Updated: Bradley Wiggins in hospital after collision, injuries "not thought to be serious" says Sky
Olympic champion hit by white van pulling off filling station forecourt
04 Bradley Wiggins at the TDF 2013 launch © Simon MacMichael
Bradley Wiggins was taken to hospital after being involved in a collision with a van in Wrightington in Lancashire. Lancashire Police later confirmed that the Olympic time trial champion and yellow jersey holder suffered a number of broken ribs and further injuries to his hands and wrist.
The Lancashire Evening Post reports that The incident occurred at 6pm when a white Astra van pulled off a filling station forecourt and collided with the cyclist, although the Sun have the vehicle as a car and say that the woman driver was being questioned by police.
The incident took place about five kilometres south of the village of Eccleston, where the 32-year-old lives with wife Cath and their two children.
In a brief statement issued shortly before 1130pm this evening, Team Sky said: "We can confirm that Bradley Wiggins was involved in a road traffic accident whilst riding his bike near his home in Lancashire on Wednesday evening.
"He is being kept in hospital overnight for observation but the injuries he has sustained are not thought to be serious and he is expected to make a full and speedy recovery.
"We will announce more details in due course."
Earlier, a spokesman for Lancashire Police said: "A cyclist has been involved in a collision with a white Vauxhall Astra car.
"The rider of the bike, a 32-year-old local man, was taken to hospital by ambulance with injuries not thought to be life-threatening. His family have been told."
The attendant at the garage, Yasmin Smith, reportedly said of Wiggins, "He said he thought he had broken his ribs and while a lot of police cars arrived it was about 15 minutes before the ambulance got there by which time he was blue."
Crow Orchard Road filling station is the reported scene of the incident (Google Maps)
The Sun, which notes that Wiggins had recently shaved off the 'lucky' sideburns he sported on his way to Tour and Olympic glory, aid that he was being followed by a support vehicle when the incident happened, and quoted a source as saying: Wiggo was on a ride followed by his support team.
He was sent flying by the impact and his pals raced to his aid. A source said: “They were following him in a van and they helped him out after the crash. We think he’s going to be fine, but I don’t know how quickly he’ll be back on his bike. His family have been told.”
A lorry driver, Barry Blacklidge, aged 46, who arrived at the scene immediately after the incident, told the Sun: “There were about four police cars there. All the roads were coned off.
“I could see a pushbike, like a mountain bike, and the front wheel was all buckled. I went into the garage and asked what was going on.
"She said ‘Bradley Wiggins has just been knocked off his bike’. The ambulance turned up and they treated him for a while.
“He was up and walking around, but apparently he wasn’t too good. Drivers were stuck in the service station as the emergency vehicles blocked the exits.”
He continued: “I couldn’t get out of the service station in my truck because there were that many police vehicles there. I had to wait until they had moved. The police were examining his bike.”
Wiggins found himelf at the centre of a controversy over road safety during the Olympic Games when he suggested at a press conference that cyclists had a responsibility to wear a helmet.
He made his comments after being put on the spot with a question related to the death of 28-year-old Dan Harris from Wanstead, who was struck by a bus ferrying media between London 2012 venues immediately outside the Olympic Park.
He later took to Twitter to clarify his comments, saying that he had not been calling for helmets to be made compulsory.
Three years ago, Wiggins' wife Cath, who is herself an age group national champion on the track, vowed to stay off the road bike after being hit by a car while out riding.
A separate incident today in Leyland, less than 10 kilometres from Wiggins' home and 15 kilometres from where he was hit, left an male cyclist aged in his 80s seriously injured whe he was hit by a Citroen car on a roundabout at around 2pm. Lancashire Police have issued an appeal for information, with further details on their website.
Responding to news of Olympic cyclist Bradley Wiggins’ road incident last night, Sustrans Policy Advisor Joe Williams said:
"This collision shines a light on the increasing number of cyclists being killed or serious injured on Britain’s roads.
“Making cycling safer for everyone would cut congestion and pollution and help us to lead healthy lives. The government must create more safe space for cycling on and off roads and look at changing the law to follow the lead of many European neighbours, where a driver is also presumed at fault in a collision with a cyclist.
“We wish Wiggo a speedy recovery and a quick return to cycling.”
Heal up soon Wiggo - think the van driver is going to have some questions to answer
OldRidgeback
Shit
Sir Velo
My thoughts go out to him, and i hope he gave the driver a proper Wiggo dressing down before he was arrested. It is the perils we all face every day and maybe now it will gain some proper traction among law makers now a high profile accident has occurred. Its a real shame though that it would take something like this, happening to a high profile cyclist for them to buck their ideas up and thats a poor reflection on our elected leadership.
A white van very nearly collected me on the over pass by Ikea Purley heading north the other day. Some days i have 2 or 3 close calls on my 8km commute through London. The common thread is that all the drivers show a lack of understanding or compliance of the road rules which ultimately endangers someone elses life.
