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London cyclist killed in collision with HGV at KnightsbridgeJunction of Sloane Street with Knightsbridge and Brompton Road (source Google Street View).PNG

London cyclist killed in collision with HGV at Knightsbridge

Latest fatality comes on day Stop Killing Cyclists hold vigil for Lucia Ciccioli, killed in Battersea last week
by Simon_MacMichael
Mon, Oct 31, 2016 15:13
20

A cyclist has been killed in London this lunchtime following a collision involving a lorry at Knightsbridge. The latest death of a bike rider in the capital, the eighth this year, comes ahead of a vigil and die-in this evening in memory of 32-year-old Italian national Lucia Ciccioli, who died in an incident also involving a lorry in Battersea last week.

The victim today was 21-year-old Filippo Corsini, an Italian prince and the heir to one of Florence's oldest families. The Metropolitan Police say they were called to the incident, at the junction of Sloane Street with Brompton Road and Knighstbridge.

According to the London Evening Standard, firefighters and paramedics also attended the incident. The driver of the lorry stopped at the scene, and was subsequently arrested on suspicion of causing death by careless driving.

This evening's vigil in Battersea, organised by the campaign group Stop Killing Cyclists, begins at 5.30pm.

Collision with HGV
Lucia Ciccioli
Knighstbridge
Filippo Corsini
Simon MacMichael

Simon joined road.cc as news editor in 2009 and is now the site’s community editor, acting as a link between the team producing the content and our readers. A law and languages graduate, published translator and former retail analyst, he has reported on issues as diverse as cycling-related court cases, anti-doping investigations, the latest developments in the bike industry and the sport’s biggest races. Now back in London full-time after 15 years living in Oxford and Cambridge, he loves cycling along the Thames but misses having his former riding buddy, Elodie the miniature schnauzer, in the basket in front of him.

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20 comments

Avatar
Sven Ellis | 7 years ago
0 likes

Story: "The driver of the lorry stopped at the scene, but has not been arrested.

Standard: "Police said the lorry driver, a 42-year-old man, stopped at the scene and was arrested on suspicion of death by careless driving.

Avatar
Simon_MacMichael replied to Sven Ellis | 7 years ago
0 likes

Sven Ellis wrote:

Story: "The driver of the lorry stopped at the scene, but has not been arrested.

Standard: "Police said the lorry driver, a 42-year-old man, stopped at the scene and was arrested on suspicion of death by careless driving.

Correct at the time the story was published, will update it.

Avatar
Jimmy Ray Will | 7 years ago
1 like

Just watched that video for the first time... What I think is worth focusing on is the manner in which the driver looks up from his phone - I guess to check that all is OK - and then continues fiddling. 

The point is that he looked up, and at that time, it was clear he should be braking, but didn't absorb that information. 

So, people may say that they 'only look away for a couple of seconds' but there is clearly a lag between looking back at the road and being back in the room so to speak. 

 

 

Avatar
Judge dreadful | 7 years ago
0 likes

I was riding through that junction on Friday, there seemed to be more heavy vehicles than I'd normally see there. I'm guessing it may have been due to the new roadworks in the vicinity. RIP to the rider, and condolences to the F&F.

Avatar
Housecathst | 7 years ago
2 likes

Well it's nearly 1st November, the start of London motorists open season cull of cyclists. 

I wonder how many the hgv drivers will be able to rack up between them this year! 

Avatar
CygnusX1 | 7 years ago
3 likes

RIP.

Avatar
brakesmadly | 7 years ago
12 likes

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

Avatar
Bluebug replied to brakesmadly | 7 years ago
0 likes
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

It always helps if there is dashcam footage of what the driver is doing just before and during the accident.

Unfortunately with HGVs in cities the main issue is why are they there at that time in the first place.

Avatar
Dan S replied to Bluebug | 7 years ago
0 likes
Bluebug wrote:
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

It always helps if there is dashcam footage of what the driver is doing just before and during the accident.

That's exactly the point.  To put an offence into the most serious category for sentence you need to show a "deliberate decision to ignore (or a flagrant disregard for) the rules of the road and an apparent disregard for the great danger being caused to others".  The Prosecution have to prove that beyond reasonable doubt and that's often hard to do.  In a mobile phone case, for example, you may have some eyewitness evidence that the driver was looking at their phone but if the defendant says that they only glanced down for a few seconds then it's hard to disprove that.  And while we can rant as much as we like about locking them all up for ever, bloody drivers, all just murderers etc etc, the law distinguishes between levels of fault and it does so on the basis of proof.

