Rapha , Shutt Alternative ?? (Torm)

by phax71   October 11, 2010  

Hi

Found these guys:

http://www.torm.cc/

at The Cycle Show at the weekend, seems like pretty good stuff ...

Has anyone purchased and used any of their gear?

Cheers!

30 user comments

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thats a good price for a jersey !

jimmythecuckoo's picture

posted by jimmythecuckoo [1259 posts]
11th October 2010 - 11:47

3 Likes

haven't tried it... we would tap them up for some review gear but the contact form on their website doesn't seem to work. i guess we could pick up the phone or something Plain Face

Dave Atkinson's picture

posted by Dave Atkinson [7409 posts]
11th October 2010 - 11:57

3 Likes

I can see Rapha writing these guys a stern letter... total ripoff even down to the photography...

No phone number on the site, forms not working... Caveat Emptor I think you brits say Smile

Fixie Girl's picture

posted by Fixie Girl [119 posts]
11th October 2010 - 13:15

6 Likes

To be fair to Torm, Rapha don't have the copyright on banded jerseys – they've been around since the 1940s at least – or Sportwool, which is freely available to anyone that wants to make a shirt out of it.

I'd say their photographic style was a bit more Colomba than Rapha Nerd

Dave Atkinson's picture

posted by Dave Atkinson [7409 posts]
11th October 2010 - 14:05

3 Likes

Agree they are more colomba (and shutt vr) than rapha - in photographic style and garment design. except for the arm warmers, which look like a straight copy of the rapha ones.

like the look of the double chest striped one. at £45, I might give it a go.

posted by step-hent [685 posts]
11th October 2010 - 14:41

4 Likes

they do have an email address visible on the site - have not recieved a reply yet so who knows if it works.

not all carbon is the same.

Jon Burrage's picture

posted by Jon Burrage [1081 posts]
11th October 2010 - 15:14

3 Likes

With Rapha it's not just a stripey jersey you're buying. You're buying a good cut, good material, and good workmanship (plus, admittedly, an expensive marketing campaign). How is Torm being compared to Rapha? I haven't seen anyone comparing Colnago with Huffy just because the bikes look sort of similar. You get what you pay for in clothing as well as bikes! I don't think the guys at Rapha will be losing any sleep over this. It's Harvey Nicks vs. Poundstretcher!

simonmb's picture

posted by simonmb [360 posts]
11th October 2010 - 15:41

4 Likes

Rapha stuff looks good right enough but take the shutt vr stuff, cheaper than rapha and really quite good too. Until road.cc have tested a torm top then we cant say its not as good.

On the face of it, the prices would suggest rapha is better than torm.

not all carbon is the same.

Jon Burrage's picture

posted by Jon Burrage [1081 posts]
11th October 2010 - 15:47

6 Likes

I think they're being compared because they're making a stripey jersey out of Sportwool™ and knocking it out for £45. Sportwool™ is what Rapha use as well, and they're well noted for their stripey jerseys, but theirs cost quite a bit more.

There's plenty of discussions on road.cc already about the value, or otherwise, of Rapha's gear; the general feeling in the office is that it's great quality stuff, works well and is very nicely detailed, and if you want to buy it and you have the money then you won't be disappointed. Except for that scarf. Let's not pretend it's made of some magical exclusive material hand-stitched by virgins in a fairytale castle though, cause it isn't.

Let the great 'I love Rapha' vs 'I hate Rapha' discussion begin. Again.

Big Grin

Dave Atkinson's picture

posted by Dave Atkinson [7409 posts]
11th October 2010 - 15:57

3 Likes

I chatted with Torm at the show, they are very much 'inspired' by Rapha designs.. Buy one and compare with a Rapha jersey and make your own judgement. I did..

Interesting comparison with Colomba, I seem to remember them getting slapped wrist from Rapha in the past from over enthusiastic 'inspiration'?!

Love them or hate them Rapha do invest in R&D, do make great kit [scarves excepted] and put a lot of money back in to cycling.

I felt that Torm are out to make a quick buck.

Pete Bragg
Shutt Velo Rapide
www.shuttvr.com

Miggers's picture

posted by Miggers [63 posts]
11th October 2010 - 16:50

1 Like

Miggers wrote:
Buy one and compare with a Rapha jersey and make your own judgement. I did..

and that is..?

