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Wiggins in 2011, TDF Thoughts

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  • July 28, 2015 at 11:40 am #24510
    Leviathan

    Its now or never for this thought.
    Remember the 2011 tour? Wiggins crashed out early when there was a pile up at a little dip in the road. Pretty sad end, but he picked himself up for 2012 and was still in great form. Now it has been trotted out many times that Froome towed him around that tour and the large amount of TT mileage suited him. All this may be true. It is possible that Froome could have won if given his head, but we don’t know. However it is unfairly used as a weapon to suggest Wiggins achievement in winning the tour for GB was all down to Froome.
    I just wonder what could have been in 2011. There was no Froome. In the end Evans and Schleck has an epic mountain duel, but there was a Saturday TT that would have been Wiggins trump card (how is that for designing the course for him.) But the competition wasn’t quite as strong as at some tours, Contador was missing. Wiggins was certainly one of the favourites.

    I personally look at Froome’s physique today and think that Sky learned a lot with Wiggins about diet and conditioning that Froome is still benefiting from today, He is ‘Sticks’ now and all that was worked out with Wiggins. True Froome is undoubtedly the better climber and Wiggins the better TT rider, but it really takes a team to win the tour. There is definitely a succession with Sky and it is unfair to try and take 2012 off Wiggins retroactively and give it to Froome as I think W was capable of winning before F arrived. Well…, we will never know of course.

    If GT is to win the tour in two or three years time he is going to have to shred himself too and become Sticks3.

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Viewing 14 replies - 1 through 14 (of 14 total)
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  • August 6, 2015 at 11:31 am #855295
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    unclebadger

    Its relatively rare to have
    Its relatively rare to have two true GC contenders on the same team unless you are a “Super team” and have the budget and resources that can attract them. That’s definitely one of Sky’s strengths.

    Premiership/1st Division analogies abound….

    August 5, 2015 at 9:28 pm #855293
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    Anonymous

    All this speculation
    All this speculation regarding the 2012 TdF is ridiculous and gets you nowhere.

    Sky work on a policy of strength in depth. They look at the course and then select the team to ride it. They pick the GC rider they think can win and then team him up with a lieutenant who is good where he is weak.

    There is no sentiment in this, it is all about having a second string to your bow. In 2012 if Wiggins had blown up or crashed out then Sky would have thrown everything behind Froome without a backward glance. In 2014 when Froome crashed out Porte was the lieutenant but was not strong enough that year.

    This year the lieutenant was Thomas. If Froome had failed then he would have assumed the mantel and become the protected rider and could well have won. Until he got punted of the road that is. I think he was hurt a lot more than either he or Sky let on.

    There is no sentiment involved, it’s just how the Sky Machine works.

    August 5, 2015 at 5:10 pm #855291
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    Must be Mad

    Quote:With Porte going to BMC

    With Porte going to BMC perhaps Thomas could lead at the Giro? After losing the muscle mass built for the TP he’s not that much heavier than Froome, who was always long and skinny.

    Tis a distinct possibility – but Thomas will have to choose between the Giro or the Classics.

    August 5, 2015 at 4:28 pm #855289
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    unclebadger

    Wiggins could have won it
    Wiggins could have won it earlier with the right support I reckon. He was in top form in 2009, LA was seriously worried about being overtaken by him.

    It’s really unfair of people to suggest that Froome pulled Wiggins round (which I think is your point). By his own admission Froome has said he wouldn’t have won this year without the rest of his team and it has always been so with whoever wins in any grand tour. I’m thinking of the likes of ONCE and Banesto as well as later teams. I hate to say it but USPS/Discovery had some cracking riders on their squad as well. I think that would be why Wiggins was so cheesed off with his own teammate attacking him like that. When the timings are that close you need to be psychologically as well as physically strong.

    Wiggins is by far the more accomplished, all-round champion as far as I am concerned.

    August 2, 2015 at 3:24 pm #855287
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    ianrobo

    daddyELVIS wrote:ianrobo

    daddyELVIS wrote:
    ianrobo wrote:
    daddyELVIS wrote:
    Now G winning the Tour – I really would LMAO – that would be a whole new level of ridiculous!

    people would have said that about Wiggins or Froome at any one point. Sky can create these tour winners from those you could not think of before.

