Descending breaking the fear

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  • #23358
    pablo

    So as the title suggests how did you get over it?

    This weekend i did a Hilly Sportive i did it last year and for this year i specifically trained for it. I took 20 minutes out of my time with a course that was 4 miles longer. I should be happy but i’m not i’ve figured out how to climb without blowing up but descending at speed scares the life out of me. The feeling that the bike is completely out of my control moving all over the place and generally on the edge of falling off i can’t beat. I’m never going to be the best but being in control without fear is surely an achievable next target!

Viewing 15 replies - 16 through 30 (of 39 total)
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  • #833715
    0
    rjfrussell

    Quince wrote:Speed is not

    Quince wrote:
    Speed is not dangerous on its own.


    This, and indeed your full post, is of course factually accurate. And on an intellectual level, very difficult.

    The big problem that I have (and I suspect others posting to this thread have) is that no matter how much I tell my head to tell my body that speed on its own is not dangerous, it scares the shit out of me on a bike.

    I gave up skiing for the same reason. But you can’t ski up hill. At least cycling has some point left to it!

    #833713
    0
    crazy-legs

    The absolute #1 is to have
    The absolute #1 is to have confidence in the bike.
    If the brakes are rubbish or it doesn’t fit properly or the tyres have a tendency to slide, it doesn’t matter how good you are, you’ll never be able to give it 100%.

    So ensure that the rims are clean, the brakes are as good as you (or a shop!) can get them, all the nuts and bolts are torqued correctly, the tyres are good quality, free from cuts etc and inflated to the correct pressure for your weight, the road conditions etc.

    Then find a gentle descent that’s as traffic free as possible and practice flowing down it. Not riding it. Flowing. Don’t go for all out speed, go for smoothness, as little braking as possible, head up, look [b]through[/b] the corners rather than at them. Once you can do that, the speed will come as a by-product of being smooth. Try to go fast and you’ll end up over-braking which isn’t smooth. Outside leg down, weight the bike with the body, don’t try and steer it too much, you steer by leaning, looking where you want to go and using the hips and a bit of weight on the inside of the bar.

    Chris Boardman did a very funny video (which I can’t find…) on descending but in the absence of the video, try his tips here: http://www.tamiasoutside.com/2012/07/17/descending-2/

    The problem in the UK is that a lot of descents tend to be on rubbish roads, short / steep / twisty where you can’t let the bike go or on busy A-road where you’ve got loads of traffic.

    #833711
    0
    fustuarium

    Good thread, with good advice
    Good thread, with good advice and links. Take comfort that there’s always someone worse than you; in this case it’s me! Last year I had brake failure at 30pmh on 16% decent that lead to a monumental off. I’ve only just started going back on the road and am half my old descending speed. Over 15mph and my bottle goes (despite doing 26mph on the flat!). On todays ride I took a wrong turn and ended up on a 20% decent I meant to come up. Stopped in a sweat and had to give myself a bollocking just to carry on down, even at walking pace, thinking ‘What if the brakes fail’. You can’t be that bad!

    I’ve been trying to plan how to sort it out and thankfully it fits much of what’s said here: hill repeats to climb better and learn to descend comfortably, concentrate on being relaxed, be happy that I’m not trying to break any timesspeed on descents, dust off hybridmountain bike and go off road to get the feel back. Trying to put it all together reminds me of a Lou Holtz quote “Ability is what you’re capable of doing. Motivation determines what you do. Attitude determines how well you do it”.

    #833709
    0
    crikey

    Quote:Don’t think its been

    Don’t think its been explicitly mentioned yet – on a bike/motorcycle at speed you countersteer to turn

    I know that in discussions about bicycle handling, countersteering usually crops up at some point. It’s not really that important because it’s the way two wheeled things work; if you ride a bike, you can already countersteer.

    #833707
    0
    JonD

    Don’t think its been
    Don’t think its been explicitly mentioned yet – on a bike/motorcycle at speed you countersteer to turn (in).
    It’s pretty subtle on a bike, but way more noticeable on a motorcycle.
    You push on the bar to the side you want to turn (or pull on the other) – which often feels like pushing the bike down into the corner.

    #833705
    0
    JonD

    Don’t think its been
    Don’t think its been explicitly mentioned yet – on a bike/motorcycle at speed you countersteer to turn (in).
    It’s pretty subtle on a bike, but way more noticeable on a motorcycle.
    You push on the bar to the side you want to turn (or pull on the other) – which often feels like pushing the bike down into the corner.

    #833703
    0
    JonD

    Don’t think its been
    Don’t think its been explicitly mentioned yet – on a bike/motorcycle at speed you countersteer to turn (in).
    It’s pretty subtle on a bike, but way more noticeable on a motorcycle.
    You push on the bar to the side you want to turn (or pull on the other) – which often feels like pushing the bike down into the corner.

    #833701
    0
    Quince

    Along with all the other
    Along with all the other excellent advice, it may be worth trying to pinpoint exactly what it is about a particular descent that scares you.

    For straight, steep drops, the only thing you really need to worry about is the road surface. So long as you can keep the bike in the straight line, there’s only one place gravity’s going to send you, so you can ‘model’ the decent in your head pretty easily. Knowing that, you can ride with the aim of avoiding imperfections; small movements, but not really editing your course. The speed may ‘feel’ scary, but the knowledge that it’s not going to chuck you anywhere unexpected should make it easier to come to terms with. It’s just you, but faster. Speed is not dangerous on its own.