Everyone out their ride safe, never assume what a car will do and take the higher ground and obey the road rules.
Just proves again that it can happen to absolutely anyone.
So not only does the driver feel shit for knocking a cyclist off.. but they feel shit because its the TdF and Olympic time trial champion.. a national hero 
Hope he's ok though.. if he had a support car with him looks like training proper for the Giro has started? maybe he'll have to re-think his targets next year 
Get well soon Wiggo.
Wow, hope he's alright and the reports are just OTT as normal with the hacks.
If not, it just shows that sometimes the police do take an interest in cyclist 
I take it that he won't be on the Chris Evans (BBC R2) show in the morning then. Just saying... 
All the best Wiggo!
@karl_holland
Heal up soon Wiggo - think the van driver is going to have some questions to answer
GWS Wiggo. But Ridgeback, don't hold your breath if you expect any real legal action against the van driver.
"The cyclist was just coming too fast"/"I couldn't see the cyclist because he was smaller than a truck"/"I couldn't see the cyclist because of the headlights behind him"/"He just came out of nowhere"/"I'll lose my job if I'm banned"/"SMIDSY".
Everyone out their ride safe, never assume what a car will do and take the higher ground and obey the road rules.
I'd add to that - assume that every driver is a homicidal tw@t who thinks bicycles are incapable of travelling faster than walking speed.
The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
OF COURSE SHE FUCKING WASNT! SHE WAS IN VAN! THAT HIT A CYCLIST! THATS HOW IT WORKS!!!!
Crikey, I'll be keeping my lucky sidies in place then.
So not only does the driver feel shit for knocking a cyclist off:(
Why do you assume that? Do you not think the driver will immediately start spouting excuses and reaching for his lawyer? Sorry, Wiggo, I didn't see you?
The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
What a shame.
I wouldn't focus my feelings of sympathy on the driver. He or she should probably have thought about those potential outcomes beforehand. It sounds as if he or she simply didn't look.
Some Fella wrote:The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
What a shame.
How exactly would her being injured have made things any better?
Gutted for Bradley, woman will have a lot to answer for come the morning!!
Must feel pretty stupid!
I got taken out a couple of months ago, classic smidsy and the insurance are trying to blame it on me. Bloke wasn't of British origin but was insured, so that's a start.
Rather than questioning why he didn't check his mirrors (I'm pretty sure I didn't teleport onto his bonnet) they are questioning why I was on the outside of the lane.
I wonder what her excuse will be and whether anything will happen!!!
i cant help but think that it seems like an awful lot of police presence there for a cyclist/van incident!
still, its good that they turned up - wonder if they got autographs as well!
Some Fella wrote:The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
What a shame.
Are you for real? You don't even know how the accident occurred and you want the driver hurt?!
Hope he has a swift recovery, doesn't sound like it'll impact 2013 too much fortunately. Maybe some good will come out of a bad situation though. Maybe a few more people will realise they need to pay more attention when driving and maybe it'll make cycle safety worth a few more political points and lift it off the bottom of the agenda.
Exactly the same thing happened to me 5 months ago. I hope Brad makes a speedy recovery and gets a new set of wheels quicker than I have been able to!
Wow, what a lot of driver-bashing going on. Nobody here knows a thing about this incident other than what each of the media sources have chosen to report to suit whatever their particular agenda is however this driver has already been found guilty with an unpleasant dose of glee by a lot of posters here.
It's getting a bit boring now, all the same anti-driving comments following every story of accident involving vehicles and cycles.
I'd be surprised if many commenters never use a car/van/truck and we all know there are plenty of moron cyclists out there on the roads as well.
Don't get me wrong, I'd be very surprised If Wiggins was cycling like a moron and I wish him a speedy recovery, but let's have a bit of common sense and balance here: not every driver is a maniac, and not every cyclist is a saint.
I think biggest prize goes to the telegraph for leading with "enough force to knock the wing mirror off" rather than perhaps enough force to break a mans ribs!
I think the only shocker in this sadly inevitable story is that the driver actually stopped.
-
It's crap, and I hope Wiggins isn't seriously injured and can get back on his bike quickly, but I can't help but think this could be a great thing.
Mainstream media doesn't seem to care about cyclists but an Olympic champion? Hopefully it'll force a change of views when it comes to these kinds of accidents and possibly even on liability laws. Although, because its Wiggins, I could see the whole legal process going quite smoothly for him.
My only worry is that this is used as a stick to beat cycling with to show that its 'really dangerous'. "look, its not even safe for pro cyclists on our roads".
Ribs are nasty. I cracked a couple in late September in a freak "hand slipping off the bars and flinging myself to the ground' accident. It took 6 weeks to heal and hurt like hell. I imagine a TDF is made of sterner stuff.
Swift recovery Sir Bradley of Wiggins.
MercuryOne
The fit state of Bradley Wiggins has probably done much to mitigate the effects of this crash. Some years ago I was hit from behind by a car and bounced off with sufficient force to write off the car.
