Support road.cc

Like this site? Help us to make it better.

Back to news
news
Community
Transport
Campaigners say IAM RoadSmart is trying to 'undermine' 20mph speed limits20mph sign (CC licensed by EdinburghGreens via Flickr)

Campaigners say IAM RoadSmart is trying to 'undermine' 20mph speed limits

20’s Plenty For Us points to WHO recommendation that 20mph is the right speed limit where vehicles conflict with pedestrians and cyclists
by Alex Bowden
Sat, Jul 08, 2017 14:21
37

Not for profit organisation 20’s Plenty For Us has accused road safety charity IAM RoadSmart of attempting to ‘undermine’ 20mph speed limits. The campaign group has taken issue with IAM RoadSmart’s recent claim that “widespread confusion over 20mph may be undermining a more general trend to slow down.”

Responding to recent government speed compliance statistics which indicated that 81 per cent of car drivers exceeded the speed limit on 20mph roads, IAM RoadSmart’s director of policy and research, Neil Greig, said that there was a problem, “getting drivers to comply on the ever increasing number of roads in our towns and cities with a 20mph limit.”

IAM RoadSmart is against “blanket 20mph limits” and wholesale changes in the urban limit from 30mph to 20mph.

A policy document states its position as being that distributor roads should always remain as 30mph or above and that the key requirement of any 20mph zone must be that it is “self-enforcing” through signposting that makes sense or traffic calming features.

That document adds: “Research suggests that drivers use the clues from the environment around them to judge the correct speed. Where limits do not match the environment uncertainty and confusion are generated which can raise stress levels and provide an unwelcome distraction from safe driving and lead to a wider disrespect for limits.”

Rod King MBE, the founder and campaign director for 20’s Plenty for Us, took issue with IAM RoadSmart’s position.

“IAM RoadSmart would be more credible if they called on all speed limits to be obeyed rather than trying to undermine 20mph speed limits where people live, work, shop, play and learn. The call for default 20mph limits with exceptions is echoed by many health and road safety organisations, including WHO saying that 30kmh (20mph) is the right speed limit where vehicles conflict with pedestrians and cyclists.”

King also took aim at the government report, arguing that the 20mph roads included were not representative.

“The nine 20mph roads detailed in this report have very little in common with most residential and high street roads where communities set 20mph speed limits to make them safer and more comfortable.

“Even then, this report shows that compliance on these nine roads is improving. IAM RoadSmart keep complaining about “blanket 20mph limits” yet most authorities are using discretion to exclude such roads as this report references or add the appropriate engineering or enforcement to gain compliance.”

20mph
IAM RoadSmart
20's Plenty for US
Alex Bowden

Alex has written for more cricket publications than the rest of the road.cc team combined. Despite the apparent evidence of this picture, he doesn't especially like cake.

Add new comment

37 comments

Avatar
Bigfoz | 6 years ago
0 likes

We have 20 limits near us, on a 30 limit road. They operate at school arrival and kick out times, and are accompanied by some flashing lights / warning signs - i.e. 20 when lights are flashing. I'm very in favour of them.

Does any road need to be a blanket 20? Not sure. I guess in overcrowded urban areas, yes, but in small rural towns where the road can go 10 minutes at a time without any cars (like where we are), would the 30/20 when required system actually be better? Would more motorists toe the line simply because they understand the rationale better? 

 

Avatar
adamthekiwi replied to oldmixte | 6 years ago
2 likes

OldMixte wrote:
Simon E wrote:

tarquin_foxglove wrote:

I can't believe how many people are quite happy to anounce that they are unable to drive at 20mph without keeping a constant watch on the speedo

I've seen the same rubbish trotted out repeatedly for 30 and 40 mph limits.

However, they manage just fine to keep a lid on their speed if they think a Gatso or mobile speed camera is nearby. Arseholes.

My car in 4th, does 25 mph without touching the accelerator, the slightest touch can send me over the 30. If you were to check the speeds in 20mph areas, judging by my observations less than 1% obey the limits including the police. The defence against hitting a pedestrian was that I was checking my speed. It takes around 2 seconds to do that and a lot can happen in those 2 seconds, like a child running out into the road. By the way I am not against sensible speed limits.

That is a *very* long 4th gear. My mini will happily chunter along at 20mph in 5th, although, to be fair, it's only just above idle; it's comfortable in 4th at 20 and will accelerate reasonably well if asked to. However, it also appears to have a facility that maybe your car is lacking: a "gearstick" and "clutch" that allow me to the change the gears in the transmission to suit the speed at which I'm driving. Perhaps your car predates that invention?

It absolutely should not take 2 seconds to check your speedometer. If it does, may I suggest that you simply drive slightly more cautiously - if you're well within the speed limit, you won't need to check that often. Also, at 20mph, you won't travel as far in the time it does take you to check, plus you're *much* less likely to kill or main anyone that you do mow down while peering in wonderment at your dashboard.

