[mattydubster]

Hi everyone

So I did a the 3 counties (97 miler) sportive yesterday in preparation for the Newcastle to London 24hr 300 miler in August, and I’m really struggling with taking on energy that won’t make me feel sick. I have a High 5 powder in my water which is ok for the shorter runs, but yesterday after about65 miles I started feeling really sick. I had been supplementing this with jelly babies and 9Bars, and it was only when I ditched the remainder of the drink and went with water only that I started feeling better. So my question is – should I rely entirely on solid food only for my energy needs and perhaps slip a zero tab in my water, or is there a specific energy supplement that I could put in the water which won’t make me feel dodgy. Oh, I’ve also discovered that gels over a long period are a big no no too.

Thanks

Topic

[ChuckB]

The best presentation I have
The best presentation I have encounter about cycling nutrition

http://www.uctv.tv/shows/Nutrition-for-Cycling-Fueling-Your-Human-Powered-Vehicle-25325

University of California, San Francisco, Oscher Center for Ingrative Medicine
Nutrition for Cycling: Fueling Your Human Powered Vehicle
Medicine of Cycling — Mini Medical School for the Public

[jstone1]

Agree with Colin, ride all
Agree with Colin, ride all day, but not too much protein. Get the fats in and make sure you’re able to burn them at higher intensities more effectively! Another useful resource here (well, it was for me) :
http://eatingacademy.com/how-a-low-carb-diet-affected-my-athletic-performance

The issue for most is going to be the time it takes to switch from the “carbs are essential” mindset and rethink your daily fuelling. Taken me about 4 months. Early on any all-out-sprint type efforts seemed to be worse but they’re getting better again now…and the really weird one is a reduction in “air hunger”, I thought I was losing it as I didn’t seem to need to breathe as hard for a given heart rate but turns out it is an effect : https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=76353.25

[AJ101]

jstone1 wrote:You carry a

jstone1 wrote:

You carry a huge tank of fuel with you, it’s called fat. Just need to train your body to use a much higher percentage at higher power outputs, which takes time & effort, but works (well, has worked for me, but I’m just another N=1 experiment on this).

This – TOTALLY! You can train yourself to switch over to more fat burning even when you’re not riding. High protein with slow carbs 6 days a week. Junk on the 7th day.

Protein for breakfast with minimal carbs so you are absolutely full and then go out riding all day. You’ll be surprised how far you can go without a midmorning carbcrash kicking in and making you feel empty.

Seriously, you can ride all day like this, and, if like the majority of the population you’ve got a bit of extra weight around your middle you’ll feel pretty good knowing you’ve got a route to burn it direct whenever you want.

[Colin Peyresourde]

Most of the above advice has
Most of the above advice has been fairly unscientific, and I’m not going to claim to be a nutritionist but choosing a mixture of different sources is the way forward.

There’s a finite limit to how many calories your gut will absorb per hour (which decreases the harder you exercise) and the more complex the food compound the harder it is to process.

The answer is that you need to ensure you don’t work at ‘full gas’ if you’re guzzling proteins and fats. If you do the calories will just sit undigested in your gut.

So what about carbs? Well as you probably know High 5 2:1 in suggests simple sugars are the easiest way to get calories into your system. But overload that system and a) you’ll get diarrhoea and dehydrate yourself b) you won’t absorb all the calories (which is why (a) happens) c) you shut down your bodies own carb processing.

The main solution is to go easy on the carbs, having High 5 4:1 seems to kind of help, but mixing up the calorie sources does help. But as one of the earlier posters suggest learning to let your body cannabolise itself (convert glycogen, fats and proteins into energy) is key. Everyone wants to avoid the bonk (it’s just painful in a very uninspiring way), but if you eat and drink a little regularly you’ll find that you will have plenty in the tank as long as you’re not in the red for too long because your body will naturally process its own resources. It does need a top up (water is the most important thing and carbs thereafter) but it can effectively convert its own resources….unless you’re diabetic.

Try stringing it out, but keep a gel or two to keep you out of trouble.

