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Grrrr a bit of a rant this one.

I was cycling on a back road this afternoon, happily bimbling along when I saw a pothole approaching. Moved over by a foot and a half to avoid it and brushed elbows with another cyclist that had decided to overtake.

It's not the bloody peloton of the TdF, it was a decent sized straight road with a centre line and no oncoming traffic, there's no need to be trying to tangle yourself in my cranks.

Rant over.

30 comments

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sergius [424 posts] 1 week ago
1 like

Dunno, I don't particularly see anything wrong with passing fairly close to another cyclist (though obviously you wouldn't to a kid etc); however I always call out before overtaking - they've no way of knowing you are there 99% of the time.

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Grahamd [528 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes
sergius wrote:

Dunno, I don't particularly see anything wrong with passing fairly close to another cyclist (though obviously you wouldn't to a kid etc); however I always call out before overtaking - they've no way of knowing you are there 99% of the time.

Agree, I'll usually call out something like "on your right" it's not difficult.

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700c [1130 posts] 1 week ago
4 likes

Sounds like he was a bit close but your moving out to avoid pothole may have caught him by surprise. So best to always check before you change road position

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don simon [1026 posts] 1 week ago
4 likes
700c wrote:

Sounds like he was a bit close but your moving out to avoid pothole may have caught him by surprise. So best to always check before you change road position

Yeah! Why not a quick look over the shoulder before moving? A quick indication with the hand wouldn't have gone amiss and marked you out as an experienced rider.  I believe you can get mirrors that clip to the glasses if a quick look is too much travel.

It's not a problem I have come across, no one can over take me.

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Yorkshire wallet [1183 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes

Partly your fault for moving out on him, he was probably giving you plenty of room before you did that. 

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brooksby [2306 posts] 1 week ago
3 likes

S'funny: I have never been overtaken by another cyclist who called out or used a bell before or as they were doing so. Never. (I always do, so it grates a little).

As regards the OPs comments and subsequent replies , don't we expect *anyone* (motorised or not) to overtake us leaving enough room that if we suddenly have to move because of, say, a pothole then there won't be a collision...?

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Vehlin [17 posts] 1 week ago
4 likes
brooksby wrote:

S'funny: I have never been overtaken by another cyclist who called out or used a bell before or as they were doing so. Never. (I always do, so it grates a little).

As regards the OPs comments and subsequent replies , don't we expect *anyone* (motorised or not) to overtake us leaving enough room that if we suddenly have to move because of, say, a pothole then there won't be a collision...?

The guy called out as we nearly collided.

I'm honestly a bit shocked by some of the comments. If you're passing a bike close enough that it moving half a metre puts you in danger of a collision, you are passing too close.

Yes I should have shoulder checked, but at the same time I'd not seen another vehicle for 5 mins. The other rider could have passed myself and my 12 imaginary friends in the other lane and still not needed to move back in. I just don't understand why he'd pass so close when he literally had the entire road to choose from.

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climber [81 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes

Surely the passing cyclist would have a bit of common and give the inside rider a bit of room. Wasn't a chain gang after all. Loads in my club have been 'told off' for close passes, it's intimidating for the less 'initiated'. A bit of empathy is called for here I think.

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Mungecrundle [774 posts] 1 week ago
4 likes

Surely on a purely self interest level the passing cyclist is as likely to be injured as the passed cyclist in the event of a collision so just why would you not pass with a decent gap and a cheery 'good morning / afternoon'?

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hawkinspeter [732 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes

It depends on the size of the pothole. If you only moved out less than a metre or so, then the overtaking cyclist should have left more room and he would be at fault for overtaking when not safe to do so (i.e. He was performing a maneuvre and thus should have anticipated the bad road surface). If you swing out more than about a metre, then I reckon you should have checked first, but with a pothole, you might not have had any choice about it and had to go around for your own safety even if you had checked and seen an overtaking cyclist (the checking would most likely have tipped off the overtaking cyclist that you were about to move, though).

Overtaking other cyclists should always be performed with a decent safety margin. As an overtaker, you have the better view of the situation and should be able to react quickly enough to avoid getting within "brushing" distance.

I did get told off the other morning about overtaking a cyclist without using a bell which surprised me as I hardly ever use a bell to warn that I'm overtaking. I left him a good 2 metres of room (I used the other side of the road as he was close to the middle line - only a small back road), so I think I just startled him with a quick silent pass.

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don simon [1026 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes

OP should have looked behind or signalled.

Overtaking cyclist should have given more room.

Both partly at fault.

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Yorkshie Whippet [602 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes

Interesting to note that if a motorist does a close pass it's pitch forks out and there'll be a hanging tonight. 

A fellow cyclist who should be more aware of the road conditions and how cyclist may react, you are at fault!

