Should you wear a bike helmet?

Peter Scott wrote:

I always wear a helmet.

Must make it very difficult washing your hair, then!

(There's a serious point to that joke, by the way - I suffered concusion running around the playground as a child - should I conclude from that I should always wear a helmet when running?)

froze wrote:

Well I've always said buy a helmet based on how much you think your head is worth, if you think your brains are worth nothing then don't bother spending money on a helmet.  I also use to hear the excuse that a helmet weighed too much to be worn, to which I replied that they're too weak to ride a bike if they can't hold a helmet on their head.

I can't see the video link for some reason, but I disagree with the assumption you ride safer with your helmet off, most people where I live who ride their bikes like complete idiots and disregard for safety or for any laws on the street with cars aren't wearing helmets!  Not saying that I've never seen helmet riders ride like that, but mostly is the bareheaded boneheads riding like that.  This has been my observation with over 40 years of watching cyclists ride.

You should stop saying that.

froze wrote:

Well I've always said buy a helmet based on how much you think your head is worth, if you think your brains are worth nothing then don't bother spending money on a helmet.  I also use to hear the excuse that a helmet weighed too much to be worn, to which I replied that they're too weak to ride a bike if they can't hold a helmet on their head.

I can't see the video link for some reason, but I disagree with the assumption you ride safer with your helmet off, most people where I live who ride their bikes like complete idiots and disregard for safety or for any laws on the street with cars aren't wearing helmets!  Not saying that I've never seen helmet riders ride like that, but mostly is the bareheaded boneheads riding like that.  This has been my observation with over 40 years of watching cyclists ride.

Drivel. Anecdotal. Generalisations. Drivel. Uninformed opinion. Drivel.

froze wrote:

I can't see the video link for some reason, but I disagree with the assumption you ride safer with your helmet off, most people where I live who ride their bikes like complete idiots and disregard for safety or for any laws on the street with cars aren't wearing helmets!  Not saying that I've never seen helmet riders ride like that, but mostly is the bareheaded boneheads riding like that.  This has been my observation with over 40 years of watching cyclists ride.

Hi Froze

I think that without you being able to see the video, you may have misunderstood what the results of the study suggested.

The study suggests that if you take two otherwise similar sets of people, put helmets on one and don't give helmets to the other, then those who are wearing helmets will take more risks.

What the study does not show (and is not designed to show), is that people who choose to wear a helmet while cycling are people who take more risks.  

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Do you wear one whilst walking?

hawkinspeter wrote:

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Do you wear one whilst walking?

I'd be tempted to wear one while walking if I could walk at the speed I cycle.   

hawkinspeter wrote:

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Do you wear one whilst walking?

a watermelon?

ConcordeCX wrote:

hawkinspeter wrote:

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Do you wear one whilst walking?

a watermelon?

No one cared who I was, until I put on the mask.

hawkinspeter wrote:

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Do you wear one whilst walking?

no I carry one, so it's ready to deploy when using stairs and crossing the road  obvs 

but its a lot harder to do this while riding

my big dimena is how to address the increased risk in the shower, when i need to wash my hair 

???

(I do actually wear one while cycling, not because I think it will save my life, but because concussion would be quite annoying, as would severe grazing of one of my ears.)

wycombewheeler wrote:

hawkinspeter wrote:

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Do you wear one whilst walking?

no I carry one, so it's ready to deploy when using stairs and crossing the road  obvs 

but its a lot harder to do this while riding

my big dimena is how to address the increased risk in the shower, when i need to wash my hair 

???

(I do actually wear one while cycling, not because I think it will save my life, but because concussion would be quite annoying, as would severe grazing of one of my ears.)

The obvious answer is to shave your head or to KickStart a helmet with some kind of rinse cycle.

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

Very few people (even on here) fundamentally disagree that a helmet provides some protection for your head, but as the video points out, that isn't the only issue. There is also not only your own behaviour whilst wearing one (do you instinctively take more risks because you feel more protected?) but also the behaviour of other road users (do they take more risks around you because you look more protected?). 

If wearing a helmet makes it 10% less likely that I will suffer a serious head injury if I have an accident but 20% more likely that I will have an accident, should I wear one?

There is also the fact that there is safety in numbers ... the more people are out riding bicycles, the safer those riders are (according to the evidence from countries like The Netherlands and Denmark), and making helmet use compulsory reduces the number of people out riding bicycles (according to evidence from countries like Australia). 

