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Tubeless newbie

A few weeks ago had some swchalbe tubeless which were fantastic although disappointingly on the way home tonight I had a puncture it doesn't seem massive and compared to the "nail through the tyre test" didn't seem a lot only about 3mm x 1mm Sealant went everywhere initially I got off and span the tyre a bit no joy. Running a tube in there now. 

Now I'm worried if the tyre is buggered and if I missed something after getting the puncture. Anyone got any tips? 

3 years on Duranos not one puncture. 3 weeks on tubeless one potentially ruined tyre.  

If you're new please join in and if you have questions pop them below and the forum regulars will answer as best we can.

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24 comments

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ktache | 6 years ago
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I believe it is called blackwitch

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matthewn5 | 6 years ago
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Don't use superglue, it goes hard and cracks. Use that stuff that's made to repair holes in neoprene wetsuits. Can't remember the name, but it's utterly brilliant for fixing holes in tyres. Takes about 36 hours to set.

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stem | 6 years ago
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Hutchinson Sectors have a good rep with the Audax crowd.

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mattydubster | 7 years ago
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I've been running Schwalbe X ones (run S-Ones in the summer) this winter, all tubeless, and have done loads of trail riding.  I've just deflated the front one to check sealant level and address a slight slice in the sidewall (want to reinforce it from the inside before it has a chance to give me any grief).  I counted SEVEN thorns that had gone into the tyre and then got sealed up.  A great advertisement for going tubeless  1

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peted76 | 7 years ago
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IRC do a range of tyres some more durable than others.

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BrokenBootneck | 7 years ago
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Any recommendations for more durable tubless tyres, I love the Schwalbe Pro-One's but i don't think they will last long on my commuter/winter hack! 

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hawkinspeter | 7 years ago
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I had a similar encounter with my first road tubeless - Schwalbe Pro-One on the rear and got a big cut on a new Bristol cycle path (CattleMarket Road under the bridge). I ended up assuming the tyre was knacked and put a new one on instead, but after reading some of the comments here, I might try and repair the old one now.

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peted76 | 7 years ago
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I don't get on with stans tape, I find it too thick and unsupple. I've found that Giant tubeless tape is very good, it's the same as some other manufacture tape who I can't recall, but basically it's made by 3m, is thinner and more supple than stans. 

The zefal tubless patches work for patching tyres very well. Conventional patches aren't strong enough. 

I always use soapy water when seating, tyres to rims. 

I recommend the Bontrager sealant for road tubeless, seems to seal better than others I've tried, I carry a little tube of this with me now just incase.

Remember to top up your sealant every now and again also as it dries out.

I use Schwable Pro Ones but i've heard good things about the IRC range of road tubeless tyres, i think they were reviewed well on here also.

 

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bob_c | 7 years ago
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If anyone is looking for cheaper tubeless tape, search eBay for Tesa 4289. It's around £10 for 66 m and seems to be roughly the same as Stans etc

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BrokenBootneck | 7 years ago
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Cheers for all the advice guys, bought an airshot, tried a few times then had to remove the core and pump it to 145psi, tyre popped on nicely then.

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KiwiMike | 7 years ago
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@BrokenBootneck:

http://road.cc/content/review/183575-genuine-innovations-tubeless-tire-r...

I've just pulled the pictured set of One's out of the loft to re-visit a tubeless wheelset review. The three or four repairs made last year are holding strong. I cannot recommend this repair kit highly enough. 

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mattydubster replied to KiwiMike | 7 years ago
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KiwiMike wrote:

@BrokenBootneck:

http://road.cc/content/review/183575-genuine-innovations-tubeless-tire-r...

I've just pulled the pictured set of One's out of the loft to re-visit a tubeless wheelset review. The three or four repairs made last year are holding strong. I cannot recommend this repair kit highly enough. 

 

I've got this kit in my tool bag, have heard lots of good stuff about them!