At the time I was about 15Kg lighter and with good muscle tone, and I think it was this that provided a shock absorber function, and I escaped with just a chipped spine, and some mighty impressive bruises. The broken bones are likely to be the painful hairline cracks but with the added forces of powerful muscle tone raising the degree of pain you experience.
Cracked ribs are the real problem as it is almost impossible to 'set' them and let them heal. I got a couple of those when the crank snapped going uphill, and the bike rolled over with me and landed on my chest. I hope that this doesn't ruin his potential for 2013. If it does than the lawyers will really have a fine time wading in to this case.
47 years of breaking bikes and still they offer me a 10 year frame warranty!
Injured ribs are indeed nasty. Let's hope nobody tells Wiggo any jokes for a few weeks.
Let's also hope some good comes from this. Drivers have to be more careful. And be told that cyclists come in various speeds, and must be treated with respect. Some chance.
Edgeley
I hope Wiggin's recovers quickly and fully.
I'm fed up with the media treatment of RTA's - If you read the Mcr Evening Post article about this the language used tries to create the impression that the "accident" just seemed to have occurred as some random act of god rather than as the result of a vehicle driver negligently failing to look properly before pulling out. No excuses , I know the location - in the dark the road is well illuminated with street lamps and light from the garage forecourt.
It'll be interesting to see what the Police will do - no doubt they'll start with asking Bradley to recommend a "Driver Awareness Course" to enable them to avoid court action to prosecute for careless driving.
Sudor
The incident happened on Crow Orchard Road, close to the junction with Mossy Lea Road, at 6pm on Wednesday evening, when a white Astra van pulled off a filling station forecourt and collided with the cyclist.
Usually such incidents are described as accidents, or the cyclist is described as having collided with the motorist, not the other way around, as above. So now we know what it takes for an adult cyclist to be considered likely to know what they are doing, and intent on at least their own safety: win the Tour de France and seven Olympic medals...
Doesn't stop collisions but wearing a camera on your helmet means hard evidence against careless drivers and a more realistic chance of claiming back some money for the mangled metal that used to be your pride and joy ...... if you survive
JohnS wrote:Some Fella wrote:The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
What a shame.
How exactly would her being injured have made things any better?
If drivers were as easily injured in collisions as cyclists, there'd be a lot fewer collisions. The 70% caused by drivers may not even happen.
JohnS wrote:Some Fella wrote:The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
What a shame.
Are you for real? You don't even know how the accident occurred and you want the driver hurt?!
And I quote:
"The incident occurred at 6pm when a white Astra van pulled off a filling station forecourt and collided with the cyclist"
Classic SMIDSY.
And if drivers were hurt when they drove into cyclists, they'd drive into fewer cyclists.
...I was going to say that maybe Lancashire Evening Post is better than most local newspapers in this regard, but it appears not...
http://www.lep.co.uk/news/local/man-due-in-court-over-tragic-cyclist-acc...
http://www.lep.co.uk/news/local/cyclist-killed-in-accident-1-4241802
http://www.lep.co.uk/news/local/cyclist-rushed-to-hospital-after-acciden...
proves it can happen to any of us of course. I just hope he can use his status to do change something, anything to make it safer for us all ....
Should never have shaved them bad boy burners off...thats what this is really about...
Wow, what a lot of driver-bashing going on. Nobody here knows a thing about this incident other than what each of the media sources have chosen to report to suit whatever their particular agenda is however this driver has already been found guilty with an unpleasant dose of glee by a lot of posters here.
It's getting a bit boring now, all the same anti-driving comments following every story of accident involving vehicles and cycles.
I'd be surprised if many commenters never use a car/van/truck and we all know there are plenty of moron cyclists out there on the roads as well.
Don't get me wrong, I'd be very surprised If Wiggins was cycling like a moron and I wish him a speedy recovery, but let's have a bit of common sense and balance here: not every driver is a maniac, and not every cyclist is a saint.
A driver pulled off a garage forecourt and hit a cyclist. You don't need any more information that that to know the driver was at fault. Either they pulled out purposefully, which I doubt, or they were careless and didn't look properly before pulling out.
When it's cyclists' lives at risks and drivers walk away with just a dent in their bonnet "driver-bashing" is perfectly reasonable. Not all drivers are morons but this one certainly was and there are plenty more guilty of SMIDSY out there. Until these sorts of things are treated less as an innocent mistake and more as recklessly endangering the lives of others then nothing will change.
Looking at the location I suspect it won't be long before someone blames him for cycling on a dual carriageway and pushes for cyclists to be banned from them. I'd agree that cyclists shouldn't be on roads like that but the solution is less stick and more carrot. If there were good quality, segregated cycle routes running alongside, there'd never be any need for cyclists to ride on dual carriageways!
Not all drivers are morons but this one certainly was and there are plenty more guilty of SMIDSY out there. Until these sorts of things are treated less as an innocent mistake and more as recklessly endangering the lives of others then nothing will change.