Fringe's picture

posted by Fringe [1081 posts]
11th October 2010 - 17:07

3 Likes

Fringe wrote:
Miggers wrote:
Buy one and compare with a Rapha jersey and make your own judgement. I did..

and that is..?


Let's just say that if I was Rapha I'd be taking 'advice'...

Pete Bragg
Shutt Velo Rapide
www.shuttvr.com

Miggers's picture

posted by Miggers [63 posts]
11th October 2010 - 17:19

2 Likes

Miggers wrote:
Fringe wrote:
Miggers wrote:
Buy one and compare with a Rapha jersey and make your own judgement. I did..

and that is..?


Let's just say that if I was Rapha I'd be taking 'advice'...

I really don't think there's any legal recourse if that's what you're implying. Making a similar jersey and being inspired by anothers website isn't unlawful. Rapha don't have a copyright on moody photos and understated jumpers. Its not like the company is called Repha.cc.

TheHatter's picture

posted by TheHatter [810 posts]
11th October 2010 - 19:22

3 Likes

I have 2 columba jerseys. I've worn them more than my rapha jerseys. They seem to fare better in the machine too. The softshell is v good having said that. As a brand/website Rapha seem peerless (apple of the cycling world?). I admire the bussiness nous behind them and the apparent passion. Pricey though, but goodluck to them.....

posted by scottydug [14 posts]
11th October 2010 - 19:27

4 Likes

TheHatter wrote:
Miggers wrote:
Fringe wrote:
Miggers wrote:
Buy one and compare with a Rapha jersey and make your own judgement. I did..

and that is..?


Let's just say that if I was Rapha I'd be taking 'advice'...

I really don't think there's any legal recourse if that's what you're implying. Making a similar jersey and being inspired by anothers website isn't unlawful. Rapha don't have a copyright on moody photos and understated jumpers. Its not like the company is called Repha.cc.


Hi Hatter... It not the website or the similarities in design... You'd need to see 2 jerseys next to each other to see why Rapha might be a bit miffed... Miggers

Pete Bragg
Shutt Velo Rapide
www.shuttvr.com

Miggers's picture

posted by Miggers [63 posts]
11th October 2010 - 19:36

4 Likes

Hi,

This is Michael from TORM. I wasn't sure whether to post but it's late so what the hell..

We're a brand new business and are finding our way. We're certainly not in it for a quick buck. We love Sportwool as a fabric and wanted to bring it to a wider audience but the jerseys currently available were quite expensive.

We also think the Rapha gear is great and I personally think they have done great things for British cycling. They have a great brand and that's a fantastic achievement to have created it in such a short time.

Just like Columba and ShuttVR we wanted to make SportWool jerseys and since we're new we're simply trying to be as competitive as we can. We will be sending a jersey in for review so that will be the acid test! Some people on LFGSS have bought our gear so we hope they will post back what the jerseys are like in use.

Michael

p.s. our web site was custom written which has its benefits but we've had problems with emails via the contact us page - apologies.

posted by cad [2 posts]
12th October 2010 - 1:03

2 Likes

Hi Michael,

Good to hear from you, we'd really like to test a couple of jerseys so fire some in.

As for imitation? Well as the marketing manager of a well known cycling brand once said to me on this subject, "welcome to the bike industry". Colomba still make the jersey that supposedly irked Rapha - flags not being copyright and all that.

As TheHatter said, in fashion, 'inspiration' has always been the name of the game - the High St is inspired by haute couture surely?

Tony Farrelly's picture

posted by Tony Farrelly [4145 posts]
12th October 2010 - 9:31

3 Likes

tony_farrelly wrote:
As TheHatter said, in fashion, 'inspiration' has always been the name of the game - the High St is inspired by haute couture surely?

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, as the phrase goes. And David Bailey always say that he steals ideas, whether from other photographers, other art forms or anywhere else yet nobody seems to complain.

Copycats and lookalikes are certainly not new, and the chaps at Rapha should be confident enough in their products not to have any sleepless nights. Those of us who feel ~£50 is a more realistic or justifiable expense for a jersey weren't going to buy Rapha anyway.

