[Johnnyvee]

So I’ve managed to do my 50 miler ride with no huge disasters thanks to the help of the others on here. I was sensible and ate normal food and drank plenty whilst out. So is like to try some longer distances next year but having two little ones means training has to take place at weekends and silly o’ clock in the morning. I’m usually out at around half five for and hour to hour and a half before breakfast. I can get a longer ride in over the weekend.
So to develop from here in looking at trading zones and ask kinds of advice. Can anyone point me to a good basic guide to know what I need to get – kit wise and how I apply it or do I need to enlist the help of a coach or far better cyclist.
I’m over 50, 100 kg and can now ride for over three hours and get through 50 miles in just under three in our area. I’d like to Malden my training more effective..
So please would you let me have your thoughts?
Cheers
Johnny

Topic

[riotgibbon]

About this time last year,

About this time last year, just after getting a new bike (with thru-axle) I fell off it and broke my wrist. After 3 weeks of sitting about going insane, I got a Tacx Vortex, loaded up on  the video things and Zwift, and it kept me sane and fit. What I found worked extraordinarily well was TrainerRoad+Game of Thrones.  Fantastic combination, TR has an overlay mode, it tells you what to be doing leaving most of the screen clear for all the different swords swinging about. Awesome

 

Zwift is pretty amazing, I didn’t do that much of it because I was more focussed on TR and not wanting to wipe myself out totally, but the times I did use it were pretty incredible – so immersive, you totally forget that you’re not outside

First chance to get back out riding for real I did, because I love the open air, but if you really are constrained, then give it a go, it worked for me when I needed it

this is the thru-axle adaptor I used for my Diverge Comp:

https://www.rosebikes.com/article/tacx-t1706-and-t1707-thru-axle-adapter-for-the-rear-wheel/aid:716584

 

 

[fustuarium]

Johnnyvee wrote:

Johnnyvee wrote:

Fustuarium & CXR94Di2 – I’ll dig out the old turbo trainer but I have a feeling it won’t work with the thru axles I have on the current bike so will see how I can adapt it.

Do I need to get some forum of heart rate monitor to hit these zones and are there free apps that can help with this?

Turbo through the crap weather seems like a good idea though. Nice warm garage! And I suppose you can concentrate on the training rather than the road and drivers…

IIRC there are adaptors for thru axels.
Only time I ever watch telly is on the turbo. Currently Eurosport Eneco tour and half way through Game of Thrones. Not at all boring, and time well spent 🙂

TrainerRoad – have a read of website in sensors. I use a laptop and Suunto usb ant+ that’s was cheap as chips. I think TR do a referral where existing folk can give others a free month. So if you want to try it let me know and I’ll find the link (iirc there’s nothing back to me so I’m not suggesting it for my own ends).

Agree with others on upping mileage at low effort. I tend to do shorter rides and upping to long ones at zone 2 is the mental aspect of aching arse/shoulders/neck than aerobic capacity. I’ll leave others to comment on 100 miles at tempo pace lol.

[madcarew]

For Max HR, about the most

For Max HR, about the most effective way is to do a ramp test (see the British cycling site) and then add 5% to your final HR. Re-test after a couple of weeks. Your resting HR is just that, when you’re resting. Take it in the morning before you get out of bed. Some may argue that this isn’t necessary, but you’re time poor and so you might as well make the best of what you’ve got. Look up Heart Rate Reserve to use these figures to set your training zones. They’re not cast in stone, but they are a very good guide.

So far as doing longer rides goes, one of the more important things is to improve your fatburning as much as you can. As you ride early in the morning, doing a hard 2 hr ride before eating anything in the morning will help get your body used to using fat as a fuel. This will be of enormous benefit doing longer rides. After some practise it’s pretty easy to ride 60 – 70 miles without eating anything. This makes century rides much easier.