Note that no arrest has been made. Another one getting away scot-free.
Looking at the location I suspect it won't be long before someone blames him for cycling on a dual carriageway and pushes for cyclists to be banned from them. I'd agree that cyclists shouldn't be on roads like that
I would have thought a wide, straight road was an ideal training ground for one of the world's greatest time-triallists.
And not only do you have a right to cycle on any road except a motorway, when I commuted to work, there were parts of the route where the dual carriageway was the only road available.
If Bradley was being followed by a support car as reported the van pulling out, even if not seeing the bike, must have been taking a chance to get out in front of the support car.
Trust he gets well soon
In other commuter related news just seen this:
I would have thought a wide, straight road was an ideal training ground for one of the world's greatest time-triallists.
I read in one report that he was on a mountain bike, heading to meet up with others. [see: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/nov/07/bradley-wiggins-hospital-acc... ]
As bad as this sounds, this is the best thing that could have happened, especially if its shown that the driver didnt look.
I really dont want the driver to face unduly harsh punishment just because its Bradley Wiggins as other drivers that have committed worse crimes have received lenient punishment, if any at all.
What needs to come from this is the groundswell that people say 'enough is enough' and actually do something about how car-centric our society is, not just more empty platitudes from guff filled politicians (especially the scraggy haired kind).
Unfortunately, it took a series of child deaths on Dutch roads before the will was there for real changes to take place.
I feel that after the weekend, this will be forgotten and it will be business as usual on Monday.
Get well soon Bradley!
Driving bashing? Are you having a laugh? Is that part of 'the war on motorists'? I drive and I cycle. No, not every driver is a moron. Drivers who pull out from garages and knock people off their bikes are morons.
Glee? Anger and frustration perhaps but not glee.
"It's getting a bit boring now, all the same anti-driving comments following every story of accident involving vehicles and cycles."
The comments are not anti-driving, they're anti dangerous/ careless/ selfish driving. If it's getting boring then push off to the Daily Mail comments pages.
So you're saying not every cyclist is a saint and you'd be surprised if Wiggins was cycling like a moron. Great, thanks for adding that to the discussion. What can we take from that?
Did anyone hear the R2 news at 7am, bearing in mind BW was supposed to be on the show, Moira Stewart said "the cyclist was in collision with a car" or words to that effect.
Probably not how i would phrase it to BW!!!
P.S. Did he go on the show? I was in the pool after that and my radio doesn't work so well in water!
This has started a right ding-dong in the office. I've just gotten a bit worked up having run the whole gamut of it probably being Wiggo's fault, "I pay road tax", "damn cyclists riding two abreast", you name it. A 4x4 driver even told me that we should ride single file because then there was room for him to overtake us aginst oncoming traffic. I have pointed out that this is *precisely* why we ride two abreast, so that a 'proper' overtake is necessary. I wouldn't mind but he rides a mountain bike and a motorbike as well.
If the bicycle was invented tomorrow, it would be seen as the solution, not the problem
+ 1 for that;
I got knocked off my bike last month (t-boned a car that pulled across traffic without looking); driver was ok until I mentioned insurance, when he turned round and said 'Sure you're not insured on your bike'.
It turned out it wasn't his car, had to phone police to get insurance details, and luckily, a local shop had caught it on camera. Insurance claim sorted, but absolutely no remorse from the driver. We exchanged phone numbers, but not even a 'are you alright' text.
massive spike in the steering wheel of all cars...I can guarantee that'll reduce accidents of all kinds.
GWS mr wiggest
Sometimes it takes something of a high profile to get things to actually change. Too much apathy otherwise. Drink driving used to be perfectly acceptable, nowadays most people would consider it abhorrent.
Not caring about cyclists IS seen as acceptable, that needs to change. And maybe it takes Brad Wiggins getting run over for people to take notice. Thank god he's okay a few years ago a young up and coming cyclist was killed in similar circumstances not a million miles away from there, it seems maybe things haven't changes much since then.
If a pro like Wiggins with a support car can't stay safe then there is just no hope for cyclists out there. Presumed liability needs to come into effect and I am certain motorists will think twice about the way they drive especially around cyclists although I like mrchrispy's idea, remove airbag and all other safety features and replace with ones that can also give drivers lasting injuries.
It's always the drivers fault ?
Well no actually it isnt always their fault and until people realise this then the forum will be full of "stick a spike in the steering wheel" and "remove all safety features" comments which serve absolutely no purpose whatsoever and make as just as bad as the bad drivers out there.
Accidents happen and careless driving which is a "momentary lapse of concentration" will continue to happen. No-one can say they have never been in this situation before, even the safest of drivers and cyclists.
Untill the facts are announced by either Wiggins / Sky or the Police no-one will know what exactly happened.
Stumpy
I wonder if the first thing they asked *him* was whether he was wearing his helmet!