    I agree!

    Your average Sky fan thinks cycling started in 2012 – they have no clue how ridiculous their champions’ achievements are!

    The debate about how they do this is long and hard. Whether clean or not no one can say that they do not create champions from riders with potential. Thomas if this progression continues will want to challenge sooner or later on larger stage races and GT’s.

    sky will have no compassion in dumping Froome if he can not keep up, thats for sure.

    August 2, 2015 at 3:00 pm #855285
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    daddyELVIS

    ianrobo wrote:daddyELVIS

    ianrobo wrote:
    daddyELVIS wrote:
    Now G winning the Tour – I really would LMAO – that would be a whole new level of ridiculous!

    people would have said that about Wiggins or Froome at any one point. Sky can create these tour winners from those you could not think of before.

    I agree!

    Your average Sky fan thinks cycling started in 2012 – they have no clue how ridiculous their champions’ achievements are!

    August 2, 2015 at 2:47 pm #855283
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    ianrobo

    daddyELVIS wrote:Now G

    daddyELVIS wrote:
    Now G winning the Tour – I really would LMAO – that would be a whole new level of ridiculous!

    people would have said that about Wiggins or Froome at any one point. Sky can create these tour winners from those you could not think of before.

    August 2, 2015 at 1:51 pm #855281
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    daddyELVIS

    Now G winning the Tour – I
    Now G winning the Tour – I really would LMAO – that would be a whole new level of ridiculous!

    July 30, 2015 at 10:22 am #855279
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    700c

    Simon E wrote:With Porte

    Simon E wrote:
    With Porte going to BMC perhaps Thomas could lead at the Giro? .

    would love to see that. The guy deserves a shot at leading a big event

    July 30, 2015 at 10:19 am #855277
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    Stumps

    G went downhill at this years
    G went downhill at this years tour after he hit the post. Personally i think he damaged muscles which were made worse after he hammered it to get back and not lose a lot of time. After that he dropped away quite quickly and had it not been for the crash i believe he would have still been top 5.

    July 30, 2015 at 9:35 am #855275
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    Scoob_84

    Maybe Thomas could have won
    Maybe Thomas could have won this years tour had froome been riding for him, who knows. Fact of the matter is, winning a yellow jersey is a team effort.

    July 30, 2015 at 6:47 am #855273
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    dastott

    Wiggins actually got really
    Wiggins actually got really skinny for the 2009 season whilst riding for Garmin and managed to snag 3rd (4th) at the Tour because of it. Not sure how much input GB Cycling had in that transformation but Team Sky really reaped the benefits.

    July 29, 2015 at 3:25 pm #855271
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    Simon E

    With Porte going to BMC
    With Porte going to BMC perhaps Thomas could lead at the Giro? After losing the muscle mass built for the TP he’s not that much heavier than Froome, who was always long and skinny.

    July 29, 2015 at 12:53 pm #855269
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    700c

    hmm.. Well yes Sky were
    hmm.. Well yes Sky were strong in 2012 and I think Froome also would have won that year, had he been the team leader instead of Wiggins, but he wasn’t, so I agree, it’s unfair and pointless to take anything off Wiggins for 2012.

    As for 2011 – Wiggins would still have been an underdog I think, and *might* have sneaked under the radar to take it in the TT, but don’t forget Cadel Evans was very strong that year, he had huge capacity to suffer and great determination as well as being a good Time Trilaist. I would like to think Wiggins could have got a podium place but if and when he saw himself losing time in the mountains, he might have gone off the boil a bit?

    As for GT, he’s got some qualities that he could build upon to become a contender for a grand tour; he’s hard & can really suffer, he’s decently fast on the flat and uphill. Maybe becoming a ‘stick’ would help, but he also needs to remain strong over three weeks, which he didn’t quite manage this year as a domestique.. However realistically he’ll be hampered whilst Froome is in the team as he’s the weaker Grand Tour prospect at present.

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