Wait just a goddam minute...

by Squiggle   June 10, 2012  

...you can't penalise players scores in the leagues for not going Premium!

Just noticed that I've dropped to 3rd in my region because the bloke in 2nd scored in the tour de Suisse stage today when I didn't play it. Angry

That's hardly fair! Surely it's best to give the premium players a seperate league incorporating the extra stages and have only the main stages count in the automatic leagues. Thinking

26 user comments

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My region is based on the non-premium points. (are you sure its not because the dauphine points changed last night as some points were added in? i dropped a further 4 places)

The only league that includes the other points is the premium league table

posted by TERatcliffe26 [3969 posts]
10th June 2012 - 10:03

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I don't think the leagues have been updated since the extra points were added. Depending on which comp I select and which league (user or overalls) I look at I can see 5 different totals for my current score :-
5754 - user league, CdD
5866 - user league, TdS
5729 - overall, TdS
7023 - overall, premium TdS

and 7048, total stage score on teams page.

I think the correct numbers should be 5754 and 7048 only.

Maybe Dave could have a look and let us know what's going on.

posted by simon F [994 posts]
10th June 2012 - 11:12

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Maybe its just a system glitch and will get sorted

posted by TERatcliffe26 [3969 posts]
10th June 2012 - 11:27

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I just came to that conclusion when I was checking my surrounding players teams to predict how they'd score tomorrow and their last stage scores were from TDS.

Also I'm sure I've just clawed my way into 2nd rather than 3rd but could be mistaken as there was no red arrow. Okay so it was late...

Sq

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posted by Squiggle [414 posts]
10th June 2012 - 11:28

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Just to update, Dave will be having a look at various issues later... bit difficult right now as he's taking part in the Dragon Ride, so thanks for being patient Wink

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posted by Simon_MacMichael [8118 posts]
10th June 2012 - 11:42

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No worries, none of this is a big deal. It would just be good if it was sorted before the TdS ends so we all know where we stand.

posted by simon F [994 posts]
10th June 2012 - 11:46

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The team I picked for Suisse Tour never registered between rosta change in the early hours of Saturday morning.
I Am Not Happy as my score for Prologue was NULL POINTE

I'm always in two minds
Then I go and pick the wrong one Sad

posted by fluffchucker [284 posts]
10th June 2012 - 16:17

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Actually on further investigation my overall score in my chosen leagues is 11 points more than my overall in my regional league!!!

Anyway I'm sure it'll all be sorted forthwith, could use the 11 points though Smile

Sq

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posted by Squiggle [414 posts]
10th June 2012 - 18:01

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duly noted folks, i'll kick the cogs... tomorrow

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posted by Dave Atkinson [7388 posts]
10th June 2012 - 21:47

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I have to say that I dont agree with the opening post. If you didnt go premium and contribute to the prize fund so to speak you still get the enjoyment of each race that you can enter a team for absolutely free gratis,and get to see where you rank in each seperate competition...those of us that did pay get points for every race, so why should they not be included in the region scores, we earned the points?

Go premium next time would be my advice, rather than giving out to the guys who put time and effort into something without giving something back to them.

posted by noddy69 [79 posts]
11th June 2012 - 14:21

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I couldn't agree more...and, how many that don't pay still have multiple teams, as Purist & change on the day & still have a whinge

I'm always in two minds
Then I go and pick the wrong one Sad

posted by fluffchucker [284 posts]
11th June 2012 - 16:48

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noddy69 wrote:
I have to say that I dont agree with the opening post. If you didnt go premium and contribute to the prize fund so to speak you still get the enjoyment of each race that you can enter a team for absolutely free gratis,and get to see where you rank in each seperate competition...those of us that did pay get points for every race, so why should they not be included in the region scores, we earned the points?

Go premium next time would be my advice, rather than giving out to the guys who put time and effort into something without giving something back to them.

I do appreciate the work that the guys put in as much as anyone else, and they have an award winning and lucrative website to show for it. Please believe me the title is pure tongue in cheek.

BUT... regarding your comment, you're kidding right? That's like going to a TT and paying for a 5 minute head start. Surprise

Sq

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posted by Squiggle [414 posts]
11th June 2012 - 18:01

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Sod it I'm not dropping any more bloody places, I've gone premium before it's too late. Sick

At least I'll be getting some free socks (which I've just paid for) from the 100Km thingy Plain Face

Sq

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posted by Squiggle [414 posts]
11th June 2012 - 23:50

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noddy69 wrote:
I have to say that I dont agree with the opening post. If you didnt go premium and contribute to the prize fund so to speak you still get the enjoyment of each race that you can enter a team for absolutely free gratis,and get to see where you rank in each seperate competition...those of us that did pay get points for every race, so why should they not be included in the region scores, we earned the points?

Go premium next time would be my advice, rather than giving out to the guys who put time and effort into something without giving something back to them.

I'm premium and I completely agree with Squiggle, the premium membership was about adding extra features and races, not about giving players an advantage. Effectively you haven't 'earned' those points from the TdCalifornia or TdSuisse, you've paid for them.