Given his ill-advised and insensitive comments on the subject after a cyclist died during the Olympic Games I'd be horrified if his helmet hadn't protected him as a 4 ton van tried to go through him
I suppose it is lucky for the driver that they hit someone who has the money to pay for the damage to their van. No doubt there will be a hard luck story interview with the driver over the coming days about how they are now frightened to drive which is affecting their livelihood or walk down the street for fear of reprisals.
massive spike in the steering wheel of all cars...I can guarantee that'll reduce accidents of all kinds.GWS mr wiggest
Roads and cars are designed so that people can drive like tw@ts and survive while mowing down pedestrians and cyclists.
It's always the drivers fault ?
It is when the driver drives into the road without first checking properly that there's no other vehicle approaching.
I wonder if the first thing they asked *him* was whether he was wearing his helmet!Given his ill-advised and insensitive comments on the subject after a cyclist died during the Olympic Games I'd be horrified if his helmet hadn't protected him as a 4 ton van tried to go through him
Wasn't he massively misquoted? I could be wrong but I thought he was actually talking about protection in terms of protection from the law in the event of an accident e.g. assuming the driver was at fault, but someone took it to mean the law should require cyclist to use protection i.e. helmets and the media ran with it?
Anyone catch BBC Breakfast this morning where the sports reporter (whose name I cannot remember) claimed that Wiggo was pro helmet compulsion laws?
Now, is it me, or did he not specifically clarify his comment to say that he did NOT support complusion?
And what on EARTH do helmets have to do with an accident involving broken ribs?
JohnS wrote:Some Fella wrote:The Manchester Evening News reports "The woman driver of the van was not injured."
What a shame.
How exactly would her being injured have made things any better?
Well, if drivers were more likely to be injured in such cases they wouldn't risk-compensate so furiously and might pay a bit more attention. The old "curare-tipped spike in the middle of the steering wheel" principle. Obviously no mileage in wishing injury on her once the crash has happened though.
Usually such incidents are described as accidents, or the cyclist is described as having collided with the motorist, not the other way around, as above.
This is a good point, and while it might sound a bit trivial it's a bit like the continued use of 'road tax'- this sort of language constantly implies or props up an idea or perception, in this case that drivers aren't to be thought of as responsible for things that happen with their vehicles.
I suppose some of it is to do with trying to report the facts neutrally when what happened isn't clear, but it often seems to suggest that cyclists have just driven into a car while the poor old driver sat there inside, helpless and frightened.
It's quite clear who was at fault in this situation. He obviously wasn't wearing the high-vis jersey or reflective pendant he won in those cycling competitions over the summer, so what does he expect to happen
Is there nothing this man won't do to raise the profile of cycling issues? He's a hero!
Hoski - YES! I actually shouted "NO HE ISN'T!" at the TV when the silly mare said that!
I too hope that Wiggo recovers quickly and focuses his post-crash emotions that we're all too familiar with into galvanising a real cultural movement (maybe along side the Times' campaign) that is long, long overdue in this country.
Wasn't he massively misquoted?
Short answer - No
Try misquoting this
"Ultimately, if you get knocked off and you don’t have a helmet on, then you can’t argue. You can get killed if you don’t have a helmet on.
"You shouldn’t be riding along with iPods and phones and things on. You have lights on. Once there are laws passed for cyclists then you are protected and you can say, ‘well, I have done everything to be safe."
http://road.cc/content/news/62783-cyclist-killed-olympic-bus-witness-acc...
I'm not sure what 'context' could change the meaning of what he said - he *did* try back-pedalling, but what he SAID was pretty damn clear
Now on the Jeremy Vine show on Radio 2. Await the 'Road Tax' paying idiots saying how cyclist shouldn't be on the roads.
Spread the word and get calling in.
It's always the drivers fault ?Well no actually it isnt always their fault and until people realise this then the forum will be full of "stick a spike in the steering wheel" and "remove all safety features" comments which serve absolutely no purpose whatsoever and make as just as bad as the bad drivers out there.
Accidents happen and careless driving which is a "momentary lapse of concentration" will continue to happen. No-one can say they have never been in this situation before, even the safest of drivers and cyclists.
Untill the facts are announced by either Wiggins / Sky or the Police no-one will know what exactly happened.
As ever, Stumps is being Mr Sensible again and spoiling the mouth-frother's fun.
I have to agree, too much conclusion jumping at this point. We don't know FOR CERTAIN what happened so it's hard to crucify the driver.
The vast majority of drivers don't actively seek to cause cause these things, through errors of judgement or slips of concentration these things occur and there's not much we can do about these things happening (without massive overhaul of driver training) but what we can concentrate on is making sure the post-'accident' process is improved. Assuming fault is not good for anyone as it demonises motorists. Assuming liability (which is different) is great for cyclists as the driver then has to actively prove they weren't responsible or be liable for costs etc.