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Miller | 7 years ago
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For a cut in the tyre that's too much for the sealant I've had good results using conventional puncture patches on the inside of the tyre. You need to clean the inside tyre surface so that the rubber solution will bind to it. You'll be good to go when you reinflate.

For a tyre that won't seat, either build up the tape with another layer or completely retape. My new thing is trying Gorilla tape. You'll probably need to adjust the width but my first impression is that it does work very well as tubeless tape at about a quarter of the cost of Stan's or equivalent (just why is that yellow tape so expensive anyway).

 

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SingleSpeed replied to Miller | 7 years ago
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Miller wrote:

For a cut in the tyre that's too much for the sealant I've had good results using conventional puncture patches on the inside of the tyre. You need to clean the inside tyre surface so that the rubber solution will bind to it. You'll be good to go when you reinflate.

For a tyre that won't seat, either build up the tape with another layer or completely retape. My new thing is trying Gorilla tape. You'll probably need to adjust the width but my first impression is that it does work very well as tubeless tape at about a quarter of the cost of Stan's or equivalent (just why is that yellow tape so expensive anyway).

 

 

I would just warn you on this one, if you use a traditional puncture patch you risk a blow out as the typical puncture patch stretches and can bulge.

For a much better tyre repair you are better of using the sidewal from another tyre. The reason being that tyres have threads which mean there is no stretching and no deformation/bulge at the site of the tear...I use Evo Stick for the repairs which stand upwell to the sealant.

I keep old tyres that are worn out for just this purpose, I've repaired slices in tyres upto 2cm or so using this method, but only when the tyre is pretty much brand new and I'm far too tight to bin it!

Re Tape, +1 for gorilla tape, it's got more flex than stans. though to be fair I've used Insulation tape, normal gaffer tape and anything in between it all works just fine!

Same for valves if it's got a core just cut off the tube...instant tubeless valve...no idea why stans charge £14 for them!

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Miller replied to SingleSpeed | 7 years ago
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SingleSpeed wrote:

I would just warn you on this one, if you use a traditional puncture patch you risk a blow out as the typical puncture patch stretches and can bulge.

Is a fair point but I've only done this for slits which are big enough to defeat sealant but not so big as to damage the integrity of the tyre. The repairs I've made like this have held up nicely.

I did try once repairing a bigger cut in a tubeless with a piece of Veloflex tyre carcass but it was never a satisfactory repair. I will say that leaking sealant can make roller riding a dodgy affair!

 

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riotgibbon | 7 years ago
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I've had a couple of big cuts on my S--Ones, on the sidewalls where they never really fixed. I tried those "rope plug" kits, all they did was pop out and make the hole bigger

I've got these for repairs now, just really hefty patches:

http://www.acycles.co.uk/zefal-tubeless-repair-kit-10369.html

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Default Username | 7 years ago
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For bigger cuts on tubeless I use superglue, believe it or not. Squeeze the tyre so the hole 'gapes' and swipe in a little superglue. Give it time to harden. You're not closing the hole with the glue, (you can't, the glue will dry hard and the tyre will flex and the bond will fail) but you are making it smaller so that the sealant has something to 'bridge'. Pump the tyre like hell to force through the remaining sealant. It has helped me about half the time and the weight/cost/effort is almost zero. I buy superglue multipacks from Poundland.

I do this with the tubs I run on the summer bike too (before using a can of Effeto Mariposa).

*Full disclosure, I am not sponsored by Poundland  1

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thax1 | 7 years ago
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Had similar challenges getting tubeless to re-seat after topping up sealant. Ended up taking it to my LBS (who happen to be a Hunt / Tubeless dealer). Their air-line wouldn't 'pop' one of the tyres, so they've built up the rim a bit with more tape.

This reduces required air volume, and encourages the bead onto the rim sidewall, rather than sitting in the middle of the gulley of the rim.

 

There's only so long you can pump up air chambers, soap tyres, use inners to 'stretch' tyres, and generally swear - whilst reading the words 'easy tubeless ' on the One-Pros!

