Amber pedal reflectors - are you bothered?

by mattbibbings   August 10, 2013  

No one has them. I don't, I bet you don't either.

They are a legal requirement https://www.gov.uk/rules-for-cyclists-59-to-82/overview-59-to-71

It was mentioned here http://road.cc/content/news/90037-driver-who-killed-oxford-cyclist-found...

Does it matter?

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Although you are unlikely to be arrested for not having them, they are still a legal requirement (at night). My worry would be a smart Lawyer using an abscence of reflectors as evidence of contributory negligence in Court.

posted by The Rumpo Kid [590 posts]
10th August 2013 - 16:37

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I wrote to the Government during their red tape campaign to have this amended. I and many others have said that a snap-band ankle reflector, or shoe/clothing reflectors SHOULD be a suitable replacement.

Motorcyclists dont have this problem, and I strongly think cyclists - if they have good lights - shouldn't either.

I can see no strong evidence that it really makes a difference, whereas lights do.

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posted by downfader [184 posts]
10th August 2013 - 16:52

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Have them on my city bike but wouldn't dream of sullying my road bike with anything approaching a reflector! That said, I never ride it at night... And strongly doubt they have much influence on drivers looking at sat navs, eating sandwiches or fiddling with phones anyway!

posted by nicstevenson [29 posts]
10th August 2013 - 17:15

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In that case the pedals without them being sold are illegal and therefore should not be used on the roads Thinking . How long before there is a disclaimer in with the pedal literature, if there isn’t already, or some Ftard starts suing them for it not having them. Still it gives another reason to be stopped and ticketed in Cambridge and other places. Devil

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posted by cidermart [446 posts]
10th August 2013 - 17:23

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cidermart wrote:
In that case the pedals without them being sold are illegal and therefore should not be used on the roads Thinking . How long before there is a disclaimer in with the pedal literature, if there isn’t already, or some Ftard starts suing them for it not having them. Still it gives another reason to be stopped and ticketed in Cambridge and other places. Devil

No.

The law states "illegal during the hours of darkness". Not illegal full-stop.

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posted by downfader [184 posts]
10th August 2013 - 17:32

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cidermart wrote:
In that case the pedals without them being sold are illegal and therefore should not be used on the roads Thinking . How long before there is a disclaimer in with the pedal literature, if there isn’t already, or some Ftard starts suing them for it not having them. Still it gives another reason to be stopped and ticketed in Cambridge and other places. Devil

The sale of pedals without reflectors is not illegal in the same way that the sale of GPS jamming equipment is not illegal. However their use is illegal. (only at night for the pedals without reflectors)

It may be an outdated law but I imagine it would be easily neutralised provided suitable lighting and alternate reflective clothing is used.

And if someone goes out at night without something hiviz/reflective then they are an idiot.

posted by pinecooler [9 posts]
10th August 2013 - 17:34

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Thank you for clarification. A lot of my rides do end in darkness so maybe just a big sticker saying “Not to be used at night” then. As for lights always just no reflectors.

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posted by cidermart [446 posts]
10th August 2013 - 17:42

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Do reflective parts on my shimano cycling shoes count they are attached to the pedals when I ride?

posted by Cycleoptic [19 posts]
10th August 2013 - 17:52

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Cycleoptic wrote:
Do reflective parts on my shimano cycling shoes count they are attached to the pedals when I ride?

Legally no. This is why the law needs to be updated. Studies also need to be done to verify that reflectors do what people assume they do.

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posted by downfader [184 posts]
10th August 2013 - 18:05

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pinecooler wrote:
cidermart wrote:
In that case the pedals without them being sold are illegal and therefore should not be used on the roads Thinking . How long before there is a disclaimer in with the pedal literature, if there isn’t already, or some Ftard starts suing them for it not having them. Still it gives another reason to be stopped and ticketed in Cambridge and other places. Devil

The sale of pedals without reflectors is not illegal in the same way that the sale of GPS jamming equipment is not illegal. However their use is illegal. (only at night for the pedals without reflectors)

It may be an outdated law but I imagine it would be easily neutralised provided suitable lighting and alternate reflective clothing is used.