Also, I don't think that by being premium your membership fees have 'paid for' the prizes, the bikes are an incentive to pay for premium membership but not a direct result of us all signing up. The fees road.cc have received probably went to that new server so have actually benefitted every player of the game, not just the paying ones.

fluffchucker wrote:
I couldn't agree more...and, how many that don't pay still have multiple teams, as Purist & change on the day & still have a whinge

That's completely and utterly irrelevant. How does running a purist team separately to your main team affect your overall score? It doesn't, paying wasn't a way of having more than one team, it was a way of including a load more races into the schedule and raising some money to improve the game infrastructure. Something which, to date, it's done fairly well.

posted by drheaton [3429 posts]
12th June 2012 - 8:04

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My view doesnt change, the game is for all but the premium membership has its bonuses.One is prizes and two , well its your overall score. You have paid to play the extra events.
The notion that it is unfair that you go down a place in your league table cause you didnt go premium being unfair is in my opinion not right. As I stated, in each competition you are on an even playing field with everyone else. In the overall if you dont pay you dont get full points and will drop places. Its not as if its big money for the year.
And if as you stated the premium membership has benefited all then all the more reason to leave the points stand.
The opening posters title did get my back up a bit, but he has since clarified it was tongue in cheek. We will have to agree to disagree, and at the end of the day its up to the guys what they deem fair.

posted by noddy69 [79 posts]
12th June 2012 - 13:03

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Oh and finally just to clear something up regarding the opening post. As it stands at the moment you are not being penalised points , that would be taking points off you which is not happening.Anyway rant over. Devil

posted by noddy69 [79 posts]
12th June 2012 - 13:07

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I think a good analogy is that going premium is the virtual equivalent of doping, and I as a young David Millar type character have realised that I cannot keep up with the peloton without the use of this virtual EPO.

By paying for extra points I am the virtual Lance Armstrong donating dosh to the virtual UCI to turn a blind eye. How ironic that this has all come about around the Tour de Suisse. Thinking

Seriously though, the regional leagues don't have prizes and I enjoyed my high ranking (which is now lost) for pride alone. Whilst looking at the other tables I also noticed that the Overall actually incorporates Premium scores too. I just think that we need a way to rank the players fairly as at the moment there's no way to compare the quality of a standard player with a premium player. Sure at the top of the table it's easy to see who the best players are but by the end of the season there will be no way to tell who is the better player from the top standard and top premium.

Sq

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posted by Squiggle [414 posts]
12th June 2012 - 15:35

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I agree with squiggle although calling it tantamount to doping might be a bit extreme.

It is causing an uneven playing field and giving an advantage to those paying. What really, as a premium player, do you lose by not having those extra stage scores included in your overall points? Other than an over-inflated sense of ability. What joy can you take from beating those in your region or other leagues if you're not playing the same game and you get 80 odd stages extra with which to accumulate points?

Make it fair, make it even and most of all make sure those not paying for the game are not disadvantaged.

posted by drheaton [3429 posts]
12th June 2012 - 15:48

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I agree squiggle. Everyone should be compared on the standard races and then have another table to compare premium.

I was rather hoping the leagues/scoreboard might be the subject of one of future improvements....

posted by cherrypicked [172 posts]
12th June 2012 - 15:50

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Without coming across as an over-competitive stats freak, I'd like to see a ranking based on average score (ideally with associated number of stages played and standard deviation).
That'd include anyone who's joined the game late or gone to Premium late.

Is that too much Dave???

Sq

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posted by Squiggle [414 posts]
12th June 2012 - 17:41

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Squiggle wrote:
I think a good analogy is that going premium is the virtual equivalent of doping, and I as a young David Millar type character have realised that I cannot keep up with the peloton without the use of this virtual EPO.

I didn't go premium on purpose! My dietician paid the £7 for me and never mentioned it! I wondered why it seemed so much easier recently... Wink

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posted by chrisdstripes [1644 posts]
12th June 2012 - 17:49

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There was an average score table last year, it doesn't work at all Wink

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posted by Gkam84 [8865 posts]
12th June 2012 - 17:49

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cherrypicked wrote:
I agree squiggle. Everyone should be compared on the standard races and then have another table to compare premium.

I was rather hoping the leagues/scoreboard might be the subject of one of future improvements....

they will be. Smile

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posted by Dave Atkinson [7388 posts]
12th June 2012 - 18:43

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Squiggle wrote:
Without coming across as an over-competitive stats freak, I'd like to see a ranking based on average score (ideally with associated number of stages played and standard deviation).
That'd include anyone who's joined the game late or gone to Premium late.

Is that too much Dave???

the people who are best at this have been in from the start. the average score table simply reflects the overall table. that's what we found last year.

we replaced it with a high score table: one good stage and you're in Smile

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posted by Dave Atkinson [7388 posts]
12th June 2012 - 18:45

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Squiggle wrote:
Whilst looking at the other tables I also noticed that the Overall actually incorporates Premium scores too.

no it doesn't.

there's a separate overall league for premium.

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posted by Dave Atkinson [7388 posts]
12th June 2012 - 18:46

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The purist overall incorporates premium scores, Dave. One guy whos been 100 points behind me has suddenly 300 advantage because hes premium. Please fix that or my hopes for the overall victory are destroyed. Sad

posted by arsene [217 posts]
13th June 2012 - 12:25

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