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Victim was told “I thought you were a bloke” in immediate aftermath of the incident

A van driver who seriously injured a triathlete by pulling her off her bike has been given a six-month suspended sentence and ordered to pay her £5,000 compensation. Martyn Lee pleaded guilty to assault occasioning actual bodily harm at an earlier hearing.

The BBC reports that Lee had been driving his silver Ford Transit on Low Wath Road, Pateley Bridge, near Harrogate in May last year, when Livesey swerved in front of him.

Speaking at the October hearing, Shawn Morales, prosecuting, said: "The defendant had been driving along when the complainant, who was at the left side of the road, had moved over to the right to avoid hitting a dog.

"As she pulled across the road, the defendant had to then drive into the middle of both carriageways to narrowly miss Mrs Livesey.

"The complainant said the defendant then drove past her shouting something about 'undertaking', referring to a previous incident of driving down the inside lane.

"Further down the road he had stopped and, as the complainant went past, he rugby tackled her from the bike and she hit the back of her head on the road surface.”

Lee is then said to have told Livesey "I thought you were a bloke" before apologising.

The semi-professional triathlete from Harrogate had been hoping to qualify for last year’s World Championships, but was left with a bone fracture in the pelvic region and cuts and bruises to her lower back and head. She was unable to cycle for eight weeks.

"I have lost earnings. I lost out in prize money for qualification to these events and I am still in part-time employment," she wrote in a victim impact statement.

Speaking after sentencing, she added: "I don't really see 'you were a bloke' as a defence. If he had knocked a man off their bike it wouldn't be any better, he assaulted somebody – whether they were male or female doesn't matter.”

Livesey has since moved to Mallorca and explained: "One of the reasons we came out here is the roads are really safe and the drivers are very considerate and expect a lot of cyclists on the roads.

"There is definitely a selection of drivers in the UK who think it's ok to be aggressive and react in a road rage type situation to cyclists.

"Drivers do not know the physical impact they can have on cyclists by not just waiting their turn – so many times I've had drivers swearing and trying to scare me. If they get it wrong, for a cyclist it could be game over – it's really not ok.”

At the October hearing, the court heard that Lee’s plumbing business suffered in the wake of the case following what was described as “a hate campaign” on social media.

Livesey denied a hate campaign, explaining: "We live in a very small town near Pately Bridge, myself and husband are well known in the local area. We know everyone in the village and word got out."

Sentencing, Recorder Nicholas Barker said he chose to suspend the sentence due to Lee's remorse and because he had proved with his current employment he "could make a meaningful compensation".

Lee was also handed a community order to undertake 150 hours of unpaid work to be completed within the year.

Alex has written for more cricket publications than the rest of the road.cc team combined. Despite the apparent evidence of this picture, he doesn't especially like cake.

38 comments

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alansmurphy [1473 posts] 4 days ago
8 likes

I'm off out to the pub. Just so I'm clear, if someone on a bar stool is taking what I deem too much room at the bar, can I haul them to the floor? If it's a lady, should I make sure she's ugly?

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Grahamd [822 posts] 4 days ago
11 likes

So a £5000 fine is now meaningful compensation that avoids a jail term. What planet do our judges live on, whiplash compensation claims can be a few thousand, break somebody’s bones and affect their livelihood should be way more. Whatever happened to taking account of victim impact statements.

 

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wellsprop [617 posts] 4 days ago
7 likes

The £5000 is significant, but it's no compensation for jail, just as Graham has said. I'd like to say I'm surprised, however, I'm afraid I'm not  2 I am, however, once again appalled that someone has been allowed to walk free after hurting someone, essentially because they were on a bicycle.

If I ever wanted to murder someone, I'd wait until they were on a bike and run them over when the sun is low.

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alansmurphy [1473 posts] 4 days ago
6 likes

Don't worry about waiting for sunshine, if they don't have hi viz or a helmet or they were cycling recklessly (more than 15mph or more than a couple of feet from the kerb) you're all good.

 

If you've got a bit of cash saved up, don't even worry about this; get a hire car, have a few beers, forget who was driving it, reverse if you must...

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grumpyoldcyclist [56 posts] 4 days ago
7 likes

Dreadful sentencing

So let me see, the next time a pedestrian walks up past his van stuck in traffic he's okay to assault them,yes?

Or if he had assaulted the owner of the uncontrolled dog, that's fine too?

Don't think it's likely, but assault a cyclist lawfully conducting themselves on the road and it's fine.

And the government think tougher laws for cyclists are the answer......

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Grumpy17 [92 posts] 4 days ago
11 likes

The victim has a right to be dissatisfied with the sentence- this was an appalling assault with no justification whatsoever.