And if someone goes out at night without something hiviz/reflective then they are an idiot.

I've worn said kit at night. I can honestly say in my experience it doesn't make a lot of difference.

During the winter I have white bands down my lycra longs, and reflective strips on my tops. People still pull out or close pass from time to time. Short of waving my arms like a maniac and shouting "please dont hit me!" at every car I see I dont see that changing unless attitudes are properly challenged and red herrings removed from the debates.

If someone wears a black coat at night I dont really care as long as the lights are up to scratch!

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posted by downfader [184 posts]
10th August 2013 - 18:10

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Cycleoptic wrote:
Do reflective parts on my shimano cycling shoes count they are attached to the pedals when I ride?

They would not meet the requirement, which is amber pedal reflectors front and rear marked BS6102/2 or equivalent. You should also have a rear facing red reflector on the bike itself (no matter how many lights you have).

posted by The Rumpo Kid [590 posts]
10th August 2013 - 18:19

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I would seriously consider riding up to a copper at night on my bike (with lights) and ask their opinion when in real terms my 900lumen front light and 2 watt pulsing led rear seriously out weigh small amber reflectors.

posted by mattbibbings [101 posts]
10th August 2013 - 19:05

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What about a sticker on the pedals? I don't have reflectors on my pedals but don't usually ride at night, but a reflective sticker on the back of them wouldn't be a hardship.

posted by APB [3 posts]
10th August 2013 - 19:57

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I am thinking that to reduce any compensation payout you would have to prove that the lack of amber reflectors made a significant enough difference to the outcome?
I would think that this would be not worth the effort?

posted by SideBurn [731 posts]
10th August 2013 - 20:06

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The reflectors in my Shimano SPD's are so small, they might as well not have been there. I am happy with my Speedplays (without reflectors) and lights when riding in the dark on Cotswolds country lanes. Whether that is legal or not...

posted by Tilesey [9 posts]
10th August 2013 - 20:06

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APB wrote:
What about a sticker on the pedals? I don't have reflectors on my pedals but don't usually ride at night, but a reflective sticker on the back of them wouldn't be a hardship.

The sticker is unlikely to comply with the relevant British Standard so would not comply with the law. But if you had these stickers instead then it would be more difficult to claim contributory negligence against you I think Thinking

posted by SideBurn [731 posts]
10th August 2013 - 20:12

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Well, apparently, after checking with a local policeman months ago, it would make NO difference to the law if I had reflectors or not, because they cannot be seen from behind, that is purely because I ride a recumbent trike.

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posted by Gkam84 [8149 posts]
10th August 2013 - 20:20

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Oh crap. I got double sided SPDs with no space for reflectors. And now I've got used to SPDs, am not going back to flat pedals. SPDs feel safer.

Shimano's Click'R pedals would appear to do the job, but ew, they're ugly. I'll get busy with reflective ankle bands and tape on the seat stays/shoes as the nights draw in. Is there any case law on this area?

posted by Argos74 [209 posts]
10th August 2013 - 20:59

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downfader wrote:
I've worn said kit at night. I can honestly say in my experience it doesn't make a lot of difference.

During the winter I have white bands down my lycra longs, and reflective strips on my tops. People still pull out or close pass from time to time. Short of waving my arms like a maniac and shouting "please dont hit me!" at every car I see I dont see that changing unless attitudes are properly challenged and red herrings removed from the debates.

If someone wears a black coat at night I dont really care as long as the lights are up to scratch!

I'm inclined to agree. I've found that motorists tend to be more patient if I use a single very bright light on the front; my theory being that they mistake me for a motorcyclist. If I use several smaller or flashing lights they'll pull out because I'm easily identified as "only a cyclist".