 

 

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Chris Hayes [126 posts] 1 week ago
1 like

Confession: I sometimes deliberately close-pass cyclists who are using mobile phones if they wobble in my way; usually on the superhighways and parks in Central London.  If you do this, please stop. 

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Mungecrundle [774 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes
Chris Hayes wrote:

Confession: I sometimes deliberately close-pass cyclists who are using mobile phones if they wobble in my way; usually on the superhighways and parks in Central London.  If you do this, please stop. 

Does that not constitute a punishment pass?

However much the behaviour of others may annoy you, you have no right to be handing out the summary justice.

Or if you are a hypocrit like what I am, you don't mention it publicly.

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BehindTheBikesheds [443 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes

When overtaking give plenty of room no matter what the vehicle, as the person in front has priority it is your responsibility to ensure that they and other road users are safe whilst making your maneouvre.

The overtaker was in the wrong, end of story, if you disagree/won't accept that, get off the road, hand your motorvehicle licence and bike in and get some training until you undesrstand why you're wrong!

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don simon [1026 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

When overtaking give plenty of room no matter what the vehicle, as the person in front has priority it is your responsibility to ensure that they and other road users are safe whilst making your maneouvre.

The overtaker was in the wrong, end of story, if you disagree/won't accept that, get off the road, hand your motorvehicle licence and bike in and get some training until you undesrstand why you're wrong!

I've never seen the point of rear view mirrors on the car either. Where's the angle grinder?

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BehindTheBikesheds [443 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes
don simon wrote:
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

When overtaking give plenty of room no matter what the vehicle, as the person in front has priority it is your responsibility to ensure that they and other road users are safe whilst making your maneouvre.

The overtaker was in the wrong, end of story, if you disagree/won't accept that, get off the road, hand your motorvehicle licence and bike in and get some training until you undesrstand why you're wrong!

I've never seen the point of rear view mirrors on the car either. Where's the angle grinder?

So by admittance with your futile and ill judged statement you also don't get it. stay off the road until you do as it would appear you're just as ignorant as the rest!

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don simon [1026 posts] 1 week ago
2 likes
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:
don simon wrote:
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

When overtaking give plenty of room no matter what the vehicle, as the person in front has priority it is your responsibility to ensure that they and other road users are safe whilst making your maneouvre.

The overtaker was in the wrong, end of story, if you disagree/won't accept that, get off the road, hand your motorvehicle licence and bike in and get some training until you undesrstand why you're wrong!

I've never seen the point of rear view mirrors on the car either. Where's the angle grinder?

So by admittance with your futile and ill judged statement you also don't get it. stay off the road until you do as it would appear you're just as ignorant as the rest!

So you are serious then.  

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ChrisB200SX [395 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes

You should both have read the road ahead better so a swerve wasn't necessary, but the overtaker should have seen that and given enough room. A quick shout by the overtaker wouldn't have been difficult either.

I've been very nearly clipped a couple of times while waiting at traffic lights... last time, the other cyclist flew past through a red light. There was another cyclist behind who saw it, he just shrugged at me. So, when I caught the dickhead 3/4 of the way up the hill I made sure I returned the favour. Wanted to shout at him but I hope missing his handlebar by an inch with my mad bikeskilz was enough to demonstrate that his recklessness wasn't cool.

Re the lack of pitchforks, how many cyclists kill or injure people compared to drivers? Vehicle mass and energy, or wanton disregard for them, explains the pitchforks.

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ChrisB200SX [395 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes
Chris Hayes wrote:

Confession: I sometimes deliberately close-pass cyclists who are using mobile phones if they wobble in my way; usually on the superhighways and parks in Central London.  If you do this, please stop. 

just for context, what vehicle are you in when you do this?

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Chris Hayes [126 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes
ChrisB200SX wrote:
Chris Hayes wrote:

Confession: I sometimes deliberately close-pass cyclists who are using mobile phones if they wobble in my way; usually on the superhighways and parks in Central London.  If you do this, please stop. 

just for context, what vehicle are you in when you do this?

 

A Litespeed - should have mentioned that..... I'm never dangerously close, but close enough to tell them to get off their phones and ride straight. 

 

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Chris Hayes [126 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes
Mungecrundle wrote:
Chris Hayes wrote:

Confession: I sometimes deliberately close-pass cyclists who are using mobile phones if they wobble in my way; usually on the superhighways and parks in Central London.  If you do this, please stop. 

Does that not constitute a punishment pass? However much the behaviour of others may annoy you, you have no right to be handing out the summary justice. Or if you are a hypocrit like what I am, you don't mention it publicly.

 

ive yet to knock anyone off and don't intend to: I'd call it summary good advice rather than justice....

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ChrisB200SX [395 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes
Chris Hayes wrote:
Mungecrundle wrote:
Chris Hayes wrote:

Confession: I sometimes deliberately close-pass cyclists who are using mobile phones if they wobble in my way; usually on the superhighways and parks in Central London.  If you do this, please stop. 