    For swoopy descents, then just be cautious as hell, or as cautious as you want, until you can’t be bothered with that level of caution anymore. Try breaking the descent down into shorter, straighter sections so the drop becomes more like a series of the straight ones mentioned earlier. In these circumstances, speed CAN throw you weird places, so try and almost ‘reset’ before every new section by slowing down as much as you want, perhaps almost coming to a standstill (obviously try and find a very quiet and unpressured environment for this).

    Like many people have said, a fluid descent requires a fluid body, and that can’t happen if you’re physically and mentally rigid. Therefore, working on breaking descents down into something comfortable, understandable, and not scary pieces comes before anything else.

    Compared to most cycling, where you’re wrestling the bike up hills or desperately trying to hold someone’s wheel, descending requires you to ‘do’ almost nothing. It’s not your strength generating the force driving you forwards, but gravity (+ your combined mass). Descending about understanding those forces, knowing what they can and can’t do, and then ‘feeling’ when you can let them take you, and when to dial them back.

    If you can, find some of both types of descent (somewhere very quiet), and practice letting gravity ‘take control’ of you on the former, and letting yourself ‘take control’ of gravity on the latter (i.e. brake a lot). Weight distribution, body tension, mental focus etc. should hopefully start to feel like a natural part of something bigger. There are only really ‘gravity, contours, body and bike’ at work, and the first two are already set in stone.

    Oh, and obviously, the bike has to be suitable. A heavily laden tourer or not going to handle very responsively compared to a carbon racer.

    #833699
    0
    mrmo

    pablo wrote:
    I’ve got week

    pablo wrote:

    I’ve got week booked in the canaries cycling so I need to work on this before I go or I might run out of brake pads on some of the descents!

    Depending on the island, you may actually find things get better. UK descents tend to be short and steep, I have found that longer alpine and canarian descents I have ridden have given time to think and learn, if you can find some one to follow you can actually follow rather than find the descent has ended before it started.

    #833697
    0
    Yorkshie Whippet

    wellcoordinated wrote:Sounds

    wellcoordinated wrote:
    Sounds to me like you have the wrong bike. Your bike sounds twitchy. Try the same descent on different bikes and see whether it’s you are the bike. Almost certainly the bike.

    +1 for trying this. I use to ride a Planet X Pro Carbon and loved it but anything over 25mph and I was leaving brown stuff over the road and learnt to love the smell of melting pads. Moved over to the Fenix and now hit the same descents a good 10-15mph faster.

    #833695
    0
    OldRidgeback

    southseabythesea wrote:I used

    southseabythesea wrote:
    I used to descend at speed, when conditions were safe. After a painful brush with the tarmac at under 20mph, getting stones picked out of knees is painful, I didn’t want to find out what it would be like at 40mph+. Now I take descent easy and put effort into ascents instead.

    Stones picked up in the skin at 40mph sometimes don’t come out. There’s a bit of grit above my right knee that’s been there since I was a teenager. It’s a relic of a motorbike crash rather than one on a bicycle, but the effect was the same.

    #833693
    0
    southseabythesea

    I used to descend at speed,
    I used to descend at speed, when conditions were safe. After a painful brush with the tarmac at under 20mph, getting stones picked out of knees is painful, I didn’t want to find out what it would be like at 40mph+. Now I take descent easy and put effort into ascents instead.

    #833691
    0
    bashthebox

    I’m a terrible descender, so
    I’m a terrible descender, so have had to try very hard to get better. Like others have said – if you don’t feel too confident, don’t force yourself to go fast. Ride to the conditions… if it’s wert, you’re right to go slow. If you don’t know the road, every corner’s a risk.

    That said! There’s things you can do to help.
    1. Relax, relax, relax. Obviously your fear reflex will make you grip on for dear life, but that makes you and your bike a twitchy, unstable mess. I find breathing deeply and consciously telling yourself to relax can help.
    2. Focus on the braking, the line you want to take, and your body position. Honestly, as daft as it sounds, I’ve talked myself down a mountain descent like so:”Brake, let go of brakes, foot down, lean, apex apex, go wide out, relaxxxxx….. brake, stop braking, foot down, apex” etc.
    3. Climb mountains, descend them. You come back from a trip to high mountains descending maybe 20-30% faster than you do on short UK roads.

    #833689
    0
    Shred

    The bike needs to move around
    The bike needs to move around on the road, especially if the surface is not perfect.
    A relaxed grip on the bars and relaxed arms and shoulders are essential. Use your body to point you in the right direction and let the bike follow you there. You cannot try to steer the bike all the time.

    If you can, get out on a mountain bike. This will help teach you to allow the bike to move around under you and relax your grip.

    #833687
    0
    pablo

    Thanks for the comments. I
    Thanks for the comments. I was looking last night for some roads to do some repeats on I think I knew what people were going to say but always worth getting some comments to show your not alone. Although I agree with the comment about bike setup I suffer on both my bikes from the same fear. The bike I used was my sportive bike which I just rebuilt so I need to check it over for anything slightly loose and check the saddle height etc. On this specific event I might be able to blame the bike but in general I don’t like the feeling of the bike moving around so much.
    I’ve got week booked in the canaries cycling so I need to work on this before I go or I might run out of brake pads on some of the descents!

Viewing 15 replies - 16 through 30 (of 39 total)
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