Here we have cab footage that shows beyond doubt that he ignored the rules of the road (indeed, ignored the road) for a prolonged period.  Add in killing multiple victims and the recent reminder not to use his phone and you get to the high sentence.  It would have been just as high had they been cyclists.

Avatar
kil0ran replied to Dan S | 7 years ago
1 like
Dan S wrote:
Bluebug wrote:
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

It always helps if there is dashcam footage of what the driver is doing just before and during the accident.

That's exactly the point.  To put an offence into the most serious category for sentence you need to show a "deliberate decision to ignore (or a flagrant disregard for) the rules of the road and an apparent disregard for the great danger being caused to others".  The Prosecution have to prove that beyond reasonable doubt and that's often hard to do.  In a mobile phone case, for example, you may have some eyewitness evidence that the driver was looking at their phone but if the defendant says that they only glanced down for a few seconds then it's hard to disprove that.  And while we can rant as much as we like about locking them all up for ever, bloody drivers, all just murderers etc etc, the law distinguishes between levels of fault and it does so on the basis of proof.

Here we have cab footage that shows beyond doubt that he ignored the rules of the road (indeed, ignored the road) for a prolonged period.  Add in killing multiple victims and the recent reminder not to use his phone and you get to the high sentence.  It would have been just as high had they been cyclists.

 

Similar story from 2009 - 3 years for killing a family of six and disqualified from driving for three years. Beggars belief...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4640395/Portuguese-lorry-driver-w...

 

Avatar
Dan S replied to kil0ran | 7 years ago
0 likes
kil0ran wrote:
Dan S wrote:
Bluebug wrote:
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

It always helps if there is dashcam footage of what the driver is doing just before and during the accident.

That's exactly the point.  To put an offence into the most serious category for sentence you need to show a "deliberate decision to ignore (or a flagrant disregard for) the rules of the road and an apparent disregard for the great danger being caused to others".  The Prosecution have to prove that beyond reasonable doubt and that's often hard to do.  In a mobile phone case, for example, you may have some eyewitness evidence that the driver was looking at their phone but if the defendant says that they only glanced down for a few seconds then it's hard to disprove that.  And while we can rant as much as we like about locking them all up for ever, bloody drivers, all just murderers etc etc, the law distinguishes between levels of fault and it does so on the basis of proof.

Here we have cab footage that shows beyond doubt that he ignored the rules of the road (indeed, ignored the road) for a prolonged period.  Add in killing multiple victims and the recent reminder not to use his phone and you get to the high sentence.  It would have been just as high had they been cyclists.

 

Similar story from 2009 - 3 years for killing a family of six and disqualified from driving for three years. Beggars belief...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4640395/Portuguese-lorry-driver-w...

 

Yes, but in 2009 the maximum sentence was 5 years. Since then it's been increased to 14, in recognition of the fact that 5 years is nowhere near enough. The law is gradually moving away from the position that if it happens behind the wheel of a car then it should be leniently dealt with. It's gradual, and it will take time, but it's going in the right direction.

Avatar
STiG911 replied to Dan S | 7 years ago
0 likes
Dan S wrote:
Bluebug wrote:
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

It always helps if there is dashcam footage of what the driver is doing just before and during the accident.

That's exactly the point.  To put an offence into the most serious category for sentence you need to show a "deliberate decision to ignore (or a flagrant disregard for) the rules of the road and an apparent disregard for the great danger being caused to others".  The Prosecution have to prove that beyond reasonable doubt and that's often hard to do.  In a mobile phone case, for example, you may have some eyewitness evidence that the driver was looking at their phone but if the defendant says that they only glanced down for a few seconds then it's hard to disprove that.  And while we can rant as much as we like about locking them all up for ever, bloody drivers, all just murderers etc etc, the law distinguishes between levels of fault and it does so on the basis of proof.

Here we have cab footage that shows beyond doubt that he ignored the rules of the road (indeed, ignored the road) for a prolonged period.  Add in killing multiple victims and the recent reminder not to use his phone and you get to the high sentence.  It would have been just as high had they been cyclists.

I hate with a passion the statement 'I only looked down for a few seconds' almost as much as I hate the courts treating the people who use it with such leiniency.

'Oh well if it was only a few seconds that you weren't concentrating on the road while driving your block of metal' Fuck's sake.