Vilifying someone for a momentary lapse of judgement is just entrenching the cyclist v motorist view held by many people, accepting that this was an accident (def: An unexpected and undesirable event, especially one resulting in damage or harm) and probably hugely regretable on the part of the driver helps us move past the fact that it happened and onto what can be done to help those involved and stop it happening again.
Bloody hell - didn't take long
From the Evening Standard
The accident happened at about 6pm yesterday near to his family home in Eccleston. Wiggins, who was wearing a helmet at the time of the collision, is known to regularly embark on training rides around the area’s rural roads.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/no-arrests-to-be-made-after-bradley-wi...
Hope that this doesn't harm is preparation for next year's Giro.
GWS sir!
The vast majority of drivers don't actively seek to cause cause these things, through errors of judgement or slips of concentration these things occur and there's not much we can do about these things happening (without massive overhaul of driver training) but what we can concentrate on is making sure the post-'accident' process is improved. Assuming fault is not good for anyone, assuming liability (which is different) is great for cyclists as the driver then has to actively prove they weren't responsible or be liable for costs etc.Vilifying someone for a momentary lapse of judgement is just entrenching the cyclist v motorist view held by many people, accepting that this was not intentional and probably hugely regretable on the part of the driver helps us move past the fact that it happened and onto what can be done to help those involved and stop it happening again.
This is a good point, but I think at the moment these incidents are too easily waved away as just one of those things. I agree there will always be accidents when humans are behind the wheel, even with much higher driving standards than we seem to have now. But the fact is that people in control of a couple of tons of metal need to look what they're doing, and far too many drivers seem to be totally desensitized to that responsibility.
drheaton, very well put 
The slip in concentration though can be brought on by the simplest of things, "what shall i do for tea", "must remember to phone "whovever" when i get in" etc etc. The list is endless and all of these can cause the lapse and ultimately an accident.
Driver training will never remove these however you ARE right though in that driver training needs to be made better. The roads are getting busier all the time and this will only lead to more accidents occuring.
I like the Mr Sensible, thank you
Stumpy
The slip in concentration though can be brought on by the simplest of things, "what shall i do for tea", "must remember to phone "whovever" when i get in" etc etc. The list is endless and all of these can cause the lapse and ultimately an accident.
I would argue this is the very core of the problem - drivers of motor vehicles do not always take the responsibility and risks involved seriously enough
The question becomes one of how can they be made to?
Social stigma is one method - as per the successful anti drink-driving campaigns both in the UK & Eire
However I would contend that in the short term only a more forceful application of the law can make a difference by providing a deterrent
Just to clarify - i quoted the Mcr Evening News not to highlight daft drivers but to highlight daft reporting.
I would be very interested to know how many vehicle drivers *have* been injured when they have run a cyclist off the road. That was *my* point.
In other news - i love the reports that Mrs Wiggins turned up and was rather keen to "discuss" the incident with the driver. Mrs Wiggins sounds like a wonderful woman.
I would have thought a wide, straight road was an ideal training ground for one of the world's greatest time-triallists.
This section of road links Parbold (hill) with Standish yes it is mainly strait yes it is fast and in generally good condition but it is a busy section of road with a number of significant junctions including a Hospital and a motorway. In the past I cycled it a lot and early evening would not be a time to do time trial training here and I would think Wiggo was cycling it to get somewhere not per say to train. The potential for a SMIDSY at 6pm is too great as it is an area where a driver is very likely to both underestimate a cyclists speed and be distracted by other road users. I stress this does do exonerate the driver who should have been aware of the presence of another road user especially when they were rejoining the road from the garage.
This part of the UK has some really great cycling terrain mixing exposed flat roads with undulating areas and some short stiff climbs, unfortunately you sometimes have to do sections like this one to get to these areas.
I wish Wiggo a speedy recovery and hope the heavy reporting of this incident encourages drivers to pay greater attention to all road users and pedestrians
G
Cycle Streets is reporting that they have an accident logged at the same location back in 2007:
http://www.cyclestreets.net/collisions/reports/2007/06l082760/
stumps wrote:The slip in concentration though can be brought on by the simplest of things, "what shall i do for tea", "must remember to phone "whovever" when i get in" etc etc. The list is endless and all of these can cause the lapse and ultimately an accident.I would argue this is the very core of the problem - drivers of motor vehicles do not always take the responsibility and risks involved seriously enough
The question becomes one of how can they be made to?
Social stigma is one method - as per the successful anti drink-driving campaigns both in the UK & Eire
However I would contend that in the short term only a more forceful application of the law can make a difference by providing a deterrent
I think you're wrong there. I don't drive along safely avoiding cyclists because I'm scared of going to prison, I drive safely because it's how you're supposed to drive.
Implementing harsher sentences as a deterent only works where there is a thought process involved such as with shop lifting, assault and other considered crimes. You think about stealing something and a prison sentence may persaude you against it. You don't think about hitting a cyclist so the punishment is really irrelevant when it comes to ways of preventing accidents like these.