Avatar
Jeffmcguinness replied to Bigfoz | 6 years ago
0 likes

Bigfoz wrote:

OldMixte wrote:
Simon E wrote:

tarquin_foxglove wrote:

I can't believe how many people are quite happy to anounce that they are unable to drive at 20mph without keeping a constant watch on the speedo

I've seen the same rubbish trotted out repeatedly for 30 and 40 mph limits.

However, they manage just fine to keep a lid on their speed if they think a Gatso or mobile speed camera is nearby. Arseholes.

My car in 4th, does 25 mph without touching the accelerator, the slightest touch can send me over the 30. If you were to check the speeds in 20mph areas, judging by my observations less than 1% obey the limits including the police. The defence against hitting a pedestrian was that I was checking my speed. It takes around 2 seconds to do that and a lot can happen in those 2 seconds, like a child running out into the road. By the way I am not against sensible speed limits.

 

Use 3rd then.

 

This.  

Avatar
jh27 replied to oldmixte | 6 years ago
0 likes

OldMixte wrote:

Lots of 20s in Bristol even on the main commuting routes where children don't play in the middle of the road, the original reason for their introduction and widely ignored. . The safest speed is that at which 85% of motorists would use if there were no speed limits.

 

A couple of weeks ago, at about 9pm, I was driving around a blind bend on a road off a sort of roundabout (more kind of oval shaped) where the speed limit changes changes from 40 to 30.  It is a main road, the sort of road where "children don't play in the middle of the road".  There was 2x two yearold girls, in the middle of the of the road, completely unsupervised.  It is a bend where I often see people travelling at speeds which completely impair their ability to stop for anything unexpected.  I'm pretty confident that more than 15% motorists would have painted the road with those two girls.

Avatar
Simon E replied to oldmixte | 6 years ago
0 likes

OldMixte wrote:

My car in 4th, does 25 mph without touching the accelerator, the slightest touch can send me over the 30. If you were to check the speeds in 20mph areas, judging by my observations less than 1% obey the limits including the police. The defence against hitting a pedestrian was that I was checking my speed. It takes around 2 seconds to do that and a lot can happen in those 2 seconds, like a child running out into the road. By the way I am not against sensible speed limits.

A serious suggestion: voluntarily return your driving license and sell your car. Based on your comments I suspect you are not fit to drive a motorised vehicle.

Avatar
adamthekiwi replied to Simon E | 6 years ago
2 likes

Simon E wrote:

OldMixte wrote:

My car in 4th, does 25 mph without touching the accelerator, the slightest touch can send me over the 30. If you were to check the speeds in 20mph areas, judging by my observations less than 1% obey the limits including the police. The defence against hitting a pedestrian was that I was checking my speed. It takes around 2 seconds to do that and a lot can happen in those 2 seconds, like a child running out into the road. By the way I am not against sensible speed limits.

A serious suggestion: voluntarily return your driving license and sell your car. Based on your comments I suspect you are not fit to drive a motorised vehicle.

Honestly, this is a suggestion that should be taken more seriously. The debate always seems to be framed in terms of convenience or safety of motorists - or occasionally in terms of how to keep other road users separated from the dangers presented by motorists. There is rarely a suggestion (outside of cycling fora) that motorists should have to adhere to higher standards of competence in order to limit their shocking toll of death and serious injury. Wouldn't it be wonderful if the IAM started suggesting that motorists should be properly trained in how and why to observe 20mph speed limits and have their license to drive revoked if they are not able to display that competence?

Just how "advanced" can a motorist claim to be if they are unable to:
- operate a gearbox?
- observe signs?
- operate within a clearly marked speed limit?

If aircraft pilots or train drivers were killing at least 1800 people every year, without fail, and maiming over 20000 more, would we be handing out points and fines and letting them continue to take the controls, whinging about how the signs might be inconsistent, or would we be sacking them and finding people better at the job?

Avatar
Bmblbzzz | 6 years ago
0 likes

The IAM have a sort of point in saying that motorists judge an appropriate speed from the environment. I think what actually happens is we take our speed cues from the other motorists on the road at that time. 

 

The article doesn't (or maybe the IAM didn't) explain just what this "confusion" over 20mph speed limits is. If it's that people don't know whether a particular road has a 20 or 30 mph limit (or maybe even 40) then, aside from the obvious factors of a) paying attention to road signs, and b) erring on the side of caution, it's not a big deal. If you choose 20 and the limit is 30, wowee, you've taken 30 seconds longer. If you choose 30 and the limit's 20, well the figure of 80% drivers ignoring 20 limits is probably correct, so again, normal for drivers. Next time, pay more attention. 

 

Oh, and if we were all really that good at judging appropriate speeds by environmental clues, we wouldn't need speed limits at all. This was the case in UK from 1930 to 34. Didn't last long cos crashes shot up. Also the case in Third Reich Germany, same result but (surprise!) they didn't alter the law. 

Pages

Latest Comments