Avatar
Dan S replied to STiG911 | 7 years ago
0 likes
STiG911 wrote:
Dan S wrote:
Bluebug wrote:
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

It always helps if there is dashcam footage of what the driver is doing just before and during the accident.

That's exactly the point.  To put an offence into the most serious category for sentence you need to show a "deliberate decision to ignore (or a flagrant disregard for) the rules of the road and an apparent disregard for the great danger being caused to others".  The Prosecution have to prove that beyond reasonable doubt and that's often hard to do.  In a mobile phone case, for example, you may have some eyewitness evidence that the driver was looking at their phone but if the defendant says that they only glanced down for a few seconds then it's hard to disprove that.  And while we can rant as much as we like about locking them all up for ever, bloody drivers, all just murderers etc etc, the law distinguishes between levels of fault and it does so on the basis of proof.

Here we have cab footage that shows beyond doubt that he ignored the rules of the road (indeed, ignored the road) for a prolonged period.  Add in killing multiple victims and the recent reminder not to use his phone and you get to the high sentence.  It would have been just as high had they been cyclists.

I hate with a passion the statement 'I only looked down for a few seconds' almost as much as I hate the courts treating the people who use it with such leiniency.

'Oh well if it was only a few seconds that you weren't concentrating on the road while driving your block of metal' Fuck's sake.

Yup, me too. I have to deal with it on pretty much a weekly basis...

Avatar
STiG911 replied to brakesmadly | 7 years ago
1 like
mbrads72 wrote:

Whilst it's always a tragedy and not a point-scoring exercise I did struggle to reconcile the 10 year custodial  sentence with the usual slap on the wrist if the victim is a cyclist.

I think it's just as appauling actually. 2.5 years per life, plus the guy who ended up with a broken back? Yep, standard shite UK sentance.

 

Avatar
tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
5 likes

Throw a politician under a lorry everytime this happens. Bet quality of life would improve real fast then. 

 

Saw this footage for the first time today. The guy signed a form saying he wouldn't use his phone behind the wheel of the lorry. Then gets into the lorry, and starts using his phone. Then kills a woman and her kids.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67Em_LR2q58

 

Story:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/oct/31/lorry-driver-distracted-...

Avatar
brooksby replied to tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
10 likes
unconstituted wrote:

Throw a politician under a lorry everytime this happens. Bet quality of life would improve real fast then. 

Quality of life would improve if we just started throwing politicians under lorries as a general rule, rather for any specific reason... yes

Avatar
tritecommentbot replied to brooksby | 7 years ago
0 likes
brooksby wrote:
unconstituted wrote:

Throw a politician under a lorry everytime this happens. Bet quality of life would improve real fast then. 

Quality of life would improve if we just started throwing politicians under lorries as a general rule, rather for any specific reason... yes

 

Cannot disagree with that 

Avatar
brooksby replied to tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
0 likes
unconstituted wrote:

Saw this footage for the first time today. The guy signed a form saying he wouldn't use his phone behind the wheel of the lorry. Then gets into the lorry, and starts using his phone . Then kills a woman and her kids.
 

Less than an hour after signing the form  no

Avatar
ChrisB200SX replied to tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
2 likes
unconstituted wrote:

Throw a politician under a lorry everytime this happens. Bet quality of life would improve real fast then. 

 

Saw this footage for the first time today. The guy signed a form saying he wouldn't use his phone behind the wheel of the lorry. Then gets into the lorry, and starts using his phone. Then kills a woman and her kids.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67Em_LR2q58

 

Story:

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/oct/31/lorry-driver-distracted-...

Fully sickening, I'm actually sat at my desk crying after seeing that. Will have to take a few minutes before cycling home.
I hope this can be the turning point for mobile device use while driving/riding and attitudes towards such.
I'm also slightly angry that we don't seem to see these sort of sentences when it's "just a cyclist" that is affected.
Sadly, it is now that time of year when fatalaties spike 2

Avatar
P3t3 replied to tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
2 likes
unconstituted wrote:

 

Saw this footage for the first time today. The guy signed a form saying he wouldn't use his phone behind the wheel of the lorry. Then gets into the lorry, and starts using his phone. Then kills a woman and her kids.

 

As clear an example of why cars should be fitted with black boxes as ever.  Last 30 min of driven time, in cabin video with sound + forward looking video on a loop.  Tested at MOT time.  Chaep to implement and should allow large scale forensic level examination of the causes of crashes in one fell swoop.  

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