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My interest in Jacques has been stirred; there does not appear to be too many books about him or by him. Any ideas? I just would like to know more about him!

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daddyELVIS [654 posts] 3 years ago
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I've got 'Sex, Lies and Handlebar Tape' on my must-read list. Have you considered that one?

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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daddyELVIS wrote:

I've got 'Sex, Lies and Handlebar Tape' on my must-read list. Have you considered that one?

Does that mean you have read it and liked it or want to read it? That is the title that comes up but there are a few others. I thought that as a french five time tour winner that the french would love Jacques; but that does not seem to be the case, I would like to learn more. His, "you cannot ride the Bordeaux-Paris on water" may have been pragmatic then but looks naive now.

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daddyELVIS [654 posts] 3 years ago
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No, not read it yet - I think it'll be my next purchase. I've only been reading cycling books for less than a year, but want to read as much as possible.

So far, I've read:

Every Second Counts
Its Not About the Bike
Fallen Angel - the Passion of Fausto Coppi
Tomorrow, we ride (by Jean Bobet - about his brother, Louison)
Racing Through the Dark (David Millar) - one of the best books I've ever read!!

Currently reading: The Man Who Cycled the World (Mark Beaumont)

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theincrediblebike [40 posts] 3 years ago
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Sex lies and handlebar tape great read, also read the Death of Marco Pantani absolutely brilliant.

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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What was so good about David's book? I liked Lance until I read 'It is not about the bike' (years ago) I think because he went on about his wonderful wife, then divorced her, and went on about 'The Tour' as if there was only one. I enjoyed reading that Lance concentrated on the Tour of France because he could not maintain his precise drug routine all year round (in USADA's reasoned decision).

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daddyELVIS [654 posts] 3 years ago
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I couldn't put it down - read it in a couple of evenings (and I'm a slow reader usually). It's very honest(although I suspect he's not telling us everything), it gives great insight into life in the peloton during the 'EPO era', it gives a great account of his early life and how he became a professional cyclist, and it has some fantastic little stories from within and outside of the peloton. Most of all it illustrates how easy it is (was) for a top cyclist to dope, given the prevailing attitude within the sport at that time. I'll definitely read it again some time.

I forgot - also read: ' In Search of Robert Millar' by Richard Moore.

This is another book I'll read again - it was a great read.

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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Thank you for your help.....instead of choosing one from a few books; I now have a reading list  20 It is a good job I like reading  16

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issacforce [210 posts] 3 years ago
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i hope you did,nt buy millars books, as to put money in the cheaters pocket.

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notfastenough [3661 posts] 3 years ago
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Yes, I think we should only buy books from people who've never made any mistakes in life. Ever.

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issacforce [210 posts] 3 years ago
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it was,nt a mistake, he did,nt fall over and it stuck in his arm, he knew what he was doing CHEATING and making money off it and still is

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The Rumpo Kid [589 posts] 3 years ago
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issacforce wrote:

it was,nt a mistake, he did,nt fall over and it stuck in his arm, he knew what he was doing CHEATING and making money off it and still is

You seem to be confusing the words "mistake" and "accident".

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issacforce [210 posts] 3 years ago
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not at all. you cant accidently stick epo in your body(imo should be banned for life it was his choice to CHEAT)also if i wanted to read his books i would borrow one from a library so not to expand his large bank balance

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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I know what you are saying Issac but David grassed himself up, with no suggestion of duress. This makes a difference to me. David always comes across as being as dull as dishwater on TV so would not have bothered with his book, but I find the science of cheating fascinating. I think a trip down the library could be in order!

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notfastenough [3661 posts] 3 years ago
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No, but you can do something you regret, which makes it a mistake. Or at least, everyone else can, presumably (in order to occupy such high ground) you've never done anything you wish you hadn't.

And while you are perfectly entitled to avoid furnishing DM with cash, you might find that reading his book will explain a few things.

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issacforce [210 posts] 3 years ago
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hi he says he grassed himself up, maybe, maybe not, or was it he was about to get caught, we,ll never know!! or are we supposed to believe wot he says his book.
im not saying im squeeky clean but ive not taken drugs to gain an advantage or for personal gain, i like to do local time trials under my own steam.

