Doesn’t make sense to me.

    Get some 28 or 32mm tyres (“wider is faster” is the mantra). Starting with the recommendations in this Michelin chart, try experimenting in 10 psi steps either side to find your preferred setting.

    SuperSharks wrote:
    The Tricross has a carbon fork and alloy frame and comes in at about 10kgs. 2kgs less over 100 miles will make a difference I’m sure.  

    There only real difference will be to your bank balance. I ride 10kg and 8kg Giant road bikes and the difference is insignificant, even on hills. The calculations I’ve seen indicate 2 secs for every kilo over 100m of vertical ascent. On a ride with 2,000m of ascent that’s 1 min 20 secs quicker on the lighter bike. CW found that, on Box Hill (2.5 km @ 5%), adding 5 kg meant it took 16 secs longer, 6:59 vs 6:43.

    Reminding yourself of “rule 5” or telling yourself to HTFU can be useful at times when you’re cursing the weather, your route choice or tired legs. But only insecure people feel the need to be live by a mildly comical made-up list and tell everyone else they should do the same.

    If your brother was smart he would be saying: “Come on, you will feel so much better if you’re that bit fitter. It’s such a great feeling, so rewarding, the effort is worth it, I promise”. IMHO he would be right, because it is.

    February 25, 2016 at 9:48 pm #867307
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    arfa

    having ridden both schwalbe

    having ridden both schwalbe ones and gp4000s, the durability of gp’s wins every time (and they’re faster). schwalbe’s are fine but my experience was one lock up (an emergency stop to avoid a car cutting a corner) and the tyre scuffed and “50 pence pieced” necessitating a replacement. I have emergency stopped plenty of times on gp’s and never had this problem.

    February 25, 2016 at 4:22 pm #867305
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    AEB
    SuperSharks wrote:
    cyclesteffer wrote:
    Can always keep up with road bikes, club runs, chaingangs , etc.

    I will be very happy on my CX if I am able to avoid being dropped by road bikes. The satisfaction would be immense – especially while sporting mud guards and a pannier rack. 🙂 

    Maybe you’d want to take your rack and guards off too? Any weight you can shed will help you, especially over the course of 100 miles. 

    I use entirely seperate wheels too, one set up for cross/commuting and an aero set for summer/club runs etc, maybe this is a good way to go for you if you intend on doing more distance work with it in the future too.

    February 25, 2016 at 3:26 pm #867303
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    SuperSharks

    CXR94Di2 wrote:

    CXR94Di2 wrote:
    If your brother is faster than you, you will regret trying to match his pace and will blow up at some point. If he thinks it’s a race tell him to try and tag on the back of a fast group and you will see him at the Mall. Fast rider should slow down to slower rider. Re tyres if you weigh 85 kg+ use 28mm. Less than 75 kg use 23/25mm. I weigh 95kg and found 25mm tyres needed maximum pressure to give good performance. I have just fitted tubeless 28mm Schwalbe pro ones and already are better

    Good point, I need to ride my pace. Hopefully I can get fit enough for him to turn the wick down and we still cruise in around 5 hours. I weigh 88kgs so 28mm will be the way to go.   

    February 25, 2016 at 3:19 pm #867301
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    SuperSharks

    cyclesteffer wrote:

    cyclesteffer wrote:
    Can always keep up with road bikes, club runs, chaingangs , etc.

    I will be very happy on my CX if I am able to avoid being dropped by road bikes. The satisfaction would be immense – especially while sporting mud guards and a pannier rack. 🙂 

    February 25, 2016 at 3:16 pm #867299
    0
    SuperSharks
    bikebot wrote:
    I’m riding my CX with GP4000s 28mm at the moment, used them for RideLondon last year on a different bike. With the wider rim of a CX wheel, I found they actually expanded to 32mm as measured in place on the bike.  Lots of grip, lots of comfort, great.

    I just looked up your bike and there’s one other thing you might want to try.  If you’ve got the same straight seatpost I see in the picture, consider a setback seatpost with a bit of flex.

    Thanks BikeBot, good idea about the seat post – might try that. So far the choice is either GP4000s or Schwalbe Ones.

    February 25, 2016 at 3:15 pm #867297
    0
    SuperSharks
    peted76 wrote:
    Take a look at some of the buying guides on road.cc for new bikes, budget – Triban 3 /  bit more – Giant Defy / bit more – Carbon Giant Defy.

    Thanks Pete, the Defy is a good looking bike. My brother is a lot fitter, races often so that means more hills practice for me. The Tricross has a carbon fork and alloy frame and comes in at about 10kgs. 2kgs less over 100 miles will make a difference I’m sure.   

    February 25, 2016 at 3:08 pm #867295
    0
    SuperSharks
    P3t3 wrote:
    1) Lower rolling resistance will make you faster.  Narrow isn’t necissarily faster, no need to go smaller than a 28.  

    2 ) Comfort – you will ride faster for longer if you are comfortable and not fatigued by being rattled around by narrow tyres.   

     

    Very good points and exactly what I was worried about with a roadie – thanks Pete. Will have to give tubulars a miss for now but the Schwalbe Ones seem to be the most popular.

    February 25, 2016 at 3:05 pm #867293
    0
    SuperSharks
    Morat wrote:
    While the correct answer is always “Get another bike” the more pragmatic option is to get some 28mm Schwalbe Ones (tubeless or folding, up to you) and enjoy your bike at full speed.

    Thanks Morat, The concensus so far seems to be Schwalbe Ones. 

    February 25, 2016 at 3:03 pm #867291
    0
    SuperSharks
    AEB wrote:
    I ride my CX bike for everything, and go between full CX tyres (Continental Cross King 35mm and Challenge Grifo Pro 32mm) and Road tyres (Bontrager R1 23mm) and the bike is significantly better handling on road tyres without changing anything else.

    Thanks AEB, I pretty much do the same. My commute is 11 miles with a mix of park track and road, which includes some pretty rough parts. 

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