Sadly, this is simply yet another example of an aggressive,egomaniac driver completely losing the plot because he encountered a fast-paced cyclist whose riding did not conform to the stereotype  he expects from a person on a bike. . I'm sure we have all experienced this type of driver, they are the 'must get in front' or 'left hook' specialists who expect a cyclist to ride @ 10mph in the gutter and to simply give way to all four wheeled traffic whatever the rights and wrongs of the situation. In their eyes, you are a cyclist therefore ,by definition, you have NO rights as a road user and if you try and  assert your rights, either  by the manner of your riding or,when challenged,  by any kind of verbal response, then you are  deserving of the greatest contempt imaginable- I honestly believe this is the deluded and psychopathic mentality of a small minority of motorists towards cyclists.

 

Anyway, he'll have to fix a few more toilets and unblock a few more sinks now to make up the £5k compensation he owes- probably a sh*t plumber anyway -  no doubt  he's  one of the 'shiny  van brigade' with big lettering on the side and  wears company logo designer workwear that never gets dirty- looks really 'pro' but still gets leaks and call backs all the time 'cos he's still not got the hang of it after years in the trade. These guys are ten a penny, I can vouch for that.

Let's  just hope the courts in Yorkshire are more robust at chasing non-payers than they are in other parts of the country.The overall debt of unpaid court fines in the country currently stands at something like £500 million..

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Pushing50 [14 posts] 4 days ago
6 likes

If there is the admission of guilt and the court have ordered £5k compensation, can a civil action be taken to sue for the loss of earnings and prize money? I do not know the regulations but was just wondering.

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burtthebike [1270 posts] 4 days ago
10 likes

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/simon-bramhall-latest-surgeon...

The British justice system is broken, like much about our society.

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alansmurphy [1473 posts] 4 days ago
8 likes

I'm not sure that's really the case we should be comparing, something really fucked up about that, plus £10k to a surgeon Vs £5k to a plumber.

If I was going to compare it, how about comparing it to a cyclist that had an accident, hit someone who walked out in front of him and is going to prison...

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Yorkshire wallet [1629 posts] 4 days ago
9 likes

Cyclist gets assaulted....ends up leaving the country as it's safer to ride elsewhere.

Attacker get pitiful sentence because..... he's sorry. His sentence is also less than the 8 months suspended for the motorbike rider than crashed only injuring himself. 

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Housecathst [617 posts] 4 days ago
16 likes

“At the October hearing, the court heard that Lee’s plumbing business suffered in the wake of the case following what was described as “a hate campaign” on social media.”

its got to the point where this is the only way cyclists can get any justice. 

Are we supposed to feel sorry that people dont want a thug that attacks a women in the street working in there homes!

Fuck Lee’s and his shity plumbing business, and long many the hate campaign continue, its the least he deserves.

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perpetual121 [4 posts] 4 days ago
1 like
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

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burtthebike [1270 posts] 4 days ago
9 likes
perpetual121 wrote:
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

It was said in court, and not challenged, that it had not affected the transplant.  Myself, I just can't understand how having the surgeon's initials on my successful transplant would affect me in any way shape or form, being completely invisible and not affecting the outcome.  It isn't as if he'd signed his name on my buttocks with a scalpel is it?  Compare this assault with dragging a cyclist off her bike and seriously injuring her, and tell me it was even worth prosecuting, let alone being found guilty and fined twice as much.  It would have been quite sufficient to leave it to his professional organisation to investigate and punish, bearing in mind that many drivers are not prosecuted for quite outrageous assaults causing injury and even death with their deadly weapon.

If this surgeon had saved the life of my loved one with his skill and dedication, I'd have been quite happy that he signed his name and I most certainly would have opposed his prosecution.

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Feckthehelmet [7 posts] 4 days ago
3 likes

Let's face it. Martin Lee is vermin, pond amoeba.

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Pastmybest [16 posts] 4 days ago
20 likes

Hmmmm.........I'm up in court in a few days in a virtually identical case where the driver got out and pulled me off my bike, luckily in front of witnesses. Given that I didn't break any bones, and that (due to my intense sporting mediocrity) my injuries didn't impede my ability to win any prize money, the best I feel I can now hope for is that the defendant is given 50 lines and told to stand in the corrner for 10 minutes.

It was luck rather than judgement that Caroline Livesey didn't end up in a wheelchair.

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oldstrath [928 posts] 4 days ago
4 likes
perpetual121 wrote:
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

Why would you be remotely bothered? Everything works fine, what's the problem?