I think you're wrong there. I don't drive along safely avoiding cyclists because I'm scared of going to prison, I drive safely because it's how you're supposed to drive.
I can certainly see your point on that - hence my argument about Social Attitudes being the *correct* way to fix this - but sadly those inevitably take a long time to change
What I struggle to see is any way other than fear of a deterrent making a quick impact
drheaton wrote:I think you're wrong there. I don't drive along safely avoiding cyclists because I'm scared of going to prison, I drive safely because it's how you're supposed to drive.I can certainly see your point on that - hence my argument about Social Attitudes being the *correct* way to fix this - but sadly those inevitably take a long time to change
What I struggle to see is any way other than fear of a deterrent making a quick impact
Agreed, this isn't something that can be fixed quickly, driver attitudes and ability need to be improved over a couple of decades (yes, decades) before we'll see significant change. Implementing a tougher, or more comprehensive, driving test now would start the change but would only kick in once there were enough people on the roads who'd taken it.
I might also suggest (to the ire of many motorists) having to take refresher courses every 10-20 years after passing your test to re-learn all the things you forget. This would improve the standard of driving across the age range and allow instructors to teach older drivers as well as the young rather than relying on the slow trickle effect of 18yr olds improving the overall quality of drivers over time. I wouldn't go as far as forcing people to re-take their test every few years but having compulsory courses could help.
Likewise, starting to change opinions now and social attitudes would still take years to come into effect but in the long run it's the best option. Knee-jerk reactions might satisfy the public's desire to see something 'done' to fix the problem but short term measures won't solve the problems cyclists face.
My other bug bear is new drivers driving around in big engined cars. In your first year of driving you should be limited to a 1l car, 1.2l cars for years 2 and 3 then 1.4l for those up to 5 years experience. That would reduce a large number of accidents and reduce the severity of many more.
Shane Sutton, head coach of Team GB cycling team is in hospital after an 'incident' on the A6:
http://www.britishcycling.org.uk/gbcyclingteam/article/gbr20121108-News-...
I might also suggest (to the ire of many motorists) having to take refresher courses every 10-20 years after passing your test to re-learn all the things you forget. This would improve the standard of driving across the age range and allow instructors to teach older drivers as well as the young rather than relying on the slow trickle effect of 18yr olds improving the overall quality of drivers over time. I wouldn't go as far as forcing people to re-take their test every few years but having compulsory courses could help.Likewise, starting to change opinions now and social attitudes would still take years to come into effect but in the long run it's the best option. Knee-jerk reactions might satisfy the public's desire to see something 'done' to fix the problem but short term measures won't solve the problems cyclists face.
Personally, I think periodic retesting would be a great idea. One way to do it would be to make it voluntary, but then incentivise insurance companies to offer lower premiums to those who have taken it. It would quickly become popular. The after a few years of that, look at the data - if it works, make it compulsory.
My other bug bear is new drivers driving around in big engined cars.
I don't hold this only as a complaint regarding new drivers - I seriously struggle to understand the need for a vehicle which can achieve 0-60 in less that 7 seconds and has a top speed of over 140 mph where both of those activities would almost always be illegal
I find little more pathetic than middle-aged men who define themselves by the powerful car they drive
Personally, I think periodic retesting would be a great idea. One way to do it would be to make it voluntary, but then incentivise insurance companies to offer lower premiums to those who have taken it. It would quickly become popular. The after a few years of that, look at the data - if it works, make it compulsory.
Nice suggestion
drheaton wrote:I might also suggest (to the ire of many motorists) having to take refresher courses every 10-20 years after passing your test to re-learn all the things you forget. This would improve the standard of driving across the age range and allow instructors to teach older drivers as well as the young rather than relying on the slow trickle effect of 18yr olds improving the overall quality of drivers over time. I wouldn't go as far as forcing people to re-take their test every few years but having compulsory courses could help.Likewise, starting to change opinions now and social attitudes would still take years to come into effect but in the long run it's the best option. Knee-jerk reactions might satisfy the public's desire to see something 'done' to fix the problem but short term measures won't solve the problems cyclists face.
Personally, I think periodic retesting would be a great idea. One way to do it would be to make it voluntary, but then incentivise insurance companies to offer lower premiums to those who have taken it. It would quickly become popular. The after a few years of that, look at the data - if it works, make it compulsory.
Excellent idea. When people feel that doing something will save them money they're more inclined to take to it than if they're being forced to.
This, in conjunction with a better driving test, would be a great start.
See? We should be the ones setting policy - robust debate followed by workable suggestions
Wow, what a lot of driver-bashing going on. Nobody here knows a thing about this incident other than what each of the media sources have chosen to report to suit whatever their particular agenda is however this driver has already been found guilty with an unpleasant dose of glee by a lot of posters here.
