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Hi all,

Now disc brakes are allowed in the pro-peloton, have there been any good examples of where a disc-braked rider has managed to out brake his closest competitors on rim-brakes and create a decent lead for themselves?

Just wondering, as I was expecting to see some being boasted about, or shown on TV, but havent seen anything.

23 comments

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CXR94Di2 [2152 posts] 1 month ago
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It's more subtle than that, there could be a variety of incidents where discs brakes have helped. Maybe stopped rider from crashing into other riders

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Mungecrundle [1002 posts] 1 month ago
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They are just a different way of stopping. They have some advantages but I'm not sure that any performance differences are going to be huge at the top level of racing. One thing you can be sure of is that regardless of how much the sponsors push disc models on pro teams, they won't last long if they make riders uncompetitive.

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Mungecrundle [1002 posts] 1 month ago
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They are just a different way of stopping. They have some advantages but I'm not sure that any performance differences are going to be huge at the top level of racing. One thing you can be sure of is that regardless of how much the sponsors push disc models on pro teams, they won't last long if they make riders uncompetitive.

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Canyon48 [1031 posts] 1 month ago
1 like

Peter Kennaugh was being interviewed during the commentary of one of the TdF stages the other day, he said he was dubious of disc brakes at first but having switched to them said they make a very noticeable difference in how late you can brake for corners.

They aren't going to make you win though.

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Canyon48 [1031 posts] 1 month ago
2 likes

Peter Kennaugh was being interviewed during the commentary of one of the TdF stages the other day, he said he was dubious of disc brakes at first but having switched to them said they make a very noticeable difference in how late you can brake for corners.

They aren't going to make you win though.

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leqin [249 posts] 1 month ago
3 likes

There seems to be a echo in here.

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madcarew [749 posts] 1 month ago
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Any examples of rim brakes adding caution to a riders effort that has been shown to have won them the race (etc, etc)

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Paul7189 [22 posts] 1 month ago
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No but they look better and perform better in every way  3

 

I cant believe the levels of hatred from moaning old codgers stuck in their ways, afraid of change! It’s the future, even if it comes from the past and it’s just taking this long to get through. Should of been introduced years ago. More important question is can anyone say they would of saved peoples lives or reduced injuries if they were accepted when they were for mountain biking?

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BehindTheBikesheds [2134 posts] 1 month ago
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future? what benefits does it bring aside from wear, something that isn't an issue at pro level?

crack on

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Mungecrundle [1002 posts] 1 month ago
4 likes
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

future? what benefits does it bring aside from wear, something that isn't an issue at pro level?

crack on

Why not give them a go yourself, maybe over this winter? Then you would have an informed opinion which would actually be worth reading.

I wonder if road.cc might have a spare test bike? You have contributed enough interesting and thought provoking if sometimes controversial material over the years that keeps their website fresh.

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Rapha Nadal [864 posts] 1 month ago
4 likes
Mungecrundle wrote:
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

future? what benefits does it bring aside from wear, something that isn't an issue at pro level?

crack on

Why not give them a go yourself, maybe over this winter? Then you would have an informed opinion which would actually be worth reading. I wonder if road.cc might have a spare test bike? You have contributed enough interesting and thought provoking if sometimes controversial material over the years that keeps their website fresh.

And there we have it.  The impression I get is that those who are dead against discs are those who've not actually used them.

I honestly cannot recall anybody I know who uses discs to say that they're going back to calipers because this progression of technology is utter shite!

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BehindTheBikesheds [2134 posts] 1 month ago
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Mungecrundle wrote:
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

future? what benefits does it bring aside from wear, something that isn't an issue at pro level?

crack on

Why not give them a go yourself, maybe over this winter? Then you would have an informed opinion which would actually be worth reading. I wonder if road.cc might have a spare test bike? You have contributed enough interesting and thought provoking if sometimes controversial material over the years that keeps their website fresh.

What advvantages in pro racing do discs have over rim brakes, I'm still waiting.

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Mungecrundle [1002 posts] 1 month ago
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What are you expecting?

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madcarew [749 posts] 1 month ago
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BehindTheBikesheds wrote:
Mungecrundle wrote:
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:

future? what benefits does it bring aside from wear, something that isn't an issue at pro level?

crack on

Why not give them a go yourself, maybe over this winter? Then you would have an informed opinion which would actually be worth reading. I wonder if road.cc might have a spare test bike? You have contributed enough interesting and thought provoking if sometimes controversial material over the years that keeps their website fresh.