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daddyELVIS [654 posts] 3 years ago
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If you read the book you'll find out that he didn't grass himself up. He confessed after being frog-marched out of a restaurant by the police (he was having dinner with a certain Mr Brailsford), back to his apartment in Biaritz, where he was sat on a chair at gun-point whilst his apartment was turned over. Eventually (it took hours) they found 2 empty EPO phials and 2 used syringes. He confessed a couple of days later. He says he'd already stopped doping at that point and he'd just kept these items as 'souveniers' (I struggle to believe this claim).

It's a difficult one - on the one hand I see the opinion of not wanting to put money in a doper's pocket. But, on the other hand, it is part of the history of the sport (as is the fact that Merckx tested positive 3 times) and if you want to learn about the personalities that have shaped the sport, and learn about life in the peloton through the various eras of cycling, then David's book is a very relevant book from the 'EPO era', and a definite must-read!

Each to his own, I suppose.

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issacforce [210 posts] 3 years ago
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that comment makes me laugh, i kept them as souveniers, (numpty comes to mind)

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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Cheers daddyELVIS; I did not know David already had his hand caught in the biscuit barrel before he 'fessed up. Souvenirs? Oh yes, like you would keep good evidence against you as souvenirs.

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notfastenough [3661 posts] 3 years ago
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DM's point was that the attitude towards anti-doping enforcement was so blasé within the peleton that the risk of it being used as evidence was near to nil. I would have been more sceptical if there had been a reasonable amount, or indeed unused syringes/vials.

Regardless, unless you wish to ignore an entire generation of the sport (which is your choice), you can either read:

1. books by repentant dopers
2. books by unrepentant dopers - I hear there's a couple of these written in Texas
3. books by clean riders or those who weren't found out - fine, but you don't get the insight that you can from number 1, and which of those really *were* clean?

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Lacticlegs [124 posts] 3 years ago
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not at all. you cant accidently stick epo in your body(imo should be banned for life it was his choice to CHEAT)also if i wanted to read his books i would borrow one from a library so not to expand his large bank balance

Seems a bit self-defeating don't you think? You don't see a difference between the likes of Amstrong who lied (and will probably continue to do so to his dying breath), and Millar and his ilk?

So then presumably you haven't read the books by or about Paul Kimmage, Floyd landis, Tyler Hamilton, Lance Armstrong, Bjarne Riis, Marco Pantani (or for that matter Anquetil, Merckx etc)?

As someone already mentioned - this is the history of the sport. I understand your position, but I think you're only excluding yourself from the richness of cycling's story. Personally I only exclude anything that might profit Armstrong since it seems pretty clear that he is the worst and most unrepentant of a long line of serial cheaters...

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daddyELVIS [654 posts] 3 years ago
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Armstrong's books are still relevant - you might want to read the sections carefully where he became obsessed with the science behind his blood values in hopital - did he learn something here that allowed him to take doping to a whole new level post-cancer? Just a thought. He could do himself a big favour though, and that would be to confess to the truth and then re-write his story. I for one would buy that book!

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PhilRuss [352 posts] 3 years ago
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[[[[[[[ DRUGS SCHMUGS! Best book I've read on every other bike-racing topic but sodding drugs is Tim Hilton's "One More Kilometre And We're In The Showers!" Comprehensive, engrossing, and funny.
P.R.

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issacforce [210 posts] 3 years ago
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I jst think he was on the verge of getting caught so he fessed up, if he hadn't would he have stopped that's the real ? here. I have read Paul kimmage L. A . Book . He is the biggest offender I agree, but in my opinion they r all in the same basket .

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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I was expecting people to talk about Jacques and his, "Yeah, whatever" attitude to drugs. My thinking was, is it right to judge a person based on the standards of today. Maybe David M is too recent for this thinking but hopefully we have turned a corner and David is now part of the solution.

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SideBurn [890 posts] 3 years ago
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But he is still a cheating f****r!