Does that not constitute a punishment pass? However much the behaviour of others may annoy you, you have no right to be handing out the summary justice. Or if you are a hypocrit like what I am, you don't mention it publicly.

 

ive yet to knock anyone off and don't intend to: I'd call it summary good advice rather than justice....

Annoying though it is, I'm not sure it's illegal, or dangerous to anyone except themselves, generally. I would make no complaint if you knocked the phones out of their hands though.

Actually, you're supposed to have two hands on the bar. Maybe nudge it with an elbow as you pass?

So tired of seeing chavs ride (mostly) on the pavement no-handed, expecting pedestrians to jump out of their way. If I happen to be a pedestrian as they come towards me... Life lessons will be taught.

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Duncann [1022 posts] 1 week ago
4 likes

Close passes by other cyclists are pretty common in London, particularly during busy times. I get that there's not often a lot of space (although sometimes there's plenty and they still don't leave room) and some people are slow(er) but a little consideration and patience would help make the world a slightly better place.

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Chris Hayes [126 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes

 

[/quote]Annoying though it is, I'm not sure it's illegal, or dangerous to anyone except themselves, generally. I would make no complaint if you knocked the phones out of their hands though.

Actually, you're supposed to have two hands on the bar. Maybe nudge it with an elbow as you pass?

[/quote]

 

You can't really achieve this outcome, most riders are right handed so hold their phones in their left hand....it's all or nothing therefore  1 

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Bikebikebike [309 posts] 1 week ago
3 likes
don simon wrote:
700c wrote:

Sounds like he was a bit close but your moving out to avoid pothole may have caught him by surprise. So best to always check before you change road position

Yeah! Why not a quick look over the shoulder before moving? A quick indication with the hand wouldn't have gone amiss and marked you out as an experienced rider.  I believe you can get mirrors that clip to the glasses if a quick look is too much travel.

It's not a problem I have come across, no one can over take me.

You should expect people to swerve around potholes.  There's often not enough time to look or signal - completely the other guy's fault.

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700c [1130 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes
Bikebikebike wrote:
don simon wrote:
700c wrote:

Sounds like he was a bit close but your moving out to avoid pothole may have caught him by surprise. So best to always check before you change road position

Yeah! Why not a quick look over the shoulder before moving? A quick indication with the hand wouldn't have gone amiss and marked you out as an experienced rider.  I believe you can get mirrors that clip to the glasses if a quick look is too much travel.

It's not a problem I have come across, no one can over take me.

You should expect people to swerve around potholes.  There's often not enough time to look or signal - completely the other guy's fault.

Likely both at fault. As per highway code, signal to others before changing course and check that your actions will not force another road user to change their course or speed.

Methinks some people need a refresher course!

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Yorkshie Whippet [602 posts] 1 week ago
3 likes

 

[/quote] Likely both at fault. As per highwaeey code, signal to others before changing course and check that your actions will not force another road user to change their course or speed. Methinks some people need a refresher course![/quote]

Really? The interpretation I was taught was to indicate when changing lane or turning into a side street. Here in Leeds, I'd better learn to ride no handed. Tried it in the car and got flashed at and horn blown as I was constantly switching from one side to other. 

Read Rule 103 a bit further;

make sure your signals will not confuse others

Me thinks you need a refresher;

The vehicle in front has right of way over those behind.

You travel at a safe distance behind allowing yourself space to react.

When over taking ensure the road is clear and it is safe to do so.

When over taking prepare to abandon if it becomes unsafe.

Cyclists may suddenly swerve

Rule 144

You must not drive without consideration for other road users.

 Rule 146

Try to anticipate what pedestrians and cyclist might do.

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OldRidgeback [2769 posts] 1 week ago
0 likes

As a BMX racer I'm used to close passes on the track. We also shut each other off on berms and bash bars regularly.

But on the road you should try and overtake while giving enough room. I appreciate that isn't always feasible in London where I live for example, as many of the cycle lanes are too narrow for the cycle traffic volumes they carry. At the same time, a quick shoulder check is a good idea, but isn't always feasible.

But what I know too is tha too many cycle commuters are pushing too hard. If they want to race, there is a time and a place for it. Just like the Audi and BMW driving dimwits who fight to get through the traffic to the risk of other road users, there are some dimwits on bicycles who don't appreciate that they are going to work and not racing.

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Carton [388 posts] 1 week ago
1 like

This annoys me to no end. If you're in a chaingang or a race the onus is on you not to deviate, sure. But if you're in open traffic follow the rules of the road and overtake with care. Maybe not 1.5 metres, but unless you are overtaking a group, why not give at least three feet?

I once had a pro pass me on the inside as I was retaking my position afer passing a girl on a beach cruiser (who he must have also passed on the inside) on a very wide closed road. He had the nerve to mutter something back to me. I sprinted beside him and told him off. It's amazing how quiet people can get all of a sudden.