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BrokenBootneck | 7 years ago
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Pro ones it is. Cannot get the damn things to seat now. Been to the garage (flat tyre setting) gone through several co2 canisters even resorted to duct taping the tyres to rims almost twice but no bloody joy. 

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hsiaolc replied to BrokenBootneck | 7 years ago
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BrokenBootneck wrote:

Pro ones it is. Cannot get the damn things to seat now. Been to the garage (flat tyre setting) gone through several co2 canisters even resorted to duct taping the tyres to rims almost twice but no bloody joy. 

I had the same problem.  It was the rim tape in the end. 

Not saying you have the same problem but try a new rim tape. 

Not all of them are the same quality and sometimes while we are trying to change the tyre we can damage the tape unknowingly. 

I feel much more secure with my tubeless than clinchers.  Currently I am running the old Schwalbe S-Ones and they seem to be quite good all round. 

 

 

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Rider X | 7 years ago
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The ability to seal is very sealant dependent.  You can try some tricks like adding glitter to your sealant to help it seal larger holes.  That said, 3mm x 1mm is a fairly sizable hole, you may need to get one of those "rope plug" kits to fix the tire, I am not sure any sealant would reliably seal a hole of that size.

The main advantage of tubeless on road (as I see it) is being able to run thin supple tires (which greatly reduces rolling resistance and increases comfort) while having some puncture protection. You probably give up 20-30 watts running Durano  over Pro-one tires. Trying to run the same type of tire tubed would result in even lower reliability than you see now.

If reducing punctures is your primary goal then Durano is probably a better choice, you can even get a tubeless version which should be even more bomb proof as any small holes that make it through the tire breaker can get sealed.  You will however take a hit in rolling resistance for the added security (there are no free lunches).

The Pro-one's are quite thin fragile tires as they are racing tires.  Tubeless setup makes them more reliable than they would be otherwise, but it really is a relative scale.

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Jimthebikeguy.com | 7 years ago
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You dont say what tire you are actually running. The S-one is generally the best overall, and is pretty much indestructible. If its a small cut like you describe then the sealant should take care of it, providing there is enough in the tire. For a 700c road tire you generally want about 40-50 ml. Failing that there are tubeless tire repair kits, by Genuine Innovations; basically its a strip of rubber that you jam in the hole with a little poker supplied with it. Work a treat. The problem you describe sounds an easy fix whatever.

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CasperCCC | 7 years ago
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Schwalbe Pro One? I got a pair of them. Felt fantastic, and then I realised that they're like tissue paper. Guess it's fine if they seal, but only to a point - you still lose the air and a load of sealant.

Plus I clearly had a manufacturing fault in one of them - I wonder if there was a problem with the liner or something similar, because there were weird bulges at parts of the tyre. Like blisters just under the surface. I tried patching the inside of the trye, but it didn't do any good.

A bit part of me really wants to replace it, but looking at the reviews, it seems like so many other people are also having problems with durability. 

The summer bike's been put away for a few months. I've still got the one surviving Pro One on the back, with a GP4000s on the front. I'm off to Mallorca in a few weeks time. What I *want* to do is replace the knackered Pro One. But I'm thinking that what I actually should do is ditch the remaining Pro One and swap it for another GP4000s.

I'm totally sold on the concept of tubeless. I just don't know if there's a road tyre out there that's at that GP4000s sweet-spot of being nice enough for the summer bike, but still offering a degree of durability.

 

 

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CXR94Di2 | 7 years ago
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Tyre is fine with a hole like that, you either had too little sealant or the hole was just too big to seal.  Tubeless arent immune from punctures, they offer better rolling resistance and eliminates pinch flats.  I have had thorn punctures and they have sealed fine, but bigger, who knows.  The other benefit is that tubeless is much less to suddenly deflate(pop), crtitical in safety especially when travelling at speed or downhill.

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