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Bob'sbikes [856 posts] 4 days ago
2 likes

Am I right in assuming because the scumbag wasn't in his van when he attacked Mrs Livesey he will not be recieving any ban.

Which means that road users in that part of the country have to share the roads with somebody who thinks this is perfectly appropriate behaviour (along as your "a bloke")

 

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Pastmybest [16 posts] 4 days ago
6 likes

Am I right in assuming because the scumbag wasn't in his van when he attacked Mrs Livesey he will not be recieving any ban.

Which means that road users in that part of the country have to share the roads with somebody who thinks this is perfectly appropriate behaviour (along as your "a bloke")

 

As I discovered when I launched my civil suit against the bloke who attacked me, once you're out of your car the whole situation changes. Weirdly, they go from considering you to be a 'dangerous driver' to a 'dangerous assailant'. Another (slightly dull and frustrating) point to note is that once a driver leaves his car, his insurance company are no longer under any obligation to indemnify him against the consequences of his actions. Which has an odd double impact - firstly, that if he has money then any judgement must be met by him in person, but secondly, that if he doesn't have any money, then your chances of agreeing a conditional fee arrangement with a solicitor are much lower....

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Butty [225 posts] 4 days ago
11 likes

Much more detail here.

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/road-rage-nut-who-rugby-11840634

She was originally after £9+k but it seems that judge was more sympathetic to how much Mr lee could pay, rather than the actual cost of his actions.

I bet this sh*tbag does his best not to meet the payment terms.

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Yorkshire wallet [1629 posts] 4 days ago
5 likes

She's been awarded £5000 from the magistrate in relation to the criminal charges, so can she now sue for civil damages elsewhere? 

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Pastmybest [16 posts] 4 days ago
0 likes

She's been awarded £5000 from the magistrate in relation to the criminal charges, so can she now sue for civil damages elsewhere? 

True, although......depending on how 'collectable' the defendant is considered to be, the victim may or may not be able to secure a CFA from a solicitor. If not, then she has to put down the cash herself, and hope that any judgement goes in her favour, and includes her costs. Whilst this  is highly likely in this case, as the defendant has pleaded guilty, he may still be extremely difficult to get any money out of, and the victim may yet have to pay for the debt to be enforced. All of which she has to do from overseas. Given the stress and inconvenience involved, and the likelyhood of the defendant falling over himself to avoid paying, I strongly suspect that she won't bother.

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FluffyKittenofT... [1931 posts] 3 days ago
2 likes
oldstrath wrote:
perpetual121 wrote:
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

Why would you be remotely bothered? Everything works fine, what's the problem?

 

It would sure as heck bother me.  Though I have some 'issues' about the worrying arrogance and imperiousness of more than a few medics anyway.   You're a guy paid to do a job, you don't own anyone's body parts.  Branding people is not acceptable even if its not visible on the outside.

 

  But that case was so utterly peculiar and unusual that it's  not a good choice of comparison with anything.

 

What I'd want to know is whether the leniency of this sentence is to do with the victim being a cyclist or if it's actually just par-for-the-course with violent assaults generally.

 

A far as I can see,violent assaults, even with serious concequences, often seem to get overly soft sentences when compared to non-violent offences (the ones that always comes to my mind are the kid during the riots who stole bottled water from a  shop - 6 months - and the canoe-man insurance frauster).

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ChrisB200SX [588 posts] 3 days ago
10 likes

I wonder whether he would have apologized and plead guilty if it was a bloke he had assaulted? Or whether he would have continued the assault and then fled the scene?

I think the hate campaign was probably just an honesty and disclosure of character campaign. I certainly wouldn't want a plumber in my house if he behaves like that in public!

6 months suspended seems somewhat weak for attacking and seriously injuring someone for no sane reason.

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burtthebike [1270 posts] 3 days ago
2 likes
FluffyKittenofTindalos wrote:
oldstrath wrote:
perpetual121 wrote:
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

Why would you be remotely bothered? Everything works fine, what's the problem?

It would sure as heck bother me.  Though I have some 'issues' about the worrying arrogance and imperiousness of more than a few medics anyway.   You're a guy paid to do a job, you don't own anyone's body parts.  Branding people is not acceptable even if its not visible on the outside.

 But that case was so utterly peculiar and unusual that it's  not a good choice of comparison with anything.

Why would it bother you?  You couldn't see it, you wouldn't know it had been done and you would be healthy again, due to this surgeon, who, after a very long complicated procedure, jokingly put his initials on the organ to lighten the mood, mistakenly perhaps, but doing no damage.  How is that even assault?  What was the public interest in prosecuting?  Why was it prosecuted when killer drivers aren't?