Simon E's picture

posted by Simon E [1984 posts]
12th October 2010 - 10:15

4 Likes

I am tempted... and I have a wardrobe full of jerseys.

Can I test it Tony?

promise to send it back...

jimmythecuckoo's picture

posted by jimmythecuckoo [1259 posts]
12th October 2010 - 10:53

2 Likes

There's an interesting thread on the subject here:
http://www.lfgss.com/thread52843.html

A few members have been talking to Torm.

posted by Pifko [86 posts]
12th October 2010 - 11:54

2 Likes

Tory,

The jerseys for testing will be sent out tomorrow. Any feedback is very much appreciated as I'm sure you've seen and used every possible bit of kit!

Michael

posted by cad [2 posts]
12th October 2010 - 16:46

1 Like

Miggers wrote:
Hi Hatter... It not the website or the similarities in design... You'd need to see 2 jerseys next to each other to see why Rapha might be a bit miffed... Miggers

Hi Miggers
I've no doubt that they've been 'inspired' by Rapha and I'm sure the London boys in black are miffed but unless they are exact copies there's nothing they can do - if there was primark wouldn't exist.

TheHatter's picture

posted by TheHatter [810 posts]
12th October 2010 - 20:18

3 Likes

My Torm jersey just arrived (a T1, in grey with a cream double stripe accross the chest and arms in cream). My thoughts and comparisons:

If you like the retro styling, this is a lovely looking jersey - understated and classy, much like its various rivals.

The fabric is a little thinner than my Rapha 'club' jerseys from this year, but there isn't much in it, and it feels very similar (as you'd expect with the same branded fabric). It is thinner than the Colomba jerseys (which are quite heavy) and a similar weight to my Shutt VR sportive jersey.

The cut and fit seems good - I ordered a medium and it is a similar size to my Rapha and Shutt VR jerseys, but slightly smaller than the Colomba jerseys and slightly shorter in the sleeve than all of them (especially Colomba ones, which have longer sleeves)). It fits nice and close through the body, with enough stretch not ton feel restrictive.

Detailing is nice - three standard rear pockets, with two additional zipped pockets, one in each of the left and right rear pockets. There is a cream contrasting chin guard on the 1/4 length front zip. Stitching is neat and tidy.

I've yet to ride in it, so will have to see how it performs when worn in anger, and how it comes out of the wash, but my initial impressions are very good.

posted by step-hent [685 posts]
13th October 2010 - 15:04

1 Like

My god ... ??

What did I start here, World War 3 ... Smile

Personally I thought it was very nice stuff and certainly seemed to be of good quality, I shall likely be purchasing some (I love the Rapha stuff, just don't have the moolah at present)..

Will look forward to seeing the review soon guys!

Me, Myself and I

posted by phax71 [301 posts]
14th October 2010 - 12:22

3 Likes

Well the Torm gear has landed at road.cc towers, so more on that soon.

Dave Atkinson's picture

posted by Dave Atkinson [7409 posts]
14th October 2010 - 12:29

1 Like

Schwag Grab????

demoff's picture

posted by demoff [344 posts]
14th October 2010 - 14:18

2 Likes

http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/5692879/

for those who would like to know why Rapha is so good!!!!
Epic!!!

posted by mers hanson [1 posts]
14th October 2010 - 22:59

2 Likes

The_Kaner
FREEEEEEEEDOM!

The _Kaner's picture

posted by The _Kaner [447 posts]
11th December 2010 - 19:02

3 Likes

I must have missed a trick here. I'm still using Team Lidl and loving it, and the money I save pays for the stripper!

Mike

mike the bike's picture

posted by mike the bike [144 posts]
19th February 2011 - 17:32

2 Likes

The problem with all these "emulate Rapha" business plans is that they fail in the details.

It's not just about the clothing, which as someone rightly states could be made by anyone, anywhere. It's the details. The story labels, the high quality website with clear marketing message, the quality of the packaging, the great customer service, the exclusive feel, the classy photography and above all the price.

If Rapha was half as expensive, it wouldn't sell twice as much. People buy it BECAUSE it's expensive, not in spite of it. Exclusivity and brand snobbery are it's keystones.

posted by italiafirenze [68 posts]
29th March 2011 - 17:46

4 Likes