Hear hear. Most of the comments on here show the cycling community as ignorant and judgemental, all too eager to blame and condemn the van driver despite the fact that no specifics of the accident have been published. I wasn't at the scene so I'm not going to make any assumptions about who was right or wrong, regardless of fame or mode of transport. Sounding off with such biased views is hardly the way we are going to raise the status of cycling.
Don't suppose Brad and family will be feeling like visiting Wrightington Hospital Open Day on Nov 22 but if they do there will be a warm welcome! Get well soon Brad and get back out on the bike!
I wasn't at the scene so I'm not going to make any assumptions about who was right or wrong, regardless of fame or mode of transport. Sounding off with such biased views is hardly the way we are going to raise the status of cycling.
I can see where you're coming from, but the reports indicate that the car/van was pulling out onto a main road from a garage forecourt, while Wiggins was riding along that main road. Therefore the onus was on the driver to give way, so I don't think it's in anyway unreasonable or biased to assume the driver was at fault.
If the incident had been the other way round, and Wiggins had pulled out into the path of the car, I'm sure the tone of the comments on here would be very different and much more along the lines of "he should have known better than to do that".
The Manchester Evening News article isn't well-written, but:
"A lady had been coming out of the forecourt and she’s hit him and he’s gone flying – knocking the wing mirror off her van.
"She stopped because she realised he was on the floor."
She added: "I think he was on the phone to his wife.
"A gentleman was shouting at the woman driver. The next thing, about eight police cars arrived.
Not sure if she's saying he was on the phone at the time, or called his wife afterwards.
If the bicycle was invented tomorrow, it would be seen as the solution, not the problem
Shane Sutton, head coach of Team GB cycling team is in hospital after an 'incident' on the A6:http://www.britishcycling.org.uk/gbcyclingteam/article/gbr20121108-News--Wiggins-Hurt-in-Accident-0
I blame the French. Who's going to be next - Jason Kenny?
Re - my previous post about bad/ biased reporting
The Shane Sutton story carried something similar
"A Greater Manchester Police spokesman added: 'The driver of the Peugeot was not injured.'
Thats a huge relief because the figures regarding cyclists injuring occupants of vehicles are truly shocking.
Hang on. 6pm? No-one's mentioned lights yet. I'd like to think he had some uber-LEDs of some kind.
Why did they let him turn blue?
He's skinnier than me - and people just stand around pointing, "oo it's wiggo?". Put a coat or 3 on him while you wait for the ambulance, at least.
Why did they let him turn blue?
They "let him"? They may not have had much choice in the matter.
Shock can set it regardless of layers and any other precautionary measure you might deem appropriate. Perhaps now is a good time for everyone to read up on the subject:
http://www.redcross.org.uk/What-we-do/First-aid/First-aid-campaigns/Road...
And 15 minutes is not a long time to wait for an ambulance with a conscious patient. Not desirable, yes. But not that long.
It's likely that the Ambulance Service may have called back to ask what Brad's state was (apart from livid). Certainly at an accident I witnessed & called in, LAS dispatcher/triage phoned me back in order to prioritise the need for the ambulance. Victim was conscious but with likely broken wrist, no apparent head impact but was possibly woozy from, er, other substances... so after the blood wagon didn't turn up after 30 minutes stuck him in a taxi. Similar temperatures, we were turning blue!
There's also the question of kit, was he wearing hi-vis or Team Sky issue black kit?
I'm not saying that this in any way negates the severity of the drivers offence, but from purely a view of making the best argument possible for improved driver training there needs to be no 'out' for the driver to use as an excuse.
If Wiggo's in black kit and doesn't have amazing lights (even though the area is well lit) then the driver, and driving groups, will likely use these as excuses and brush the whole affair under the carpet.
Also, I picked up the Sun this morning (purely because of the front page Wiggo story) while I was waiting for my bacon buttie and the driver is quoted as saying "I just didn't see him" so clearly another SMIDSY.
It bugs me that this is socially acceptable. That while driving something that can cause great harm you can hit someone, say "I just didn't see him" and that'll make it all ok. It's the usual, shoulder shrugging, indifference to the damage caused by these events that bothers me more than the events themselves. As has been previously mentioned we can't stop people lapsing in concentration and making these mistakes but the post-accident indifference really needs to change.
Also, Sun quotes a source as saying that she won't face charges as long as she takes an awareness course.
Nzlucas wrote:Everyone out their ride safe, never assume what a car will do and take the higher ground and obey the road rules.
I'd add to that - assume that every driver is a homicidal tw@t who thinks bicycles are incapable of travelling faster than walking speed.
And get well soon & i hope the side burns come back again Brad
Alex7
It's also almost certain that she did the usual turning-right-from-side-road observations that I see most car drivers do (including my wife, unfortunately).
Stop car, usually with a good chunk of the bonnet poking into the road.
Long look left
Short look right to see if anything's coming
Another long look left while pulling out.
There is often no additional check to the right to re-evaluate the speed of whatever's coming before moving the car. I always find this surprising as traffic coming from the right is what's going to hit them first.
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