You can readily do good century rides on 3 – 4 rides a week, total of 6 – 10 hrs. My training program is a hard 90 min ride on tues and thurs. I do a lot of the ride in zone 4-5 (this evening’s ride was 30 miles, av 20 mph, with 3 x 15 min efforts in zone 5 (85% max HR) and 3 x 3 min efforts at max VO2 (92% max HR) and 2000 ft climbing. At the weekend I do a 3 hr ride at 75% max HR. About once a month I do a 5 hr ride. This generally gets me round  a century in a bunch in about 4:10  – 4:15. Solo 4:30 – 4:45

How you measure your HR is not particularly important, but from what I’ve seen fit bits aren’t particularly accurate when going hard on a bike, chest strap linked to something reliable is a good idea.

Above all of this consistency is the most important thing. Much better to do regular smaller rides than irregular big ones. 

[CXR94Di2]

Johnnyvee wrote:

Johnnyvee wrote:

I’ll have to train outside as the old manual turbo I have well not fit my current bike as it had thru axles rather than QRs and I don’t want to have the expense of a new bike just for that or a new bike and a smart trainer.   Mind you the oldest mountain bike has quick release rear so I could at a push use that. 

For training in heart zones is the best combo a smart phone and heart strap with an app or a garmin and an app.  Anyone using a set up like this and what have you found is the best combo that’s not too expensive.  I was after all born and bread in Yorkshire.

Is there also a good /easy way to determine max heart rate and these zones that folks keep referring to? 

Best option is Garmin or alike bike computer with heart strap. Phones work just a well but don’t have the battery time compared.
Max heart rate, ride up a long incline as fast as you can until you can’t do it anymore. Resting heart rate, sit quietly for half an hour. Feed figures into an online calculator ( British cycling have one) this will give you a good guide as to your zones. Note zones are guides and not clean definitive levels. Train away 🙂

[Johnnyvee]

I’ll have to train outside as

I’ll have to train outside as the old manual turbo I have well not fit my current bike as it had thru axles rather than QRs and I don’t want to have the expense of a new bike just for that or a new bike and a smart trainer.   Mind you the oldest mountain bike has quick release rear so I could at a push use that. 

For training in heart zones is the best combo a smart phone and heart strap with an app or a garmin and an app.  Anyone using a set up like this and what have you found is the best combo that’s not too expensive.  I was after all born and bread in Yorkshire.

Is there also a good /easy way to determine max heart rate and these zones that folks keep referring to? 

[tritecommentbot]

Really want to get into Zwift

Really want to get into Zwift.. don’t think it’s going to happen this winter now though 

Hope they make it more RPG’ish. Scoring points for training sessions that you can use to buy posh bikes and upgrades!

 

Sort of thing I could waste hours on every night 

[fukawitribe]

Non-interactive can be a

Non-interactive can be a laugh too, especially with Sufferfest videos or Zwift. I was running a Kurt Kinetic Road Machine with InRide as a dumb trainer on TrainerRoad and Zwift and a Tacx Genius as interactive under Tacx TTS. The dumb trainer wasn’t as engaging as the interactive one, but still had a blast racing on Zwift, Tour of Sufferlandria and so on – now the Genius has had a Smart upgrade the elevations on Zwift are great and workouts on Zwift, TR etc in erg mode are useful and it’s nice to only need/setup the one trainer but i’d happily use the RoadMachine for stuff if the Genius ever went off-line.

 

Just staring at the wall on a dumb trainer though…. agree – very dull, very quickly IME.

[Anonymous]

Yep, smart trainers are not

Yep, smart trainers are not boring, they’re actually quite motivating. I’m going on a Bkool virtual world tour of famous climbs this winter. I can’t resist pushing myself to try and catch a rider in the distance and if you use Zwift there are plenty of people just that little bit better than you to drag you up a level. People on turbo trainers tend to be a bit more serious about riding so the times I get on Zwift that go into Strava are way lower down the scale than the real world ones. I went up a decent real climb I’d never been to before the other day and was inside the top 20% on Strava. In Zwift I’ll probably end up in the bottom 25%. 

[CXR94Di2]

me wrote:

me wrote:

Blimey, some people make it complicated.  50m in under 3h is good.  Yes I can do quicker on a flat main road, on a TT bike, with passing traffic but any other ride will see 50m in give or take 3h.  You’ve already improved to get to where you are, just keep at it.