Having the rear of the bike lit up like a Christmas tree is my preferred way of avoiding close passes, though.

Rob

posted by robert.brady [142 posts]
10th August 2013 - 22:00

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Interestingly enough for this to be brought up, I bought some SPD pedals to replace my old ones that were looking a bit scruffy/worn and they came with screw on pedal reflectors - the first set didn't.

posted by Cycle_Jim [281 posts]
11th August 2013 - 14:08

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Studies have been done, by TRRL in the 1980s. These studies found that whilst a red light could be seen from further away, pedal reflectors gave the most distant notification that the thing in front was a pedal cycle. So in 1983 reflectors were required on both faces of the pedals on all new bikes sold, and a few years later it became illegal to ride at night without them.

Given that a pedal cycle goes slower than a car, so the driver has to brake or steer pretty soon after realising the little red light in front is NOT on a more distant motorbike, I think we must agree that the matter of identification is pretty important. Since the 1980s however, the use of flashing lights has become commonplace and even legal, on pedal cycles but no other vehicles. So nowadays, a flashing light also uniquely identifies a pedal cycle.

It has not been shown that pedal reflectors play any role in identifying cycles from in front. So logically, front pedal reflectors are required only because pedals may be presented either way up.

So I would argue that an additional rear light should be permitted to substitute for pedal reflectors, so as to provide at least one steady and one flashing rear light on pedal cycles not equipped with pedal reflectors.

If you agree with this suggestion, please write to your MP with it.

Crankwinder

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posted by Crankwinder [16 posts]
1st October 2013 - 12:49

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Argos74 wrote:
Oh crap. I got double sided SPDs with no space for reflectors. And now I've got used to SPDs, am not going back to flat pedals. SPDs feel safer.

All is not lost!

You could get a pair of Shimano SM-PD22 clip-on reflectors, they are plenty on ebay. I have a pair fitted to my wet/winter bike. You can also find the pedals sold with the reflectors included.

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posted by Simon E [1779 posts]
1st October 2013 - 13:34

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No, not bothered. Don't have rear, front, or wheel reflectors either.

posted by daddyELVIS [227 posts]
1st October 2013 - 13:54

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wear bright cloathing . Have good front and rear lights. don't start saying two little pedal relectors are going to stop someone knocking you off!!!! will they work from the side? catch the bad road users - yes that includes some cyclist.
who still has the white spoke reflectors fitted?

"Care and Share Everywhere" thats my motto, you read it here- pass it on please.

We should all learn to be carefull and respect other road users - simple Smile

posted by Gary rb [19 posts]
1st October 2013 - 13:55

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downfader wrote:
I wrote to the Government during their red tape campaign to have this amended. I and many others have said that a snap-band ankle reflector, or shoe/clothing reflectors SHOULD be a suitable replacement.

Motorcyclists dont have this problem, and I strongly think cyclists - if they have good lights - shouldn't either.

I can see no strong evidence that it really makes a difference, whereas lights do.


Motorbikes do have to have reflectors, one of my previous bikes failed an MOT for it.

posted by freespirit1 [114 posts]
5th October 2013 - 21:00

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+1

My commute takes me out of the town and onto unlit country lanes. I have excellent lights and hopefully some luck on my side. I don't feel reflectors would add anything to the package...

posted by Tilesey [9 posts]
6th October 2013 - 20:46

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I've got reflectors on the flat pedals on my hybrid Cool

posted by paulfg42 [355 posts]
6th October 2013 - 21:55

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when driving I can think of a few times when I've spotted an unlit bike because of the movement of the pedal reflectors so the insistence that they are fitted to all bikes sold on the assumption that some numpties won't use lights makes some sort of sense - with modern high power flashing lights (and I always have 2 fitted just in case) no need - I'm sure will come up in court cases as police will report if bike was considered roadworthy in legal sense - irrespective of common sense

posted by antigee [106 posts]
6th October 2013 - 22:10

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