It seems to be a very good comparison; both assaults, both taken to court and the one which caused serious injury gets very little punishment, only has to pay just over half the deserved compensation, while the one causing no harm gets a massive fine, when he saved the life of the victim.

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burtthebike [1270 posts] 3 days ago
5 likes
FluffyKittenofTindalos wrote:

A far as I can see,violent assaults, even with serious concequences, often seem to get overly soft sentences when compared to non-violent offences (the ones that always comes to my mind are the kid during the riots who stole bottled water from a  shop - 6 months - and the canoe-man insurance frauster).

We live in a capitalist society where money is more important that people's lives.  One pleb assaulting another is no reason for the ruling classes to come down hard, but steal their money.....

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FluffyKittenofT... [1931 posts] 3 days ago
1 like
burtthebike wrote:
FluffyKittenofTindalos wrote:
oldstrath wrote:
perpetual121 wrote:
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

Why would you be remotely bothered? Everything works fine, what's the problem?

It would sure as heck bother me.  Though I have some 'issues' about the worrying arrogance and imperiousness of more than a few medics anyway.   You're a guy paid to do a job, you don't own anyone's body parts.  Branding people is not acceptable even if its not visible on the outside.

 But that case was so utterly peculiar and unusual that it's  not a good choice of comparison with anything.

Why would it bother you?  You couldn't see it, you wouldn't know it had been done and you would be healthy again, due to this surgeon, who, after a very long complicated procedure, jokingly put his initials on the organ to lighten the mood, mistakenly perhaps, but doing no damage.  How is that even assault?  What was the public interest in prosecuting?  Why was it prosecuted when killer drivers aren't?

It seems to be a very good comparison; both assaults, both taken to court and the one which caused serious injury gets very little punishment, only has to pay just over half the deserved compensation, while the one causing no harm gets a massive fine, when he saved the life of the victim.

 

This really is going off on a tangent.

 

I mean, I agree that the punishment in the case in the article seems very mild, but as I say, I just genuinely don't know if it's just a typical lenient treatment of violent thuggery or if it is to do with lenient treatment of motorists attacking cyclists in particular.

But as for that surgeon I don't want him to 'lighten the mood' by treating my body parts as his private canvas, thanks.  Its not his to use for his amusement.

As I said, I feel medical types have an occupational risk of becoming overly arrogant and thinking their high status makes them some sort of overclass (see the history of the profession, including those in the psychiatric field especially - I've heard some horror stories about them both from general reading - e.g William Sargeant - and from people I've known personally).

 

  You are in a hugely vulnerable position when in the hands of such professionals, that's why they are supposed to have strict professional standards.

 

The fine he got seems reasonable to me - I don't think he should have gone to prison - and hopefully he'll have gotten the message and he realises that what he did wasn't acceptable.  And I again say it's such an odd and unusual case that I don't see it's the best comparison to this one.

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wycombewheeler [1243 posts] 3 days ago
2 likes
perpetual121 wrote:
burtthebike wrote:

Just to put this into context, this highly regarded transplant surgeon, who saves lives and did no harm, is spared jail but fined twice as much for signing his work.

No harm? Seriously. If you had a loved one whom had this done to them I would hazard a guess you would see this differently.

true but I'd be  lot less upset than if someone had rugby tackled my wife froma bike breaking bones and causing loss of earnings.

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ktache [641 posts] 3 days ago
6 likes

The tatooing of the organs was not good, and he is paying for it.  But it was after performing a life saving organ transplant.

The same cannot be said for a thick moton rugby tackling a defenseless woman off a bike.

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ktache [641 posts] 3 days ago
9 likes

And is it really a "hate campaign" to remind everyone , especially locals and potential customers how much of an arsehole this bloke really is, now comfirmed by the law.

A bit like reminding the world, and especially the internet, that Dr Helen Measures is a killer driver.

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brooksby [2794 posts] 3 days ago
7 likes
ktache wrote:

And is it really a "hate campaign" to remind everyone , especially locals and potential customers how much of an arsehole this bloke really is, now comfirmed by the law.

A bit like reminding the world, and especially the internet, that Dr Helen Measures is a killer driver.

Now, remember: Dr Helen Measures only killed that female cyclist while overtaking head on into her on a blind bend because the cyclist slipped and came off. Dr Helen Measures believes that she has a clear conscience because how could she be expected to anticipate someone panicking and coming off their bike right under her wheels as she was overtaking on a blind bend. I definitely think it's time that the Internet forgot that Dr Helen Measures killed a cyclist by driving head on into her while overtaking at speed on a blind bend.  She showed no remorse whatsoever but the courts found her not guilty anyway, so that's OK then.    1

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