All those factors (and others) combined to make this a topic that is not as self-evident as you think it is, by any metric, and why we need to look at all the evidence and then make the right choices based on it. 

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

if you're going to come on here and claim that some things are so self-evident that they don't need evidence, then you'll have to provide some evidence to support that claim rather than say you just feel it. Otherwise nobody's going to respect anything you have to say about anything. Just common sense, innit?

ConcordeCX wrote:

Zeesy wrote:

I couldn't agree more with those who have written in supporting the use of helmets. I watched the video, which tries to give a balanced view. I feel some things are so self-evident that they do not require evidence! In any type of impact to the head, the better protected the head the less severe or absent the head injury. Accidents do not occur only in road traffic situations. A fall can occur while swerving, sneezing or failing to see an obstruction. In such a situation I know I'd rather be with than without a helmet!

Many years ago I watched on a children's programme a watermerlon being dropped on the floor from a height and spattering all over the place. Another melon was dropped from the same height inside a cycle helmet. It came out intact!

if you're going to come on here and claim that some things are so self-evident that they don't need evidence, then you'll have to provide some evidence to support that claim rather than say you just feel it. Otherwise nobody's going to respect anything you have to say about anything. Just common sense, innit?

That's a paddlin'

I also feel a graph coming on ...

Zeesy wrote:

if you're going to come on here and claim that some things are so self-evident that they don't need evidence, then you'll have to provide some evidence to support that claim rather than say you just feel it. Otherwise nobody's going to respect anything you have to say about anything. Just common sense, innit?

For a full round-up of evidence relevant to the cycle helmet debate, please see Cycling UK's evidence briefing, downloadable from

www.cyclinguk.org/campaigning/views-and-briefings/cycle-helmets

Podc wrote:

It's worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and not wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions.

ftfy

Podc wrote:

It's worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions.

It's also worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and NOT wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions either.

RMurphy195 wrote:

Podc wrote:

It's worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions.

It's also worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and NOT wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions either.

The former scenario is of course more indicative & produces more easily relevant data than the latter of course.

Those who lost their lives because of an accident even though they wore a helmet died....the cause of death is of little relevance. The helmet did not save them. It's data/statistics that are automatically included in any research on cycle helmet effectiveness.

Those who lost their lives because of an accident but weren't wearing a helmet died....but the cause of death is of great importance as opposed to the first scenario before even considering them for inclusion in the same research on cycle helmet effectiveness (eg: death even though no injury to head or neck area).
If the injury leading to death could not be prevented by wearing a helmet it's data that makes the case for the limited protection (if at all) of wearing a helmet.
If the injury leading to death could in theory be prevented by wearing a helmet, further studies are needed before deciding whether this data is valid for inclusion in conclusions advocating for helmet use. Why? The same helmet could be a contributing factor leading to the death of the helmet user, for a variety of reasons.

RMurphy195 wrote:

Podc wrote:

It's worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions.

It's also worth remembering that none of the people who have lost their lives after being involved in an accident whilst riding bikes and NOT wearing a helmet, are able to add their anecdata to these discussions either.

What if I refer to the accidents I had while not wearing a helmet where I didn't die?  Do those count?  How about all the occasions I didn't have an accident in the first place?

(Obviously I'm not going to mention all the accidents where I _did_ die, because those wouldn't support my helmet-skepticism).

Come to think of it, I could also cite all the non-fatal accidents, and not-accidents I had while not riding a bike.  In a simiar spirit to the 'helmet saved my life' stories, I could claim that 'not riding a bike saved my life' and argue that therefore nobody should ever ride a bike.

Leviathan wrote:

 

I am sure some of the naysayers just think they have a superior level of skill that protects them. I just wish that half the energy some people put into debating the subject on this site was put into actual cycling and the world would be a better place.

I often wonder if they've suffered a bang on the head...

alansmurphy wrote:

Leviathan wrote:

 

I am sure some of the naysayers just think they have a superior level of skill that protects them. I just wish that half the energy some people put into debating the subject on this site was put into actual cycling and the world would be a better place.

 

I often wonder if they've suffered a bang on the head...

I did a race (MTB) in the Pyrenees and came off, wearing a hardshell helment and shattered all the inside.  Hurt my neck but other than than was okish.  I was pro helments before even more so after.