Winter is dull, do what you can and when the days get longer do more.

Turbos are dull, smart/VR turbo are dull and expensive.  If you want one buy it secondhand after the previous owner has realised how boring it is – usually a couple of weeks after buying it after the nights close in.

I disagree wholly about smart trainers being boring. Once hooked up to the internet and you’re competing against other riders, either live or with ghost riders, it’s immersive and draws you in. I use bkool and have also joined forums which organise twice weekly races. In winter we have handicap team time trials over 20 miles or so with audio link up- it’s a great event which all enjoy no matter of the end result. The banter afterwards is fun too.
I did join in bkool summer league against 1800 riders of various abilities, the front runners matching Pro level and others just casual riders wanting to compare their ability against others . I was chuffed to bits to come in the top 100 riders at the end of it. There are literally hundreds of different courses and sessions to choose from. I spend 90% of my cycling on the trainer. When I take to the road, I find I am more than capable of keeping up with my fellow club riders who ride all year round, outdoors.

Now non interactive trainers are completely different and do become boring after a short while.

[tritecommentbot]

Puy my hand up here and say

Puy my hand up here and say that I actually enjoy my indoor sessions!

 

Sufferfests are short, intense and I play music vids on my smartphone while doing it. Great fun, especially when you add a caffeine buzz into the mix. 

[me]

Blimey, some people make it

Blimey, some people make it complicated.  50m in under 3h is good.  Yes I can do quicker on a flat main road, on a TT bike, with passing traffic but any other ride will see 50m in give or take 3h.  You’ve already improved to get to where you are, just keep at it.

Winter is dull, do what you can and when the days get longer do more.

Turbos are dull, smart/VR turbo are dull and expensive.  If you want one buy it secondhand after the previous owner has realised how boring it is – usually a couple of weeks after buying it after the nights close in.

[CXR94Di2]

You will need a heart rate
You will need a heart rate monitor to work out your heart zones. Warm garage and a decent fan to keep air moving over your body whilst training. Turbo training is much more intense than road riding. Like I said, I did 52 miles yesterday at a cadence average of 89rpm. For over 2 hours I did not free wheel once. I treated the ride as a good base ride mainly keeping heart rate just in zone 2, then with 12miles to go went up to zone 4/5 to finish strong.

[Johnnyvee]

Thanks for the input so far.
Thanks for the input so far.

Unconstituted – I’ll try thosec stretches when I get back from my very early ride tomorrow morning.

Fustuarium & CXR94Di2 – I’ll dig out the old turbo trainer but I have a feeling it won’t work with the thru axles I have on the current bike so will see how I can adapt it.

Do I need to get some forum of heart rate monitor to hit these zones and are there free apps that can help with this?

It’s a right can of worms finding out about new stuff – just seeing how I can train better to do 100 without it impacting too much more on family life.

Turbo through the crap weather seems like a good idea though. Nice warm garage! And I suppose you can concentrate on the training rather than the road and drivers…

[fustuarium]

Another vote for turbo/indoor
Another vote for turbo/indoor trainer with software. I find TrainerRoad to be excellent at making the most of a small amount of time. It’s software that tells you how hard to ride during a session. I’ve tried it with smart and manual turbo trainers and you’ll progress fine with regular cheap turbo trainer. Mix it up on longer days for skills, outdoor rides and to get some gristle on your bum and you’re golden 🙂

Before spending anything you can have a listen to TrainerRoad Podcasts for free. They’re very informative about training and the technical side of things. There were a few episodes recently about riding for longer (they frequently talk about Ironman etc that are probably similar effort profile to what you are looking at).

[tritecommentbot]

Yorkshire wallet wrote:

Just been trying the indian knot and I feel like a weeble. The link you posted said you should be able to get a good grounding on the buttocks but I’m rocking about all over the place. Something is well tight!!

 

Yeah, me and the missus were like that too  

 

But it does get better.. pretty quickly surprisingly if you do it couple times a week 

[Author]

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