[NickK123]

I have been through the same
I have been through the same process and came to the conclusion that after 100K of hoovering sweet stuff I felt nauseous. Spoke to a fellow cycling club mate and he suggested trying something savoury to alternate with. So last Sunday on the Evans’ Milton Keynes event I had a small quartered pork pie with me in my jersey pocket – brilliant! So, had mix of 2 gels, small number of jelly babies, High 5 tablets in the water and pie! It might be an advert for the potential ‘fat lad at the back’ but it broke the cycle of high/lows with eating sweet stuff. Will be speaking to a nutritionalist in the club to see if there is something more suitable than pie (but I hope not!)

[DavidC]

Dry-type sausages
Dry-type sausages — cabanossi, salami, or some such thing.

[runskiprun]

hmm, I shall train for the
hmm, I shall train for the London 100 on biltong and droewors. I know I can eat both, and if it works, I’ll be the fat lad with one leg riding at the back with some meat tucked in his jersey (and some haribo for the last hour!)

[peterben]

Agree with adamtaylor about
Agree with adamtaylor about the Torq pink grapefruit, very drinkable.
I make my own energy bars, combination of oats, chia seeds, dried cranberries and cherries, pea protein, toasted pumpkin seeds, maple syrup and coconut oil. if you soak the oats and chia seeds overnight you get a nice moist bar.

[pdows47]

I agree with trying proper
I agree with trying proper food. Have a look at Allen Lim’s book (the feedzone cookbook). There’s lots of proper food in there that I find really good for my stomach, as I get gut rot with some of the highly processed stuff. Also look for drinks like Skratch Labs which are made with real fruit, and was created by the same guy. Or OTE, that’s all made with real food and agrees with my stomach

I realise this sounds like an advert, but I promise it isn’t, I just like the stuff Lim makes

[mattydubster]

Thanks for the replies,
Thanks for the replies, there’s quite a lot of slightly different variations. I’m starting to think that getting my energy intake through my fluids perhaps isn’t the be all and end all so I may just switch to either a tasteless sodium/electrolyte tablet or even a very small amount of my High5 in the water. I reckon ‘real food’/salted nuts/flapjacks/homemade schnizzle etc could be worth a pop, and I seem to remember that I’ve had success with dry fruit too. I suppose it also helps knowing that during my 300 miler there are 7 stops, of which 2 will be serving a hot meal!

Not so sure I can give up the jelly babies though – towards the end of my sportive, after I had dealt with the sickness, they actually went down really well and proper lifted my spirits up whilst biking into a headwind!

[crikey]

Cheese and jam sandwiches.
Cheese and jam sandwiches.

[Flying Scot]

American hard gums from lidl
American hard gums from lidl and high 5 plus caffeine one tab (not 1.5) in a 750ml bottle.

[Flying Scot]

American hard gums from lidl
American hard gums from lidl and high 5 plus caffeine one tab (not 1.5) in a 750ml bottle.

[jstone1]

You carry a huge tank of fuel
You carry a huge tank of fuel with you, it’s called fat. Just need to train your body to use a much higher percentage at higher power outputs, which takes time & effort, but works (well, has worked for me, but I’m just another N=1 experiment on this). Best result is you don’t need to keep stuffing sickly sweet sugar in and putting your system through massive sugar induced highs and lows.

http://www.samiinkinen.com/post/86875777832/becoming-a-bonk-proof-triathlete-fat-chance

My version of the ham and cheese sandwich would be just the ham and cheese, some salted nuts, plain water.

But, @alotronic is right, it’s all very personal.

[alotronic]

Very very personal!
I can’t
Very very personal!

I can’t abide energy products if my ride is longer than about 6 hours.

Up to six hours I will use an energy bottle and a nuuns bottle, and munch my way through a commercial cereal bar every 45mins to an hour. This will do for moderate power output. After 6 hours it all just makes me want to gag.

If I am doing a properly long ride (12 hours plus) I will take spare peanut butter sandwiches (!) bananas. Along the way I will have real food (baked potatoes) and drink chocolate milk and water. 3am – coca cola!

Basically real food is good, but is hard to carry. I think someone did a study once on the power of the ham sandwich – perfect mix of carb, fat, protein.

Don’t be too fooled by the marketing. There’s plenty online about making your own energy drinks and bars. Home made flapjack or riceballs are the business. And probably the best thing for the intensity and distance you are aiming for. Then you can keep the gel for that last hour 🙂

[Author]

Replies