What advvantages in pro racing do discs have over rim brakes, I'm still waiting.

Greater control, better stopping. But you're not really listening to the answer. 

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dottigirl [819 posts] 1 month ago
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Dan Martin expressed concern today that the relative increase in incidents was down to the disparity in braking between discs and rims. 

At least, there is still some concern in the pro peloton about this, though it doesn't really affect us plebs.

 

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wycombewheeler [1340 posts] 1 month ago
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dottigirl wrote:

Dan Martin expressed concern today that the relative increase in incidents was down to the disparity in braking between discs and rims. 

At least, there is still some concern in the pro peloton about this, though it doesn't really affect us plebs.

 

Right...because when you are riding at 30mph 6 inches behind another bike the key factor is how hard brakes can be applied and reaction time doesn't factor at all.

It's quite clear that if rider a is travelling behind rider b and b brakes hard there will be an incident no matter what brakes are used.

The ludites claim there is no inherent benefit and disc brakes as rim brakes provide all the braking the tyres can deal with and now they also claim braking differences are problematic.

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beigemaster [35 posts] 1 month ago
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I was having a think about this myself. I would imagine where you would gain the most advantage by way of actual time gaps would be presumably on a very long Alpine descent with multiple hairpins (especially in the wet). However, at the moment the only riders who are really using the discs seem to be the sprinters and the larger guys on aero style frames- who are almost never going to be at the front of the peleton on that type of descent/stage bar perhaps Sagan who could probably walk on water if he gave it a crack. 

 

There is a forecast for storms this week as Le Tour enters the mountains, so watch this space. 

 

Other and perhaps more subtle difference, it seems that manufacturers are able to get aero gains from losing the callipers as there's greater clearance for wider tyres and rim combos, so again that might offer a marginal gain but pretty hard to quantify- I'm sure it's been noted that John Degenkolb won on the pave on stage 9 on a disc brake bike.  

 

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Canyon48 [1031 posts] 1 month ago
1 like

The aero advantages are significant of disc brakes over rim brakes. Removing the brake surface as well as moving the calliper away from the rim gives vastly improved airflow over the tyre and rim.

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Anthony.C [264 posts] 1 month ago
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Canyon48 wrote:

The aero advantages are significant of disc brakes over rim brakes. Removing the brake surface as well as moving the calliper away from the rim gives vastly improved airflow over the tyre and rim.

I don't know where you get that from, disc brakes are always said to be less aero.

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don simon [2411 posts] 1 month ago
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Kapelmuur [429 posts] 1 month ago
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I'm sure I remember drum brakes when I was a nipper, I used to covet them as the rod operated rim brakes on my Hercules were useless and stopping was more effective by dragging my feet on the road.

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Canyon48 [1031 posts] 1 month ago
3 likes
Anthony.C wrote:
Canyon48 wrote:

The aero advantages are significant of disc brakes over rim brakes. Removing the brake surface as well as moving the calliper away from the rim gives vastly improved airflow over the tyre and rim.

I don't know where you get that from, disc brakes are always said to be less aero.

The key there is "said to be". The first disc brake road bikes were less aero (those bikes which were essentially unchanged from their rim brake counterparts, just with added discs).

But the latest disc brake bikes, designed from the ground up as disc brake bikes, are in fact more aero. Or, at the very least, not less aero  10

I also have 1500 hours of CFD simulations and a few hours of wind tunnel data comparing the two, the disc brake version (modelled using some of the neat tricks the Scott Foil Disc uses around the calliper) was massively better than the rim brake version.

But again, not to say that all disc brake bikes are faster, though the latest disc brake bikes that have exploited the advantages really are faster.

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fukawitribe [2505 posts] 1 month ago
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There are some cases already where disc equipped bikes appear more aero than rim, e.g.

https://www.slowtwitch.com/Tech/Disc_and_Rim_Brake_Aero_Drag_6073.html

(disc better over most of the yaw range they tried, rim brakes more slippery at high yaw towards NDS, head-on is never going to be much different) but what i'm looking to see is what folk can come up with now that aero/deep-section wheels are increasingly being properly designed without needing to consider a brake track, as Canyon48 alluded to.